Discussion Official Baam Discussion Thread

[kkck]

I see it the other way, The army did engage with Bam and Bam got to fight Charlie and the other rankers in a 2 v 1 fight without a bleep from the admins. Hec he was about to be killed by Kallavan without as much as a snort from the admin. I guess the rules of the Rankers v regulars being a taboo is much less enforced and much more promulgated as absolute.
I am pretty sure that when Bam makes his reappearance the whole tower will swarm to kill him again rankers or otherwise. Bam got away with the vanishing ship and then went into underground fighting arenas thanks to Evankhel and fought and trained there. I guess undergrounds dont really care about these issues that tower faces. However when Bam reappears Zahard squadrons wont loose time to attack him.

What other way? We saw how limited the army was a number of times. They went with capturing regulars rather than killing them and they also never interfered with the station directly. They could only do things to regulars while they were outside the station hence why they had to flaunt their hostages to try and hope bam and the others there come out. Its not necessarily the case that whatever even allowed the army to interfere with regulars as much as they did will be a thing every time bam is found.

 

[shaheer]

We saw how limited the army was a number of times. They went with capturing regulars rather than killing them and they also never interfered with the station directly. They could only do things to regulars while they were outside the station hence why they had to flaunt their hostages to try and hope bam and the others there come out. Its not necessarily the case that whatever even allowed the army to interfere with regulars as much as they did will be a thing every time bam is found.

why didnt admin intervene when Kallavan and co was trying to kill him off? With the Freeza dude and Sharon trying to attack him and finally Kallavan more or less pursuing him to kill him off?

 

[link to the past]

why didnt admin intervene when Kallavan and co was trying to kill him off? With the Freeza dude and Sharon trying to attack him and finally Kallavan more or less pursuing him to kill him off?

They did intervene but indirectly, by sending evankhell there to help him. For me it seems they saw it as an important event for the tower to change, they let a big obstacle along Bam's way to see if he can overcome it. You could say that they tested Bam worth in changing the tower and facilitate his growth but letting things happen to him. Or simply they didn't want to openly oppose Jahad and chose an indirect route. Finally the admin in charge of that floor might be pro Jahad, and other admins can only help indirectly, we have seen that admins have their own opinions on matters as well in the past.

 

[kkck]

why didnt admin intervene when Kallavan and co was trying to kill him off? With the Freeza dude and Sharon trying to attack him and finally Kallavan more or less pursuing him to kill him off?

SIU was less than specific of course but we generally know that the army "dealt" with this somehow. And it is an unquestionable fact that for the army there was an unassailable red line when it came to the last station hence why they relied on hostages to lure bam out. Ultimately the army never did anything whatsoever to any regular inside a regular protected area. Heck, even early in the arc we were specifically told the hell train had its protection for regulars removed. So even under this unique set of circumstances where the army "dealt" with the rules protecting regulars and got rid of the protection for them inside the hell train they still had to respect remaining regular safe zones. Bam could have been at the edge of the stations safe zone with kallavan an inch away and then proceded to call kallavan's mom a whore while mooning him and kallavan would have been helpless (unless bam doing that would waive his protection of course or kallavan deciding that it's too much and whichever punishment comes from that is worth ending bam).

 

[Ripcord]

SIU was less than specific of course but we generally know that the army "dealt" with this somehow. And it is an unquestionable fact that for the army there was an unassailable red line when it came to the last station hence why they relied on hostages to lure bam out. Ultimately the army never did anything whatsoever to any regular inside a regular protected area. Heck, even early in the arc we were specifically told the hell train had its protection for regulars removed. So even under this unique set of circumstances where the army "dealt" with the rules protecting regulars and got rid of the protection for them inside the hell train they still had to respect remaining regular safe zones. Bam could have been at the edge of the stations safe zone with kallavan an inch away and then proceded to call kallavan's mom a whore while mooning him and kallavan would have been helpless (unless bam doing that would waive his protection of course or kallavan deciding that it's too much and whichever punishment comes from that is worth ending bam).

From Yuri’s statement just outside the Hell Train at the FoD it seems that Rankers can attack Regulars if they are defending themselves. I think this is also consistent with Ren attacking Anak - clearly she attacked him first. I think this requires an actual attack, not just insults so Bam in your above scenario should be safe.

why didnt admin intervene when Kallavan and co was trying to kill him off? With the Freeza dude and Sharon trying to attack him and finally Kallavan more or less pursuing him to kill him off?

In terms of why the admin didn’t intervene - if they are trying to stage a quiet rebellion against Zahard then openly opposing his army is not a smart move. Not to mention I have this suspicion that admins can see paths which would mean they already knew how much to push it.

Besides in Super Hero stories, the powerful good guys lay in wait until the proper moment to act. They can’t solve all the problems for our intrepid hero. Just like Evankhell said, real battles are where the growth is - this was perfectly evidenced by Bam’s growth at the Last Station. Bam had to fight to grow and he has to grow to beat Zahard - so if the Admin stepped in to save Bam that would be foolish in the long run.

 

[kkck]

From Yuri’s statement just outside the Hell Train at the FoD it seems that Rankers can attack Regulars if they are defending themselves. I think this is also consistent with Ren attacking Anak - clearly she attacked him first. I think this requires an actual attack, not just insults so Bam in your above scenario should be safe.

Yeah, I have something similar in mind. Hence why in other posts I have made the point that this whole thing kinda hinges on Bam not picking fights with rankers.

 

[Xeroxed]

Keep in mind that the last station was located in the middle area. Regulars does not have any automatic protections given by the administrators there. They are only protected in the inner area and in regular specific areas. So they were safe inside the last station and the train as those were regular test areas(Until the protection in the train after the hidden floor collapsed.) But the army was free to attack them if they left the train or the station as then they would be in a general "PvP" area.

Karaka could not attack the regulars when they were in the train but he could attack them in the gap between the naming station and the train. Likewise the rankers of the army worked hard to prevent the train and the station from being physically in contact with one another as they probably had a method to canceling the protection of the train. (Through the conductor?) But did not have that ability for the station.

 

[Ripcord]

Yeah, I have something similar in mind. Hence why in other posts I have made the point that this whole thing kinda hinges on Bam not picking fights with rankers.

Well lucky for Bam he’s got a fairly cool head and doesn’t fight unless he feels he needs to (like at the Last Station).

 

[King Dryst]

Yeah, I have something similar in mind. Hence why in other posts I have made the point that this whole thing kinda hinges on Bam not picking fights with rankers.

It's going to happen somehow or other no matter what. Baam still needs to engage in serious battles going forward, and not just dump truck Regulars all the time.

 

[kkck]

It's going to happen somehow or other no matter what. Baam still needs to engage in serious battles going forward, and not just dump truck Regulars all the time.

Ah, bam is without a doubt going to face rankers in the future and even pick the fights himself. My point is more along that at least based on what we know bam is sort of in charge of the situation though. Because the empire has to jump through hoops to target him via rankers. getting him out of regular safe zones, voiding regular safe zones, get administrators to look the other way.... Meanwhile bam can pick a fight with a ranker any time he wants. The empire can try to pick a fight with bam but bam can simply choose to retreat to a safe zone (depending on the situation of course). if bam actually went into a full zero fucks given mode he'd climb the tower without ever leaving regular safe zones and otherwise just deal with test shenanigans at the worst. bam is likely just years away from being strong enough that hordes of normal rankers aren't enough to deal with him. And a and give or take a few dozen years from being at a point where only top high rankers can deal with him. Of course, along the way there will be traps and schemes and straight up shenanigans but overall bam's situation isn't straight up terrible in regards to being found.

 

[shaheer]

SIU was less than specific of course but we generally know that the army "dealt" with this somehow. And it is an unquestionable fact that for the army there was an unassailable red line when it came to the last station hence why they relied on hostages to lure bam out.

Thats just a just so. The army dragged Bam out by some means sure but they werent just dilly-dallying around. If Bam didnt come out i would think they would have other means to get the battle to him. Especially Kallavan at the end or Sharon (when she faced off Bam only to be paired with White), They intended to kill him off. Admin definitely observed it all but showed zilch interest in intervening.

Also SIU can bring up 100 s of such exceptional zones of fight where Bam can be and would be lured to duke it off with high rankers of Zahards forces. As he is exposed Zahards army, i doubt, will be complacent enough to let him climb to 135 and then attack. He will be attacked and so will his friends be attacked.
In the end I doubt with all the mayhem that is to come Bam will get to prioritize climbing rather than being on defense and fighting these forces off one by one. I think that the rule of not attacking regular is a general guideline and it can be circumvented if there is a need especially when the order is coming from Zahard who has the seal of approval from Admins.

And then there is Yuri attacking Karaka almost killing Yihwa and Rak only to be saved by some deus ex machina. Karaka trying to kill Bam off etc. The prohibition seems quite malleable and thus i doubt Zahards army wont utilize it to their advantage before Bam reaches 135 with/without howsoever timeskip you can fit in the story.

Not to mention now that Bam is on ranker level power we need to have powerful rankers and highrankers as Bams opponent to make things difficult for him. He just 1 shotted few C rank without even batting an eye in the Kallavan arc. He has grown substantially now, I doubt a score of A rank will pose much of a threat to him.

 

[kkck]

Thats just a just so. The army dragged Bam out by some means sure but they werent just dilly-dallying around. If Bam didnt come out i would think they would have other means to get the battle to him. Especially Kallavan at the end or Sharon (when she faced off Bam only to be paired with White), They intended to kill him off. Admin definitely observed it all but showed zilch interest in intervening.

Also SIU can bring up 100 s of such exceptional zones of fight where Bam can be and would be lured to duke it off with high rankers of Zahards forces. As he is exposed Zahards army, i doubt, will be complacent enough to let him climb to 135 and then attack. He will be attacked and so will his friends be attacked.
In the end I doubt with all the mayhem that is to come Bam will get to prioritize climbing rather than being on defense and fighting these forces off one by one. I think that the rule of not attacking regular is a general guideline and it can be circumvented if there is a need especially when the order is coming from Zahard who has the seal of approval from Admins.

And then there is Yuri attacking Karaka almost killing Yihwa and Rak only to be saved by some deus ex machina. Karaka trying to kill Bam off etc. The prohibition seems quite malleable and thus i doubt Zahards army wont utilize it to their advantage before Bam reaches 135 with/without howsoever timeskip you can fit in the story.

Not to mention now that Bam is on ranker level power we need to have powerful rankers and highrankers as Bams opponent to make things difficult for him. He just 1 shotted few C rank without even batting an eye in the Kallavan arc. He has grown substantially now, I doubt a score of A rank will pose much of a threat to him.

Their only alternative appeared to be to use the hostages and hope for the best at that point. I don't see any evidence that they actually a better or even other alternatives. As far as we know bam could have spent his entire life at the station had he simply not moved out. Your point about the admin is completely irrelevant to this. One way or the other the army couldn't touch regulars within the station. And they had permission to do so outside.

Yuri's attack was outside the regular safe zone. They even made the point that once they left that station they would be outside the regular station. Sure, the admin didn't intervene to stop that fight BUT the fact remains the actual regular safe zones remained so throughout.

i am not saying bam won't have to fight rankers. of course he will, the plot basically needs that. My point is simply that bam absolutely enjoys regular protections right now and that gives him an edge.

 

[shaheer]

Yuri's attack was outside the regular safe zone. They even made the point that once they left that station they would be outside the regular station. Sure, the admin didn't intervene to stop that fight BUT the fact remains the actual regular safe zones remained so throughout.

i am not saying bam won't have to fight rankers. of course he will, the plot basically needs that. My point is simply that bam absolutely enjoys regular protections right now and that gives him an edge

Then I dont see why you objected to what i said before:
I said this :: We dont have time for Bam to go across all 135 floor and till he challenges Zahard unless we are talking about a major time skip. Also Gustang declared sth like a war though recent chap barely shows any effect of Gustang taking away hostages from zahard army. So I would presume the heavy hitters will be down pretty soon to fight with Bam ergo he has to be ready for them.

How is that objectionable? I think Bam will face Zahard before 135 and if he has to face zahard before 135 he will have to face the whole army of zahard before as I would think Zahard will try to get his army to do his biddings before he steps in. The climbing of floors is less important in the story the clash between Bam and Zahard force seems to be much more center to the story and given there is about what 80 floors to go I would think the story will take its turn to make Bam face heavy hitters in one way or other including zahard before he tops 135. Sure he wont be sitting in 1 floor ie he will be climbing but Zahards retaliation will come faster than he can climbe the 80 + floor left for him to climb.

 

[kkck]

Then I dont see why you objected to what i said before:
I said this :: We dont have time for Bam to go across all 135 floor and till he challenges Zahard unless we are talking about a major time skip. Also Gustang declared sth like a war though recent chap barely shows any effect of Gustang taking away hostages from zahard army. So I would presume the heavy hitters will be down pretty soon to fight with Bam ergo he has to be ready for them.

How is that objectionable? I think Bam will face Zahard before 135 and if he has to face zahard before 135 he will have to face the whole army of zahard before as I would think Zahard will try to get his army to do his biddings before he steps in. The climbing of floors is less important in the story the clash between Bam and Zahard force seems to be much more center to the story and given there is about what 80 floors to go I would think the story will take its turn to make Bam face heavy hitters in one way or other including zahard before he tops 135. Sure he wont be sitting in 1 floor ie he will be climbing but Zahards retaliation will come faster than he can climbe the 80 + floor left for him to climb.

I don't agree with the idea that bam will fight zahard before becoming a ranker and that there need to be timeskips that huge otherwise. Certainly there will be timeskips and floors will be skipped but I sincerely doubt SIU will go and straight up skip 40 floors and at a minimum 20 years worth of story. SIU can only skip so many floors without it being a copout. I for one would be straight up pissed if bam makes it to floor 100 and then immediately timeskips his way to floor 134. Certainly bam and zahard have taken the center stage in a way but the story is still ultimately about climbing the tower even if tests aren't a big deal anymore. And we have already seen zahard's retaliation. The only thing he can do that he hasn't done so far is either send adori or show up himself. And adori is only a threat if she gets bam out of a regular safe zone that can't be conveniently deactivated like the train or doesn't immediately join bam's harem.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 15, 2019, Original Post Date: Mar 15, 2019 ---

On another note, I do wonder what bam devouring the black march means for mascheny. Can bam puke it out? Mascheny certainly does not care about bearing zahard's child but even then it did seem like she fully intended to gather the 13 month series if at least only to incite more battles. And even then, if bam has devoured the black march and this can't be undone it means the princess competition is effectively over as it is conceptually impossible for any princess to ever gather them. I do think bam devouring all the 13 months will be a plot point in the future but I am really curious about what zahard's princess army will have to say about this.

 

[Ripcord]

I don't agree with the idea that bam will fight zahard before becoming a ranker and that there need to be timeskips that huge otherwise. Certainly there will be timeskips and floors will be skipped but I sincerely doubt SIU will go and straight up skip 40 floors and at a minimum 20 years worth of story. SIU can only skip so many floors without it being a copout. I for one would be straight up pissed if bam makes it to floor 100 and then immediately timeskips his way to floor 134. Certainly bam and zahard have taken the center stage in a way but the story is still ultimately about climbing the tower even if tests aren't a big deal anymore. And we have already seen zahard's retaliation. The only thing he can do that he hasn't done so far is either send adori or show up himself. And adori is only a threat if she gets bam out of a regular safe zone that can't be conveniently deactivated like the train or doesn't immediately join bam's harem.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 15, 2019, Original Post Date: Mar 15, 2019 ---

On another note, I do wonder what bam devouring the black march means for mascheny. Can bam puke it out? Mascheny certainly does not care about bearing zahard's child but even then it did seem like she fully intended to gather the 13 month series if at least only to incite more battles. And even then, if bam has devoured the black march and this can't be undone it means the princess competition is effectively over as it is conceptually impossible for any princess to ever gather them. I do think bam devouring all the 13 months will be a plot point in the future but I am really curious about what zahard's princess army will have to say about this.

I agree with you that large timeskips would be unacceptable. I don’t know about most of the people here but I’m in this for the ride not the destination.

I think Bam fighting Rankers is essential but I think it might happen from Evankhell’s challenges than anywhere else. If Bam can’t beat normal Rankers on a regular basis then there is no way he can even scratch Kallavan (special power not withstanding). I agree that Bam will be doing this on his own terms unless we find other special areas like the Train. I am sure there are special places but the Rankers at Wolhaiksong seemed to speak about the train as a unique place.

As to the competition, I agree that if Bam keeps it then it’s over but I don’t think the princesses will give up. If anything some of them will still collect them to make Bam’s job harder.

 

[kkck]

I agree with you that large timeskips would be unacceptable. I don’t know about most of the people here but I’m in this for the ride not the destination.

I think Bam fighting Rankers is essential but I think it might happen from Evankhell’s challenges than anywhere else. If Bam can’t beat normal Rankers on a regular basis then there is no way he can even scratch Kallavan (special power not withstanding). I agree that Bam will be doing this on his own terms unless we find other special areas like the Train. I am sure there are special places but the Rankers at Wolhaiksong seemed to speak about the train as a unique place.

As to the competition, I agree that if Bam keeps it then it’s over but I don’t think the princesses will give up. If anything some of them will still collect them to make Bam’s job harder.

Indeed, bam even needs to fight rankers. The biggest advantage literally any ranker continues to have over bam so far is skill and experience. It's has been a two year timeskip and bam clearly and bam will have certainly made leaps since then but your average ranker will have hundreds if not thousands of years of having survived in the tower and that with far less going for them than bam. Evankhel's training seems to specifically address that in the sense that in going through it bam's life is in actual danger but two years shouldn't be enough to overcome the gap even in this scenario. Picking fights with rankers will be a necessity for bam if he aims to overcome the skillgap within the short term (as in, 10-20 extra floors).

If bam gathering the 13 months will be a thing then by any logic the active chosen princesses are pretty much targets for bam. First the chosen princesses, then zahard who seems to be the one that hands over and by extension keeps at least a few of them at any given time. Yuri will of course willingly give up her weapon for bam but I feel like people mascheny or haripherione should be achievable at least some 30 floors from now.

 

[toil]

If Baam teamed up with Levi the Question™ then the question—get it, the question™—isn't if they could beat a ranker, it's "how many rankers will we beat today?"

1. Step 1: ask a question,
2. Step 2: reverse control flow
3. Step 3: wait
4. Step 4: select next target, repeat as necessary

Moving on from that harmless levity, nerfing Baam for a few years just seems like a way to delay the day he beats his first ranker. Yeah he needs better fundamentals, sure, but just saying.

If bam gathering the 13 months will be a thing then by any logic the active chosen princesses are pretty much targets for bam. First the chosen princesses, then zahard who seems to be the one that hands over and by extension keeps at least a few of them at any given time. Yuri will of course willingly give up her weapon for bam but I feel like people mascheny or haripherione should be achievable at least some 30 floors from now.

I agree with the logic. Problem is it’s too many battles to actually go get them all—years and years just for those quests—so some shortcut or other workaround seems predictable.

Relatedly, I actually wonder if Black March will still be “cursed” when Evankhell finally lets Baam use it.

 

[kkck]

I agree with the logic. Problem is it’s too many battles to actually go get them all—years and years just for those quests—so some shortcut or other workaround seems predictable.

Relatedly, I actually wonder if Black March will still be “cursed” when Evankhell finally lets Baam use it.

I am not too concerned about that. We are barely at floor 50... bam still has more than half the tower left to climb. Plenty of room and time for him to get them. Add to that he likely already has access many of the weapons. Garam has two and has been out of the princess contest for thousands of years. Bam probably just has to ask to get them. Though for simplicity's sake bam probably won't be returning to floor 43 to ask for them. I guess we can expect garam to mobilize at some point to wherever bam is at the time. Yuri has the green april which is basically a freeby for bam.

An zahard is a missing princess... which I would argue makes her weapon also a freeby. Alphid is also missing... Meaning another possible freeby if she is alive.

The weapons that are likely to be tricky are mascheny's, adori's and hagipherione's. Since they likely won't give them up without a fight. Specially mascheny. She doesn't give a crap about the contest but she likely will relish the change to fight bam.

There are a few weapon's whose whereabouts are completely unknown to us of course. but chances are that they are either with zahard, meaning getting the weapon is an endgame thing or held by another princess. n

I am surprised time is such a concern in this, for all we know we are not even halfway through the series. And the series still has to deal with the zahard princes at some point who also account for at least 2 parts of the key to the tower. Though gustang claimed a ring recently....

 

[toil]

I am surprised time is such a concern in this, for all we know we are not even halfway through the series. And the series still has to deal with the zahard princes at some point who also account for at least 2 parts of the key to the tower. Though gustang claimed a ring recently....

Yeah I feel like we're at most about 40% through by "things that have to happen", but what that means in terms of episodes is hard to say (SIU could go faster or slower!).

I should restate what I was thinking: collecting the 13 months seems like it has to happen—one of the only “sure bets” in this series—but I can't ever see "getting the months" getting more than, maybe, one dedicated arc—and if it gets a dedicated arc, it'll be some “last roundup” thing. Get months as part of some other objective, sure, but zero or one “weapon roundup” arcs is all I can see.

Absorbing the BM sets a bad precedent and could turn into Tower of Megaman: is Baam going to get green and yellow and colorless shinsoo, too?

The rings are interesting and I really want to know how many there are in total out there. I think I heard Zahard likes threes.

 

[Ripcord]

Yeah I feel like we're at most about 40% through by "things that have to happen", but what that means in terms of episodes is hard to say (SIU could go faster or slower!).

I should restate what I was thinking: collecting the 13 months seems like it has to happen—one of the only “sure bets” in this series—but I can't ever see "getting the months" getting more than, maybe, one dedicated arc—and if it gets a dedicated arc, it'll be some “last roundup” thing. Get months as part of some other objective, sure, but zero or one “weapon roundup” arcs is all I can see.

Absorbing the BM sets a bad precedent and could turn into Tower of Megaman: is Baam going to get green and yellow and colorless shinsoo, too?

The rings are interesting and I really want to know how many there are in total out there. I think I heard Zahard likes threes.

ROFLMAO!!!!



I hadn’t thought of Bam as Megaman but that’s exactly what he is! Ok ok... Megaman has to beat the boss to get the power, though Bam did do this with the Red Thryssa. Bam however is a suped up Megaman and just needs to be attacked to absorb the ability (e.g. Daniel Hachid’s purple shinsoo).

Regarding the rings, many have speculated that Rachel is related to Zahard, although she has no fangs. Otherwise a third person would have to be someone new.