Team Team August vs Team Irene

[Ramen]

Larcade has dragon slayer magic too. In that case.

No......no he doesn't.

This was never said about Larcade:

Spoiler

 

[Verter]

And August has Acno magic to nullify all magic against him.
Also August has magic to nullify all physical damage on him.

 

[Ramen]

And August has Acno magic to nullify all magic against him.
Also August has magic to nullify all physical damage on him.

No he doesn't.

 

[Verter]

No......no he doesn't.

This was never said about Larcade:

Spoiler

Same Macarov said anyone in Team Natsu can defeat Ajeel.
Same Macarov did not Gray DeS.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Oct 12, 2020 ---

No he doesn't.

Why? It same rule as for Dragon slayer magic,

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 12, 2020 ---

You imagined one ability, I imagined another.

 

[Ramen]

Same Macarov said anyone in Team Natsu can defeat Ajeel.
Same Macarov did not Gray DeS.

What does this even mean?

Why? It same rule as for Dragon slayer magic,

Because his hax won't work on a being far stronger than himself. We've seen Brandish not being able to even affect Aldoron in the slightest because the latter was far too strong.

August is not nullifying a roar from Acnologia.

August can't even comprehend Acno's speed.

 

[Verter]

Also, Irene is Great Enchanter.
DS magic is enchant also.

Irene knows all types of DS magic !

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Oct 12, 2020 ---

Because his hax won't work on a being far stronger than himself. We've seen Brandish not being able to even affect Aldoron in the slightest because the latter was far too strong.

August is not nullifying a roar from Acnologia.

August can't even comprehend Acno's speed.

Which roar ?

August did not react on Acno attack , while Wendy did.

Wendy >>>> August.

 

[Ramen]

Which roar ?

Any

August did not react on Acno attack , while Wendy did.

Wendy >>>> August.

When did Wendy react to an attack from a dead serious Acno with the intent to kill?

 

[Verter]

P.S. Maybe we stop fooling around ?

There's no any single one confirmation August is able to use DS magic.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Oct 12, 2020 ---

Any



When did Wendy react to an attack from a dead serious Acno with the intent to kill?

When August faced Acno roar at first place? Stop use "imaginations" which does not exist in manga.

August met Acno when he killed Serena. August failed even notice his attack.
Wendy was able to react on his attacks (f.e. in battle 7DS vs Acno)

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 12, 2020 ---

Spoiler

Anyway, it long time had disproved.

He can not use holder type magic,

Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy? Macarov said "everyone under the sun"........... whyyyyyyyyyyyy????!!!

***

Maybe holder type magic is not under the Sun, but under the Moon ?!

 

[Nie Li]

Larcade has dragon slayer magic too. In that case.

Please, don't be a child about this. You can choose to disagree with the manga's own explanation about August but don't try to ridicule it with absurd statements.

Why would Larcade know DS magic? Larcade's magic is light magic, not copying magic, so there's no reason to support this. Unlike August.

And August has Acno magic to nullify all magic against him.
Also August has magic to nullify all physical damage on him.

There're 2 ways to justify August doesn't have Acnologia's magic.

1- Since Acnologia negates magic used on him, August's "copy magic" was negated and thus could not copy it.

2- Acnologia is just that much stronger than August that he's immune to his hax.

August does have good physical durability, though. Gildart's final attack with Holder Magic didn't knock him out.

There's a third explanation:

3- Mashima's writing most of the time sucks and makes not much sense, like Acnologia being teleported away against his will (with magic) or Gray never using his demon slayer ability to eat ice. Or August not using any spell to defend against Gildart's Holder Magic, despite him having copied not only DS magic but also Jellal's barriers or Racer's speed.

You imagined one ability, I imagined another.

August's copy magic is not imagined, it was well explained in the manga as a magic that can copy any kind of magic, and when it was explained, there was a panel of Natsu's face right besides a panel of August using a fire spell on Natsu. Coincidence? Of course not.

Also, Irene is Great Enchanter.
DS magic is enchant also.

Irene knows all types of DS magic !

DS magic is not an enchantment. It can be enchanted into objects, but it's not an enchantment. It's caster-type.

P.S. Maybe we stop fooling around ?

There's no any single one confirmation August is able to use DS magic.

One would think of the time August's magic was explained with a pictured example of him copying DS magic as one confirmation but if you don't, then don't.

 

[Axiomus]

I think what @Tirl said here is correct.

Dragons were affected by Face too, they used their natural strength and speed to destroy them, and didn't use any magical attacks as far as I know.

Acnologia was floored by Igneel at the same time as well. I find it hard to believe this was by coincidence. IMO it's due to Face. Face probably nerfed Acno far more than it did to other dragons, because he's originally not a dragon. His strength comes from his DS magic, while dragons are born with their enormous strength and speed
He roared Igneel AFTER Face got destroyed.

The parent dragons used magical attacks to destroy face. Skiadrum used a bunch of blasts, and was covering himself in shadow. Weisslogia coated himself in light. Igneel, while not destroying face, was still setting himself on fire. And you're not going to convince me that the dragons can just naturally do this, because there is no way shadows would behave the way it does on Skiadrum if it weren't magical.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

There's also the fact that to actually stop face, you need to destroy the magic itself. Merely breaking the physical structure of face doesn't actually stop it. I doubt there's any way of destroying magic without using magic yourself.

There's no reason Acnologia would be disproportionally affected by face. He had the body of a dragon. More importantly....Dragons use magic just as much as humans do, and shouldn't have any special resistance to face's magic. If anything, Acnologia is the only dragon that has a special resistance to all types of magic. The parent dragons were just resistant to magic of their own element.

If someone had all of their MP wiped out, then it would take time for them to recover. Think of when Eclipse wiped out Natsu's MP. Took him the rest of the day to recover. Acnologia still had enough MP to roar at Igneel pretty much minutes after face went down. Now if you think he can recover that much MP in a couple of minutes, that's one thing. But if you don't, then face simply didn't wipe out all of his power. Mind you, a single roar from Acnologia probably contains more MP than everyone at Tartaros combined.

 

[Nie Li]

Anyway, it long time had disproved.

He can not use holder type magic,

Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy? Macarov said "everyone under the sun"........... whyyyyyyyyyyyy????!!!

***

Maybe holder type magic is not under the Sun, but under the Moon ?!

August can use and copy holder magic. Once again, don't be a child in ridiculing what you disagree with.

The thing about holder magic is that it's magic that either comes from an object or needs said object to work. August can copy and use it, obviously, but he still needs said object to make it work, which he doesn't have in a normal fight.

 

[Verter]

August can use and copy holder magic. Once again, don't be a child in ridiculing what you disagree with.

The thing about holder magic is that it's magic that either comes from an object or needs said object to work. August can copy and use it, obviously, but he still needs said object to make it work, which he doesn't have in a normal fight.

Cana is not Lucy. Cana throws her cards to target.
August could even touch them if he wished.

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--- Double Post Merged, Oct 13, 2020 ---

But he did not do it. Why?

 

[Nie Li]

Because I don't consider as serious all last posts. Why I need re-read it? It's just "mirror pay back"

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 13, 2020, Original Post Date: Oct 13, 2020 ---

Cana is not Lucy. Cana throws her cards to target.
August could even touch them if he wished.

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And what's your point? He doesn't need to touch a magic to use it, but he also cannot use holder magic without holding the object it is used through. He would need to use the cards in combat himself and even then it's a magic that would only come through the card and not through his body so there's no "nullifying that in defense".

 

[Verter]

And what's your point? He doesn't need to touch a magic to use it, but he also cannot use holder magic without holding the object it is used through. He would need to use the cards in combat himself and even then it's a magic that would only come through the card and not through his body so there's no "nullifying that in defense".

I say about cards. Cards are object. With that logic I heard here, if August gets object (cards) he should be able to cancel its magic.
He did not do it. Why ? (c)

 

[Nie Li]

I say about cards. Cards are object. With that logic I heard here, if August gets object (cards) he should be able to cancel its magic.
He did not do it. Why ? (c)

I just explained it to you.

 

[Verter]

I just explained it to you.

No. You did not. (it's not sarcasm, nor trolling)

Your words:
"And what's your point? He doesn't need to touch a magic to use it, but he also cannot use holder magic without holding the object it is used through. He would need to use the cards in combat himself and even then it's a magic that would only come through the card and not through his body so there's no "nullifying that in defense"."

Cana uses her magic via cards. Cards are medium(s). Cana literally "gives" her cards to August.
Re-ask my question:
- Why August could not catch her cards ? (if originally it should touch his body via attack)
- If August hold her cards in his hands, why August can not nulify / copy it's magic (= object /medium in his hands).

 

[Verter]

There're 2 ways to justify August doesn't have Acnologia's magic.

1- Since Acnologia negates magic used on him, August's "copy magic" was negated and thus could not copy it.

2- Acnologia is just that much stronger than August that he's immune to his hax.

August does have good physical durability, though. Gildart's final attack with Holder Magic didn't knock him out.

There's a third explanation:

3- Mashima's writing most of the time sucks and makes not much sense, like Acnologia being teleported away against his will (with magic) or Gray never using his demon slayer ability to eat ice. Or August not using any spell to defend against Gildart's Holder Magic, despite him having copied not only DS magic but also Jellal's barriers or Racer's speed.

I assume how Mest was able to manipulate Brandish mind is 3rd option too, right ?

Because the allergie thing was funny, but explainable one. Mest and Brandish issue does not fit very well with your 1 and 2 explanation.

 

[grey matter]

The parent dragons used magical attacks to destroy face. Skiadrum used a bunch of blasts, and was covering himself in shadow. Weisslogia coated himself in light. Igneel, while not destroying face, was still setting himself on fire. And you're not going to convince me that the dragons can just naturally do this, because there is no way shadows would behave the way it does on Skiadrum if it weren't magical.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

There's also the fact that to actually stop face, you need to destroy the magic itself. Merely breaking the physical structure of face doesn't actually stop it. I doubt there's any way of destroying magic without using magic yourself.

There's no reason Acnologia would be disproportionally affected by face. He had the body of a dragon. More importantly....Dragons use magic just as much as humans do, and shouldn't have any special resistance to face's magic. If anything, Acnologia is the only dragon that has a special resistance to all types of magic. The parent dragons were just resistant to magic of their own element.

If someone had all of their MP wiped out, then it would take time for them to recover. Think of when Eclipse wiped out Natsu's MP. Took him the rest of the day to recover. Acnologia still had enough MP to roar at Igneel pretty much minutes after face went down. Now if you think he can recover that much MP in a couple of minutes, that's one thing. But if you don't, then face simply didn't wipe out all of his power. Mind you, a single roar from Acnologia probably contains more MP than everyone at Tartaros combined.

I see, so face failed to wipe off magic from the dragons themselves. You're right about this. So, this means face isn't powerful enough to take magic from dragons, or at the very least, would take out of time to do so.

But I find it very hard to believe that Acnologia being floored by Igneel at the same time as when face activated, was a mere coincidence. Acnologia, throughout the fight, was either in par with Igneel or had a slight edge, but suddenly he's down for quite a lot of time (a minute or more)? Seems very fishy.
Yeah, I guess he simply recovered that magic power. The rate of recovery is also dependent on the vessel size, right (I assume larger vessels have larger pipes)? So it's not hard to imagine Acnologia recovering that much MP in that time

 

[Nie Li]

No. You did not. (it's not sarcasm, nor trolling)

Your words:
"And what's your point? He doesn't need to touch a magic to use it, but he also cannot use holder magic without holding the object it is used through. He would need to use the cards in combat himself and even then it's a magic that would only come through the card and not through his body so there's no "nullifying that in defense"."

Cana uses her magic via cards. Cards are medium(s). Cana literally "gives" her cards to August.
Re-ask my question:
- Why August could not catch her cards ? (if originally it should touch his body via attack)
- If August hold her cards in his hands, why August can not nulify / copy it's magic (= object /medium in his hands).

I'll then reword my comment.

August can copy Cana's card power even without touching her cards because we have previously seen August copy magic from opponents he had not touched (nor their magic). We can safely say that, before he died, August learnt Cana's magic.

However, when he nullifies magic, he does so by employing the same magic that is used against him in a way that it cancels the attack. It's actually not as simple as "being immune", but rather an active action from himself to "deactivate" the magic by using the same power himself. Going by the plot, the reason he's vulnerable to holder's magic is because it can only be casted through an object. So...

Yes, if August held one of Cana's cards, he would then be able to use it like she does, but how would it help him nullify attacks on his body? The copied magic would only flow through the card he's holding, so he would have no way to "employ the magic to deactivate it" when another card targets his body.

You can make a point that he could try to disenchant the incoming cards the moment they come in contact with him, but Mashima probably didn't even think of that (I don't hold him in high regard in this kind of topic, yeah). In Gildart's case, the possibility of stopping it with his copy was impossible because he lacked the object, but even then he should have many spells at his disposal to either block or dodge the attack, so it can only be called "plot" that he instead just tanked it.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 13, 2020, Original Post Date: Oct 13, 2020 ---

I assume how Mest was able to manipulate Brandish mind is 3rd option too, right ?

Because the allergie thing was funny, but explainable one. Mest and Brandish issue does not fit very well with your 1 and 2 explanation.

Probably, Mashima's writing is just like that when it comes to hax and power levels.

 

[Verter]

I'll then reword my comment.

So, all concludes in "Mashima is not best mangaka". Ok, I got that position.
But why same should not be applied to his "hype" battles or "feelings power-ups" ?
Like f.e. first "battle" between Team Natsu and 3 DE ?