Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2021] - Discussion and ToC Talk

[OniluapL]

I mean, I don't think they would reveal the number if they were unhappy with it, so it stands to reason that it's a good thing.

 

[SharkBait]

I don't think anyone says its bad, but that people seemed to have overplayed or oversold how well it was doing.

 

[galaxy-juice]

If it is simply the effect of WSJ's neglect upon the manga.
If he had the same treatment as roboko and magu chan, sales would grow.

We simply don't know this. If it had promotion it might have grown, but that growth might have been just 1-2K.

There's no point in pointing fingers at Nak. It's all just speculation and "what if's". We don't know how Phantom Seer would have performed with promotion. To act like it was actually some supersized megahit that Jump willfully sabatoged is just wishful thinking.

Still, getting a circulation number means that it probably won't get cancelled anytime soon, so that's a good thing. Maybe soon they start to promote it more so we can see if it actually helps it grow.

Either way I really hope it gets a color page soon since I love what Matsura does with them.

 

[tirakai]

This does help with the idea that there's around a 60-40 split between what Shoseki tracks and digital/other stuff they don't track.

~20k sales first month, add in the frequent reprints and it's probably up to 30k circulation per volume. Then with a 60-40 split, that gives another 20k from non-shoseki sources adding up to ~50k per volume (and hence 100k for 2 volumes).

Where does this 100k in circulation come from anyway? WSJ itself or a band on new prints or what?

 

[101nemesis]

The mental gymnastics some of ya'll are showing trying to defend PS's lack of promotion or push is commendable, not gonna lie.

Where does this 100k in circulation come from anyway? WSJ itself or a band on new prints or what?

I just wish they'd give circulation numbers for Yozakura, Undead, and Mashle.

Mashle should definitely be getting 1M circulation announcement with the next volume.

 

[Blink22]

The Phantom Seer phenom is only just beginning. Once promotion officially kicks in this series will boom.

You were saying Sharky?

 

[galaxy-juice]

The mental gymnastics some of ya'll are showing trying to defend PS's lack of promotion or push is commendable, not gonna lie.

To be fair, I'm not trying to defend PS's lack of a push. I think it should have gotten at least some promotion, and I still hope it does. Maybe there's a reason Nak hasn't promoted it, maybe there isn't. But we don't know what would have happened if he had, so statements like "if it had been promoted, then..." are meaningless.

It's easy to say "if Nak had promoted it, then it would have sold great", but we simply don't know that it would have sold great if Nak had promoted it. Maybe it would have had a huge boost, maybe it would have had a small boost, or maybe it would have had no boost at all. We can speculate, but speculation is all that is.

There's still hope for it to rise the ranks against all odds like Yozakura Family did so my fingers are crossed.

 

[Halloween]

I don't think anyone says its bad, but that people seemed to have overplayed or oversold how well it was doing.

Where are you getting that from? 100k from two volumes is great by any standard.

 

[CrOF]

As good as this circulation notice is, at the end of the day it's only the text the series editor can put in there himself. It really doesn't put the series in a better position than it was before. When it goes up in the toc or gets a color page, which is something determined by higher staff than the series editor, then I'll be more comfortable.

Still, it's a good number.

 

[101nemesis]

To be fair, I'm not trying to defend PS's lack of a push. I think it should have gotten at least some promotion, and I still hope it does. Maybe there's a reason Nak hasn't promoted it, maybe there isn't. But we don't know what would have happened if he had, so statements like "if it had been promoted, then..." are meaningless.

It's easy to say "if Nak had promoted it, then it would have sold great", but we simply don't know that it would have sold great if Nak had promoted it. Maybe it would have had a huge boost, maybe it would have had a small boost, or maybe it would have had no boost at all. We can speculate, but speculation is all that is.

There's still hope for it to rise the ranks against all odds like Yozakura Family did so my fingers are crossed.

It's not even about if any promotion would've had any effect on it. Leave that argument aside.

It's simply about you promoting your new IP, in this case a manga. That's literally WSJ's whole purpose. To sell manga, its products.
That's where the incompetence lies. In the fact that he's not promoting a new IP that is selling more than most of the new IPs that came out in the past year and half.

No one can predict what effects promotions will have. But one thing you can be sure about is that NOT promoting it, isn't doing PS any favors.

 

[tirakai]

You've got it the wrong way around, the manga exist to sell WSJ.

 

[Koni]

Phantom Seer has a circulation number - something that I think only series that are gonna stick around for a bit usually get. Something that Undead Unluck, MASHLE, Yozakura Family, Magu-chan, and Hard-Boiled don’t have. And unlike Roboco’s, it’s actually pretty decent for a series with only 2 volumes.

The series clearly has potential. The current lineup desperately needs more established series, and IMO Phantom Seer has the best chance of establishing itself, apart from MASHLE and maybe Sakamoto Days. It would simply be wiser for Jump to promote it, since it’s currently doing as well as some other manga that they’ve extensively promoted for a while now and has a chance of doing better.

 

[taqzer]

You've got it the wrong way around, the manga exist to sell WSJ.

Bro if I'm not mistaken the weekly magazine runs at a near loss?
101Nemesis is right, its the mag sells the manga

 

[galaxy-juice]

It's not even about if any promotion would've had any effect on it. Leave that argument aside.

It's simply about you promoting your new IP, in this case a manga. That's literally WSJ's whole purpose. To sell manga, its products.
That's where the incompetence lies. In the fact that he's not promoting a new IP that is selling more than most of the new IPs that came out in the past year and half.

No one can predict what effects promotions will have. But one thing you can be sure about is that NOT promoting it, isn't doing PS any favors.

Yeah, I completely agree.

I don't necessarily think that the lack of promotion is the result of incompetence like you (I'm still convinced it's due to the polls or some other number we don't have access to), but do I feel like the series has earned way more than it's getting. At least a color page. At least a passing mention. At least something, geez.

Yozakura is pretty much established, same for Mashle, and Undead-unlock, they all passed 52 chapters, and all without circulation numbers as you suggest, so I think that shows that a circulation number isn't predictive of success. (for all we know there could be cancelled manga that reached 100K)

Series can be successful without circulation numbers, but we don't have a whole lot of circulation numbers for series that weren't successful (the only ones I can think of are Robot x Laserbeam, which was expected to be successful, and Butsu Zone, which didn't have its circulation announced after Shaman King got popular).

I wonder if Phantom Seer will finally rise out of the bottom after the next batch.

 

[101nemesis]

You've got it the wrong way around, the manga exist to sell WSJ.

This is not even remotely true.

Shueisha spends most of their money promoting their product releases ie. manga volume releases not WSJ issue releases.
WSJ exists solely as a platform to provide their products (manga) maximum possible exposure at once.

And there have only been 2 instances of WSJ issues ever getting close to selling out in the last decade. Kochikame's end and Kimetsu's end (I think).
Even when that issue sold out for Kochikame's final chapter, WSJ only scheduled a reprint of that issue for months later.
When manga volumes run out or are close to running out, Shueisha scrambles to get reprints scheduled at the earliest.

Magazine is NOT their priority. Lol.

 

[SharkBait]

Series can be successful without circulation numbers, but we don't have a whole lot of circulation numbers for series that weren't successful (the only ones I can think of are Robot x Laserbeam, which was expected to be successful, and Butsu Zone, which didn't have its circulation announced after Shaman King got popular).

I wonder if Phantom Seer will finally rise out of the bottom after the next batch.

it should at least get a color page since, ayakashi got a color page and had its circulation numbers so it would only be keeping consistent, imo.

 

[savethecat]

Idk why PS has low placements, and no color color pages,
But I highly doubt there just not giving it color pages for shits and giggles.
We’ll probably never get s definitive answer, nor will we be able to guess one, but I’m sure behind the scenes there’s so sort of reasoning

 

[Stivie]

Idk why PS has low placements, and no color color pages,
But I highly doubt there just not giving it color pages for shits and giggles.
We’ll probably never get s definitive answer, nor will we be able to guess one, but I’m sure behind the scenes there’s so sort of reasoning

It is pure neglect, it is the most plausible answer I can suppose.

There is no valid reason for not giving CP to Phantom seer, whereas magu chan who does not have good sales receives.

We are not charging for advertising with commercials or PVs on the internet, it is only a CP that is being charged and a better position. It doesn't even have to be Top 5, half of the table would be enough.

 

[galaxy-juice]

It is pure neglect, it is the most plausible answer I can suppose.

There is no valid reason for not giving CP to Phantom seer, whereas magu chan who does not have good sales receives.

We are not charging for advertising with commercials or PVs on the internet, it is only a CP that is being charged and a better position. It doesn't even have to be Top 5, half of the table would be enough.

Neglect isn't really enough to explain what's happened to Phantom Seer. Cop & Dolphin, High School Family... those series are neglected, and they bounce around the bottom of the TOC, whereas Phantom Seer is consistently in the bottom three, despite performing better than either of those series (it isn't because they're veteran authors, either, since Build King is also bottom three and Shimabukuro is more successful than either of them).

Honestly, it feels like the only two explanations for the TOC are that the voting polls for Phantom Seer are just that bad and Nak isn't lying about its popularity, or Nak simply hates Phantom Seer so much that he wants it to look like its unpopular.

But putting the Phantom Seer issue aside, why do people call Nak incompetent? Genuinely curious, since I didn't follow Jump before he was EIC.

 

[savethecat]

It is pure neglect, it is the most plausible answer I can suppose.

There is no valid reason for not giving CP to Phantom seer, whereas magu chan who does not have good sales receives.

We are not charging for advertising with commercials or PVs on the internet, it is only a CP that is being charged and a better position. It doesn't even have to be Top 5, half of the table would be enough.

You seem to have been getting overly worked up about this for weeks when we literally know absolutely nothing about the TOC process aside from surface level stuff.
‘we have no clue what’s being discussed in there meetings or what’s even going on with the creators.

for exp. Everyone has pretty much accepted that MHA’s lack of color pages and covers is most likely just because Horikoshi probably just turns them down due to being so busy with the actual manga, and outside material, rather than Jump outright not giving him any.
We have even seen cases, like Dr.Slump with Toriyama, where a mangaka starts a series, and loses interest in there series, and requests a short run for the series themselves.

most likely isn’t the case with PS, but point is, there are probably outside situations and conversations going on that we, as a foreign readers, can’t even fathom what’s actually going on.

but You guys seem to be delving into borderline conspiracy theories that PS is just getting unfairly bullied by Nak, despite us not understanding whats going on.