Luclec vs Gustang (No Okbi or Flame Spark)

[Pro Factor]

Hm, but isn't it precisely because they can't just kill eachother that the great match and administrator sign off was needed?

We know they can't commit suicide at least so self harm is useless to the great warriors, but them being able to kill eachother isn't as easy either is the way I see it

You would think so right? But since Traum did technically killed Gustang it makes no sense for them to even have immortality contract. Who is it protecting them from, suicide?

 

[Ray Barracuda]

You would think so right? But since Traum did technically killed Gustang it makes no sense for them to even have immortality contract. Who is it protecting them from, suicide?

Suicide and perhaps eachother unless certain conditions are met.

We can say Traum technically killed Gustang but isn't it Gustang that also technically set the conditions for his death in the first place?

 

[Lord V returned]

If you want my honest opinion on this...

SIU just retconned it.

He initially wanted all irregulars to be immortal between themselves and therefore there was a need for V (from storytelling perspective) to NOT take a contract, that way it was possible to kill him without need to explain how it happened. Now he just decided they can kill each others and suddenly as you say immortality contract doesn't make a lot of sense.

People came up with the reasoning how "You accept your contract, but others don't so they can kill you" and bunch of other different justifications for why Traum was able to kill Gustang... problem is, SIU should have explained it himself.

If others could kill you all along and Arlene wanted to die so badly she could have just asked from other great warriors to do her a favor and kill her, or just be a total badass and pull an "Enryu" - provoke an administrator to fight you and get killed like that...

I actually hope that the contract stuff wasn't retconned but everything that played off must have played off this way for a reason, for example.

Let's assume then that Gustang went to the administrator and said that he will battle traumerei and wants to be able to kill him. But they can't just void traumerei's contract like that. So Gustang made a deal and suggest that it could be done via the scales of judgement. Gustang would be willing to gamble his life. Let traumerei kill him and make the choice(repent or not). So Gustang dies, the scales activate, Traumerei gets to make his choice. If he repents, then Gustang stays dead and we move on. If however he doesn't, then Gustang gets revived and he will be able to "override"Traumerei's "contract" with the approval of the administrator for Traumerei to die, whether by his hand or the hand of some "vermin"(Like through chess game). If it's none of that, then the entire scale thing was pointless again.

The Family leaders having the contracts then would also help to explain why V would want to "leave" and "re-enter" the tower as an "irregular" free from the contracts again. I mentioned this before. Because if they could all kill each other the entire time, then it wouldn't make sense for V to "come back" as an "irregular" again in order to accomplish something which he could have accomplished in the first place.

But regardless one big issue is Siu's lack of properly explaining these things. Unless he'll finally wise up soon and give us a massive "lore dump" surrounding all of this stuff before the season ends, but I won't hold my breath.

 

[Pro Factor]

Suicide and perhaps eachother unless certain conditions are met.

We can say Traum technically killed Gustang but isn't it Gustang that also technically set the conditions for his death in the first place?

What do you mean? I mean not like he can just turn off his immortality, or am I missunderstanding something here?

 

[Demonspeed]

V and Arlen are the GWs who were erased from history. There is no way Luslec is one, we would know already. He wouldn't have been no diffed by Traumerei if he was one of their peers. He wasn't a GW, he was V's follower.

He went cqc against a 15% reinforcement Urek. He got speed blitzed when Urek went 25%, and then he started to slow down and pretend to be fighting after that point. Urek's gorgon's which is basically a 30% reinforcement punch completely dwarfed any of Luslec's physical feats.

Anyway, even If you think Luslec can tango with Gustang in CQC, Luslec's not showed any close combat skill that would do anything to Gustang.

Reminder that Luslec also buffed himself with Dark Charge before fighting. A transformation powerful enough to make Jinsung and the two Elders run.

 

[Pro Factor]

I actually hope that the contract stuff wasn't retconned but everything that played off must have played off this way for a reason, for example.

Let's assume then that Gustang went to the administrator and said that he will battle traumerei and wants to be able to kill him. But they can't just void traumerei's contract like that. So Gustang made a deal and suggest that it could be done via the scales of judgement. Gustang would be willing to gamble his life. Let traumerei kill him and make the choice(repent or not). So Gustang dies, the scales activate, Traumerei gets to make his choice. If he repents, then Gustang stays dead and we move on. If however he doesn't, then Gustang gets revived and he will be able to "override"Traumerei's "contract" with the approval of the administrator for Traumerei to die, whether by his hand or the hand of some "vermin"(Like through chess game). If it's none of that, then the entire scale thing was pointless again.

The Family leaders having the contracts then would also help to explain why V would want to "leave" and "re-enter" the tower as an "irregular" free from the contracts again. I mentioned this before. Because if they could all kill each other the entire time, then it wouldn't make sense for V to "come back" as an "irregular" again in order to accomplish something which he could have accomplished in the first place.

But regardless one big issue is Siu's lack of properly explaining these things. Unless he'll finally wise up soon and give us a massive "lore dump" surrounding all of this stuff before the season ends, but I won't hold my breath.

Ok I see you, but you need to go out of your way to explain it and brain storm it... It should be SIU who explains this without us having to make "surprised pikachu" face when Gustang died. Now we can only guess... maybe he did that and maybe he didn't...

 

[arrowofsky]

V and Arlen are the GWs who were erased from history. There is no way Luslec is one, we would know already. He wouldn't have been no diffed by Traumerei if he was one of their peers. He wasn't a GW, he was V's follower.

Reminder that Luslec also buffed himself with Dark Charge before fighting. A transformation powerful enough to make Jinsung and the two Elders run.

We don't really know how he was helplessly captured at that time. Elaborate traps? Other mechanisms? We did not really see the no-diffing part, just the conclusion. Arie Hon just let him enter the building, it felt fishy for me as well. Arie Hon is also more than an emo introvert.

I always feel the possibility of a "hidden irregular" for Luslec, just like V before, as the number of irregulars are not limited or explicitly stated. The way Luslec is portrayed in the lore is definitely more than "a simple towerborn who can't impact anything". But we can only wait for the following chapters.

I don't really see the point of being absolutely sure of one thing or another at the moment. Also, it is boring.

And yeah, dark charge was cool i doubt it would make someone absolutely unimportant and ineffective against an irregular starts to be nonnegligible though.

 

[Ray Barracuda]

What do you mean? I mean not like he can just turn off his immortality, or am I missunderstanding something here?

I mean for the judge thingy to activate Gustang had to allow Traum kill him right there if I remember correctly.


And according to conditions if Traum had felt guilty or plagued by his sins of the past then he would die as would Gustang.


The conditions were set for a double suicide or is murder as I understand it right?

 

[Lord V returned]

V and Arlen are the GWs who were erased from history. There is no way Luslec is one, we would know already. He wouldn't have been no diffed by Traumerei if he was one of their peers. He wasn't a GW, he was V's follower.



Reminder that Luslec also buffed himself with Dark Charge before fighting. A transformation powerful enough to make Jinsung and the two Elders run.

Well technically Traumerei was "No diffed" by a nerfed V just 1 chapter ago...And yes, ironically both instances occurred from "behind".

Traumerei took out Luslec from behind. - no diff
V took out Traumerei from behind. - no diff.

 

[Pro Factor]

I mean for the judge thingy to activate Gustang had to allow Traum kill him right there if I remember correctly.


And according to conditions if Traum had felt guilty or plagued by his sins of the past then he would die as would Gustang.


The conditions were set for a double suicide or is murder as I understand it right?

Sure but how can he let him kill him if he is supposed to be immortal? I know what the purpose of it was,I’m saying it shouldn’t have been possible to die in the first place. Makes their immortal contract be useless af, protecting them basically from no one but tower borns (who are already weaker to the point they can’t beat them) and themselves.

That part is almost certainly retconed. It should have protected them from killing each others in the first place, I’m sure of it.

 

[Ray Barracuda]

Sure but how can he let him kill him if he is supposed to be immortal? I know what the purpose of it was,I’m saying it shouldn’t have been possible to die in the first place. Makes their immortal contract be useless af, protecting them basically from no one but tower borns (who are already weaker to the point they can’t beat them) and themselves.

That part is almost certainly retconed. It should have protected them from killing each others in the first place, I’m sure of it.

Ahh, yeah i see where you're coming from now.

Something like under absolutely no circumstances would it be possible for them to kill eachother bar i guess an Administrators authority right?

If Gustang had blatantly set the conditions for this match that the Admin made it possible for them to actually kill eachother it would have fixed all this speculative shit.

 

[maverickframe_19]

This is not fair fight tbh, if it was Gustang vs Yiwha in that case it would be hard to predict the outcome...

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 21, 2024, Original Post Date: Nov 21, 2024 ---

Watch Luslec being Arlene reincarnated and we get rematch of : V+Arlene vs Zahard + FHs

I won't say she will reincarnate but maybe he planted some Arlene cells on him, Hashirama cells beat. To give him irregular durability and perhaps some form of spell mastery!

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 21, 2024 ---

Sure but how can he let him kill him if he is supposed to be immortal? I know what the purpose of it was,I’m saying it shouldn’t have been possible to die in the first place. Makes their immortal contract be useless af, protecting them basically from no one but tower borns (who are already weaker to the point they can’t beat them) and themselves.

That part is almost certainly retconed. It should have protected them from killing each others in the first place, I’m sure of it.

Sometimes I wish the weekly blogs would return or some form of blogs/interviews for SIU to explain some unexplained part just like SBS interviews with Oda for One Piece. Information is needed for a story that has been running for a long time because you can't put every bit of information in one chapter. You have to focus on the main dashboard for the arc.

 

[V_TheHiddenAxis]

V and Arlen are the GWs who were erased from history. There is no way Luslec is one, we would know already. He wouldn't have been no diffed by Traumerei if he was one of their peers. He wasn't a GW, he was V's follower.

I think its pretty clear current luslec >>> luslec of the flashback. Traum easily took care of the luslec in FB where even with 30% reinforcement , someone like urek who is easily a level above flashback traum couldn't deal with current luslec.

And luslec himself didn't go all out against urek either.

Urek > Current traum > Flashback Traum >>> Flashback luslec is fact for now.

How current luslec fits in the above is not clear.

 

[Demonspeed]

I think its pretty clear current luslec >>> luslec of the flashback. Traum easily took care of the luslec in FB where even with 30% reinforcement , someone like urek who is easily a level above flashback traum couldn't deal with current luslec.

And luslec himself didn't go all out against urek either.

Urek > Current traum > Flashback Traum >>> Flashback luslec is fact for now.

How current luslec fits in the above is not clear.

My point was that no FH would get no diffed by another one.