One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[LadyVados]

Zoro is stronger than Sanji, and that's OK.

Zoro is a bit stronger than Sanji, this is a fact. Zoro's character is all about fighting and getting stronger. Sanji is strong too but his main character traits is that he's a cook who's interested in finding the all blue.

They're both great characters who are amazing in their own way and just because Zoro is a bit stronger, that doesn't take away from that. Zoro can't cook.

If you look at Zoro's best moments in the series, they've all been related to fighting. If you look at Sanji's best moments they've either been related to strategy (like Mr. Prince) or related to his character (like the whole of the WCI arc). Zoro's whole shtick is fighting so it would make sense he'd be better than Sanji at it. Sanji's arguably better at everything else.

 

[I Am Atomic]

I always see it this way. Luffy had Rayleigh as teacher. Zoro had Mihawk. Sanji had Ivankov at best. Even if the trio were similar in power before TS, post TS shouldn't be the case because of their respective teachers.

 

[XXGenesis]

Zoro is stronger than Sanji, and that's OK.

Zoro is a bit stronger than Sanji, this is a fact. Zoro's character is all about fighting and getting stronger. Sanji is strong too but his main character traits is that he's a cook who's interested in finding the all blue.

They're both great characters who are amazing in their own way and just because Zoro is a bit stronger, that doesn't take away from that. Zoro can't cook.

If you look at Zoro's best moments in the series, they've all been related to fighting. If you look at Sanji's best moments they've either been related to strategy (like Mr. Prince) or related to his character (like the whole of the WCI arc). Zoro's whole shtick is fighting so it would make sense he'd be better than Sanji at it. Sanji's arguably better at everything else.

Voting for this to be the standard “Calm Down Sanji Fans” Read.

Pre-TS. Sanji w/o DJ was screwed against Luffy; & with DJ, he doesn’t come close to G3.
There are scenes and enemies That clarify Zoro is stronger than Sanji. Pre-TS Zoro is never shown fully healed from PH...So honestly this was the closes Zoro & Luffy ever was in strength aside from beginning of the series.

Luffy vs Doffy, vs Cracker , vs Katakuri....Sanji CoO may be Katakuri-ish but I think Luffy surpassed that. As with Zoro knowing advance Haki, Luffy has Advance Advanced Haki & Conquerors Haki.

 

[HereNThere]

Is all of this because of the Death Battle? Sanji clearly isn't Admiral level. Death Battles cherry pick feats and, often times, don't include the context of the greater fictional universe in said feats. Do not take their word as gospel, especially of you're an avid reader/watcher of any series they examine.

 

[LadyVados]

Is all of this because of the Death Battle? Sanji clearly isn't Admiral level. Death Battles cherry pick feats and, often times, don't include the context of the greater fictional universe in said feats. Do not take their word as gospel, especially of you're an avid reader/watcher of any series they examine.

Oh no, the 2 posts weren’t connected.

 

[HereNThere]

I always see it this way. Luffy had Rayleigh as teacher. Zoro had Mihawk. Sanji had Ivankov at best. Even if the trio were similar in power before TS, post TS shouldn't be the case because of their respective teachers.

Honestly don't think Iva taught him anything. Series hadn't shown it anyway.

That being said, I don't think it really matters much at this point seeing as how they are pretty far removed from where they initially began post time skip.

If there is a major gap between Sanji and the other two, it won't be because of who they trained with. It'll be because the other two just had more opportunities to fight and grow. But I'm not really worried. I imagine that Sanji, like usual, will be shown to still be comparable to Zoro, if only a slight step behind. We'll see though.

 

[thedude]

I always see it this way. Luffy had Rayleigh as teacher. Zoro had Mihawk. Sanji had Ivankov at best. Even if the trio were similar in power before TS, post TS shouldn't be the case because of their respective teachers.

Ivan was beating Kuma down during Marineford, i wouldn't be so quick to say he's so weak that he'd hurt Sanji's development compared to the others...

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 16, 2020, Original Post Date: Dec 16, 2020 ---

Honestly don't think Iva taught him anything. Series hadn't shown it anyway.

That being said, I don't think it really matters much at this point seeing as how they are pretty far removed from where they initially began post time skip.

If there is a major gap between Sanji and the other two, it won't be because of who they trained with. It'll be because the other two just had more opportunities to fight and grow. But I'm not really worried. I imagine that Sanji, like usual, will be shown to still be comparable to Zoro, if only a slight step behind. We'll see though.

That's what I think. It's too bad Oda didn't think "hey, there was a timeskip, lets show some of what everyone learned" in a real fight. Only Luffy's growth was shown.

 

[I Am Atomic]

Katakuri is one of my favourite characters in One Piece. I see some users on this thread downplay him and assume he is weak for a YC1.

How do you think he will fare against other YC characters?

Unlike other other YCs, Katakuri is literally untouchable if u don't have superior CoO. That man can literally read the future and dodge any attacks. His is the only fruit in the series that's a special class. Anyone else apart from Luffy and they would have got wrecked.

No other commanders had a intro like him. He was more intimidating than BM.

 

[LadyVados]

Katakuri is one of my favourite characters in One Piece. I see some users on this thread downplay him and assume he is weak for a YC1.

How do you think he will fare against other YC characters?

Unlike other other YCs, Katakuri is literally untouchable if u don't have superior CoO. That man can literally read the future and dodge any attacks. His is the only fruit in the series that's a special class. Anyone else apart from Luffy and they would have got wrecked.

No other commanders had a intro like him. He was more intimidating than BM.

He has broken COO but this is offset by the fact that he is physically weak (relatively). One-shot material for a Yonko.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 16, 2020, Original Post Date: Dec 16, 2020 ---

Marco is not a top tier. A top tier is Kaido, Big Mam, Shanks.

In this very thread people were going up in arms when I said Katakuri wasn’t a top tier. Now people are saying Marco isn’t one ? LMAO

 

[I Am Atomic]

He has broken COO but this is offset by the fact that he is physically weak (relatively). One-shot material for a Yonko.

Only if the Yonko can hit him. If Kaido or BM doesn't have advanced CoO, they can't hit him. Simple as that

 

[LadyVados]

Only if the Yonko can hit him. If Kaido or BM doesn't have advanced CoO, they can't hit him. Simple as that

Haha, you may have a point.

I wonder if Mihawk and Fujitora have advanced COO too and Kaido/BM wouldn’t be able to land a hit on them either.

 

[I Am Atomic]

I wonder if Mihawk and Fujitora have advanced COO too and Kaido/BM wouldn’t be able to land a hit on them either.

Not sure. I think Oda will focus on their other strength which is Mihawk having supreme swords kills and Issho with his broken DF.

Katakuri has a advantage with his CoO due to his fruit. He can dodge like a Logia and attack simultaneously.

I still am impressed by him, he didn't have any abnormal birth powers or broken DF power. His threat was solely due to his haki. His haki made his fruit OP, otherwise it's average.

 

[Ramen]

In this very thread people were going up in arms when I said Katakuri wasn’t a top tier. Now people are saying Marco isn’t one ? LMAO

Marco and Katakuri are top tiers. There is a big difference between the top tiers who are the high-level commanders and the god tiers who are the Yonkos and Admirals.

Katakuri = someone with all 3 types of Haki and has them all mastered and has an OP devil fruit power. He's easily top 20-25 in the series. That by very definition is top tier.

 

[thedude]

Guys like Marco could fight Admirals. Katakuri could as well more than likely. Yonko are strong, but they aren't one shotting everyone they meet, including probably the YC's.

 

[Ramen]

Guys like Marco could fight Admirals. Katakuri could as well more than likely. Yonko are strong, but they aren't one shotting everyone they meet, including probably the YC's.

Exactly. Just because you're not stronger than someone doesn't mean you're fodder lol. Being a Yonko's right hand comes with respect. Plus, Katakuri could probably do a little against Fujitora or Kuzan before going down.

 

[thedude]

Exactly. Just because you're not stronger than someone doesn't mean you're fodder lol. Being a Yonko's right hand comes with respect. Plus, Katakuri could probably do a little against Fujitora or Kuzan before going down.

I wouldn't assume they'd go down either. Take the very old and out of his prime Rayleigh, who held of an admiral. Rayleigh was a YC. Are we to assume that he was the only one at that level? Even though just after that we saw Marco and Jozu holding off Admirals, and then saw Ben Beckman hold off an admiral briefly.

These guys are not fodder. They aren't getting one shotted by anyone most likely, and saying otherwise is deciding that you know more than what the manga has shown us.

 

[Ramen]

I wouldn't assume they'd go down either. Take the very old and out of his prime Rayleigh, who held of an admiral. Rayleigh was a YC. Are we to assume that he was the only one at that level? Even though just after that we saw Marco and Jozu holding off Admirals, and then saw Ben Beckman hold off an admiral briefly.

These guys are not fodder. They aren't getting one shotted by anyone most likely, and saying otherwise is deciding that you know more than what the manga has shown us.

I don't know, I always looked at Rayleigh as someone different. It could be my headcanon but he and Beckmann strike me as people who if they had their own crews, could be Yonkos or Admirals if they joined the marines.

Either way, to claim they aren't top tiers are childish.

 

[M3J]

Marco is not a top tier. A top tier is Kaido, Big Mam, Shanks. And Zoro is not on Marco's level.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 16, 2020 ---

It seemed like an on the fly thing. Luffy is dumb in general but a genius fighter.

Jinbei could probably deal with Cracker because he can weaken the biscuits. Zoro and Sanji tho... Like I said, neither of them deserve the benefit of the doubt above a YC. Katakuri is smoking Zoro, Karakuri was BULLYING Luffy until he pulled a haki zenkai boost out of his ass.

Honestly, I don't think Luffy's that dumb, he's just reckless and does and says things that come to his mind due to "no ragrets" way of tackling life.

I mean, we agree with Katakuri, but I'm talking about Cracker against Sanji or Zoro.

Is all of this because of the Death Battle? Sanji clearly isn't Admiral level. Death Battles cherry pick feats and, often times, don't include the context of the greater fictional universe in said feats. Do not take their word as gospel, especially of you're an avid reader/watcher of any series they examine.

I don't think even Luffy's an admiral level, so it's weird to put Sanji on that level too. The Monster Trio would lose to the admirals, even to the new ones like Fujitora.

Katakuri is one of my favourite characters in One Piece. I see some users on this thread downplay him and assume he is weak for a YC1.

How do you think he will fare against other YC characters?

Unlike other other YCs, Katakuri is literally untouchable if u don't have superior CoO. That man can literally read the future and dodge any attacks. His is the only fruit in the series that's a special class. Anyone else apart from Luffy and they would have got wrecked.

No other commanders had a intro like him. He was more intimidating than BM.

Matchups matter, again. Katakuri's Future Sight should give him an edge, but if he can't hurt other commanders, or if their durability is as strong or high as Luffy's, in worst case scenario, then Katakuri might not have a chance. It also comes down to stamina, who'll get tired first? The man who can predict attacks or the person who can take damage? At least, that's my assumption.

Only if the Yonko can hit him. If Kaido or BM doesn't have advanced CoO, they can't hit him. Simple as that

But they'd still likely win because Katakuri can't hurt them, unless he finds a way to get past their defense. I'd have more faith in the Emperors beating Katakuri than I do the other way around. Big Mom might be the only exception as Katakuri should know how to traumatize her.

 

[I Am Atomic]

But they'd still likely win because Katakuri can't hurt them, unless he finds a way to get past their defense. I'd have more faith in the Emperors beating Katakuri than I do the other way around. Big Mom might be the only exception as Katakuri should know how to traumatize her.

No idea what u talking about. I was saying Katakuri wouldn't get OHKO. Never said he would defeat any Yonko.

 

[M3J]

No idea what u talking about. I was saying Katakuri wouldn't get OHKO. Never said he would defeat any Yonko.

I'm saying he could get OHKO, unless you mean one-hit knockout.