American Politics

[kkck]

Remember how WW2 started? It didn't start with Hitler invading Poland. It started with the dissolution of the League of Nations (which is the predecessor of the UN) and it only got worse from there....

I still don't see the whole WW3 thing happening. Who would the war even be between? Even in spite of trump the US and Europe remain allies. Japan and the US are allies. China and the US have trade ties so profound a war between them sounds asinine. We live in a world where basically all developed nations are allies and rely economically on one another through trade. What is left is South america, Africa, the middle east, Russia and other Asian countries. How does a world war play into this? Russia does not actually have the military to beat the US. Russia's economy is only somewhat larger than mexicos... What russia does have is nukes but if they use them then the US uses their own. Basically the whole mutually assured destruction still applies. Heck, russia and the US are fighting on opposite sides at syria and event hat has failed to escalate. Not to mention that even putin does not actually want to go to war with the US. What he wants is Russia to have the same or more importance as the US on the international stage, not war.

The US disappearing would indeed bring about a great deal of instability. It might even cause a few wars. but it would be between smaller nations who take advantage of not having that oversight anymore. But I still don't see how it can plausibly turn into something like the world wars where you had major powers trying to end each other.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 23, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 23, 2017 ---

And more importantly, there is no evidence as of yet that trump endorses such a bill. Not to mention that there is any mention anywhere of trump wanting to quit the UN. He has not said it on TV nor on any of his books nor during the campaign. Granted that trump is incredibly unpredictable but the evidence does not yet point to this being a real possibility.

 

[EmptySoul]

Trump is president now

Wish u good luck from the UK

 

[shionoro]

There will not be a worldwar 3.
But there might be an america that is much less democratic than the America you were used to.

 

[Aonori]

There will not be a worldwar 3.
But there might be an america that is much less democratic than the America you were used to.

Humans never learn and war never changes, so there is a possibility it could happen, even if it doesnt get started by Trump, it can just get started by anyone else, though to precise here, the only possible WW3 scenario at this point, would be if America and China relations dropped to the lowest, that Taiwan issue and the South pacific sea military maneuvers arent exactly inspiring a peaceful world either.

 

[shionoro]

Humans never learn and war never changes, so there is a possibility it could happen, even if it doesnt get started by Trump, it can just get started by anyone else, though to precise here, the only possible WW3 scenario at this point, would be if America and China relations dropped to the lowest, that Taiwan issue and the South pacific sea military maneuvers arent exactly inspiring a peaceful world either.

Humans learn nonstop, that is why we have weapons in the first place.

China and the US are not going to war because they both have nuclear weapons. It is that simple.
Even a complete retard like trump does not want to die. Nor does any other hardliner who leads a nation.
When those people become complete lunatics, they usually lose their grip on power and have other important
figures who cover for them and won't let such a thing happen.

There could be something like a cold war again, but no mobilization of troops fighting each other.
It is not goign to happen, people should focus on very real fears:
The grasp of demagogues, rightwingers and autocrats on our democracy.

 

[Onyx Darkmatter]

Honestly, I can't see any possibilities of a third World War. There has to be a stunning instability between nations and a purpose to actually engage into war (You'd have to have China, Russia, and the U.S. at each other's neck if you want to throw in propaganda of "We're at war for our Freedom!").
But to be quite honest, what I fear the most is a Nuclear Warfare. I'm not feeling comfortable that Trump doesn't know what the fuck is a Nuclear Triad and his potential of removing the Iran Nuclear Deal (not saying he will do it tho; if he keeps it, then that's great).
It just takes a single one of these toxic weapons, and then it gives other nations an excuse to use theirs (unless the UN puts the U.S. into some sorts of Sanctions like they did on Russia).

 

[Aonori]

Humans learn nonstop, that is why we have weapons in the first place.

China and the US are not going to war because they both have nuclear weapons. It is that simple.
Even a complete retard like trump does not want to die. Nor does any other hardliner who leads a nation.
When those people become complete lunatics, they usually lose their grip on power and have other important
figures who cover for them and won't let such a thing happen.

There could be something like a cold war again, but no mobilization of troops fighting each other.
It is not goign to happen, people should focus on very real fears:
The grasp of demagogues, rightwingers and autocrats on our democracy.

You say that now, but we never know when something changes and leads to a world war, eitherway as long as China and the US dont start pushing each other too much with economics it will be fine (but I will only take this for real once the South pacific sea tension wears down and the troops go home), but I really dont like how one election can have two candidates that lead to a pretty direct antagonism between 1 of two other powerful foreign countries it really speaks volumes for the load of problems the US is in right now

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 24, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 24, 2017 ---

Honestly, I can't see any possibilities of a third World War. There has to be a stunning instability between nations and a purpose to actually engage into war (You'd have to have China, Russia, and the U.S. at each other's neck if you want to throw in propaganda of "We're at war for our Freedom!").
But to be quite honest, what I fear the most is a Nuclear Warfare. I'm not feeling comfortable that Trump doesn't know what the fuck is a Nuclear Triad and his potential of removing the Iran Nuclear Deal (not saying he will do it tho; if he keeps it, then that's great).
It just takes a single one of these toxic weapons, and then it gives other nations an excuse to use theirs (unless the UN puts the U.S. into some sorts of Sanctions like they did on Russia).

Some countries need to be controled in that area not every country desserves or needs nuclear weapons, otherwise we can get some issues like the one with North Korea, it´s not good for it´s neighbours for a start just because of the tests they do near them.

 

[POW]

May god save us all...

That's our new Secretary of Edcumacation son !

Remember how WW2 started? It didn't start with Hitler invading Poland. It started with the dissolution of the League of Nations (which is the predecessor of the UN) and it only got worse from there....

You know I think the people trying to instigate war with Russia are the real ones likely to push WW3 not Trump. I know people like to make it as simplified as "Trump = Bad, everyone who oppose him = Good" but it's never that simple. Trump has his problems but he's not threatening to bomb nations rather focusing on American interest and internal economic and security issues .

You notice the same people pushing the Russia angle are the same war hawks who got us into Iraq with the media egging it all on with their pro-conflict propaganda. History repeats itself and there is no public information absolutely linking Russia to the hacks despite the media continue to repeat these false claims.

You can still be critical of Trump and reject the false BS the media and politicians on both the left and right are spewing out to create a conflict with Russia.

 

[Aonori]

That's our new Secretary of Edcumacation son !





You know I think the people trying to instigate war with Russia are the real ones likely to push WW3 not Trump. I know people like to make it as simplified as "Trump = Bad everyone who oppose him = Good" but it's never that simple. Trump has his problems but he's not threatening to bomb nations rather focusing on American interest and internal economic and security issues .

You notice the same people pushing the Russia angle are the same war hawks who got us into Iraq with the media egging it all on with their pro-conflict propaganda. History repeats itself and there is no public information absolutely linking Russia to the hacks despite the media continue to repeat these false claims.

You can still be critical of Trump and reject the false BS the media and politicians on both the left and right are spewing out to create a conflict with Russia.

WW with russia was more likely than WW with China with Hillary and Obama done well to set that up, with Trump we will most likely only get a few rising tensions with China at best, but that Stuff at the south pacific sea needs to fixed ASAP, the Third world contries and the Oil already gave the middle east their fare share of problems.

 

[Onyx Darkmatter]

Some countries need to be controled in that area not every country desserves or needs nuclear weapons, otherwise we can get some issues like the one with North Korea, it´s not good for it´s neighbours for a start just because of the tests they do near them.

Honestly, no nation deserves Nuclear Weapons, not even the United States. I get the whole "We have Nukes so don't fuck with us!", but at the same time, it carries a big risk.
I don't even see North Korea using their nukes, unless Kim literally goes into the state of insanity.

That's our new Secretary of Edcumacation son !

Unfortunately.

 

[TotalEconomist]

First of All, World War 3 will be over in minutes since it will involve MAD.

Secondly, Trump's economic policies are misguided and will hurt the US in the long run (in theory). On one hand, pure economic destruction in the US will hurt the ruling party badly if things come up quick within a year or so. So if you're partisan person or absolutely hate the GOP, this is a good thing for the political pendulum to swing back the other way.

As for the executive Order on ObamaCare, it does little in terms of anything since Congress itself need to change the law. Absolute repeal is flat dumb since shocking the system is never good for economic stability.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 24, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 24, 2017 ---

Honestly, no nation deserves Nuclear Weapons, not even the United States. I get the whole "We have Nukes so don't fuck with us!", but at the same time, it carries a big risk.
I don't even see North Korea using their nukes, unless Kim literally goes into the state of insanity.



Unfortunately.

Now we're all sons of bitches - Kenneth Bainbridge

I can see Kim launching a Nuke at his southern neighbor in the future, granted that Trump doesn't beat him to it.

 

[kkck]

Well, from what I can tell trump started like this:

- Gutting obamacare.
- Withdrawal from TPP
- Renegotiating nafta
- Anti Abortion something something

Gutting obamacare is a tragedy and people will die. It's not that obamacare was by any means perfect but it did provide access to health care for millions of people. And as expected, not a hint of an alternative in sight (which IMO republicans won't ever present because it would be regulation and they are anti regulation).

I have mixed feelings about tpp. On one hand, there definitely are issues with it in regards to it being more convenient to corporations than people. On the other hand, I am not so sure trump's priority will be to craft a deal that is about the people instead of simply benefiting US corporations over corporations from other countries.

About nafta, I have the same reservations. The US approaching renegotiation without an ounce of good faith and aiming to squeeze other countries for all they are worth using it's immense influence would be rather catastrophic in a place like mexico and get the US a fair bit of ill will from there. Not to mention doing that to even poorer countries. Not to mention trump's apparent basic misunderstanding of the trade deficit (because it's not really an issue for the us...).

And the anti abortion. I am not particular pro abortion to be honest (nor am I very religious currently) but I do think de-funding planned parenthood and similar organizations would be a disaster simply because they do provide other services for women.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 24, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 24, 2017 ---

First of All, World War 3 will be over in minutes since it will involve MAD.

Secondly, Trump's economic policies are misguided and will hurt the US in the long run (in theory). On one hand, pure economic destruction in the US will hurt the ruling party badly if things come up quick within a year or so. So if you're partisan person or absolutely hate the GOP, this is a good thing for the political pendulum to swing back the other way.

As for the executive Order on ObamaCare, it does little in terms of anything since Congress itself need to change the law. Absolute repeal is flat dumb since shocking the system is never good for economic stability.

Well, from what I have read the absolute repeal is actually impossible in the short term. Even if trump passes executive action against it there are a number of things that could prevent it from being executed. What trump is going for is not an outright repeat but rather gutting. He starts with this and then one step at a time congress will tear it apart until it simply is too underfunded to do anything for anyone. And then, once it is as useless and terrible as republicans say it is, they repeal it. What trump is doing is simply the first step in a systematic sabotage of obamacare.

 

[shionoro]

You say that now, but we never know when something changes and leads to a world war, eitherway as long as China and the US dont start pushing each other too much with economics it will be fine (but I will only take this for real once the South pacific sea tension wears down and the troops go home), but I really dont like how one election can have two candidates that lead to a pretty direct antagonism between 1 of two other powerful foreign countries it really speaks volumes for the load of problems the US is in right now

I say that now, and i also said it before all those things changed.
Because there are things that do not change.

China and the US are ECONOMICALLY DEPENDEND.
No tradewar can change that fact. They would suffer economically if the other does badly.
They have a mutual interest in growth and stability.
Going to war with each other is completely out of question unless the US wants to go bancrupt.#

And honestly: Please put it to rest. Clinton had no direct antagonism against russia.
Russia is doing shit, and it should be calle dout for it.
What was elected was a puppet who instead wants to anger a power that actually usually is considerate in foreign affairs and didnt try to meddle in the US election.

 

[TotalEconomist]

Well, from what I can tell trump started like this:

- Gutting obamacare.
- Withdrawal from TPP
- Renegotiating nafta
- Anti Abortion something something

Gutting obamacare is a tragedy and people will die. It's not that obamacare was by any means perfect but it did provide access to health care for millions of people. And as expected, not a hint of an alternative in sight (which IMO republicans won't ever present because it would be regulation and they are anti regulation).

I have mixed feelings about tpp. On one hand, there definitely are issues with it in regards to it being more convenient to corporations than people. On the other hand, I am not so sure trump's priority will be to craft a deal that is about the people instead of simply benefiting US corporations over corporations from other countries.

About nafta, I have the same reservations. The US approaching renegotiation without an ounce of good faith and aiming to squeeze other countries for all they are worth using it's immense influence would be rather catastrophic in a place like mexico and get the US a fair bit of ill will from there. Not to mention doing that to even poorer countries. Not to mention trump's apparent basic misunderstanding of the trade deficit (because it's not really an issue for the us...).

And the anti abortion. I am not particular pro abortion to be honest (nor am I very religious currently) but I do think de-funding planned parenthood and similar organizations would be a disaster simply because they do provide other services for women.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 24, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 24, 2017 ---

Well, from what I have read the absolute repeal is actually impossible in the short term. Even if trump passes executive action against it there are a number of things that could prevent it from being executed. What trump is going for is not an outright repeat but rather gutting. He starts with this and then one step at a time congress will tear it apart until it simply is too underfunded to do anything for anyone. And then, once it is as useless and terrible as republicans say it is, they repeal it. What trump is doing is simply the first step in a systematic sabotage of obamacare.

Even then he really can't gut the law, just tell the HHS to mobilize.

Either way, it probably won't go well from the Republicans (Short or Long). Of course, that could be said for any ruling party, as the voters that matter have the attention span of a goldfish.

 

[shionoro]

You know I think the people trying to instigate war with Russia are the real ones likely to push WW3 not Trump. I know people like to make it as simplified as "Trump = Bad, everyone who oppose him = Good" but it's never that simple. Trump has his problems but he's not threatening to bomb nations rather focusing on American interest and internal economic and security issues .

You notice the same people pushing the Russia angle are the same war hawks who got us into Iraq with the media egging it all on with their pro-conflict propaganda. History repeats itself and there is no public information absolutely linking Russia to the hacks despite the media continue to repeat these false claims.

You can still be critical of Trump and reject the false BS the media and politicians on both the left and right are spewing out to create a conflict with Russia.

Trump does not have 'his problems' trump is running the US into the ground and all its foreign affairs and dependencies with it.

The iraq war was partially pushed by trump himself, because back then many people believed false accusations of iraq having weapons of mass destruction.
It has NOTHING to do with the situation at hand, namely russia openly destabilizing europe and the US and annexing parts of europe.

It is a fact that russia is behind the hacks, even simple common sense implies it. How can you call it false claims when dozens of US intelligences agree on that and the russians are known for it and are the only ones who have the means for it?

There is no false bullshit the media spills about russia and trump.

it is the sad truth and you should face it.

 

[M3J]

So far, Trump is already fucking up the country and hurting women with shit like passing a bill that prevents funding of NGO that does anything remotely abortion. Ridiculous.

 

[kkck]

No one has been pushing for a war with russia. People said that about clinton but none of what she said can be rationally construed to mean she wants a war with russia.

As for trump, I am not so sure how this even needs saying but he actually pushed for the most aggressive foreign policy the US has had in decades. Allt that while proposing to withdraw support to NATO, get cozy with russia, hurt US-China relations (though I don't know enough about this specific issue to take, well, issue with it). Heck, he literally had a dick measuring contest with other republicans about who would bomb the middle east the hardest and torture more.

 

[Aonori]

I say that now, and i also said it before all those things changed.
Because there are things that do not change.

China and the US are ECONOMICALLY DEPENDEND.
No tradewar can change that fact. They would suffer economically if the other does badly.
They have a mutual interest in growth and stability.
Going to war with each other is completely out of question unless the US wants to go bancrupt.#

And honestly: Please put it to rest. Clinton had no direct antagonism against russia.
Russia is doing shit, and it should be calle dout for it.
What was elected was a puppet who instead wants to anger a power that actually usually is considerate in foreign affairs and didnt try to meddle in the US election.

thats why we are seeing investments from the chinese in America being increased now.

The US doesnt want to go bankrupt, but Trump wants to renegotiate the US debt with China, I can only wish him good luck on that one...

It certainly didnt look like it during her campaign.

And consideering my own country had it´s nice fair share of issues related to protecionism, I cant say I´m not a lil biased on the subject, which is why economically speaking, with Trump, China will have some new pressure coming up.

 

[shionoro]

It certainly didnt look like it during her campaign.

I am amazed how people can still defend russia and instead blame people calling them out.

 

[Onyx Darkmatter]

Now we're all sons of bitches - Kenneth Bainbridge

I can see Kim launching a Nuke at his southern neighbor in the future, granted that Trump doesn't beat him to it.

I don't think he would really want that, unless he believes that he and North Korea is completely immune to the Radiation.

And the anti abortion. I am not particular pro abortion to be honest (nor am I very religious currently) but I do think de-funding planned parenthood and similar organizations would be a disaster simply because they do provide other services for women.

From what I've heard, he's just withdrawing funds from Abortions done outside the U.S. He's not really defunding PP in the U.S. as far as I'm concerned.