Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2020] - Discussion and ToC Talk

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Shinuki no Reborn

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MANGAHELPERS "TOC" POLL ISSUE #51 - VOTING!​

The poll for issue #51 is now open, vote for your favorite chapters of the week clicking HERE!

Alongside the release of Sakamoto Days, the extra series this week are:

-Dragon Ball Super 66
-Boruto: Naruto Next Generations 52
-Ghost Reaper Girl 10


Good Votes!
 
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Halloween

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Moderator Notice:
Henceforth, I will be deleting posts that complain about Weekly Shonen Jump having too many/not enough gag/battle/exorcism/sports/etc series.

These posts are not insightful, and do not meaningfully contribute to this thread. Also, this decision is not up for discussion, so posts discussing this decision will also be deleted.~ Halloween
 
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Ryuusei

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呪 僕 O マ ブ S C D 破 C B 夜 C 僕 あ 灼 ぼ チ 高 ア 森 A 仄 ぼ 次号カラー ヒロアカ アンデラ 夜桜 約ネバ 道産子 GIGA 岸本先生が描くコラボポスター 爆豪クリアファイル
Jujutsu Kaisen (Cover & LCP)
My Hero Academia
One Piece
Mashle
Black Clover
Sakamoto Days (CP)
Dr. Stone
Magu-chan: God of Destruction (CP)
Build King
Mission: Yozakura Family
Me & Roboco
Ayakashi Triangle (CP)
Shakunetsu no Niraikanai
We Never Learn
Chainsaw Man
Koukousei Kazoku
Undead Unluck
Moriking
Agravity Boys
Honomieru Shounen
Bokura no Ketsumei

Issue #1
Cover & LCP: My Hero Academia
CP: Undead Unluck, Mission: Yozakura Family, The Promised Neverland, Dosanko Gyaru wa Namaramenkoi

GIGA Preview
Collab poster by Kishimoto
Bakugou clear file
 
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perroloco

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One Piece will still have the lifetime sales record, and there's no way that gets broken in the foreseeable future.
You never know haha I mean people were probably thinking the same of Dragon Ball sales.
 

yadayada

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What I mean is right now its at volume what 19? Right? With I think 25 million sales more or less right?

So when I calculated this numbers it was idk, like maybe around 2-3 weeks ago, but I think the same numbers apply, because I calculated how much each volume should have sold before fiscal year for it to beat OP's oricon record: and it was around 2.5ish million per volume, which 2-3 weeks ago I thought there's no way this thing becomes a 2.5 million seller... At least not by fiscal year.

Anyway, currently at volume 19 with 25 million in sales in this fiscal year, it will probably release 3 more volumes this fiscal year (May, August, November) too, so each volume would sell an extra 2.5 million: +7.5 million.

25million+7.5million= 32.5 million

So there's "only" 5.5 million more volumes needed to be sold, which obviously would be sold thru backlog sales.

So 19 volumes would need to be sold in this theoretical case. 5.5mill/19= 290,000ish per volume.

So I saw that last week all volumes of KnY have sold 2+million copies, I assume this week most sold an extra 100,000ish so that plus the 290,000 in this hypothetical case is around 2.4 million needed per volume.

So rounded up is 2.5million, but yeah basically around 2.4million-ish in sales for each volume of KnY released this year would do the trick. 2.5million sales are just needed to be on the super duper sure side of things.

I still think demand could probably be met.. at least I hope, lol I love One Piece and don't want its record broken by an overhyped manga. (yeah I'm salty).





Realistically it's very, very, very likely it will happen. But that's not really how sales work.. I mean I don't know the numbers or how close it is to satisfying demand, but when it finally does the backlog will sell less and less every week.

I know there's a new print of volumes coming around end of March I think?

Right now every volume has sold around 2.1 million, so the thing is if the next batch of reprints is around 200k and it sells then it will be at 2.3 million per volume which slightly puts it behind the volume count (I calculated, again my numbers might be wrong but I doubt it... Math is math lol).

IF demand hasn't been met with this new batch of prints and they make another one then KnY will fairly surley beat One Piece (and by a very large margin, as that would mean it being best before mid-year maybe, with the help of volume 20 sales of course).

IF the second thing happens and demand is met Kimetsu would still have a very high chance of dethroning OP's record, but it wouldn't be a walk in the park like in scenario 1.. it would need for the next volumes to sell super good (which ofc they will) and maybe the movie boost or something.

Again all scenarios give KnY the advantage.
But when you say that KnY sold 25m in 3 months and a half it makes you look like you expect for KnY to sell around what? 80m this year? That's not really how sales work, it will at some point reach a peak in sales and then slowly but surely diminish week by week.

Wasn't last week almost 4million in sales and now around 1.7million?
For all we know last week was probably its peak (I know it was a reprint week) so if for example next reprint week it sells noticeably less than the almost 4million week (let's say 2.5million) we will know for almost sure that hype is dying out and demand has been met.

A pattern of weekly sales once demand is met could drop by Idk 50-60% week by week (that's certainly what happens in most mediums like book sales, movie box office, videogames, etc) and it will eventually happen, Kimetsu No Yaiba isn't an exception to the rule of supply and demand, the question is just when.

So in this example once demand is met.

Week1: 1.5mill (This week)
Week2: 1.0mill
Week3: 500k
Week4: 2mill (Reprint week, end of march I think?) 300k from previous backlog + 1.7mill "new backlog reprints" sales (each volume selling around 100k copies).
Week6: 1.3mill
Week7: 700k
Week8: 350k
Week9: 200k (Demand was met in Week 6 and sales are sligthly going down week by week)
Week10: 2mill (Early May, volume 20 release, volume 20 sells 1.8mill backlog 200k)

In this particular example KnY would have sold 9.55 million in the second half of the first mid half part of the year, totaling 34.5 million, needing around 3.5+ extra million which would be easily done by more backlog sales and volumes 21 and 22.

So yeah, this is the "best case" scenario for it to not beat One Piece, and it still looks like a 95% certainty that it will lol.


This kinda reminds me of Ring Fit Adventure and how demand was never met lol.

Big tl,Dr:
I'm almost sure it will beat One Piece but if demand is met then it's gonna be a long race, not a short sprint to the finish line.
and maybe, just maybe KnY could end up being just shy of beating OP.
Look at sales for everything, once demand is met sales go down 50%-70% week by week.
This is...so much theorycrafting for something so unlikely, lol.

Even in your handpicked scenario you are forgetting something, because the series also got a reprint today/yesterday which will likely hit the stores next week. So you're probably looking at next week being lower with another spike the week after that, and THEN another reprint in the middle of march. And then you have the movie coming out sometime this year as well.

Like, it's really so unlikely.
 

Ryuusei

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What I mean is right now its at volume what 19? Right? With I think 25 million sales not or less right?

So when I calculated this numbers it was idk, like maybe around 2-3 weeks ago, but I think the same numbers apply, because I calculated how much each volume should have sold before fiscal year for it to beat OP's oricon record: and it was around 2.5ish million per volume, which 2-3 weeks ago I thought there's no way this thing becomes a 2.5 million seller... At least not by fiscal year.

Anyway, currently at volume 19 with 25 million in sales in this fiscal year, it will probably release 3 more volumes this fiscal year (May, August, November) too, so each volume would sell an extra 2.5 million: +7.5 million.

25million+7.5million= 32.5 million

So there's "only" 5.5 million more volumes needed to be sold, which obviously would be sold thru backlog sales.

So 19 volumes would need to be sold in this theoretical case. 5.5mill/19= 290,000ish per volume.

So I saw that last week all volumes of KnY have sold 2+million copies, I assume this week most sold an extra 100,000ish so that plus the 290,000 in this hypothetical case is around 2.4 million needed per volume.

So rounded up is 2.5million, but yeah basically around 2.4million-ish in sales for each volume of KnY released this year would do the trick. 2.5million sales are just needed to be on the super duper sure side of things.

I still think demand could probably be met.. at least I hope, lol I love One Piece and don't want its record broken by an overhyped manga. (yeah I'm salty).





Realistically it's very, very, very likely it will happen. But that's not really how sales work.. I mean I don't know the numbers or how close it is to satisfying demand, but when it finally does the backlog will sell less and less every week.

I know there's a new print of volumes coming around end of March I think?

Right now every volume has sold around 2.1 million, so the thing is if the next batch of reprints is around 200k and it sells then it will be at 2.3 million per volume which slightly puts it behind the volume count (I calculated, again my numbers might be wrong but I doubt it... Math is math lol).

IF demand hasn't been met with this new batch of prints and they make another one then KnY will fairly surley beat One Piece (and by a very large margin, as that would mean it being best before mid-year maybe, with the help of volume 20 sales of course).

IF the second thing happens and demand is met Kimetsu would still have a very high chance of dethroning OP's record, but it wouldn't be a walk in the park like in scenario 1.. it would need for the next volumes to sell super good (which ofc they will) and maybe the movie boost or something.

Again all scenarios give KnY the advantage.
But when you say that KnY sold 25m in 3 months and a half it makes you look like you expect for KnY to sell around what? 80m this year? That's not really how sales work, it will at some point reach a peak in sales and then slowly but surely diminish week by week.

Wasn't last week almost 4million in sales and now around 1.7million?
For all we know last week was probably its peak (I know it was a reprint week) so if for example next reprint week it sells noticeably less than the almost 4million week (let's say 2.5million) we will know for almost sure that hype is dying out and demand has been met.

A pattern of weekly sales once demand is met could drop by Idk 50-60% week by week (that's certainly what happens in most mediums like book sales, movie box office, videogames, etc) and it will eventually happen, Kimetsu No Yaiba isn't an exception to the rule of supply and demand, the question is just when.

So in this example once demand is met.

Week1: 1.5mill (This week)
Week2: 1.0mill
Week3: 500k
Week4: 2mill (Reprint week, end of march I think?) 300k from previous backlog + 1.7mill "new backlog reprints" sales (each volume selling around 100k copies).
Week6: 1.3mill
Week7: 700k
Week8: 350k
Week9: 200k (Demand was met in Week 6 and sales are sligthly going down week by week)
Week10: 2mill (Early May, volume 20 release, volume 20 sells 1.8mill backlog 200k)

In this particular example KnY would have sold 9.55 million in the second half of the first mid half part of the year, totaling 34.5 million, needing around 3.5+ extra million which would be easily done by more backlog sales and volumes 21 and 22.

So yeah, this is the "best case" scenario for it to not beat One Piece, and it still looks like a 95% certainty that it will lol.


This kinda reminds me of Ring Fit Adventure and how demand was never met lol.

Big tl,Dr:
I'm almost sure it will beat One Piece but if demand is met then it's gonna be a long race, not a short sprint to the finish line.
I think you missed it in my post but there's literally reprints out in the stores right now. With another batch going out in March, it literally means demand hasn't been met yet and if there's another batch of reprints in April (which will probably happen and we'll heard about in one or two weeks), demand won't be met by March. It's not a case of "reprints selling less", it's a case of reprints running out, which they do all the time. So yes, the overhyped manga will break OP's record. And you keep repeating "that's not how sales work" when KNY has literally been selling an insane amount of volumes since October last year. KNY is following its own pattern, so yes it might as well sell as much as 60 million or even more this year alone. Yes eventually it will reach a peak but as of now it doesn't look like said peak is coming anytime soon.
 

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I've been wondering for a while now about what's stopping Jigokuraku from gaining more traction. It's selling decently but I really feel like it has everything it needs to succeed atleast as a moderately successful hit.
Nothing is stopping it really, the source material is incredible as it is. The series is already improving in sales with each volume and getting reprints so that's a good sign. All we can do is wait for the eventual anime (seriously hope its well produced & adapted) and awards can always help in sales. Its already selling well for a Jump+ title and competing with titles in the main magazine like Act Age/WNL.

It does deserve much much more but Im waiting for its anime where it'll get its big boost. It can potentially be one of those series that gets a full adaptation since it won't go for that long.
 

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@yadayada @Ryuusei well fuck me sideways lol I didn't account for this week's reprint run lol yeah in this case then OP's record is pretty much broken now, I thought the newest print run was scheduled for March, and yeah it's pretty likely it will get another print run in April. So unless the print runs are like 100k each (Which in all likeness won't be, the print runs will probably be Idk maybe 200k each which is more than enough to dominate OP's record).

Yeah, my bad, didn't read that part I guess haha.
 

101nemesis

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I still think demand could probably be met.. at least I hope, lol I love One Piece and don't want its record broken by an overhyped manga. (yeah I'm salty).
All super popular series including OP, Naruto, Kingdom, Bleach, YYH, DBZ, FMA, Kenshin, Death Note are overhyped.
 

animeexpert

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All super popular series including OP, Naruto, Kingdom, Bleach, YYH, DBZ, FMA, Kenshin, Death Note are overhyped.
big cap my guy :disappoint, atleast most werent carried by their animation to beat the #1 king of shonen
 

perroloco

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All super popular series including OP, Naruto, Kingdom, Bleach, YYH, DBZ, FMA, Kenshin, Death Note are overhyped.
In a sense... Yes, kinda, sorta... maybe? But they grew over time slowly but surely, volume by volume, in a sense it just feels different, you know? I really, really don't want this to sound the way is gonna sound, but KnY sales I mean a 10x increase of sales just feels like it got "lucky" with its anime adaptation.

For example, in One Piece case it's particularly interesting because it got ranked 1st in the TOCs back since its very beginning like there was something promising for One Piece, the sales were good too, and of course like in a lot of cases the anime adaptation (probably as I don't have the numbers) boosted it sales and then it sold better and better volume by volume breaking records (by volume 23 IIRC it had broken Slam Dunk's previous record), then in 2011 a mix of a defining arc (Marineford), hype on a movie (Strong World) lead to its Oricon historic sales (Which are set to be broken soon).

2-3 days ago back when the video with the entire WSJ history TOC was posted I made a post about how Kimetsu had been (prior to anime) sort of a "hidden" gem in the mud, because it had been in VERY good TOC positions (Indicating the 130k sales were waaaaay below what it should have been selling, since most manga that ranked 5th-ish in TOCs constantly sold way better -around 500k life time sales per volume for the lower end of them, e.g. Eyeshield 21. Which KnY wasn't selling, KnY lifetime sales per volume would have probably ended around 300k per volume in the long run at the pace it was selling (think 20 years from now) which was short by 30-40%.

In economic terms that would be underselling, it was kinda unprecedented (By a quick glance at the video and checking easylove's 125 WSJ sales) that a top5 ranked manga sold that low.. So in a sense, in the long run, it's low sales probably helped it sell more. (I have a theory about how hiatus manga like Hunter x Hunter or Berserk have stayed relevant thru the decades thanks to their hiatuses, so in a sense KnY being "undersold" also helped it in the long run, because once people realized that it was a good story, then they bought it in mass, thus buying every volume and creating a hype around it that hasn't been satisfied yet.

So basically no one expected it to grow the way it did, not Shueisha, nor Ufo Table, nor Getouge... No one. I mean even a 100% raise from 130k-ish to 260k-ish would have been nice for it and in the long run it could have sold around 400k-ish per volume would that have been the case... Instead it got 10x (And maybe higher)

It surely is an interesting study case on marketing, I mean if we are being honest Kimetsu no Yaiba's growth will probably be a case of study in future generations of marketing classes in Japan and stuff like that, I'm not kidding, it is that impressive.


I don't know if whomever is reading this post has read Naruto, but it's kinda like the Rock Lee vs Gaara fight, you root for Lee, a guy that steadily but surely rose through hard work.. but in the end the geniusly strong Gaara beats the sh*t out of him It feels that way to me now that KnY is overhyped and IMO oversold lol.
 

BX-02BLODIA

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Do you think Miura took notes from that Chainsaw spread? I feel like he's gonna try to outlewd Fujimoto sooner or later. Maybe start a friendly rivalry or something.
 
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perroloco

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When I read stuff like "most of the people buying it are 40 year old females" I realise people take 4chan's memes way too seriously, holy shit.
Can I ask why? I literally meant what I said, unless I was trolled by fake news that was the demography that bought most KnY volumes according to a graph I saw (probably posted here).
 

yadayada

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Can I ask why? I literally meant what I said, unless I was trolled by fake news that was the demography that bought most KnY volumes according to a graph I saw (probably posted here).
I wouldn't be surprised if male-female demographic was like 40-60 or even 30-70, it's the 40 year old part that is funny.
 

101nemesis

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Also @101nemesis really? What talk show talked about Kingdom that doubled it sales, I'm curious could you elaborate a bit, was it pre-anime?
You can google it.
This was post anime. Kingdom post anime was selling 300k ish. Post talk show boost, it sells close to a million.
 

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Can I ask why? I literally meant what I said, unless I was trolled by fake news that was the demography that bought most KnY volumes according to a graph I saw (probably posted here).
I think I saw an updated report where KnY was seen by all kind of demographics, from kids to older people. Basically, an entire family.
 

pamuchi

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On a side note...
Do you think the upcoming volumes sales will be affected by the epidemic? I've hear that in Hokkaido declared state of emergency.
 

101nemesis

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On a side note...
Do you think the upcoming volumes sales will be affected by the epidemic? I've hear that in Hokkaido declared state of emergency.
Probably. We will need to wait and see.
 

yadayada

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I really wonder where all those millions of fujos buying manga were when series with maximum fujo pandering like Kuroko were running.
 

Halloween

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Guys, let's cut down on the sarcastic responses, please. This thread is for analytics of WSJ, not for mocking the opinions of users.
 

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I really wonder where all those millions of fujos buying manga were when series with maximum fujo pandering like Kuroko were running.
Probably right there. Kuroko sold almost 9 million copies in its peak year, and not far from that in the others, making it the second biggest in the magazine. Same with Haikyuu. I've heard the same things said about them at the time. The character designs make it more fitting at face value, but the sudden explosion of KnY and the mass influx of non magazine readers gives more ground to these theories in my opinion.
 
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