Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[savethecat]

Hori is as much a political or social analyst/critic as Kishi is a feminist.
Just because a word or concept is brought up in a series doesn't mean there's anything behind it.
My Hero Academia is full of surface level shit that could be cool but is never actually elaborated on with any real thought. It's just there to give the appearance of thought. Just surface level laziness.
The way it handles things like mental illness, drug use, or discrimination are absolutely laughable in how poorly they're portrayed and (un)executed.

Adding to that; Hori is as much of a feminist as Kishi as we well. Like Hori probably put the girls at the beginning of the Overhaul arc and patted himself on the back for including them despite completely forgetting them the rest of the arc. Dude is a huge hack when it comes to this kind of stuff. It really is just Naruto with superheroes and even worse pacing.

Geez, why’d you have to make it sound like Horikoshi is just this horrible person

 

[WyldViolet]

Geez, why’d you have to make it sound like Horikoshi is just this horrible person

I guess it does read that way.
I don't hate Horikoshi, I just think he tries to bite off more than he's actually capable of as an artist. Always takes the easy way out rather than see his ideas through the end, whether it's due to laziness, lack of confidence, or simply lack of creativity (I don't think it's the latter); his flaws really do affect my respect for him as an artist.

 

[Paze]

Geez, why’d you have to make it sound like Horikoshi is just this horrible person

This is why I dislike topics like this. I feel like it always devolves into personally insulting the author and an unspoken belief that stories somehow have to be vehicles for political beliefs and representation and if they aren't they failed. (Not saying anyone here is doing this)

 

[WyldViolet]

This is why I dislike topics like this. I feel like it always devolves into personally insulting the author and an unspoken belief that stories somehow have to be vehicles for political beliefs and representation and if they aren't they failed. (Not saying anyone here is doing this)

But the art of the artist is a representation of their true thoughts and beliefs. You write what you know and you know what you believe.

 

[Tamil]

Yeah, I meant those charts, thanks.
Though I am still surprised that WT kept growing after the anime ended and after a two year long hiatus. Like I expected it to drop to 100k or less with only the most hardcore fans in Japan to keep buying it, but that didn't happened. Real glad Ashihara got such loyal fans in his home country who love his work so much.

It basically reached a new peak in sales after it came back from a long hiatus. Only HxH/WT can brag about reaching new sales peaks after a long hiatus. I know its super early but WT could use a anime reboot

 

[Paze]

But the art of the artist is a representation of their true thoughts and beliefs. You write what you know and you know what you believe.

I agree, I appreciate when I was in academia how we study the culture, upbringing, and beliefs of the author to analyze the story in context. But I feel like when this is discussed now it's far more judgemental and being mad it is this way, rather then just seeing it how it is. If that makes sense. This is just my opinion but it just seems immature of get mad at authors for not properly portraying relatively new political concepts, especially when they're from different countries and the goal of their series is to entertain not to illustrate a belief. I'm not saying you're doing that btw. I agree bnha isn't really deep on those subjects and doesn't try to be.

 

[savethecat]

I guess it does read that way.
I don't hate Horikoshi, I just think he tries to bite off more than he's actually capable of as an artist. Always takes the easy way out rather than see his ideas through the end, whether it's due to laziness, lack of confidence, or simply lack of creativity (I don't think it's the latter); his flaws really do affect my respect for him as an artist.

Personally I don’t like calling any of the weekly Shonen Jump authors “Lazy”, due to the amount of work effort it takes to maintain a weekly series and survive in the magazine to begin with.
I think he has faults as a creator, as well as strengths just like every creator in the magazine

 

[Koni]

Personally, I feel as if there’s a lot Horikoshi wants to do but just doesn’t, whether that would be due to a lack of knowledge, experience or just time. He may very well have bitten off more than he can chew with HeroAca.

For example, characters: HeroAca is primarily set in a school. So that’ll have a lot of characters right off the bat, but then you have Pro Heroes, villain factions, civilians, sidekicks. And even within the school, you have two whole Hero classes, a support course, a general studies course, and The Big Three. It doesn’t help that Horikoshi’s actually really good with character designs, so naturally people would want to learn more about them. But Horikoshi doesn’t have the luxury of putting a lot of school antics in order to explore the school well cause this is a battle shonen, and people are here for high-stakes fights - the school arcs tend to be the more divisive ones in the fandom. Deku’s meant to become the greatest hero as well, so we have to focus on him the most. Horikoshi’s also drawing parallels between him and Shigaraki, as he’s on a journey to become the greatest villain and as such is a sort of protagonist in his own right. So he obviously needs some focus, along with his gang as well. All of this, and there’s only so much you can draw in one week (Horikoshi does less pages per chapter than usual, too) and you can only linger on an arc for so long. All of this has the unfortunate effect of MHA not really managing to develop many of the characters that it introduces, and the even more unfortunate effect of its female characters generally just barely getting any spotlight. It’s something I do hope the series finds a way to fix, somehow.

Other currently running shonen (Black Clover, The Promised Neverland, Chainsaw Man, Kimetsu no Yaiba) have a more focused cast of characters, which makes them easier to develop more. This might honestly be the preferred method for writing characters. Not every manga is One Piece.

 

[Paze]

Personally, I feel as if there’s a lot Horikoshi wants to do but just doesn’t, whether that would be due to a lack of knowledge, experience or just time. He may very well have bitten off more than he can chew with HeroAca.

For example, characters: HeroAca is primarily set in a school. So that’ll have a lot of characters right off the bat, but then you have Pro Heroes, villain factions, civilians, sidekicks. And even within the school, you have two whole Hero classes, a support course, a general studies course, and The Big Three. It doesn’t help that Horikoshi’s actually really good with character designs, so naturally people would want to learn more about them. But Horikoshi doesn’t have the luxury of putting a lot of school antics in order to explore the school well cause this is a battle shonen, and people are here for high-stakes fights - the school arcs tend to be the more divisive ones in the fandom. Deku’s meant to become the greatest hero as well, so we have to focus on him the most. Horikoshi’s also drawing parallels between him and Shigaraki, as he’s on a journey to become the greatest villain and as such is a sort of protagonist in his own right. So he obviously needs some focus, along with his gang as well. All of this, and there’s only so much you can draw in one week (Horikoshi does less pages per chapter than usual, too) and you can only linger on an arc for so long. All of this has the unfortunate effect of MHA not really managing to develop many of the characters that it introduces, and the even more unfortunate effect of its female characters generally just barely getting any spotlight. It’s something I do hope the series finds a way to fix, somehow.

Other currently running shonen (Black Clover, The Promised Neverland, Chainsaw Man, Kimetsu no Yaiba) have a more focused cast of characters, which makes them easier to develop more. This might honestly be the preferred method for writing characters. Not every manga is One Piece.

In an interview Horikoshi said he writes BNHA with a vertical axis and horizontal axis, the horizontal axis being the main plot which he says becomes dark because of his own personality, and a vertical axis which is where he remembered to keep thing so light hearted. I think he sees the main plot as All might becoming weaker and Deku becoming stronger, and the school setting and all the side characters being where he keeps the story light hearted.

Also I find it weird you say black clover has a more focused cast of characters, when I read bc there were so many side characters I lose track of them lol.

 

[Newkerzy]

Kimetsu isnt a potential OP slayer and never will be.

Even though Kimetsu is ending "soon", if it ends on a high note then people are going to be eager to see Gotogue's next work that much more. Imagine how much they can hype up Gotogue's return...

I dont think they're worried or in danger at all. Jujutsu/AA/CSM are likely to gain a lot of popularity when their anime arrive.

Well, we'll just have to see at the end of year now, won't we?

If Kimetsu does overtake OP this year, expect the series to stay within top 3 until the end of its run.

Bolded: wait until they proceed to butcher the hype just like they did with S8....

 

[Tamil]

Well, we'll just have to see at the end of year now, won't we?

If Kimetsu does overtake OP this year, expect the series to stay within top 3 until the end of its run.

Bolded: wait until they proceed to butcher the hype just like they did with S8....

If Kimetsu outsells OP this year, that doesnt mean it has "slayed" OP. Its similar to how Toriko outsold Bleach in series sales when its anime arrived, it didnt mean that Toriko had "slayed" Bleach as Bleach still sold more than double of what Toriko did in volume sales. All it means is that Kimetsu had bigger backlogs.

Kimetsu will probably overtake OP as its showing no sign of slowing down. Dont jinx it, what if we get a Kimetsu Shippuden...

 

[Newkerzy]

If Kimetsu outsells OP this year, that doesnt mean it has "slayed" OP. Its similar to how Toriko outsold Bleach in series sales when its anime arrived, it didnt mean that Toriko had "slayed" Bleach as Bleach still sold more than double of what Toriko did in volume sales. All it means is that Kimetsu had bigger backlogs.

Kimetsu will probably overtake OP as its showing no sign of slowing down. Dont jinx it, what if we get a Kimetsu Shippuden...

That's why it's gonna be interesting to see if Kimetsu will maintain these sales and if it'll even compete within Top 3.

 

[TyVip]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ next year might be another 3 volumes OP/year, so any series that can sell 8M+ can beat it lol.

 

[Tamil]

 

[Koni]

In an interview Horikoshi said he writes BNHA with a vertical axis and horizontal axis, the horizontal axis being the main plot which he says becomes dark because of his own personality, and a vertical axis which is where he remembered to keep thing so light hearted. I think he sees the main plot as All might becoming weaker and Deku becoming stronger, and the school setting and all the side characters being where he keeps the story light hearted.

Also I find it weird you say black clover has a more focused cast of characters, when I read bc there were so many side characters I lose track of them lol.

I admit, I was a bit unsure of listing Black Clover on there, but my thought process was that the core cast of characters, the Black Bulls, is relatively small compared to MHA's core cast, Class 1-A. Sure, there's varying degrees of importance within Class 1-A, but that's still a lot of characters to juggle from the onset.
I find what Hori said about how he writes MHA quite fascinating, thanks for this!

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

I think Tabata knows how to handle the big cast of characters on Black Clover quite better than Horikoshi on BNHA, almost 250 chapters and i still feel like most of the Class A barely had any shining moment in the series, Tokoyami is by far one of coolest characters but when was the last time he was part of a important arc? i can't even remember, Tsuyu is such a popular character between fans and she also barely do anything important and the list goes on, majority only do something on training arcs while Todoroki and Bakugou are in the front every time, Horikoshi could do a lot better about putting the spot in other characters too.

 

[Heiji]

Act-age : 1-8 : 1 800 000.
Beast Children 7 "arc" end in 49th issue. From 50th issue new developpement.

Spoiler: 49th issue color page

 

[Ryuusei]

Act-age : 1-8 : 1 800 000.
Beast Children 7 "arc" end in 49th issue. From 50th issue new developpement.

Spoiler: 49th issue color page

Beast Children getting a new arc pretty much sets that it will take longer to get the chop, which is definitely weird. Nice to see AA so close to 2 million already, hopefully it will grow even more.

 

[Aeneas]

Well then.

The Rugby World Cup final is on Saturday, btw.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Watch the new development on #50 be Sakura and Yukito playing for the Japanese Rugby team in the Rugby Wold Cup finals, The End. :P