American Politics

M3J

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I agree entirely. It's too bad republicans and democrats can't come and work together on how to improve the country. Instead, politics end up being party vs. party all the way through, whether tories vs. ___ or republicans vs. democrats.
 

xi0

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I agree entirely. It's too bad republicans and democrats can't come and work together on how to improve the country. Instead, politics end up being party vs. party all the way through, whether tories vs. ___ or republicans vs. democrats.
It's a big problem with the two party system. If there was a third major option with it's own platform, compromise wouldn't just be something people encouraged, it would be a requirement.
 

kkck

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It's a big problem with the two party system. If there was a third major option with it's own platform, compromise wouldn't just be something people encouraged, it would be a requirement.
Not necessarily. That would depend entirely on at least one party being able to find common ground and compromise with the third party so to speak. On the other hand if that does not happen things get more chaotic. The issue at the US seems to be that simply people from both parties have radicalized. It's not just the republicans that come up with increasingly more far right wing ideologies. Bernie sanders is as far as I understand openly socialist, not just left wing, and has specifically an almost anti rich people rhetoric. Would that have been possible even the last elections? Common ground between parties has decreased over time and that reflects over the current state of US politics.
 

kannazuki

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It's a big problem with the two party system. If there was a third major option with it's own platform, compromise wouldn't just be something people encouraged, it would be a requirement.
Not necessarily. You'd have to get rid of the plurality (AKA "first past the post") voting first, or you'd be stuck in a situation similar to the one we are in here Canada (but for you it would be even worse, since I don't think you can have non-confidence votes or coalitions, at least as far as I'm aware). Canada has three major (and two smaller, but significant) parties that have held official party status, only two of which have ever actually held the federal reins. In the past, our parliamentary system has sometimes meant great compromises between parties (such as the one that lead to all Canadians having access to basic health care). However in the last few elections, we've repeatedly been stuck with a governing party that consistently receives less than 40% of the vote, because the other parties split the remaining vote. Our next election is on Monday and the same thing might happen again. The tragedy here (aside from the shockingly undemocratic and damaging policies and attitudes of the Conservative gov't) is that the non-governing parties are all more similar to each other than any one any one of them is to the one that is in charge, especially the two biggest opposing parties.

Unless you get rid of plurality (first past the post), anything more than two parties just splits the vote (and on top of that, people's votes get wasted without proportional representation).

Not necessarily. That would depend entirely on at least one party being able to find common ground and compromise with the third party so to speak. On the other hand if that does not happen things get more chaotic. The issue at the US seems to be that simply people from both parties have radicalized. It's not just the republicans that come up with increasingly more far right wing ideologies. Bernie sanders is as far as I understand openly socialist, not just left wing, and has specifically an almost anti rich people rhetoric. Would that have been possible even the last elections? Common ground between parties has decreased over time and that reflects over the current state of US politics.
More accurately, the Western world has followed the United States in moving its political rhetoric ever rightward, to the extent that the establishment members of your Democratic party (including Obama) are really more centre-right and not on the left at all. (People with a much better grounding in global politics than me have pointed this out time and again.) "Obamacare" is a prime example. It was originally an idea from the right wing think tank the Heritage Foundation. In 1990 they proposed an individual mandate as part of health reform that preserves the "free market" (because insurance is still private). Flash forward a couple of decades and now the same people think "Obamacare" is a vile government intrusion into the marketplace. There are countless examples of Republican party politics moving to the right but you'll not find that many examples Democratic party ideals shifting to the left (definitely not economically; maybe a few socially). Everyone has moved to the right, and your country's tendencies have influenced others to do the same.
 

M3J

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lol at anti-abortionists who claim fetuses have souls but are against welfare after the fetuses are born. Anyway. still voting for Sanders as he's the least idiotic candidate and least likely to destroy the country.
 

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Best candidate continues to strike home runs with saying the most sensible things. I hope he wins. Wont be able to watch him hit it out of the ballpark tonight on the debate.
 
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xi0

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Yeah, he's clearly working to get that problem solved with his voting attendance in the Senate.
 

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lolRubio
 

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Rubio appeared to have the clear victory last night. Hes the underdog and will surprise you all, watch.
 

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I don't see him beating Trump, Mr. Fuck-PC who is against immigration.
 

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As this election goes on... and Trump is actually developing steam... i keep silently asking myself 'why' over and over again...
 

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As this election goes on... and Trump is actually developing steam... i keep silently asking myself 'why' over and over again...
Probably because.... Trump personifies... the ignorant American... most of all?
At least that's why I'd probably vote for him.

#Sheeple
 

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As this election goes on... and Trump is actually developing steam... i keep silently asking myself 'why' over and over again...
Because the Republican party is pathetically out of touch with it's base. They'd rather vote for a boisterous reality tv star that has nothing in common with them than someone of actual substance. And shit, complaining about a candidate not having any substance is nothing new, but Trump defies all previous challengers. The silliest thing is that enough of what Trump apparently stands for isn't even the craziest stuff to come out of these candidates mouths. That's the only excuse I can think of to give some voters the benefit of the doubt....but it is incredibly perplexing even so...lol
 

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As this election goes on... and Trump is actually developing steam... i keep silently asking myself 'why' over and over again...
anti immigration
does not believe in political correctness
entertaining to watch one way or another


I'm sure these factors are part of why he's popular.
 

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Because the Republican party is pathetically out of touch with it's base. They'd rather vote for a boisterous reality tv star that has nothing in common with them than someone of actual substance. And shit, complaining about a candidate not having any substance is nothing new, but Trump defies all previous challengers. The silliest thing is that enough of what Trump apparently stands for isn't even the craziest stuff to come out of these candidates mouths. That's the only excuse I can think of to give some voters the benefit of the doubt....but it is incredibly perplexing even so...lol
Lol, that is true. I just remembered how they used to call the mormon guy an alien given how out of touch he was and mccain got called a robot or something as well. Funny, the republican party has gone through war veteran, religious nutjob and now business mogul/realitytvstar as candidates. I wonder what gimmick they will try to milk next.

I wonder if the media is actually trolling us. I have yet to meet or see online or otherwise someone actually supporting trump. Or maybe the people who support him don't have internet access?

Trump doesn't say particularly crazy stuff in regards to the other candidates. If anything his thing is that he rarely says anything at all. The issue is not "what" he says but rather "how" he says it. He can stand with a camera in front of him broadcasting to the whole world and with absolute confidence say whatever it is that first comes to his mind. He can be proven wrong, made an asshole of and ridiculed and his confidence will not waver in the slightest, at least not visibly. Trump broke politics, at least within the republican party.

Interesting carson seems to be getting traction. Though he does not look very presidential.
 

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Trump is gaining steam? He has been losing steam.

Also Mr Obama is finally putting COIN SpecOP troops in terrorist strongholds going against his word. Further proof that democrats are unable to correctly ascertain military needs of protecting America until its years late.
 
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kannazuki

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Didn't Trump's poll results go down to number #2 in a couple of places (though still #1 among Republicans overall)? I thought Ben Carson (another non-establishment candidate who speaks in outrageous ways) was gaining on him. The one who seems most out of touch with the base is Jeb Bush; the most establishment of establishment candidates. It appears he won't go anywhere as long as he has enough money for attack ads.
 

xi0

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Interesting carson seems to be getting traction. Though he does not look very presidential.
Carson might be the dumbest "smart" person I've ever known of. To think that this guy was a local hero for so long due to his work at Johns Hopkins...I guess that was before anyone knew his beliefs. He's a nutter and as insane as it is, Trump would probably be a better leader. At least, more sensible.

Didn't Trump's poll results go down to number #2 in a couple of places (though still #1 among Republicans overall)? I thought Ben Carson (another non-establishment candidate who speaks in outrageous ways) was gaining on him. The one who seems most out of touch with the base is Jeb Bush; the most establishment of establishment candidates. It appears he won't go anywhere as long as he has enough money for attack ads.
Jeb is one of the few who actually seems sane. The issue with him is the shadow of his Brother's (and Father's) presidency. He has the financial and political backing...if he was anyone else he'd probably be a decent contender.

And yeah, Trump and Carson are at a statistical tie according to one poll.

---------- Post added at 07:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:12 PM ----------

Also Mr Obama is finally putting COIN SpecOP troops in terrorist strongholds going against his word. Further proof that democrats are unable to correctly ascertain military needs of protecting America until its years late.
Except Democrats are mostly split on this decision....and again, Obama isn't running for president.
 

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Carson might be the dumbest "smart" person I've ever known of. To think that this guy was a local hero for so long due to his work at Johns Hopkins...I guess that was before anyone knew his beliefs. He's a nutter and as insane as it is, Trump would probably be a better leader. At least, more sensible.
Yeah, a few of the things he believes caught me off guard. It goes to show that being intelligent or even a genius does not stop you from believing crazy stuff. I am not sure if trump would be more sensible or better leader. I guess trump would have his business experience there but then again being president is an entirely different context.
 

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Jeb is one of the few who actually seems sane. The issue with him is the shadow of his Brother's (and Father's) presidency. He has the financial and political backing...if he was anyone else he'd probably be a decent contender.
Sad but true. He's the most moderate of all of them. Beyond just his brother though, the family political dynasty issue is also a problem (a third Bush!). His nomination would help Democrats neutralize Republican attempts to attack Clinton on the basis of dynasty as well. (That said, Romneycare sure didn't stop anybody from attacking Obamacare.) Anyway if he can rise above these issues somehow he would probably have a better shot at the general election vote than anyone else running on the Republican side.

Yeah, a few of the things he believes caught me off guard. It goes to show that being intelligent or even a genius does not stop you from believing crazy stuff. I am not sure if trump would be more sensible or better leader. I guess trump would have his business experience there but then again being president is an entirely different context.
I've been thinking about Trump's claims of being good at making money, and recently I came across where people had analyzed what he could have made based on how much he began with. Compared with those in his income bracket, he didn't do that great. (Note: I only care about this because he is campaigning on what a great businessman he supposedly is. I mean that's silly enough when you consider that business and government are two completely different things, but if his argument is just that he knows how to manage money then it's all the worse that he's full of hot air in that area as well.)

These two articles reference another one with analysis that is behind a paywall:

The exact amount Trump is worth will remain shrouded in mystery; it's always in his interest to limit information for the public and exaggerate his fortune. What we do know is that taking into account the higher numbers — between $2.9 and $4 billion — he hasn't significantly outperformed the market. Dáte explains:
Had Trump invested his even­tu­al share of his fath­er's real-es­tate com­pany in­to a mu­tu­al fund of S&P 500 stocks in 1974, it would be worth nearly $3 bil­lion today, thanks to the mar­ket's per­form­ance over the past four dec­ades. If he'd in­ves­ted the $200 mil­lion that Forbes magazine de­term­ined he was worth in 1982 in­to that in­dex fund, it would have grown to more than $8 bil­lion today.​
That doesn't bode well for Trump's brand: "That a purely un­man­aged in­dex fund's re­turn could out­per­form Trump's hands-on wheel­ing and deal­ing calls in­to ques­tion one of Trump's chief selling points on the cam­paign trail: his busi­ness acu­men," Dáte writes.
http://mic.com/articles/124840/heres-the-real-reason-donald-trump-is-so-rich


But if you compare Trump's performance since 1982, when the stock market started to take off after the early-'80s recession, it looks pretty abysmal. Forbes estimated that Trump was worth $200 million that year. If he'd put that money in an index fund that year at a 0.15 percent fee, he'd have $6.3 billion today after dividend taxes, almost certainly more than he actually does. This jibes with analyzes prior to Dáte's which have found that Trump has underperformed compared with the market since 1988; an AP analysis found that if he'd put his money in an index fund that year, he'd have $13 billion today; the S&P calculator similarly suggested he'd have $11.3 billion, after fees and dividend taxes.
http://www.vox.com/2015/9/2/9248963/donald-trump-index-fund
 
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