American Politics

[SharkBait]

When did you realize this? I mean, I'm not saying Dems are innocent in this, but Reps are way worse when it comes to giving Black people equality and equity.

when I went to an eviction exhibit (in milwaukee) and a MLK exhibit and a housing exhibit (in memphis) that showed how the system injustices us.

 

[M3J]

For some odd reason, I'm proud of you even though I'm not Black. I forgot if I've been arguing this all along, but USA has always been against the advancement of Black people from the 17th century. You know about the Tulsa, OK massacre? How Black people during the Civil War were targeted in NYC and lynched? The whole reason why cops were created?

 

[Notthetreeguy]

Regarding police cruelty is big problem all over the world not just in America. I heard in many sources that U.S. police are being trained in Israel. A country that was founded on innocent blood but lets save that for another topic.

1. So because somewhere else it is also a problem I can justify my own problem with it. I also need to question how seriously you meant this sentence in the passage before: "If you want to change, then start with yourself first. "
2. Also if you compare the numbers to other high developed countries you will see that the US is the only one having such a hard problem with police brutality. Source
3. The US Police is responsible fully for the actions of his/her officers because everything that leads to this cases is under their own control. Where or by who they were trained doesn't play any role as long as you can not proof that the other site were breaking terms in the contract that can be related to the current case(s).
4. Also you should bring evidence when you accuse someone (in this statement Israel) of such a thing especially on high sensitive statements like yours. Even if it is true the US Police need to justify their actions and name their reason for training their officers there. Also before they can blame the contract partner in any way they need to proof that the other site broke the contract in such a way that it led to this outcome. But here you need to take a lot of other things into account so no quick judgement pls.
   

 

[M3J]

^ just wanted to mention I don't agree with Israel being innocent but agree with most other things.

By now, if you've seen actual videos on Twitter and not edited one in the news, you should be outraged with how the cops are behaving. They're getting violent for no reason, and just because a group of people don't want to be killed.

 

[Raven]

1. So because somewhere else it is also a problem I can justify my own problem with it. I also need to question how seriously you meant this sentence in the passage before: "If you want to change, then start with yourself first. "
2. Also if you compare the numbers to other high developed countries you will see that the US is the only one having such a hard problem with police brutality. Source
3. The US Police is responsible fully for the actions of his/her officers because everything that leads to this cases is under their own control. Where or by who they were trained doesn't play any role as long as you can not proof that the other site were breaking terms in the contract that can be related to the current case(s).
4. Also you should bring evidence when you accuse someone (in this statement Israel) of such a thing especially on high sensitive statements like yours. Even if it is true the US Police need to justify their actions and name their reason for training their officers there. Also before they can blame the contract partner in any way they need to proof that the other site broke the contract in such a way that it led to this outcome. But here you need to take a lot of other things into account so no quick judgement pls.

Because U.S. has many races who are American, They have to be repressive and brutal to have control people when they do crimes or this country will turn in a big civil war between several parties, However that doesn't justify police killing innocent people left and right like we see now.

Look! I'm not giving U.S. a free pass by blaming Israel. I'm just pointing out from where these none sense killing actions adopted. You can relate to how Israel police treat Palestinians who are unarmed and possess no threat. They randomly kill people without any reason like what happen George and even laugh about it. The dude told him i can't breath but he still shoot him anyway. It's so similar and you can't deny it. Just like last week Israeli police killed a disabled guy for no reason then apologized about it.


Where are you from? if you don't mind saying.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020, Original Post Date: Jun 6, 2020 ---

Evidence about police being trained in Israel?

Israeli forces trained cops in ‘restraint techniques’ at Minneapolis conference

Officers from the U.S. police force responsible for the killing of George Floyd received training in restraint techniques and anti-terror tactics from Israeli law enforcement officers.

peoplesworld.org

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020 ---

US Police Regularly Trained By Israeli Military: Amnesty Report

Hundreds of law enforcement officials traveled to Israel for training, while thousands of others received training from Israeli officials in the U.S.

www.telesurenglish.net

 

[desin24]

Time to play the "It's ze jews card"

Police Brutality is IMO mostly about two things. Accountability and Training. One of the things preached in Law School here is that harsh punishments are not as much of a deterrent than a very high chance of being caught. All criminals (cops included) act because they don't fear being caught or at least don't fear it enough. For that you need to get rid of corruption and put a system of accountability in place.

Second is training. This is more about the daily police life and not those assholes randomly attacking protesters. (Those should be dealt with according to proper accountability). Not so much about ze evil jews training police but more about police being trained by former military and getting military-grade equipment. Police should not be a local military unit. The military has a very clear structure and goes out on specific missions with specific goals. The police is out there every day with the duty to protect.

Instead of an ACAB mentality what you need is a "good people need to be cops" mentality. Defunding police usually means cuts in training first and shittier hiring practices. Not even talking about those who argue for abolishing police as a whole.

Is racism a factor? Sure. Is reducing everything to race the most effective way to solve these complex multi-factored problems? Not sure.

 

[M3J]

Do we really need police, though? More often than not, they show up after the fact, and according to victims of sexual assault or abuse, they barely do anything to help. The huge backlog of rape kits in offices is evidence of this.

 

[xi0]

We do need police. But we need a police force that doesn't enforce laws by constantly acting like they're above the law. This is how power is abused.

 

[desin24]

Do we really need police, though? More often than not, they show up after the fact, and according to victims of sexual assault or abuse, they barely do anything to help. The huge backlog of rape kits in offices is evidence of this.

Let's continue your thought. No police. Who makes sure that people follow the laws that are made to ensure peace between people. Rights to property and Personal safety?

Neighborhood watches? Private Militias? Families? Do you honestly believe they will follow any kind of compassionate code of conduct? That's like burning your Tesla because of a motor malfunction and going back to carriages because all automobiles have motors and can therefore be broken.

 

[Ramen]

Do we really need police, though? More often than not, they show up after the fact, and according to victims of sexual assault or abuse, they barely do anything to help. The huge backlog of rape kits in offices is evidence of this.

Absolutely we need police.

 

[kkck]

Do we really need police, though? More often than not, they show up after the fact, and according to victims of sexual assault or abuse, they barely do anything to help. The huge backlog of rape kits in offices is evidence of this.

Yes, you definitely need the police... And sure, the police show up after facts but... how the hell can that possibly be any different? The main issue here is that in the vast majority of situations its not actually the police's job to "fight" crime. That's just confusing the police with batman... Even if you think the police is supposed to do that, for that to happen you need either the extraordinary coincidence of the police showing up as crime happens or that it lasts long enough for the police to arrive while it is still happening. There is also the issue that there is no reasonable alternative to the police. And in context, the issue with the police in the US is not that they exist... Reading online about police response to protests and protesters its fairly clear that the police believe that they are doing the right thing in all these cases. That's why (kinda in a mobster like fashion) they don't testify against each other and almost invariably got each other's back. The core issue remains that the police are doing exactly what they are trained for. Minorities in the US get the brunt of it but the fact is that it can happen to anyone. The entire police force needs to be demilitarized and retrained into not thinking they are batman. Otherwise you will simply continue to have police that is doing exactly what it was trained to do.

 

[SnuggleCupcake]

There is also the issue that there is no reasonable alternative to the police.

I can't name very many things that the police don't have an alternative for, actually. Even when they're supposed to be doing their jobs, my own anecdotal experience has been that they don't actually do that. A friend of mine got jumped a few years ago by three guys and the cops wanted to arrest him for demanding that they go arrest the other guys because they didn't want to arrest said guys. Why? It was inconvenient for them.

But they stopped long enough to flirt with his mom.

Reading online about police response to protests and protesters its fairly clear that the police believe that they are doing the right thing in all these cases. That's why (kinda in a mobster like fashion) they don't testify against each other and almost invariably got each other's back. The core issue remains that the police are doing exactly what they are trained for. Minorities in the US get the brunt of it but the fact is that it can happen to anyone.

You're so close to realizing the police is just a racist institution. Like, they believe the right thing is upholding the law. So what happens if those laws, policies, and mandates are racist? Like, what if minorities get the brunt of it because those laws, policies, and mandates are racist? What if, from conception until this very date today, the laws that get cited and protested, the actions of police in and outside of protest situations - what if those were all racist?

The good news is you don't have to wonder the what if - all those laws, policies, and mandates are, in fact, racist. Like stop and frisk laws, for example. And everything that came out of "The War on Drugs".

The bad news is that they are racist, and always have been, and it's incredibly messed up.

The entire police force needs to be demilitarized and retrained into not thinking they are batman. Otherwise you will simply continue to have police that is doing exactly what it was trained to do.

Abolish the police and replace them with something else entirely. Same thing with prisons, completely remove the prison system and replace it with a system focused on rehabilitation.

 

[Ramen]

Abolish the police and replace them with something else entirely.

Until someone comes up with an actual alternative, this is a terrible idea.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020, Original Post Date: Jun 6, 2020 ---

Same thing with prisons, completely remove the prison system and replace it with a system focused on rehabilitation.

Not all prisoners deserve rehabilitation.

 

[SnuggleCupcake]

Not all prisoners deserve rehabilitation.

They do, and if anyone is irredeemable they simply won't be rehabilitated but they still deserve for us to try.

Until someone comes up with an actual alternative, this is a terrible idea

People have! Like, There. Are. Plenty. of examples you can find just googling. The police existing for even one more zeptosecond is literally the worst idea in existence.

 

[Ramen]

They do, and if anyone is irredeemable they simply won't be rehabilitated but they still deserve for us to try.

Rapists, Serial Killers and Terrorists do not deserve rehabilitation.

People have! Like, There. Are. Plenty. of examples you can find just googling. The police existing for even one more zeptosecond is literally the worst idea in existence.

Most of them are just " Hey why don't we sit down and discuss our problems." That isn't a solution. Maybe in the US but not globally.

 

[SnuggleCupcake]

Rapists, Serial Killers and Terrorists do not deserve rehabilitation.

I disagree, everyone deserves rehabilitation. Someone who cannot be redeemed won't make it through the process. But the system gets to decide that, the process gets to decide that, not random people. Which is how it should be.

Most of them are just " Hey why don't we sit down and discuss our problems." That isn't a solution.

Conjecture, but also not true (I also read the things I link). And even if it was, most of doesn't imply that there isn't a proposed alternative just that there aren't many. So the ones even you saw you're welcome to comment on and we can have that discussion. Otherwise your post sits at conjecture.

 

[Ramen]

I disagree, everyone deserves rehabilitation. Someone who cannot be redeemed won't make it through the process. But the system gets to decide that, the process gets to decide that, not random people. Which is how it should be.

The system should focus on those who deserve a second chance.

Conjecture, but also not true (I also read the things I link). And even if it was, most of doesn't imply that there isn't a proposed alternative just that there aren't many. So the ones even you saw you're welcome to comment on and we can have that discussion. Otherwise your post sits at conjecture.

How else do you think we should deal with drug dealers, murderers and things of that nature. The idea of police isn't a bad one. It's the USA that all these events are taking place. Other countries have their faults but it's a very small minority.

First thing that happens when police go away is anarchy.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020, Original Post Date: Jun 6, 2020 ---

Otherwise your post sits at conjecture.

And yours sit at an idealist opinion.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020 ---

Reform the police, don't abolish it.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020 ---

I find this hilarious

Antifa seeks CIA funding after being labelled terrorist group – The Chaser

Makes sense.

chaser.com.au

 

[SnuggleCupcake]

The system should focus on those who deserve a second chance.

Everyone deserves a second chance. But again, this is why it would be out of the hands of people who believe in vengeance over justice. Everyone gets a shot.

How else do you think we should deal with drug dealers, murderers and things of that nature. The idea of police isn't a bad one. It's the USA that all these events are taking place. Other countries have their faults but it's a very small minority.

First thing that happens when police go away is anarchy.

Decriminalize all drug use, for starters. If someone isn't hurting anyone but themselves their actions aren't inherently evil. If that man isn't robbing a store to get money for meth, but just buying meth and doing it? Let him do meth.

Murderers and other crimes that require investigation can be handled by a separate entity that is responsible for crime investigation. And a completely different group can help with preventative crime. Not
"let's look for people speeding" but "there's an ongoing bank robbery let's handle that." That way the two departments can communicate but are inherently separate.

Also that anarchy thing is nonsense. The police aren't sitting there holding back the last levee of human decency. Most people don't call the cops at all for any reasons. We handle our business like adults, successfully. People don't avoid murder, or r*pe, or robbery because they might get caught - that's some Lord of The Flies privileged white male nonsense - we avoid those things because they're bad and wrong. You remove the police and everyone keeps doing what we already do.

And yours sit at an idealist opinion.
--- Double Post Merged, A moment ago ---
Reform the police, don't abolish it.

Idealism still provides valid things to a discussion, conjecture literally means you stated an opinion without any evidence, You did the intellectual equivalent of looking at my post and going "nuh uh", If you don't want to have the discussion simply don't.

 

[Ramen]

Decriminalize all drug use, for starters. If someone isn't hurting anyone but themselves their actions aren't inherently evil. If that man isn't robbing a store to get money for meth, but just buying meth and doing it? Let him do meth.

This I agree with.

Murderers and other crimes that require investigation can be handled by a separate entity that is responsible for crime investigation. And a completely different group can help with preventative crime. Not
"let's look for people speeding" but "there's an ongoing bank robbery let's handle that." That way the two departments can communicate but are inherently separate.

"Separate Entity." Just have the police do it.

Also that anarchy thing is nonsense. The police aren't sitting there holding back the last levee of human decency. Most people don't call the cops at all for any reasons. We handle our business like adults, successfully. People don't avoid murder, or r*pe, or robbery because they might get caught - that's some Lord of The Flies privileged white male nonsense - we avoid those things because they're bad and wrong. You remove the police and everyone keeps doing what we already do.

This is nonsense. You are arguing of the basis that human nature is to do good and whatnot and this is simply not true. Murder, hate crimes, rapes and robberies are still rampant in numbers. Guess those people forgot those were wrong actions? You remove the police and the situation get's worse. WHat everyone is doing is already terrible enough in the states. Rioting, beating up innocent civilians, destorying people's businesses, you want people to keep doing that?

Idealism still provides valid things to a discussion, conjecture literally means you stated an opinion without any evidence, You did the intellectual equivalent of looking at my post and going "nuh uh", If you don't want to have the discussion simply don't.

This makes no sense. I've studied enough where I can sometimes look at what someone says and see their wrong. Idealism is literally defined as "the practice of forming or pursuing ideals, especially unrealistically." It's like Communism, it's a utopia, sounds good on paper but it can't suffice.

Yes the police are necessary whether you like it or not. Instead of abolishing the police, change it up a bit.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 6, 2020, Original Post Date: Jun 6, 2020 ---

we avoid those things because they're bad and wrong. You remove the police and everyone keeps doing what we already do.

This is statistically not true. Crimes are still very high in numbers.

Topic: Crime in the United States

What crimes are most common, are felonies increasing, and which states have the most crime? Find out in our analysis of crime in the U.S.

www.statista.com

 

[SnuggleCupcake]

"Separate Entity." Just have the police do it.

No thanks.

This is nonsense. You are arguing of the basis that human nature is to do good and whatnot and this is simply not true. Murder, hate crimes, rapes and robberies are still rampant in numbers. Guess those people forgot those were wrong actions? You remove the police and the situation get's worse. WHat everyone is doing is already terrible enough in the states. Rioting, beating up innocent civilians, destorying people's businesses, you want people to keep doing that?

Human nature is good. Like, obviously it is. Are you saying the only thing keeping you from murdering, r*ping, and robbing people is the law? You'd do it absolutely 100% without those laws? Cause I can't name a single person I personally talk to who would.

This makes no sense. I've studied enough where I can sometimes look at what someone says and see their wrong. Idealism is literally defined as "the practice of forming or pursuing ideals, especially unrealistically." It's like Communism, it's a utopia, sounds good on paper but it can't suffice.

Yes the police are necessary whether you like it or not.

Please provide any supporting evidence from the stuff you've studied. Especially if you would like to be regarded as an authority who has studied enough that he can "just see when people are wrong".

This is statistically not true. Crimes are still very high in numbers.

This has nothing to do with what I said.