Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2020] - Discussion and ToC Talk

[Shinuki no Reborn]

MANGAHELPERS "TOC" POLL ISSUE #51 - VOTING!​

The poll for issue #51 is now open, vote for your favorite chapters of the week clicking HERE!

Alongside the release of Sakamoto Days, the extra series this week are:

-Dragon Ball Super 66
-Boruto: Naruto Next Generations 52
-Ghost Reaper Girl 10

Good Votes!

 

[Halloween]

Moderator Notice:
Henceforth, I will be deleting posts that complain about Weekly Shonen Jump having too many/not enough gag/battle/exorcism/sports/etc series.

These posts are not insightful, and do not meaningfully contribute to this thread. Also, this decision is not up for discussion, so posts discussing this decision will also be deleted.~ Halloween

 

[Ryuusei]

Spoiler: 52 TOC & 01 Preview

呪 僕 O マ ブ S C D 破 C B 夜 C 僕 あ 灼 ぼ チ 高 ア 森 A 仄 ぼ 次号カラー ヒロアカ アンデラ 夜桜 約ネバ 道産子 GIGA 岸本先生が描くコラボポスター 爆豪クリアファイル

Spoiler: Issue #52 ToC & Preview

Jujutsu Kaisen (Cover & LCP)
My Hero Academia
One Piece
Mashle
Black Clover
Sakamoto Days (CP)
Dr. Stone
Magu-chan: God of Destruction (CP)
Build King
Mission: Yozakura Family
Me & Roboco
Ayakashi Triangle (CP)
Shakunetsu no Niraikanai
We Never Learn
Chainsaw Man
Koukousei Kazoku
Undead Unluck
Moriking
Agravity Boys
Honomieru Shounen
Bokura no Ketsumei

Issue #1
Cover & LCP: My Hero Academia
CP: Undead Unluck, Mission: Yozakura Family, The Promised Neverland, Dosanko Gyaru wa Namaramenkoi

GIGA Preview
Collab poster by Kishimoto
Bakugou clear file

 

[yadayada]

JK's anime studio was never revealed, was it? Or did I miss it?

Bunch of rumors but no official confirmation.

Yo why though? I'm nit trying to say this is all the series is worth and I still reeeally like it but it's basically Dragon Ball with Swords. You've got to admit. It's like 90% fights and barely anything else. Just non stop fights fights fights fights. Like comon it's a simple series. You think that should beat OP?

I think one manga that deserved to beat OP is toriko but the world is unfair. Whaaa

"Dragon ball with swords" is definitely not something i thought I'd ever read regarding kimetsu, lol.

Also a story does not necessarily need to be complex or pretend to be.

 

[DreamcastDazia]

Bunch of rumors but no official confirmation.



"Dragon ball with swords" is definitely not something i thought I'd ever read regarding kimetsu, lol.

Also a story does not necessarily need to be complex or pretend to be.

I'm not saying it but I'm saying that's the reason why I don't think it deserves to beat something as ambitious as One Piece. Anyway I'm still happy for it

 

[savethecat]

No one is saying Japan is a horrible place to live or visit.
It just has its own issues just like America and every other country has its own issues.
A lot of people in the anime/manga community like to pretend that Japan exists in a bubble where misogyny, homophobia and racism isn’t a thing.

 

[supercow297]

Yo why though? I'm nit trying to say this is all the series is worth and I still reeeally like it but it's basically Dragon Ball with Swords. You've got to admit. It's like 90% fights and barely anything else. Just non stop fights fights fights fights. Like comon it's a simple series. You think that should beat OP?

I think one manga that deserved to beat OP is toriko but the world is unfair. Whaaa

No I like KnY for it's character writing, best in Jump rn, maaaybe Chainsawman beats it though. And good writing in general.

 

[Rain Spectre]

The idea that Kimetsu doesn't "deserve" to beat OP is purely absurd.

Like, what exactly does a series need to "deserve" it in this context? Be on par with their favorite series? Because what makes a series popular isn't it being some kind of grand-scale story, it's the emotional connection one has to it. As a story, Kimetsu is one which connected with the readers. Simple as that.

Hell, per some sources I've read, One Piece's teen readership (AKA Jump's main audience) is nowadays in the minority, something like 10-20%. In a way, I can argue OP lost years ago, it's just Kimetsu's explosive popularity is when its loss truly became obvious.

Also, the argument of "Kimetsu's arcs are too simple"? Laughable when you consider the structure of OP's arcs tends to be even more flat when you remove the massive amounts of backstory.

 

[supercow297]

I like the fact that HQ is showing some growth in sales again but we will need to see if it is significant in any way. The decline has been pretty massive over the last few years.

Some of these comments that are trying to counter women harassment are just so bad that it's starting to be funny. You're literally part of the problem and the reason progress takes forever.
I'm done with this topic.

There are people that disagree on which direction progress should be towards and your assumption that you automatically know all the right answers is disconcerting.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 17, 2020, Original Post Date: Jan 17, 2020 ---

No one is saying Japan is a horrible place to live or visit.
It just has its own issues just like America and every other country has its own issues.
A lot of people in the anime/manga community like to pretend that Japan exists in a bubble where misogyny, homophobia and racism isn’t a thing.

They're not pretending, it's just that they don't need to be in a constant state of depression when they're trying to enjoy fiction. No one needs your "grim reminders", we're just trying to have fun.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 17, 2020 ---

The idea that Kimetsu doesn't "deserve" to beat OP is purely absurd.

Like, what exactly does a series need to "deserve" it in this context? Be on par with their favorite series? Because what makes a series popular isn't it being some kind of grand-scale story, it's the emotional connection one has to it. As a story, Kimetsu is one which connected with the readers. Simple as that.

Hell, per some sources I've read, One Piece's teen readership (AKA Jump's main audience) is nowadays in the minority, something like 10-20%. In a way, I can argue OP lost years ago, it's just Kimetsu's explosive popularity is when its loss truly became obvious.

Also, the argument of "Kimetsu's arcs are too simple"? Laughable when you consider the structure of OP's arcs tends to be even more flat when you remove the massive amounts of backstory.

S8 should have beat one piece

 

[Newkerzy]

Bakugou was intended to be read as an arrogant, talented, yet insecure kid with severe projection issues.
I don't always think it was executed well, but he was always intended to have a character arc of emotional maturity which gives the behavior substance.

Weirdly, I'm starting to think Horikoshi tried to rectify that through Endeavor's character arc. He saw what went wrong in conceptualizing Bakugou's character, and improved upon that by writing Endeavor's character arc. And now, I find myself rooting for Enji instead.

Yes, I am supporting an abusive father and husband who's also trying desperately to become a better person and mend relationships with his family.

 

[Rain Spectre]

Really, I'd argue One Piece's massive scope has become a demerit. My core complaint with the series as it has progressed it that the story has evolved in such a way to where the Straw Hats, the actual main characters, feel like meaningless bit players in the story. The sheer scope means that so much of the story being told involves them in no way.

If we're to argue that characters are what tie people to a work of fiction more than story, than Kimetsu's victory is entirely deserved.

 

[supercow297]

Really, I'd argue One Piece's massive scope has become a demerit. My core complaint with the series as it has progressed it that the story has evolved in such a way to where the Straw Hats, the actual main characters, feel like meaningless bit players in the story. The sheer scope means that so much of the story being told involves them in no way.

If we're to argue that characters are what tie people to a work of fiction more than story, than Kimetsu's victory is entirely deserved.

Nah I just caught up and goddamn One Piece's large world just paid off big time
I mean. I still hate Wano but everything else that came with it is amazing

But yeah agree big time on the characters part.

 

[Tarot]

Some of these comments that are trying to counter women harassment are just so bad that it's starting to be funny. You're literally part of the problem and the reason progress takes forever.
I'm done with this topic.

Same. I'm disappointed by most of the comments trying to defend it. Some even come off trollish like supercow's post. Feels almost like a post from 4chan.

Anyways, I'm done with the topic too. Some of the users showed their true colors and it's pointless trying to argue with them.

 

[yadayada]

I'm not saying it but I'm saying that's the reason why I don't think it deserves to beat something as ambitious as One Piece. Anyway I'm still happy for it

Some stories are better off kept short, kimetsu doesn't need 200 chapters of worldbuilding to work. Tanjirou's goal is not to become the greatest demon hunter in the world, he just wants to return his sister to normal.

Ambition, complexity, blah blah don't matter. The important thing is that the series strikes a balance and manages to grip the readers. Just because OP chose to put a lot of effort in its worldbuilding does not mean kimetsu also needs to or viceversa. A simple story can be just as good as a more ambitious one depending on how it is told.

They're simply different series.

No I like KnY for it's character writing, best in Jump rn, maaaybe Chainsawman beats it though. And good writing in general.

I second this.

 

[supercow297]

Same. I'm disappointed by most of the comments trying to defend it. Some even come off trollish like supercow's post. Feels almost like a post from 4chan.

I am not trolling whatsoever, samurai 8 joke notwithstanding. Please don't dismiss my beliefs as jokes.
I believe that the issues that we're talking about exist, matter, are complicated, many people think they know exactly how to fix it, and they don't, and many political quick fixes have widespread negative collateral damage as side effects.

 

[DreamcastDazia]

No I like KnY for it's character writing, best in Jump rn, maaaybe Chainsawman beats it though. And good writing in general.

That's fair play

 

[DreamcastDazia]

Like, what exactly does a series need to "deserve" it in this context?

It needs not do what DS is doing. It has really good character writing and fights. But that's it. The entire story is just meh and it doesn't really do anything new. Even the art is meh.

Like MHA, BC and Jujutsu offer much more.

Though I guess this is just my opinion obviously.

It's fact that the boost is only happening cause of the anime though. If it had a BC like adaptation it would just be selling okay like before

 

[yadayada]

It needs not do what DS is doing. It has really good character writing and fights. But that's it. The entire story is just meh and it doesn't really do anything new. Even the art is meh.

Like MHA, BC and Jujutsu offer much more.

Though I guess this is just my opinion obviously.

It's fact that the boost is only happening cause of the anime though. If it had a BC like adaptation it would just be selling okay like before

Again though, this is just your personal preference. Just because you want a shonen to have a grand scale it does not mean it needs to have one.

I don't want to start series wars or whatever in this thread though so I'll refrain from making comparisons.

 

[supercow297]

It needs not do what DS is doing. It has really good character writing and fights. But that's it. The entire story is just meh and it doesn't really do anything new. Even the art is meh.

Like MHA, BC and Jujutsu offer much more.

Though I guess this is just my opinion obviously.

It's fact that the boost is only happening cause of the anime though. If it had a BC like adaptation it would just be selling okay like before

I like KnY art more than MHA's. Tied with BC and Jujutsu. Jujutsu and KnY have great battle choreography and BC and KnY have great designs. The story is great. I honestly believe you are either very young still, which is fine, or have not read a lot, which is fine. When you can appreciate something like Natsume Yuujinchou or 3-Gatsu no Lion, manga with no "fights", where the story is "meh and nothing happens" like you said, you might understand different appeals to different stories.

 

[tirakai]

We've got a series plodding along right now in Samurai 8 that shows that having a grand scale for the sake of having a grand scale is pointless, series work best when conflicts are on a personal level and Kimetsu does that better of all the current WSJ battle shounen, every character feels like they deserve to be in the story and all have their own personal grudges and motivations that directly relate to the conflict. Nobody's involved simply as a satellite character.

Kimetsu might be mostly fight after fight after fight but none of them feel like they're just there for the sake of having another fight, they're all personal for the characters. The core plot may be simple but it's got a really strong progression from arc to arc and fight to fight in exchange, everything is really well tied together.

Compare it One Piece for example where most of the main cast are barely more than tag-along characters past their intro arc, they just kind of hanging around getting involved in stuff because Luffy does and they've got nothing better to do. And how many side fights and plots could just be cut out entirely? Most of them are just there for the sake of giving the side cast something to do or because Oda had a new funny idea that week.

 

[101nemesis]

There are people that disagree on which direction progress should be towards and your assumption that you automatically know all the right answers is disconcerting.

At no point did any one of us state we know what all the answers are.
What we stated was one of the existing problems prevalent everywhere and displayed very obviously in the medium we all consume here, manga.
The way you shift the problem, portray typical "but what about..." examples and defence and downplay it is what is disconcerting, to say the least.

One word replies are against forum rules right, @Buranchi?

So was talking about this topic, pages ago. But you seem quite adamant to keep doing it.

 

[Ebrietas-]

Yo why though? I'm nit trying to say this is all the series is worth and I still reeeally like it but it's basically Dragon Ball with Swords. You've got to admit. It's like 90% fights and barely anything else. Just non stop fights fights fights fights. Like comon it's a simple series. You think that should beat OP?

I think one manga that deserved to beat OP is toriko but the world is unfair. Whaaa

Kimetsu has some great character writing though and most of them don't have plot armor so the fights usually have high stakes and feel more impactful than most series.

I don't think it is a masterpiece of writing in shounen but it is absurd to call it "DB with swords" and that it doesn't deserve its success. If it'll make you feel better it will most likely not come close to OP at its peak

Really, I'd argue One Piece's massive scope has become a demerit. My core complaint with the series as it has progressed it that the story has evolved in such a way to where the Straw Hats, the actual main characters, feel like meaningless bit players in the story. The sheer scope means that so much of the story being told involves them in no way.

Of all the complaints people have of post timeskip OP, this one I don't understand. Luffy and crew are very clearly still at the center of the story and they are bigger than ever in terms of importance in the overall world. The main problem with current OP is that there is so much stuff to cover that Oda can't spend much time building character relationships/developments properly without making every arc 100 chapters long

 

[101nemesis]

Dragonball with swords. That's what Bleach was.
And it was super fun.