One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[jaymizzo]

Luffy's coa has been beaten by fodder Hody Jones who was one shotted by Zoro.
Let's not insult Zoro here by comparing his coa to Luffy's...
What could have Luffy done to mr 1 back in Alabasta? Nothing.
What could have Luffy done to Kakus Yontoryu? Nothing...
It will be all clear soon enough.

Can you PLEASE, PLEASE show an instance where Zoro had to protect Luffy from an opponent because he is a swordsman. Stop moving the goal post.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Luffy's coa has been beaten by fodder Hody Jones who was one shotted by Zoro.
Let's not insult Zoro here by comparing his coa to Luffy's...
What could have Luffy done to mr 1 back in Alabasta? Nothing.
What could have Luffy done to Kakus Yontoryu? Nothing...
It will be all clear soon enough.

It's now insult to compare Luffy's haki to Zoro?

Are you forgetting Gear 4 coats Luffy entirely in CoA haki? And are you forgetting Luffy's CoA has increased even further?


When Luffy fought Lucci, Luffy was able to endure rankyuu AND shigan... multiple skin piercing techniques.

For what it's worth, I am trying to understand where tour coming from, but you are just throwing out nonsense the more we talk about it.

You literally are jumping from talking point to talking point.

 

[nik87]

Can you PLEASE, PLEASE show an instance where Zoro had to protect Luffy from an opponent because he is a swordsman. Stop moving the goal post.

Very simple, by taking on any swordsman that could have gotten in Luffy's way.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2019 ---

It's now insult to compare Luffy's haki to Zoro?

Are you forgetting Gear 4 coats Luffy entirely in CoA haki? And are you forgetting Luffy's CoA has increased even further?


When Luffy fought Lucci, Luffy was able to endure rankyuu AND shigan... multiple skin piercing techniques.

For what it's worth, I am trying to understand where tour coming from, but you are just throwing out nonsense the more we talk about it.

You literally are jumping from talking point to talking point.

Using up more haki doesnt equal to better haki, it has nothing to do with quality of its hardness.
Taking on rankyaku isnt taking on swords, big difference.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

You know that Zoro's goal has more to do with individuals strength than Luffy's goal?
Also you underestimate Mihawk who is stronger than Emperor Shanks at least and if Oden can do to Kaido what he did then Mihawk can for sure do better.

Wait what?
Where did u get your facts from, that Mihawk is stronger than Shanks?

Mihawk himself acknowledged the fact that Luffy has a far more difficult goal to achieve than Zoro.

For Zoro to achieve his dreams, all he needs do is beat Mihawk.
Luffy, on the other hand needs to beat the Yonkos and Admirals who are all hyped up to another level, and any fool seeking to be the strongest pirate out there (and that includes Mihawk if he's game for it, but I don't think he is though - strongest swordsman should be more than enough).

Check the SH's crew and tell me how many powerhouses are left when you exclude Luffy, Jimbei, Zoro, and Sanji.
Being pirate king requires the captain himself to be stronger than everyone else. Counter this if you will.

Well idk... Just Zoro's fighting history of taking out everyone with a single slice, Luffy aint different, he isnt immune to swords...
Are Kaido, Blackbeard and Akainu swordsmen? How convenient for Rubber Jesus.

Fujitora is a swordsman, Kizaru is versatile enough - can go swords and brawns, Greenbull also might just be one (though I heavily doubt it).
There are swordsmen all over Wano and pretty powerful ones at that, but we don't see Zoro challenging them.
Is it bcos:
a) They are all in the same shit so there's no time for friendly duels?
b) Zoro's going to get his ass kicked?
c) Convenience requires that he only fights hostile/enemy swordsmen?

 

[jaymizzo]

Luffy's coa has been beaten by fodder Hody Jones who was one shotted by Zoro.
Let's not insult Zoro here by comparing his coa to Luffy's...
What could have Luffy done to mr 1 back in Alabasta? Nothing.
What could have Luffy done to Kakus Yontoryu? Nothing...
It will be all clear soon enough.

Very simple, by taking on any swordsman that could have gotten in Luffy's way.

Because Zoro is a swordsman. This is actually getting silly now Nik.
So you haven't proven that Zoro has ever needed to protect Luffy from a swordsman. You just described what Zoro does and is out to do, fight swordsmen.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Very simple, by taking on any swordsman that could have gotten in Luffy's way.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2019 ---

Using up more haki doesnt equal to better haki, it has nothing to do with quality of its hardness.
Taking on rankyaku isnt taking on swords, big difference.

Slicing wind techniques can still slice into Luffy and Shigan was piercing his flesh equally well, but he endured it. That's a fact.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019 ---

Very simple, by taking on any swordsman that could have gotten in Luffy's way.

You said PROTECT Luffy. He has never had to PROTECT Luffy.

Dealing with swordsmen that COULD have gotten in Luffy's way is just silly if that's your idea of "Protecting" Luffy.

It's more like " dealing with Luffy's light weights"

Zoro is the swordsmen, it's his dream to fight other swordsmen to become the WSS. It's his goal, it's what he does.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Until I see Luffy taking out a master swordsman he will always need Zoro to protect him from one and Zoro will always need a single slice to take Luffy out.

PK doesnt mean> everyone else.

You say this which is ridiculous by the way.
Yet, you fail to remember that Zoro was taken out by one hit from Killer.

Bloody Killer! Kid's boy!

If he can't withstand that hit, how's he going to withstand a KKG that Doffy (who's shown better durability than Zoro) couldn't?

I'd rather not hype Zoro and wallow in disappointment later.
I'd rather put him where he belongs and hope he surprises me with his power ups.

 

[Shasha23]

If he can't withstand that hit, how's he going to withstand a KKG that Doffy (who's shown better durability than Zoro) would?

Yeah..............NO

 

[Pirate Queen]

Yeah..............NO

Prove it

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Yeah..............NO

What's yeah...no?
Prove me wrong don't just claim yes or no.

Doffy in one complete battle withstood a fierce red hawk punch, a puncture to the torso via gamma knife, about 3 normal gear 4 hits, before getting downed by a KKG.

Zoro in one battle got downed by a slice to the torso.

He better re-train his durability if there's anything like durability training cos this war will be bloody.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Prove me wrong

Zoro has never taken the force of a point blank King Kong Gun with enough force to level a town and bring it collapsing on top of itself.

Closest hes got was taking all of Luffy's damage and exhaustion PRE timeskip. Not even close to raw physical damage of a King Kong Punch.

Now, give me proof Zoro could sustain damage like that, knowing full well he passed out from an unfortunate stab in the shoulder(which I admit he would not have gotten of he wasnt distracted)

 

[nik87]

Zoro has never taken the force of a point blank King Kong Gun with enough force to level a town and bring it collapsing on top of itself.

Luffy has never taken on the cutting force of ISDS that sliced a mountain in pieces. Not to mention Asura...

 

[Pirate Queen]

As I said, Oda could make all opponents into swordsmen. Guess why he doesnt.
Zoro has protected Luffy, not specifically from swordsman but it is a fact.
Swordsmen are never lightweight fights for Luffy.

I'm not Oda I dont know why, but probably because there is a SWORDSMAN on the crew whose dream is to fight other SWORDSMEN and be the best.

And you second point. It's not a fact unless you provide evidence.

Your third point, How do you know swordsmen arent lightweights for Luffy? Buy your own admission he has never fought one... your making no sense.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2019 ---

Luffy has never taken on the cutting force of ISDS that sliced a mountain in pieces. Not to mention Asura...

That's not what we are discussing........ we are discussing ZORO being able to take a King Kong Punch like Doflamingo and keep going. Plus all the other damage from gear 4 that Luffy produced

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

The Killer scene is only messing up with your mind. It means absolutely nothing. Plot element plain and simple.

So Oda got Zoro hurt to mess with the fan base, excellent!

Plot element? Well same plot element got Sanji to break a leg against Vergo.

Guess what, nearly everyone shitted on Sanji (surely Moe didn't).
Luffy got the shit too in his first encounter with Kaido.
Zoro was handed the same and now you cry plot element.
Nah... It's only fair he gets shitted on too.

He's not where you think he is ATM. Relax a bit buddy.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2019 ---

Closest hes got was taking all of Luffy's damage and exhaustion PRE timeskip. Not even close to raw physical damage of a King Kong Punch.

Even then he couldn't handle it as much as we thought initially. The pain followed him till the Time Skip began.

I'll ready the panels, incase anyone requests it.

 

[Pirate Queen]

So Oda got Zoro hurt to mess with the fan base, excellent!

Plot element? Well same plot element got Sanji to break a leg against Vergo.

Guess what, nearly everyone shitted on Sanji (surely Moe didn't).
Luffy got the shit too in his first encounter with Kaido.
Zoro was handed the same and now you cry plot element.
Nah... It's only fair he gets shitted on too.

He's not where you think he is ATM. Relax a bit buddy.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2019 ---

Even then he couldn't handle it as much as we thought initially. The pain followed him till the Time Skip began.

I'll ready the panels, incase anyone requests it.

You know, I think we are all just fatigued from the implications of the new chapter.

 

[Shasha23]

What's yeah...no?
Prove me wrong don't just claim yes or no.

Doffy in one complete battle withstood a fierce red hawk punch, a puncture to the torso via gamma knife, about 3 normal gear 4 hits, before getting downed by a KKG.

Zoro in one battle got downed by a slice to the torso.

He better re-train his durability if there's anything like durability training cos this war will be bloody.

You prove he has better endurance, you cant just claim something that questionable as fact!

Yeah he got downed by an attack that punctured his lung, while Doffy cant even take 5 hits

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Remind me, who of the two is WSS?

You better add Big Mom to that list...

Why is it more difficult? Becuase you need to be stronger or because you cant achieve it alone

Both!

Luffy views it as a test of strength and freedom. The PK title requires individual strength as much as a collective one and Luffy plans to defeat every single power house in his way.

He stated it himself back in Dressrosa.

The PK was widely regarded as the most powerful pirate in the world both in individual strength and as a crew.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 17, 2019 ---

You prove he has better endurance, you cant just claim something that questionable as fact!

Yeah he got downed by an attack that punctured his lung, while Doffy cant even take 5 hits

How do you know the attack punctured Zoro's lung? I'm in the medical field and I can't make that claim.

Doffy's injury was far worse. He got his internals ruptured that I can tell you is life threatening.
He then had to tank some G4 hits and a ridiculous KKG.
That's just too much don't you think?

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019 ---

Oda can make all opponents of the arc into swordsmen, conveniently it's only the one guy that conveniently goes to Zoro.

Take away the Beast Pirates and the Big Mom pirates and your wish comes true my good friend.

 

[nik87]

I'm not Oda I dont know why, but probably because there is a SWORDSMAN on the crew whose dream is to fight other SWORDSMEN and be the best.
And you second point. It's not a fact unless you provide evidence.
Your third point, How do you know swordsmen arent lightweights for Luffy? Buy your own admission he has never fought one... your making no sense.

Nothing stops Oda from drawing Luffy's opponents as swordsmen even if they are not good at it like those who get paired with Zoro yet he never does.
Time to refresh yer memory Lexus-kun.

Because Luffy is at disadvantage against swordsmen and is focused on evasive maneuvers only. He fought Momonga, he owned him, it required plot armors to save him from him.

That's not what we are discussing........ we are discussing ZORO being able to take a King Kong Punch like Doflamingo and keep going. Plus all the other damage from gear 4 that Luffy produced

Why are we not discussing it? To make Luffy look better? Fact is, as much as Zoro cant take on KKG, the same goes for Luffy taking on Zoro's ISDS or Asura.

So Oda got Zoro hurt to mess with the fan base, excellent!
Plot element? Well same plot element got Sanji to break a leg against Vergo.

Yes, to mess with the fanbase exactly.
No, it is not plot element in Sanji's case as it was worked on it further and RS was given to him to boost his durability, something that he lacked against Vergo.

Zoro was handed the same and now you cry plot element.
Nah... It's only fair he gets shitted on too.

He did shit on him by making him faint as plot element otherwise that faint wouldnt have happened, at least not for the reason you think it did, in case you didnt notice, the manga justified it as being due to hunger.

You better add Big Mom to that list...

So, you basically agree that Mihawk>Shanks since Shanks aint BM and BM never had legendary duels with Mihawk?

Both!
Luffy views it as a test of strength and freedom. The PK title requires individual strength as much as a collective one and Luffy plans to defeat every single power house in his way.
He stated it himself back in Dressrosa.
The PK was widely regarded as the most powerful pirate in the world both in individual strength and as a crew.

Roger was never the strongest and yet was PK, never defeated BM and needed tricks instead to get poneglyph from her.
The story literally doesnt require Luffy to be the strongest and would put him up in 1vs1 against Kaido while instead it is a team-up...

 

[Shasha23]

How do you know the attack punctured Zoro's lung? I'm in the medical field and I can't make that claim.

Doffy's injury was far worse. He got his internals ruptured that I can tell you is life threatening.
He then had to tank some G4 hits and a ridiculous KKG.
That's just too much don't you think?

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 17, 2019 ---

I look at the manga panel!!!!

Far worse than a punctured lung.....whaaaaat
Sure Luffy's G4 attacks are impressive but we have seen Zoro tank attacks from Kuma, Fujitora and Kizaru so nah, i dont put Doffy's endurance that high

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

I look at the manga panel!!!!

Far worse than a punctured lung.....whaaaaat
Sure Luffy's G4 attacks are impressive but we have seen Zoro tank attacks from Kuma, Fujitora and Kizaru so nah, i dont put Doffy's endurance that high

There's no doubt Zoro can tank hits. But we are talking about current Zoro not pre TS feats.

Also, since when did Fujitora slash Zoro?
Can you post a panel?