American Politics

[xi0]

..... Did california actually put a high speed train system on hold because musk said something something hyperloop?

He has a history of floating false solutions to the drawbacks of our over-reliance on cars that stifle efforts to give people other options. The Boring Company was supposed to solve traffic, not be the Las Vegas amusement ride it is now. As I’ve written in my book, Musk admitted to his biographer Ashlee Vance that Hyperloop was all about trying to get legislators to cancel plans for high-speed rail in California—even though he had no plans to build it.

Several years ago, Musk said that public transit was “a pain in the ass” where you were surrounded by strangers, including possible serial killers, to justify his opposition. But the futures sold to us by Musk and many others in Silicon Valley didn’t just suit their personal preferences. They were designed to meet business needs, and were the cause of just as many problems as they claimed to solve—if not more.

Obviously Musk has varied business interests like most billionaires... but I'm wondering if anyone stopped to ask whether it was just a coincidence that he owns a car company but was effectively working against high-speed rail initiatives. It would obviously be in his best interest to do so, especially in a state like California that his so huge and already had a lot of infrastructure suited for EVs.

 

[kkck]

He has a history of floating false solutions to the drawbacks of our over-reliance on cars that stifle efforts to give people other options. The Boring Company was supposed to solve traffic, not be the Las Vegas amusement ride it is now. As I’ve written in my book, Musk admitted to his biographer Ashlee Vance that Hyperloop was all about trying to get legislators to cancel plans for high-speed rail in California—even though he had no plans to build it.

Several years ago, Musk said that public transit was “a pain in the ass” where you were surrounded by strangers, including possible serial killers, to justify his opposition. But the futures sold to us by Musk and many others in Silicon Valley didn’t just suit their personal preferences. They were designed to meet business needs, and were the cause of just as many problems as they claimed to solve—if not more.

Obviously Musk has varied business interests like most billionaires... but I'm wondering if anyone stopped to ask whether it was just a coincidence that he owns a car company but was effectively working against high-speed rail initiatives. It would obviously be in his best interest to do so, especially in a state like California that his so huge and already had a lot of infrastructure suited for EVs.

Holy shit. So reiterate... musk took actual steps to tank a public transport initiative in california specifically to protect and further his business interest. Straight up evil. This, and it's impact on the environment of course, should be what musk is remembered for.

On a separate note, that gets us to legislators either being stupid enough to believe the technology for a hyperloop could exist in even a near-ish future or simply being against public transport...

 

[xi0]

Holy shit. So reiterate... musk took actual steps to tank a public transport initiative in california specifically to protect and further his business interest. Straight up evil. This, and it's impact on the environment of course, should be what musk is remembered for.

On a separate note, that gets us to legislators either being stupid enough to believe the technology for a hyperloop could exist in even a near-ish future or simply being against public transport...

Billionaries billionairing... or whatever

To be fair to him, I imagine other figures in the automotive industry did the same kind of thing or would if they were in his position, but anyone expecting some sort of effective altruism from this guy because he shitposts online and wants to go to Mars and talked about UBI before are suckers.

 

[shionoro]

That is nothing new, it happens all over the wolrd with car companies. Germany, with car industry being a big part of economy, had car companies lobby to destroy rail, too. And they had lots of success.

After all, what is more harmful to you selling highspeed cars than a wellfunctioning and cheap public transport system?

 

[kkck]

I am aware of the influence car makers had on policy way back in the day in the US (I am not familiar with german stuff)... in this case what surprised me is that musk specifically engaged in this. And to add a layer of shittyness to this at the expense of the environment.

 

[M3J]

Defund the Police bad.

Defund the FBI, CIA, and other intelligence agencies good.

Sigh.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2022, Original Post Date: Aug 10, 2022 ---

I commend you for denouncing violence for what it's worth.

More like, "support anything that opposes people I don't like as long as it doesn't oppose me but be against anything that opposes me! >"

It is not about Trump going to jail (he won't in all probability).

It is about what kind of case democrats can make against trump, with what kind of information, before the midterms. And I think if they can make a very convincing and detailed case about his january six involvement, that can help mobilize their voters in the midterm election.
Whether trump gets convincted for anything after that election is on another note.

Um yeah, no. Their voter base should be energized enough to vote by now, and if they're not, I doubt going after Trump will make much of a difference, especially when nothing will happen.

He has a history of floating false solutions to the drawbacks of our over-reliance on cars that stifle efforts to give people other options. The Boring Company was supposed to solve traffic, not be the Las Vegas amusement ride it is now. As I’ve written in my book, Musk admitted to his biographer Ashlee Vance that Hyperloop was all about trying to get legislators to cancel plans for high-speed rail in California—even though he had no plans to build it.

Several years ago, Musk said that public transit was “a pain in the ass” where you were surrounded by strangers, including possible serial killers, to justify his opposition. But the futures sold to us by Musk and many others in Silicon Valley didn’t just suit their personal preferences. They were designed to meet business needs, and were the cause of just as many problems as they claimed to solve—if not more.

Obviously Musk has varied business interests like most billionaires... but I'm wondering if anyone stopped to ask whether it was just a coincidence that he owns a car company but was effectively working against high-speed rail initiatives. It would obviously be in his best interest to do so, especially in a state like California that his so huge and already had a lot of infrastructure suited for EVs.

I think he's done a good job of fooling people into thinking he gives a shit that they didn't think to question him, on top of him distracting with the shit he says and tweets.

 

[shionoro]

I know it is petty, but i do believe in checking outcomes.

I mean, face facts. Ukraine has lost 95% of the total military assets and bases immediately across the country.

That is what you wrote march 11th. I hope you don't still stand by that adessment of Ukraine having lost 95% of their military assets and bases 5 months ago.
Because I wonder how they kept fighting for 5 more months with only 5% of their assets and bases.

Do you still think those two are Zelenskyy's only options?

Option A - Zelenskyy bends the knee, bows out, and the result is a Russian 'win' with the current death count

Option B - Zelenskyy holds out even longer, still loses his city/seat/position, many more on both sides die, and Russia still gets the prize

Because right now, it awfully looks like Ukraine is winning this war. BEcause:

Meanwhile the Russian convoy is right on his doorstep, redeploying to start on Kiev.

That did not seem to have worked out so well.
Seems like "Bagdad Bob" was right, huh?

Um yeah, no. Their voter base should be energized enough to vote by now, and if they're not, I doubt going after Trump will make much of a difference, especially when nothing will happen.

Uncovering more details about trump's involvement in january sixth is certain to have an effect on the election, both when it comes to dissuading swing voters from voting red and energizing the democratic base.
If democrats can make the point "if you vote red, you vote fascism" clearer with this, that might be a winning move.

 

[M3J]

What more details need to be uncovered? Trump and a lot of his politician supporters played a role, with Trump openly encouraging his supporters to be violent on Twitter, which got him banned. If nothing else, it can energize his supporters and republicans to vote for Trump as well, especially when many of them are acting like victims.

Not really, they have to be careful with that message.

 

[shionoro]

What more details need to be uncovered? Trump and a lot of his politician supporters played a role, with Trump openly encouraging his supporters to be violent on Twitter, which got him banned. If nothing else, it can energize his supporters and republicans to vote for Trump as well, especially when many of them are acting like victims.

Not really, they have to be careful with that message.

The details. And it needs to be official. Indicting Trump was one thing, having the FBI raid his office and uncover very dirty facts like him destroying material he was not supposed to destroy is another.
A lot of voters were dissuaded from voting for clinton because the 11th hour email accusations. I very much doubt that holding trump accountable, even if just symbolic, will backfire.

The people who think this is a witchhunt are going to vote anyway. But the people in swing states who vote red but do not really like trump and his way of doing things might be affected. Especially in swing states like georgia, mobilization against trump was a thing 2020 and ensuring that there are not two senators again who'd protect people like trump is a good election promise

 

[M3J]

Clinton vs. Trump is different, and it didn't help her that Dems were exposed as working hard against Bernie. A lot of people with Trump can just say it's fake news or that he has a target on his back or whatever else, and it doesn't help that the way Dems have been reacting has been and would be helping him.

That's very few people, and probably even fewer people voting blue given Biden.

 

[shionoro]

Clinton vs. Trump is different, and it didn't help her that Dems were exposed as working hard against Bernie. A lot of people with Trump can just say it's fake news or that he has a target on his back or whatever else, and it doesn't help that the way Dems have been reacting has been and would be helping him.

That's very few people, and probably even fewer people voting blue given Biden.

It's the 0.5 percent of people that swing georgia red or blue, and some other swingstates. By that logic, basically no action has any influence on the election because trumpv oters are insane and democrats vote blue anyway. But that is not the whole truth.

Letting the horror of january sixth live up again shortly before an election with all detaisl being discussed in a court instead of social media and then making the pitch of "if you vote blue, you can prevent that kind of powergrab", that is a strong election promise.
Having January sixth be int he backround and partially forgotten by many average voters is not quite as strong.

 

[catagon87]

Let's just take a break from January 6th, Trump, etc..
Let's just enjoy some good folk music.

 

[ninjabot]

He's already dead, but we've got another Trumplican radicalized into violence. I hate that he's dead, because now he can't testify and everyone can keep claiming he's an Antifa member attempting to make Trump supporters look bad.

 

[M3J]

It's the 0.5 percent of people that swing georgia red or blue, and some other swingstates. By that logic, basically no action has any influence on the election because trumpv oters are insane and democrats vote blue anyway. But that is not the whole truth.

Letting the horror of january sixth live up again shortly before an election with all detaisl being discussed in a court instead of social media and then making the pitch of "if you vote blue, you can prevent that kind of powergrab", that is a strong election promise.
Having January sixth be int he backround and partially forgotten by many average voters is not quite as strong.

And you're focusing on just one thing in hopes that it'll work. No, that's not enough to sway undecided voters, not when the Dems had the ability to take action against Trump ages ago, could have prevented the overturning of Roe vs. Wade decades ago, and aren't upholding their promises like getting rid of student debt. Many undecided voters will just think going after Trump is just an attempt to look like they're doing something instead of focusing on the important issues, a distraction for the voters.

 

[shionoro]

And you're focusing on just one thing in hopes that it'll work. No, that's not enough to sway undecided voters, not when the Dems had the ability to take action against Trump ages ago, could have prevented the overturning of Roe vs. Wade decades ago, and aren't upholding their promises like getting rid of student debt. Many undecided voters will just think going after Trump is just an attempt to look like they're doing something instead of focusing on the important issues, a distraction for the voters.

Poll: More registered voters approve of Mar-a-Lago search than disapprove - POLITICO

only 37% disapprove of the raid action. 15% of republicans and 50% of independents agree with it. These are important voter groups and offering them evidence (if democrats manage to communicate it) that trump tried to steal the election and republicans helped him will be very helpful in midterms.

 

[Sanity Check]

FBI warns of 'dirty bomb' threat, Iranian official comments on Rushdie attack, and more top headlines

www.foxnews.com

Dirty bomb threats.

...

 

[catagon87]

Poll: More registered voters approve of Mar-a-Lago search than disapprove - POLITICO

only 37% disapprove of the raid action. 15% of republicans and 50% of independents agree with it. These are important voter groups and offering them evidence (if democrats manage to communicate it) that trump tried to steal the election and republicans helped him will be very helpful in midterms.

You should try living in Texas, Georgia or Florida for a year (I'm joking. Don't do that). I don't really know how anyone can identify as an "independent" these days, and honestly feel like they are mostly minds made up, save for a few, and just don't want to label themselves. Living in Texas I've seen an MSNBC (very liberal media) PHD Data Scientist who was one of the best software engineers I've ever worked with convert from a Democrat to a die-hard Trump supporting Republican. When I met him we talked about how insane Trump was (about 2015). These days he thinks January 6th was a bunch of people who got a little carried away, abortion is murder, and is just very pro Trump in general.

For a few reasons I'm very skeptical of any political polling. For one, I have never been part of any test sample. I also think it's hard not to bias the data. Republicans in Utah are a lot different than Republicans in Texas. Voters in West Virginia are in general a lot different than most other states. Some demographics vote for a certain party, but align either socially or economically with the other (for instance, Mexican culture is very socially conservative, but they tend to vote more Democrat).

Also, most do not vote based on this type of criteria; Need I remind you about Trump's recorded conversation with Billy Bush? Most people care about a few things:

• Do they have a paycheck?
• Is their 401k green?
• Are they fucked by a particular issue like healthcare or student loans?
• Is their paycheck smaller? (increased taxes)

Republicans have a powerful scapegoat, RINO, that they use whenever an agenda/campaign promise doesn't happen. DINO doesn't seem to get used as much. So they're left with a lot of campaign promises unfulfilled, or vastly under-delivered and nobody to blame. Obamacare not repealed? It's those mean old 30-year-tenure Republicans!

Part of the problem is that we currently have a Democrat controlled House, Senate, and Presidency in the same term the Republican controlled court has repealed Roe v Wade, and pushed religious agenda down our throats. Even though it's not in their control, it's not a good look to lose abortion rights, empower the Church even more, enhanced gun rights, all while citizens are still saddled with student loan debt, insulin is still fucking expensive, and a trip to the hospital could land you homeless.

Most Americans, right and left, do not want their taxes increased. Period. There's a very, very good reason for this.

 

[shionoro]

You should try living in Texas, Georgia or Florida for a year (I'm joking. Don't do that). I don't really know how anyone can identify as an "independent" these days, and honestly feel like they are mostly minds made up, save for a few, and just don't want to label themselves. Living in Texas I've seen an MSNBC (very liberal media) PHD Data Scientist who was one of the best software engineers I've ever worked with convert from a Democrat to a die-hard Trump supporting Republican. When I met him we talked about how insane Trump was (about 2015). These days he thinks January 6th was a bunch of people who got a little carried away, abortion is murder, and is just very pro Trump in general.

For a few reasons I'm very skeptical of any political polling. For one, I have never been part of any test sample. I also think it's hard not to bias the data. Republicans in Utah are a lot different than Republicans in Texas. Voters in West Virginia are in general a lot different than most other states. Some demographics vote for a certain party, but align either socially or economically with the other (for instance, Mexican culture is very socially conservative, but they tend to vote more Democrat).

Also, most do not vote based on this type of criteria; Need I remind you about Trump's recorded conversation with Billy Bush? Most people care about a few things:

• Do they have a paycheck?
• Is their 401k green?
• Are they fucked by a particular issue like healthcare or student loans?
• Is their paycheck smaller? (increased taxes)

Republicans have a powerful scapegoat, RINO, that they use whenever an agenda/campaign promise doesn't happen. DINO doesn't seem to get used as much. So they're left with a lot of campaign promises unfulfilled, or vastly under-delivered and nobody to blame. Obamacare not repealed? It's those mean old 30-year-tenure Republicans!

Part of the problem is that we currently have a Democrat controlled House, Senate, and Presidency in the same term the Republican controlled court has repealed Roe v Wade, and pushed religious agenda down our throats. Even though it's not in their control, it's not a good look to lose abortion rights, empower the Church even more, enhanced gun rights, all while citizens are still saddled with student loan debt, insulin is still fucking expensive, and a trip to the hospital could land you homeless.

Most Americans, right and left, do not want their taxes increased. Period. There's a very, very good reason for this.

I am aware how polarized the american society is. There are not a lot of independents and swing voters, but the number of them is still relevant because most elections are split near 50/50.
In a 50/50 election like in Georgia, these things matter.

The other is turnout. Democrats had a good turnout 2020 because people wanted to get rid of trump. That is gone now, but the trial can let some of that live up again. At least that is my estimation of it. It is not the ONLY thing, but in tandem with IRA and some smaller stuff, it can swing some good will and enthusiasm in democrats and that will be necessary to keep the senate and, if we are very lucky, the house.

About political polling: It is complicated. Polling should always be taken with a grain of salt, but it is also pretty accurate on average- America is especially hard to poll because of its system (it is far easier to poll the popular vote than to say who wins an election that is gerrymandered), but i do believe that general polling can give a good estimate about which battleground are ahead for one side and which are very even.

 

[M3J]

Poll: More registered voters approve of Mar-a-Lago search than disapprove - POLITICO

only 37% disapprove of the raid action. 15% of republicans and 50% of independents agree with it. These are important voter groups and offering them evidence (if democrats manage to communicate it) that trump tried to steal the election and republicans helped him will be very helpful in midterms.

That doesn't mean anything, especially when people who aren't diehard Dems aren't happy with how Biden broke his promises and is continuing shitty stuff like supporting Israel and trying to end remote work.

 

[shionoro]

That doesn't mean anything, especially when people who aren't diehard Dems aren't happy with how Biden broke his promises and is continuing shitty stuff like supporting Israel and trying to end remote work.

It does mean your assessment is wrong, It is very unlikely to backfire and even now, before the details are out, many voters support it. It is a good thing for democrats and it might become even better the more details come out about it. I think you are vastly underestimating this.
Its not, right now, going to swing an election all by its own, but it is a good push.