American Politics

[kkck]

Voters? They got biden there to begin with and it's not like he wasn't ancient the past elections.

 

[ninjabot]

Depends on what causes him to lose if he does indeed lose, quite simply. In order for him to lose from alienating voters, it'd have to be voters from either his biggest voting demographic in a huge swathe or voters from a lot of smaller demographics that end up equalling a large enough amount of people that it makes a difference.

Fortunately for Biden the only one's making a stink are the people who don't vote (young people) or people who are virtue signaling online only to settle for voting for him anyway.

 

[M3J]

Voters? They got biden there to begin with and it's not like he wasn't ancient the past elections.

I mean, if Biden doesn't give them a good reason to vote for him, how would it be the voters' fault?

 

[ninjabot]

They've got plenty of reasons. Whether those reasons are good enough to vote for him is up to them.

If they don't see sufficient reasons to vote for him I ain't gonna beg 'em to do the right thing... but I will throw them in the same trash heap as the MAGA deplorables or the covid anti-vaxers since they're just as selfish. And the internet will shit on them the way they still shit on the MAGAts and anti-vaxers and Bernie or Busters... basically anyone who'd rather ruin things for everyone else for the sake of updoots on twitter about the virtues that they're so heavily signaling.

Fighting the system is only worthy of praise when it's not guaranteed to be a not just a losing battle, but puts people around these would-be freedom fighters in a worse living situation.

 

[kkck]

I mean, if Biden doesn't give them a good reason to vote for him, how would it be the voters' fault?

Because to begin with he is there because of voters. Same as trump... It's not like he was actually forced on anyone, he won the previous primaries, the previous elections and as difficult as it is if he was sufficiently disliked he would have been primaried and lost (and sure, it's rare for an incumbent to face a primary challenge and it's never happened that a president who gets primary has been re-elected but my comment is more on there being a process to this rather than the chances of it working out). it's perfectly ok to be critical of the political machine that pushed and protects biden but the reality is that if he lacked support in a meaningful way there would be a democratic way out of this. Democrats need to own their shit as much as republicans own trump..

 

[xi0]

I've seen all these Republicans screaming the bill is a trap. Kinda hard to push the "Democrats are partisan monsters that won't compromise on anything" thing if they don't take steps to keep a wedge issue as a wedge issue.

Imagine having a chance to get what you want but passing on it so that you can bitch about not getting what you want. These motherfuckers really are evil.

Their entire platform is this. They only exist to cut funding and starve the government, of course they're going to complain about riders and what not. And Democrats think this demonstrates a moral high ground or a political savviness... newsflash, no one cares. Republicans don't give a shit. It means nothing. No right-leaning Independents or Republicans are supporting Biden now because all of a sudden he thinks children-maiming razor-wire is totally sick, or just ignores DeSantis sending national guard to a state Florida doesn't even share a border with.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 8, 2024, Original Post Date: Feb 7, 2024 ---

The Biden administration thinks it's necessary to play 5D Chess against these kinds of "people"

 

[kkck]

Funny enough that's not an uncommon sentiment in the third world.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 8, 2024, Original Post Date: Feb 8, 2024 ---

In his second mix-up this week, Biden talks about meeting with dead European leaders

He referred to François Mitterrand, who died in 1996, instead of French President Emmanuel Macron and the late Helmut Kohl instead of former German Chancellor Angela Merkel.

www.nbcnews.com

So what's up with USA and senile presidents? Seems to be as much of a thing as entertainer presidents (and I suppose the same thing at times...).

 

[M3J]

They've got plenty of reasons. Whether those reasons are good enough to vote for him is up to them.

If they don't see sufficient reasons to vote for him I ain't gonna beg 'em to do the right thing... but I will throw them in the same trash heap as the MAGA deplorables or the covid anti-vaxers since they're just as selfish. And the internet will shit on them the way they still shit on the MAGAts and anti-vaxers and Bernie or Busters... basically anyone who'd rather ruin things for everyone else for the sake of updoots on twitter about the virtues that they're so heavily signaling.

Fighting the system is only worthy of praise when it's not guaranteed to be a not just a losing battle, but puts people around these would-be freedom fighters in a worse living situation.

Given what's happened under Biden and what Biden is doing, I find it ironic that you're calling anyone opposed to Biden as selfish or horrible. Especially when you're brushing off the genocide that Biden is enabling and don't seem to care that Biden is spending our money on Israel murdering innocent people, especially women and kids. There is very few good argument in continuing to support Biden, and the main one they'll likely use is that he's better than Trump when both are actually from the same mold.

Plus, Biden supporters like you have also pushed away support with the way you're behaving and ignoring how Muslims and Palestinians feel about what's going on in Palestine. "So what if you lost your family because of Biden? Suck it up and get over it, I don't want Trump to win because he'll ban abortion even though several states have been doing that under Biden!!" There literally is very little difference between Biden supporters and MAGAtards.

So yeah, almost no good reason to vote for him, especially when he either wants to do everything under the table or is openly giving murderers money while saying we don't have enough money to help our people.

Because to begin with he is there because of voters. Same as trump... It's not like he was actually forced on anyone, he won the previous primaries, the previous elections and as difficult as it is if he was sufficiently disliked he would have been primaried and lost (and sure, it's rare for an incumbent to face a primary challenge and it's never happened that a president who gets primary has been re-elected but my comment is more on there being a process to this rather than the chances of it working out). it's perfectly ok to be critical of the political machine that pushed and protects biden but the reality is that if he lacked support in a meaningful way there would be a democratic way out of this. Democrats need to own their shit as much as republicans own trump..

Seems there isn't a democratic way out of this. Clinton wasn't popular, but Dems still stuck with her, and look at what happened. Biden was lucky enough to come after Trump's failure at handling COVID and other shenanigans. Plus, the same people that say they will not vote for Biden now worked hard to make sure people were able to vote, which worked in Biden's favor. Biden may have some support, but he's losing it, and Dems don't seem to be considering anyone else.




Also, now that it's been four months since Oct 7, does anyone have proof of Hamas's evilness? That Israel isn't lying to try and justify their genocide? Because as far as I know, Israel has produced NO proof whatsoever of Hamas being violent, but they have shot down ceasefire attempts. Hostages themselves are not happy with Israel, whether Israel indiscriminately bombing without concern for hostages or doing very little to get them back, and they even say Israel did the most damage on Oct 7. All Zionists seem to do is put out videos making fun of Palestinians or pretending to be affected by the "war" while they look spruced up and background looks peaceful.

Palestinians however continue to share videos and pictures of destruction and murder by Zionists. They've shown corpses and destroyed buildings while Israel has shown... fake blood and CGI.

 

[kkck]

Seems there isn't a democratic way out of this. Clinton wasn't popular, but Dems still stuck with her, and look at what happened. Biden was lucky enough to come after Trump's failure at handling COVID and other shenanigans. Plus, the same people that say they will not vote for Biden now worked hard to make sure people were able to vote, which worked in Biden's favor. Biden may have some support, but he's losing it, and Dems don't seem to be considering anyone else.




Also, now that it's been four months since Oct 7, does anyone have proof of Hamas's evilness? That Israel isn't lying to try and justify their genocide? Because as far as I know, Israel has produced NO proof whatsoever of Hamas being violent, but they have shot down ceasefire attempts. Hostages themselves are not happy with Israel, whether Israel indiscriminately bombing without concern for hostages or doing very little to get them back, and they even say Israel did the most damage on Oct 7. All Zionists seem to do is put out videos making fun of Palestinians or pretending to be affected by the "war" while they look spruced up and background looks peaceful.

Palestinians however continue to share videos and pictures of destruction and murder by Zionists. They've shown corpses and destroyed buildings while Israel has shown... fake blood and CGI.

I mean, if there isn't a democratic way out then you are pretty much at the stage where you start beheading monarchs/dictators. Which I don't have any issues with but I don't think the US is at that point yet.

 

[ninjabot]

Given what's happened under Biden and what Biden is doing, I find it ironic that you're calling anyone opposed to Biden as selfish or horrible. Especially when you're brushing off the genocide that Biden is enabling and don't seem to care that Biden is spending our money on Israel murdering innocent people, especially women and kids. There is very few good argument in continuing to support Biden, and the main one they'll likely use is that he's better than Trump when both are actually from the same mold.

Plus, Biden supporters like you have also pushed away support with the way you're behaving and ignoring how Muslims and Palestinians feel about what's going on in Palestine. "So what if you lost your family because of Biden? Suck it up and get over it, I don't want Trump to win because he'll ban abortion even though several states have been doing that under Biden!!" There literally is very little difference between Biden supporters and MAGAtards.

So yeah, almost no good reason to vote for him, especially when he either wants to do everything under the table or is openly giving murderers money while saying we don't have enough money to help our people.

Americans don't care about Palestine/Israel as much as you think.
This was 4 months ago, but it'll only grow as time goes on. Remember that this conflict is decades old. It ebbs and flows every time there's a big event it pops back into the news, then it's gone.

Also, now that it's been four months since Oct 7, does anyone have proof of Hamas's evilness?

October 7th is the only one you can't pretend is fake on some Qanon conspiracy theorist shit so I'll just say that one.

That Israel isn't lying to try and justify their genocide? Because as far as I know, Israel has produced NO proof whatsoever of Hamas being violent, but they have shot down ceasefire attempts. Hostages themselves are not happy with Israel, whether Israel indiscriminately bombing without concern for hostages or doing very little to get them back, and they even say Israel did the most damage on Oct 7. All Zionists seem to do is put out videos making fun of Palestinians or pretending to be affected by the "war" while they look spruced up and background looks peaceful.

It shouldn't take tiktok vids or tweets to help you decide when history is out there for anyone to read up about it:


This is what made me 180 degree turn on my support for Palestine in the Israel/Palestine situation. It's why bringing up the genocide (and I don't deny it's a genocide) does not affect me. My moral consideration for Palestine chipped away the more I learned. Now it's almost completely gone thanks to all the Israel/Palestine debates I've watched. It's like no one can make cogent arguments in favor of Palestine: they can just moralize and use the word genocide over and over in hopes of shaming people into not pointing out the acts of Hamas and Palestinian leadership.

 

[hblock]

Western attrocities began right off the bat (not even reading the rest of nonsens) :
- Called for the establishment of a Jewish national home in an independent Palestinian state within 10 years.
Created a mess (anti-semitic europe), displaced it by invading someone else's home and waited for a peaceful resolution, apex of hypocrisy.

 

[kkck]

It wasn't an independent state though. It was part of the ottoman empire, which fell, and then become mandatory palestine which was placed under british control by the league of nations. It was very explicitly not an independent palestinian state at that point in time.

 

[M3J]

I mean, if there isn't a democratic way out then you are pretty much at the stage where you start beheading monarchs/dictators. Which I don't have any issues with but I don't think the US is at that point yet.

USA will never be at that point, and it will remain divided thanks to brainwashed republican voters who have been indoctrinated into defending the wealthy and hating on liberals and the left.

Americans don't care about Palestine/Israel as much as you think.
This was 4 months ago, but it'll only grow as time goes on. Remember that this conflict is decades old. It ebbs and flows every time there's a big event it pops back into the news, then it's gone.



October 7th is the only one you can't pretend is fake on some Qanon conspiracy theorist shit so I'll just say that one.



It shouldn't take tiktok vids or tweets to help you decide when history is out there for anyone to read up about it:


This is what made me 180 degree turn on my support for Palestine in the Israel/Palestine situation. It's why bringing up the genocide (and I don't deny it's a genocide) does not affect me. My moral consideration for Palestine chipped away the more I learned. Now it's almost completely gone thanks to all the Israel/Palestine debates I've watched. It's like no one can make cogent arguments in favor of Palestine: they can just moralize and use the word genocide over and over in hopes of shaming people into not pointing out the acts of Hamas and Palestinian leadership.

Which again, if you claim to care about Americans and whatnot, then you should care given the fact that we need the money. Prices have gone up for almost everything while people are getting laid off, and despite promising to cancel student loans Biden refuses to do that. Yet no issue giving billions of dollars to other countries to let them murder innocent people.

That's the only thing Israel has, "OctObeR 7th!!" while Israeli hostages have blamed IOF for doing the most damage.

I don't need TikTok videos and tweets, but given they're provided by the actual sources themselves (Israel and their supporters and Palestinians), using that is not wrong.

Palestine took in Jewish people who were forced there by UK if I recall correctly, and then soon after most of the Jewish people kicked Palestinians out of their homes and claimed Palestine for their own, which created Israel.

So basically, you're okay with Israel lying about Hamas and Palestine to justify raping and killing innocent men, women, and children, and that they're starving and sniping kids. Crazy how we see videos of hostages released by Hamas, and they all seem to be doing okay, but when Israel releases hostages, these hostages have been tortured horribly. People bring up genocide because killing people, especially groups of people, is bad. There's no justification for using phosphorus bombs, sniping kids, or raping kids and women, whether or not Hamas is hiding behind citizens. Again, that's an excuse they make, and it's working for brainwashed people.

You can claim to be on a moral ground all you want, but the facts show that Israel is maiming, murdering, and raping Palestinians regardless of gender or age. If you can look at the pictures and videos of Palestinians and not even care (while feeling bad for Israelis that have full make-up on or making fun of Palestinians), then that shows just how evil you are. Especially if you've heard Israeli leaders call for murdering innocent people.

 

[hblock]

It wasn't an independent state though. It was part of the ottoman empire, which fell, and then become mandatory palestine which was placed under british control by the league of nations. It was very explicitly not an independent palestinian state at that point in time.

Which confirms western hypocrisy even further.
As a genocidal occupation, britain has no right over palestinian land which was a vastly arab/muslim majority population back then.
Israel doesn't have the right to exist to begin with, let alone the right to defend itself.

 

[kkck]

Which confirms western hypocrisy even further.
As a genocidal occupation, britain has no right over palestinian land which was a vastly arab/muslim majority population back then.
Israel doesn't have the right to exist to begin with, let alone the right to defend itself.

All I did was point out that you straight up made up a country. I am not sure of how you get from that to this respose. I don't know what this is. At the time the ottoman empire fell the allies pretty much broke the ottoman empire into numerous nations over a period of time. Palestine as a former piece of the ottoman empire which didn't have a government following its fall was placed under british control until it formed a government of its own like other former ottoman empire territories. As far as I can tell what those bits evidence is that by any reasonable metric at the start palestine was the opposite of an independent state.

 

[hblock]

All I did was point out that you straight up made up a country. I am not sure of how you get from that to this respose. I don't know what this is. At the time the ottoman empire fell the allies pretty much broke the ottoman empire into numerous nations over a period of time. Palestine as a former piece of the ottoman empire which didn't have a government following its fall was placed under british control until it formed a government of its own like other former ottoman empire territories. As far as I can tell what those bits evidence is that by any reasonable metric at the start palestine was the opposite of an independent state.

A land populated with a vast majority of arab/muslim population for centuries can't be anything than an arab or muslim state. Any other mental gymnastic with genocidal tendencies doesn't hold the candle, no matter how hard you attempt to distord it.

 

[kkck]

A land populated with a vast majority of arab/muslim population for centuries can't be anything than an arab or muslim state. Any other mental gymnastic with genocidal tendencies doesn't hold the candle, no matter how hard you attempt to distord it.

That's fine and all but it doesn't make an "independent palestinian state" more or less made up at that point in time.

 

[ninjabot]

Which again, if you claim to care about Americans and whatnot, then you should care given the fact that we need the money. Prices have gone up for almost everything while people are getting laid off, and despite promising to cancel student loans Biden refuses to do that. Yet no issue giving billions of dollars to other countries to let them murder innocent people.

Nah, the economy is doing so well that Trump is trying to take credit for it, and Fox News pundits are fighting with each other about giving Biden the credit for it.

That's the only thing Israel has, "OctObeR 7th!!" while Israeli hostages have blamed IOF for doing the most damage.

That's not all they have, it's just the only one you can't just dismiss as staged. You will still try to downplay it though.

So basically, you're okay with Israel lying about Hamas and Palestine to justify raping and killing innocent men, women, and children, and that they're starving and sniping kids. Crazy how we see videos of hostages released by Hamas, and they all seem to be doing okay, but when Israel releases hostages, these hostages have been tortured horribly. People bring up genocide because killing people, especially groups of people, is bad. There's no justification for using phosphorus bombs, sniping kids, or raping kids and women, whether or not Hamas is hiding behind citizens. Again, that's an excuse they make, and it's working for brainwashed people.

I'm indifferent to it (though they aren't lying). I have no stake in this conflict. I'm neither Palestinian nor Israeli, so this has no effect on me outside of me wishing the conflict was over for the sake of both sides, but knowing it won't ever be until one side is completely obliterated. I don't care about the tit-for-tat "This many Palestenians were killed at this point, but this many Israelis were killed here, so the correct response is this many Palestenians killed" types of arguments because it's just moralizing. It's not solving anything because Israel is never gonna give a shit about how many Palestinians they have to kill to get what they want, and neither are Palestinians when it comes to Israelis so changing peoples' minds has to come from a practical political standpoint. Not an emotional appeal. It's worthless.

As for what I do care about, I care that the response of the online Left is making me ashamed of the Left and potentially affecting the election. Because it helps no one, and hurts everyone. Palestinians included.

This unwillingness to condemn Hamas and virtue signaling to Palestinians about a ceasefire that won't happen... these acts are helping indoctrinate these kids into thinking there's a chance at Palestine owning Gaza "from the river to the sea" as long as they fire a few more thousand rockets. As long as they kill a few more Israelis. As long as they suicide bomb a few more times. As long as a few more of their civilians are bombed as they hide amongst them.

They're going to die. All of them. And you're cheering them on to the firing squad because you don't actually fucking care about these people. You care about how good it makes you look to say so online. I'll be as cold and blunt and dismissive as I have to to show you that you can't moralize about this to solve the problem because both sides believe they have the moral high ground.

 

[kkck]

USA will never be at that point, and it will remain divided thanks to brainwashed republican voters who have been indoctrinated into defending the wealthy and hating on liberals and the left.

You don't have a democratic solution out of this BUT you also aren't at a point where your monarchs/dictators warrant a beheading. Democratic limbo?

 

[M3J]

You don't have a democratic solution out of this BUT you also aren't at a point where your monarchs/dictators warrant a beheading. Democratic limbo?

No need for a beheading, we live in the 21st century! We can just hit them where it hurts and hack into their accounts, take all their resources, and use it to help people. They get paid by companies to do what companies want, so if we take that away...