One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Pirate Queen]

9 year old Oden could wield Enma... none of the 9RS could wield a blade Oden could when he was 9? Lol.




,

 

[Fox666]

His body is more durable than bodies made of flesh and blood, Kaido and BM aside.

Sorry but I think that comparing Mr. 1 durability to Kaido and Big Mom is a stretch.

Mr. 1 is not durable by One Piece standards.

All CP9 members can use Tekkai, which make their bodies as hard as steel, right? Yet the monster trio or Franky could fight them pre-timeskip.

The Pacifistas are made of a material stronger than steel, which Zoro couldn't cut through. But post-timeskip the monster trio could easily destroy a Pacifista with a single blow.

We can conclude that any character that survived blows from Luffy or Sanji have more durability than Mr. 1.

Kaido or Big Mom are on a completely different level. Even Law who cut a mountain of steel (Ceasar's lab) shouldn't be able to do anything to them.

Nobody else in Wano has managed to tame Enma aside from Oden Kozuki and still, Zoro needs to prove himself above Scabbards...

Didn't Hitetsu said Zoro could do it because he was already used to a sword by the same master?

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

The reaction of the Scabbards who have seen Oden cut Kaido:

Nobody else in Wano has managed to tame Enma aside from Oden Kozuki and still, Zoro needs to prove himself above Scabbards...

Also you seem to have missed out on the build up to this. Zoro could never achieve this feat by himself. He needed to be flung to the sky at great speeds hence cutting the huge golem was made possible.
Non of the spectators in that panel knew how Zoro did that hence they were all shocked seeing him get cut down.

You tend to pay zero attention to details, all you are interested in is worship the future number 2 of the StrawHats (cos currently his position as the number 2 combatant is in doubt).

Same thing with your usual go-to for durability, Zoro taking Luffy's damage. You seem to forget how messed up Zoro got to the extent that he never recovered from that until the Time Skip and this is not even counting how long he remained unconscious after that event.
Luffy on the other hand has demonic healing prowess, together with his crazy endurance.
Zoro will never surpass his captain that much is fact!

 

[Sachsenhesse]

You seem to forget how messed up Zoro got to the extent that he never recovered from that until the Time Skip and this is not even counting how long he remained unconscious after that event.

Wow. You on the otherhand seem to forget, that Zoro was on his limit their already. He fought Ryuma, Oz,Oz+Moria, got hit by a Ursus Shock and fought briefly with Kuma afterwards.

Then on the bring of death, he took all the damage from Luffy on top of that, which was enough to knock Luffy unconscious.

Of course he was near death afterwards, the only person who could handle more punishment was WB so far.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Wow. You on the otherhand seem to forget, that Zoro was on his limit their already. He fought Ryuma, Oz,Oz+Moria, got hit by a Ursus Shock and fought briefly with Kuma afterwards.

Then on the bring of death, he took all the damage from Luffy on top of that, which was enough to knock Luffy unconscious.

Of course he was near death afterwards, the only person who could handle more punishment was WB so far.

Whatever limit he was on was nothing compared to what Luffy went through. Taking in a 100 shadows was already some extremely crazy stuff.
Luffy had been enduring pain upon pain throughout that battle and was the focal point in taking down the 2 major enemies Oz and Moriah. In fact no one else could take on Moriah from IIRC and had to leave it to their ever reliable captain.
Of course Luffy will be out cold after all that.

Yes Zoro took in his pain which was a death sentence for him regardless of how badass he looked taking it.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Whatever limit he was on was nothing compared to what Luffy went through. Taking in a 100 shadows was already some extremely crazy stuff.
Luffy had been enduring pain upon pain throughout that battle and was the focal point in taking down the 2 major enemies Oz and Moriah. In fact no one else could take on Moriah from IIRC and had to leave it to their ever reliable captain.
Of course Luffy will be out cold after all that.

Yes Zoro took in his pain which was a death sentence for him regardless of how badass he looked taking it.

Zoro's feats shouldn't be downplayed just to make a point.

What he did was impressive

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Zoro's feats shouldn't be downplayed just to make a point.

What he did was impressive

It was. I'm not claiming otherwise. The TB event led to one of my favourite panels and badass moments of Zoro.

Doesn't make him any stronger than we know he already is (second to Luffy in the crew) neither does it sky rocket him to the level of a "god" as one guy seems to think.

 

[nik87]

Enma is Oden's sword and keepsake for his children. Of course non of the Scabbards would stoop so low to taking Oden's sword when each has his own nor would they do that given their awe, love and respect for the man.
But no Zoro, he's the guy who needs to upgrade swords so as to be able to match the very best Samurai of Wano. How convenient he gets a legendary sword used by the legendary Oden.

So, Oda dropping the line "the only man to tame Enma was Kozuki Oden" means nothing because according to you, nobody else tried?
Lmao, what are you talking about? Zoro needs to upgrade the swords? No. He needed a replacement for kokuto Shusui that was taken away from him.

Sorry but I think that comparing Mr. 1 durability to Kaido and Big Mom is a stretch.
Mr. 1 is not durable by One Piece standards.
All CP9 members can use Tekkai, which make their bodies as hard as steel, right? Yet the monster trio or Franky could fight them pre-timeskip.
The Pacifistas are made of a material stronger than steel, which Zoro couldn't cut through. But after time-skip the monster trio couldn't easily destroy a Pacifista with a single blow.
We can conclude that any character that survived blows from Luffy or Sanji have more durability than Mr. 1.
Kaido or Big Mom are on a completely different level. Even Law who cut a mountain of steel (Ceasar's lab) shouldn't be able to do anything to them.

I am not comparing Mr1's body to Kaido's and BM...
CP9's Rankyaku could cut through thick steel and yet it failed to cut through Luffy and Sanji. Are Luffy and Sanji tougher than thick steel? Imagine if Luffy and Sanji additionally had Mr1's fruit...
Would BM be more durable if she ate Mr1's fruit?
You keep equating steel body of an actual character to steel objects and machines... They are worlds apart in durability. Mr1 has 4th most durable body.

Didn't Hitetsu said Zoro could do it because he was already used to a sword by the same master?

Is that that stoping Zoro's haki mastery from being on a very high level?

Also you seem to have missed out on the build up to this. Zoro could never achieve this feat by himself. He needed to be flung to the sky at great speeds hence cutting the huge golem was made possible.
Non of the spectators in that panel knew how Zoro did that hence they were all shocked seeing him get cut down.

You tend to pay zero attention to details, all you are interested in is worship the future number 2 of the StrawHats (cos currently his position as the number 2 combatant is in doubt).

Same thing with your usual go-to for durability, Zoro taking Luffy's damage. You seem to forget how messed up Zoro got to the extent that he never recovered from that until the Time Skip and this is not even counting how long he remained unconscious after that event.
Luffy on the other hand has demonic healing prowess, together with his crazy endurance.
Zoro will never surpass his captain that much is fact!

Bullshit. Zoro didnt need to be flung to be able to golem and you have already proof for that. The only thing the throw did was close the distance between Zoro and the mountain. Whatever you think it did, was nullified after first slash because Zoro landed at King's plateau and proceeded to cut him up without any effect of the throw.
I pay zero attention?
Zoro dwarfed Luffy's endurance whether you like it or not. He took all of Luffy's on top of his own while Luffy was out cold just from his own stuff.
Zoro will never surpass his captain? Mon cheri, he doesnt need to surpass him because he never stopped being above him.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Dwarf'd is also a bit much.

Zoro took more pain than Luffy, but Luffy recovered far quicker.

Both feats equally impressive.

It's not like Zoro took the pain and kept going. He took the pain and was just useless afterwards. Endurance, in the sense some use it, is the ability to keep going.

His pain tolerance was higher than Luffy's not his endurance.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 7, 2020, Original Post Date: Apr 7, 2020 ---

And the feat is outdated anyway. Luffy has done far more impressive things since then

 

[Sachsenhesse]

And the feat is outdated anyway. Luffy has done far more impressive things since then

Only thing i can imagine is being on Ivas steroids to fight poison and exhaustion until the death of Ace.

 

[M3J]

For Daz, remember, his skin isn't blades, he can make his body blades. But it requires him to actively do it. Luffy is able to avoid the blades and hit him, hitting him isn't equivalent to hitting a sword unless Daz turns that body part into a blade at point of impact. Given his grunts, he still gets internal damage from strikes, but getting hit with a sword by Zoro fits into his strength - a sword fight. We don't know how he'd react to blunt attacks the way Luffy delivers them. Luffy punched Crocodile through how many feet of rock? You don't think Daz would be feeling those punches?

Luffy>Crocodile>Zoro>Daz is likely the ranking of that arc at the end.

Yes I know all that. how can Luffy avoid the blades though, if Daz can make his body mostly blades, like he did his wrist in that panel Lexus or someone showed?

If Daz took blunt attacks from Luffy, he'd definitely feel it. I don't know how good his durability is, but if Luffy can avoid being sliced by the blades or prevent the blades from popping up, then it's Luffy's fight.

Whatever limit he was on was nothing compared to what Luffy went through. Taking in a 100 shadows was already some extremely crazy stuff.
Luffy had been enduring pain upon pain throughout that battle and was the focal point in taking down the 2 major enemies Oz and Moriah. In fact no one else could take on Moriah from IIRC and had to leave it to their ever reliable captain.
Of course Luffy will be out cold after all that.

Yes Zoro took in his pain which was a death sentence for him regardless of how badass he looked taking it.

Are you talking about Zoro's limit before taking in Luffy's exhaustion and pain? Because after doing that, it was way worse than what Luffy went through.

I'm willing to bet Luffy chose to faint, though.

 

[albertwv]

EVERYONE just stop talking about Daz and Zoro already, it really is annoying having to go back and forth with Nik. Let him be in his own fantasy world but dont get dragged in with him.

 

[Luke Beifong]

So, Oda dropping the line "the only man to tame Enma was Kozuki Oden" means nothing because according to you, nobody else tried?
Lmao, what are you talking about? Zoro needs to upgrade the swords? No. He needed a replacement for kokuto Shusui that was taken away from him.

Well, if @AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA isn’t talking this, I say, no one ever master Enma because no one ever tried to do this. Yes, Enma needs a great Haki control, but it’s not impossible for anyone to active this level of mastery over CoA Haki. If you have a good CoA Haki, you can train with Enma to improve even more and become stronger. Can be difficult, but it’s not impossible, it’s far from impossible. Course, if you don’t control your Haki or don’t have a good control over it, Enma can kill you. I’m not saying that Brook can use Enma. But if Asura Doji or Denjiro trie to use Enma, I can see them mastering the sword in no time. They only never tried to do this in respect for Oden’s wish to his children to use his swords.

 

[Fox666]

CP9's Rankyaku could cut through thick steel and yet it failed to cut through Luffy and Sanji. Are Luffy and Sanji tougher than thick steel?

Have they really stoped an attack like that with their flesh?

 

[XXGenesis]

We still talking about Zoro, & Daz Bones..Dead ass.

if the conversation isn't around Zoro PL, Zoro pl comparison, Mihawk vs Shanks or Mhawk Vs Everyone, it's not a topic huh....

I'm tired. See you guys after quarantine is over.

 

[nik87]

Well, if @AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA isn’t talking this, I say, no one ever master Enma because no one ever tried to do this. Yes, Enma needs a great Haki control, but it’s not impossible for anyone to active this level of mastery over CoA Haki. If you have a good CoA Haki, you can train with Enma to improve even more and become stronger. Can be difficult, but it’s not impossible, it’s far from impossible. Course, if you don’t control your Haki or don’t have a good control over it, Enma can kill you. I’m not saying that Brook can use Enma. But if Asura Doji or Denjiro trie to use Enma, I can see them mastering the sword in no time. They only never tried to do this in respect for Oden’s wish to his children to use his swords.

That cannot possibly be true.
What's the point of Oda dropping the line "no one ever" if no one tried? Lol
How can Kinemon know that sword is bad news if he never tried?
It means that no one can tame Enma in Wano, aside Oden. It includes all characters that existed since Enma was forged, you wont see evidence of each and every one of them trying it but that's what that line means.
Zoro's portrayal is leagues above citizens of Wano.

Have they really stoped an attack like that with their flesh?

Yes.

 

[Fox666]

Yes.

What sort of thing you are referring to?

 

[nik87]

What sort of thing you are referring to?

I am saying that Rankyaku has gone through a steel reinforced warship and didnt leave a scratch on neither Sanji nor Luffy.
Are you finally starting to understand the difference between an object's durability and durability of a body?

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

You can say "it should not be that long before he became a yonko", but 6 years is long! And it's all there in the text. Try reading it!

I was talking nicely. No need to be so childish and insult me.
6 years was not long, it can't be called a decade.
Also if you want to rely on the text, a good reminder for you is that even though shanks uses sword, yet mihawk is still the strongest swordsman.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 8, 2020, Original Post Date: Apr 8, 2020 ---

And he doesn't have a large fleet, nor does he seem to control territory

Actually he has, one of his territory was invaded by barto crew in the cover story

 

[thedude]

I was talking nicely. No need to be so childish and insult me.
6 years was not long, it can't be called a decade.
Also if you want to rely on the text, a good reminder for you is that even though shanks uses sword, yet mihawk is still the strongest swordsman.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 8, 2020, Original Post Date: Apr 8, 2020 ---

Actually he has, one of his territory was invaded by barto crew in the cover story

Whitebeard also used a sword. Was Mihawk stronger than him? You do know people have multiple ways of fighting, right?

6 years is long. In 2 years, Luffy went from struggling to beat a Pacifista with his entire crew to casually one shotting them. That's 2 years, not 6. In the few months since then, he's improved his CoO haki to the point he can fight Katakuri, and is now improving his CoA haki to the point he can damage Kaido internally.

So do you really want to say 6 years isn't a long time???