Final August vs Irene

Who wins the Tournament?

  • August

    Votes: 52 57.8%
  • Irene Belserion

    Votes: 38 42.2%

  • Total voters
    90
  • Poll closed .
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BluePegasus

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Isn't August casting a spell as well?:oh. I don't think MP affects stuff unless it's cast as a spell. Even Acnologia's MP didn't really trigger anything.
No, that was absolutely not a spell. MP has shown to affect nature multiple times, take Alegria Mirajane for example.
 

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No, that was absolutely not a spell. MP has shown to affect nature multiple times, take Alegria Mirajane for example.
Fair enough, but Irene probably didn't want to show off her strength. August is making a conscious effort to exert his MP. Irene just didn't want to, or never needed to do it. Acno has never done such a thing before, so it doesn't really show a mage's power.

Also, Non DS magic does affect dragons but they are much less effective. This is the case with all types of slayer magic. Gray was able to beat mard geer when DF Natsu was unable to do so even though DF Natsu is technically stronger. An attack that would usually freeze a person would make a Dragon feel slightly cold, an attack that could incinerate a normal person would make a Dragon feel slightly hot. DS magic enables a person to do actual damage to a dragon.

Where was it mentioned that August could copy all types of caster magic?
 

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I just noticed something rather intriguing. Although August has the primary epithet of king of magic and is revered by some of his colleagues, notably Jacob and Brandish, they don't mention explicitly if August has copied all their powers. Instead, the rumors of him being able to wield all sorts of magic are articulated by elderly Ishgar mages, namely Makarov and Warrod. It's as if all we get are implied hints here and there, plus some rumors to give August a mysterious vibe, as if he's some legend from a distant past... the irony that he turns out to be even younger than Makarov

I really get this sense that August was initially being built up in a subtle, low-key manner, but this gimmick hardly works out in a series that's more about spectacle and friendship powers and fan service than the nuances of magical theories. And then he had to be ruined because Hiro rushed things, while his supposed counterpart Irene had way more panel time and involvement and postmortem acknowledgment. I can understand that Fairy Tail as a series is lighthearted, but while the 'comedy' in the downfall of the other spriggans is more easily appreciated, all I can see in his quiet demise is a bleak, absurd sense of dark humor...
 

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I understand what you're saying, but since like you said they know themselves better than anyone, how would you explain their meeting? Irene didn't exactly fall in line, and August went as far as to finish the job for her since she stated plainly that she wasn't moving until it was done. Then she said she would only go to "let him save face". As arrogant as you say she is she's never shown to be careless with her words. She wouldn't say something like that unless she could back it up.
You seems to have missed the point though. The Irene we knew has clearly lost her sanity and is emotionally unstable.

She was determined to enchant herself into Erza's body shortly after she was born, but failed because such a feat is impossible. Or apparently so. It turns out Irene was not actually incapable of doing so, but rather she could not bear to go through with it.

She then chose to leave Erza with an orphanage at Rosemary Village for fear of continue being a direct threat to her child due to her own madness. The torture she suffered at the hands of her own people, did not only robbed Irene of her compassion and empathy, but also her sanity.

Irene has a tendency of taking things personally. She turned Hisui into a mouse, and sadistically urged her father to say he loved her despite her transmutation. She was confident he could not bring himself to do so, because her own husband did not maintain much love for her when she started transforming. But was forced to eat humble pie.


Irene was uninformed and did not show any understanding dragonification can be halted. After witnessing Wendy possessing the capability and talent to nullify Irene's high level enchantment with her own, Irene still chose to go ahead and took over Wendy's body, which not only diminishes her magic power, but allows Wendy to enter her original body and used Irene's far superior magic power against her.









Foresighted detected: None.

Irene has a tendency to let her emotions get the better of her, and cloud her judgement. Her decision-making is erroneous, and more often than not make the wrong calls. All these lead to her claims hardly being substantial.

On the contrary, August is calm and collected. His awareness and foresight is noteworthy. He knew FT will identify the Spriggans' location with magic radar, and hid both Jacob's and his positions from it.



August told Brandish sympathisizing with FT would be a mistake. And seconds later, Mest proves him right. He correctly assessed Brandish attacking him was not voluntary, and consequently putting her to sleep rather than hurting her with the rest in return.

August also rightfully deduced the one magic as love, and that could transcend the concept of good and evil, life and death.




He predicted both his, and his parents' fate.

Perhaps, best example to compare August and Irene's mentality was the time they engaged each other in the consequence of casting Universe One. August questioned the effect of the action point, while Irene rebutted it as bringing Alvarez closer to their goals. We all know how it turned out as the spell actually changed the tide of the battle in Ishgar and FT's favour.

And on the topic of their interaction, despite insisting on torturing Mira to her death, August still got dibs on her prey, which clearly surprised and irritated Irene, she changed her tune and acquiesced to August's will . .




Anyone with any fundamental awareness on social dynamics should know who came out of the exchange looking more dominant and of higher status.

August beat Cobra with his precognition ability. He beat Racer by outspeeding and assaulting him. He reflected Midnight's Spiral Pain to defeat Cobra, Racer and Midnight himself.




Though we did not see any panels of Jellal attacking August since he was constantly on the defensive, we do not know how he went down. But according to Jellal's thoughts, he exhausted all options and there was nothing left he could employ from his arsenal. We know of Mashima's soft spot for Jellal, and probably preferred not to humiliate the guy in front of the readers further. It is not unfair to surmise August handled everything we know Jellal has to offer.

He did used Meteor later, so we at least know August is faster than Jellal with Meteor. So August dealt with the continuous assault from Jellal, Midnight, Cobra and Racer, then beat them all at their own game with zero blemishes on him.

As if the defeat was not enough, he left them all alive just because he know none of them can pose a threat or muster a challenge against his side. The next time Jellal showed up, was only after Zeref's defeat when he saved Erza from Acnologia. Let that sink in for a moment. That is how scarily accurate August is.

The one who lived up to his hype. The one who has a - I don't like to use word perfect, but damn son - flawless record against all caster magic. Despite his outrageous strength, August is a combat pragmatist first and foremost.

Usually in storytelling, most authors will choose to give power in compatibility to character flaws. So they could have an achilles heel the protagonists could possibly capitalize on. When the most broken superpower is wielded by the wisest, most competent and sensible character, it becomes terrifying.

Both August and Irene engineered their own death. But Irene's threshold of durability can at least, be quantifiable. She was killed by a sword, enchanted with Wendy's dragon slayer magic, Irene's weakness. The effective quotient is therefore, Erza's sword + Wendy's damage multiplier supercedes Irene's mortality.

Unlike dragon slayer magic on dragons, August is not particularly weak to holder type magic. He can be hurt by it, but the point was rammed home when at the end of their battle, Gildarts' most offensively powerful move move till date allowed him to bypass August's nigh invincibility over caster magic, and land a clean hit. This barely even wounded August.

August was killed because the condition of Ars Magia required him to sacrifice his body as a medium. And we cannot even quantify this property. Mashima did not let August display a move on the same offensive scale as Ars Magia - only without the sacrificial condition - which is what is frustrating.

Otherwise, we all know this discussion would already have been done and dusted with. Defensively, August record remains untouchable. More so than Irene's offence. And most success stories are built on great defence. :cheez

When it comes down to it, aside from Acnologia, this level of proficiency has never been seen before or after. No hyperbole, that is what separates August from the rest of these wannabes.

Like you mention there are a lot of assumptions in this tournament and that really doesn't interest me. It's fun to counter assumptions with even bigger assumptions but in the end I've never seen August use DS Magic so I'm not going to assume some vague lines about God Serena being "with him" is proof that he has his abilities now. Just like I'm not going to assume that Irene can use anything stronger than Deus Sema because she's a master enchanter. I go by what I see. Does August defeat Irene in her human form? Of course. Does he defeat her as a dragon? Not in my opinion.
It's such a shame despite the vast repertoire of spells in her arsenal, the chief argument for Irene over August has revolved solely around and heavily banked on her dragon form. Because in her human form, Irene's performance greatly pales in comparison to August. But seeing the stance adopted by Irene's supporters is to relegate her potential to being a flat track bully, let's address this issue.

The conventional belief held by some is that dragons being a higher plane of existence in the magic world, cannot be hurt by regular mage with regular magic. Irene's true form has always been the dragon she has already transformed into. Her human appearance, is, but a facade. Internally, the properties of her core being has never changed.


Irene always had the power of dragon within her. She did not, and could not, utilize it because she was in her human form. Nonetheless, she was bleeding from wounds she sustained. Wounds which were not just superficial, but bleeding from the internal.

Remember it was stated during the elipse gate arc how dragon slayer magic is supposed to harm them? In theory, it should have damaged them. But in practice, unless it is wielded by someone who is powerful enough, it is as useless any other kind of magic. This should also mean power level is related in accordance to damage.

A heavily wounded Erza, aided by an equally wounded Wendy, critically wounded Irene. At the point of exchange, fully transformed Dragon Irene could not resist the damage output from the attack.

When a magic is unbelievably powerful, it can affect dragons too. So much so that, it can be used to make up for the gap in power. When Ultear casted Last Aegis in the eclipse gate arc, it turned back time and reversed everything that took place, dragons included. Future Rogue created dragon supermacy magic and dragons were forced into doing his bidding.

But here comes the interesting part. Not all dragons were affected. Atlas Flame was able to break away from Future Rogue. And in his fight with Motherglare, the latter dragon says his adamantine armour is impervious to even the attacks from other dragons. All this points to conventional power level applying to dragons too.

And talking about Atlas Flame. His flame and spirit was frozen by Silver after he was dead, which naturally means he was at a state weaker than he was before he passed on. So Silver with his magical ability and power enabled him to make up for the difference and effectiveness over a dragon, despite him having no dragon slayer magic.

Which leads us to why August can hurt and harm Irene, regardless whether she is in her dragon form or not. I averted to bring this up, as it is one of the biggest asspulls in the series. But since most of Irene's supporters are unabashed on selling August short, and I only wish to bring up on panel feats, it seems like we don't really have a choice here.

Deus sema casted by dragon Irene was successfully destroyed by Erza. With a single, solitary arm. Now let's sit back and digest this nauseating feat. And it's over. Then we go back to August. The extraordinary being who wields an otherworldly ability with phenomenal consistency. We all know how this would end up.

 

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Let me just say, when I see vigorous defenses of Irene and even Zeref and Acnologia, they feel like hype fests. But when I see statements on behalf of August, even my own, I get this mindset that I'm witnessing a eulogy or an elegy.

I guess that's how affected I am of the way he was cast aside in the end. Reminds me of Madara's downfall, only worse, and amplified by that very reminder
 

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Yeah, universe one only affected a single continent. Nothing big.....
Country, not continent ;)
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
The way I interpret the mechanisms of Ars Magia is, it involves the irrevocable sacrifice of the caster, and that it takes time for the spell to cover the intended scope unless the spell is abruptly withdrawn. What we don't know is how much minimum magic power is required to even activate the spell... on that note, it's rather fascinating how he was even able to learn that spell. Could Zeref have taught it to him, but then since Zeref is immortal how can he sacrifice himself? In any case it's rather disappointing that he resorted to that move at the end, when he could have just ignored Gildarts and Cana, or use some random spell just to take them down without necessarily taking them out permanently.

The other consequence of that suicide spell is that we'll never get to know how much physical and magical damage August can take before he can be taken down. Irene at least has dragon slayer magic as a natural weakness, but in August's case we can only either downplay the guy by appealing to his human physical constitution, or optimize him by appealing to how much of an anomaly he is. Our only indirect indicator is his fearful expression when Acnologia killed God Serena...

Oh, and I should point out in addition that two of August's 'spectacular' spells, Ars Magia and the generic 'melt' heat spell, were horribly interrupted before they can achieve their full effect
Also I want to know if it affects everyone, or is a selective spell (works on enemy only). If it's the latter, August could have stopped casting the spell on Mavis, Zeref, S12 etc. Way to ruin August, Mashima-sensei :fail
 

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Fair enough, but Irene probably didn't want to show off her strength. August is making a conscious effort to exert his MP. Irene just didn't want to, or never needed to do it. Acno has never done such a thing before, so it doesn't really show a mage's power.
Uhm, I don't think that's how magic power works. You can't just stop it from being witnessed by others/affecting nature. It's not something that can be randomly activated by yourself.

Also, Non DS magic does affect dragons but they are much less effective. This is the case with all types of slayer magic. Gray was able to beat mard geer when DF Natsu was unable to do so even though DF Natsu is technically stronger. An attack that would usually freeze a person would make a Dragon feel slightly cold, an attack that could incinerate a normal person would make a Dragon feel slightly hot. DS magic enables a person to do actual damage to a dragon.
Yes, I know. You're just pointing out something in my favor. August indeed doesn't need Dragon Slayer Magic, even though he can control it, to defeat Irene.

Where was it mentioned that August could copy all types of caster magic?

Obviously a reference to the fact that he can copy every single magic, except the Holder-type. But that's old news.
 

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Country, not continent ;)
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Also I want to know if it affects everyone, or is a selective spell (works on enemy only). If it's the latter, August could have stopped casting the spell on Mavis, Zeref, S12 etc. Way to ruin August, Mashima-sensei :fail
I'm inclined to think that the spell is indiscriminate unlike Law and is thus a long-forgotten one, and what bothers me is why he had to resort to that when he's supposed to have a whole bunch of other spells... or he could have tried to contact Zeref telepathically, assuming he's the mastermind who gathered the remnants of the 12 together in the aftermath of Universe One

It seems there really is no justice for the king of magic as far as Hiro's treatment of him is concerned

ADDENDUM: HE WITNESSED FAIRY LAW, why didn't he try to come up with his own variation? Sure his life force would still be expended, but at least that's a better option, and besides he knows Mavis is his mother, so she'll be safe

I weep and rage when I remember that it wasn't friendship power boosts or special weaknesses that brought him down, it was the conspiracy between the author and the story
 
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What's wrong with speculating on someone's magic? It's been done before so I don't see why it's a problem now. We've seen Wendy and Irene counter each other with same enchantments so it's very likely she can use those lower class enchantments Wendy uses like the speed, defense and attack enchantments to a much higher level. Again, it's not a human form, just an appearance. She still has the scales and durability of a dragon hence why Erza's sword didn't go straight through her head in the fight. She mightn't be immune to magic but she should still resist it decently well thanks to being a dragon.
i dont have a problem with it. its ur supporter that are we are going by only feats only in the manga i just going by what they are bringing up but there is alot of filp flopping in debate which personally i dont like. so we are alot to speculate then that fine but when us august supporter are specuating that august has DS magic because he fought a ds slayer (cobra) then its a problem. again he was damageable even her fodder husband was able to damage her so by logic august can easily destroy her in her human form.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Where did you get that?

She imbued a country the size of continent with her magic that means she could've just blown up the Ishgar rather than compress it and distort reality. So again it's not just applicable as she can just change the property to DC. Her magic is imbueing anything in the world and changing its property to whatever she wants.

Yet Dragons were swiping humans left and right and didn't break anyone's bones. Natsu even got rammed by AF through multiple building and came put fine.

Erza busted an attack that doesn't mean she can go through Dragon Scales. Overpowering a Dragon attack is different from overpowering Dragon Scales. Irene couldn't Dragon Scales wouldn't even been scratched by Erza if Wendy didn't infuse it with DS magic. Erza with a DS sword however would've curbed those seven Dragon.
back in business :cheez what im saying that do u think that a non DS like august cant beat GMG dragons because he doesnt have DS magic?? so wendy>gildartz?

no like u said we going by feats only she didnt bust or destroy a country she just filp it. so she doesnt have country level feats if she did she would have done it. plus august can copy her magic power too.

show me a panel when gmg dragons were trying to pull a feat that irene was trying to do by swping a single human. cuz ur logic is saying fodders durablity>erza durability as this point.

fair enough ur right but that still comes to point that erza busted her strongest spell. august can easily bust it and also it took wendy a sprinkle of ds magic took heavy damage her back to her human form. now u can say he doesnt have DS magic that fine by me but she would get the chance to get there when august can blitzes her and cube her in her human form.
 

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Country, not continent ;)
Fiore is the size of a continent despite it being a country. It's like Russia or the U.S.A.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
i dont have a problem with it. its ur supporter that are we are going by only feats only in the manga i just going by what they are bringing up but there is alot of filp flopping in debate which personally i dont like. so we are alot to speculate then that fine but when us august supporter are specuating that august has DS magic because he fought a ds slayer (cobra) then its a problem. again he was damageable even her fodder husband was able to damage her so by logic august can easily destroy her in her human form.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

back in business :cheez what im saying that do u think that a non DS like august cant beat GMG dragons because he doesnt have DS magic?? so wendy>gildartz?

no like u said we going by feats only she didnt bust or destroy a country she just filp it. so she doesnt have country level feats if she did she would have done it. plus august can copy her magic power too.

show me a panel when gmg dragons were trying to pull a feat that irene was trying to do by swping a single human. cuz ur logic is saying fodders durablity>erza durability as this point.

fair enough ur right but that still comes to point that erza busted her strongest spell. august can easily bust it and also it took wendy a sprinkle of ds magic took heavy damage her back to her human form. now u can say he doesnt have DS magic that fine by me but she would get the chance to get there when august can blitzes her and cube her in her human form.
Yes. Wendy is stronger than Gild when it comes to Dragons. Non DS mages can't beat Dragons without DS. It's the reason the magic was made.

But we can go by the canon definition of her powers which is to imbue her magic into anything and change it to her whim.
If she can imbue her magic into a country that means she can change the properties of the country to whatever she wants. Instead of compressing the land she could've easily made it into a bomb.

August can't copy magical power lol. And she can easily just channel her powers into her staff or the earth and make it a holder class so he won't be able to copy her magic.

August ain't blitzing Irene, and Crash won't work as human form is just a skin. She is still a Dragon underneath.

Sprinkle of DS magic? She imbued an entire sword with her DS magic and made that sword an actual DS sword. So no it wasn't just a sprinkle. And again her Dragon Form is her true state of being. There's no such thing as hitting her out of her real body. She reverted back bcs she wanted too not bcs Erza damaged her.

Deus Sema wasn't her strongest spell. Nowhere was it stated to be her strongest attack lol. That was Irene's casual attack in Dragon form. She could spam if she wanted. She only used on Master Enchant spell and you really thought it was her best? She already told Erza that she has a long way to go to beat her, which implied she was holding back the entire fight.
 
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So the suicide squad, i mean suicide duo, is in the finals. Cool or should i say as expected. At least I'm glad there are no pof characters in the finals ... cough ... Natsu ... cough cough.
Very tricky battle. I'm still not sure who would win. I like both August and Irene, maybe Irene a bit more, but I'm leaning towards August as the victor.
August is defeneatly stronger than Irene in human form, but with dragon form it gets a bit tricky. Its not that in dragon form Irene is stronger than August, the problem is the fact that her dragon skin is imune to magic other than DS magic (i thnk August can copy DS magic, but that's just me and its still very debetable if he could). Also, the same goes for August too, he is basically imune to caster type magic due to his hax. So basically both are imune to magic, August with his hax, and Irene in dragon form.

I'm looking at it like this. August could go Melt the moment the fight starts and nuke Irene before she even transforms into a dragon. So the question is, would Irene be able to survive August's heat pillar. And also, August's Melt is surprisingly very fast, he nuked Natsu and co in an instant (his transformation is also much more faster than Irene's) so he could most defeneatly nuke Irene before she transforms.

If irene manages to transform, her Deus Sema would not be a problem for August because he would melt that shit in an instant. And the same goes for her dragon swipes. He would be capable of dodging something like that.

So in the end im still nowhere with this haha, i didn't give one solid argument who would win, trully a CLASH OF TITANS, but for now im leaning towards August.
 

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In atmosphere Deus Sema is just as fast as out atmosphere Deus Sema. There was no slow down in re-entry. Her magic would've still kept applying the pressure as she needed to pin point the exact location to drop the Meteor. It makes no sense to let go of a spell and let it come down by itself. The spell is an enhanced meteor and meteors get their power from the velocity it's going at. She had no reason to let gravity hinder the velocity of that attack and we see the attack is moving the same speed. Meteors do not even reach the melting point of rock upon reentry yet Irene's meteor was vaporizing the entire time (even upon reentry). The Earth's atmosphere wouldn't impact the velocity that meteor was hurled at in the first place. There would be huge sonic booms if the Meteor slow down that suddenly.
Gravity is not what makes an object slow down as it enters the atmosphere. Objects moving through the atmosphere creates friction and opposing pressure. this air resistance is what slows the object down. Even if Irene was applying a constant pressure, air resistance acts as an decelerating force. An object in a vacuum is always going to be travelling faster than an object through matter, provided the same amount of force is acting on them. In order to keep the meteor at the same speed upon entry with the atmosphere, Irene would have to add an accelerating force. This is assuming Irene's magic isn't just "create a meteor, and let it act like a meteor". As far as the speed of Deus Sema is concerned, I would just take the anime's portrayal of it for time. But seeing as this won't be relevant in this match, I would just take an estimate by saying the lines Erza and Irene said out loud.
Deus Sema wasn't her strongest spell. Nowhere was it stayed to be her strongest attack lol. That was Irene's casual attack in Dragon form. She could spam if she wanted. She only used on Master Enchant spell and you really thought it was her best? She already told Erza that she has a long way to go to beat her, which implied she was holding back the entire fight.
This I agree with. Irene herself considered her dragon scales to be a tougher substance than the meteor. It may not have blown up the entire battlefield, but against a single opponent it was more lethal.
 

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Can somebody explain to me why Deus Sema's speed is important to determine?
I don't doubt this is fast, as it travelled a huge distance in a matter of seconds, but at the end of the day, people were able to react to it, talk a little, Erza gave her PoF speech, and intercepted it and destroyed it. Why is everyone thinking as if Deus Sema is a big deal
 

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Those who think August can even scratch Irene is in for a rude awakening.On top of being already highly magic resistance thanks to her dragon scale, she can just use Deus Corona to enchant her defense furthermore.
Well I know it's Wendy who cast it but she was in Irene body when she use that spell, so why not Irene can't use it?
And I think she can extract August's copied magic too using Deus Zero thus dispeling it, extracting unlimited magic is not a big deal for her so why not extracting copied magic from just a 'mere' August? Basically Enchantment is the most versatile magic in FT, mastering it basically like mastering all magic together, you got nuke of all elemental, you got hax like transforming your opponent to animal, you can create slave to do your bidding, you got pretty powerful buff magic, you can switch body with another people, etc. Well anyway they both are stupidly powerful, too bad they decided to go all emo and you know it :gwah , but I'll still chose Irene my Queen all the way :derp
Oh and also : Irene's Staff >>>>>> August's Staff :cheez
 
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Gravity is not what makes an object slow down as it enters the atmosphere. Objects moving through the atmosphere creates friction and opposing pressure. this air resistance is what slows the object down. Even if Irene was applying a constant pressure, air resistance acts as an decelerating force. An object in a vacuum is always going to be travelling faster than an object through matter, provided the same amount of force is acting on them. In order to keep the meteor at the same speed upon entry with the atmosphere, Irene would have to add an accelerating force. This is assuming Irene's magic isn't just "create a meteor, and let it act like a meteor". As far as the speed of Deus Sema is concerned, I would just take the anime's portrayal of it for time. But seeing as this won't be relevant in this match, I would just take an estimate by saying the lines Erza and Irene said out loud.


This I agree with. Irene herself considered her dragon scales to be a tougher substance than the meteor. It may not have blown up the entire battlefield, but against a single opponent it was more lethal.
Yes but if the speed of a meteor dropped significantly sonic booms or shockwaves would appear due to sudden slow down. The meteor goes from high sub relativistic to mhs speeds of a regular meteor is too big of a gap in speed for me to believe. Especially if the meteorite was 1000+ tons then the Meteor wouldn't drag in the atmosphere at all. Regular meteors upon reentry don't vaporize off like Irene's meteor either. The velocity of a regular meteor doesn't have enough force to cause a meteor to go past its melting point. So even if there was drag it wouldn't be that significant.

Agreed on the other topic.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Can somebody explain to me why Deus Sema's speed is important to determine?
I don't doubt this is fast, as it travelled a huge distance in a matter of seconds, but at the end of the day, people were able to react to it, talk a little, Erza gave her PoF speech, and intercepted it and destroyed it. Why is everyone thinking as if Deus Sema is a big deal
Bcs people like to downplay Irene's speed and say she is going to be blitzed by August....
 
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Takuan

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Bcs people like to downplay Irene's speed and say she is going to be blitzed by August....
Well, she hasn't shown to be able to react to August's meteor. The only moment she actually outsped Erza was right after transforming into a dragon, and even here, Erza tried to block the claw swip so it wasn't top speed.

But that's just another subject. I don't see how Deus Sema's speed while falling down has to do with Irene's speed or reaction speed. And again, Erza had plenty of time to PoF speech and destroy Deus Sema so ...

I don't see how this is downplaying Irene. SHe has shown to be Erza tier in terms of speed, nothing more, and that's getting blitzed by August.
 

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Well, she hasn't shown to be able to react to August's meteor. The only moment she actually outsped Erza was right after transforming into a dragon, and even here, Erza tried to block the claw swip so it wasn't top speed.

But that's just another subject. I don't see how Deus Sema's speed while falling down has to do with Irene's speed or reaction speed. And again, Erza had plenty of time to PoF speech and destroy Deus Sema so ...

I don't see how this is downplaying Irene. SHe has shown to be Erza tier in terms of speed, nothing more, and that's getting blitzed by August.
She blitzed Erza before Dragon form. She also reacted Acnologia's attack. August has been shown to be in the same tier of speed as Gild. Nothing is suggesting a blitz from August. Dragons are also the fast creatures in the verse and Irene has teleportation.
 

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One thing that may be explored is if Irene can use her enchantments to tamper with August's magic. If August has already copied enchantment before, then that's not happening even if Irene were to channel her enchantment via her staff, since he would just counter with an appropriate enchantment. At any rate I think that August already has enough magical defense to deal with attempts to tamper with his magic

I have pointed this out before, but let me say it again. People would find it easier to extend what else Irene can do with enchantment, mainly because she got more panel time to show off, and because enchantment as an ability works as a sort of continuum across a range of parameters. On the other hand, even assuming that August can copy all sorts of caster magic without restrictions other than the channeling loophole, there is more room for hesitation on the question if he has copied all that can be copied, given that the copying ability seems to work on a spell by spell or a category by category basis.

This is a crucial matter since in order to match or surpass the versatility of enchantment an assumption is required, namely that August already has a corresponding similar or counter spell in his arsenal, not yet counting the possibility of copying enchantment, for every possible enchantment move. My contention is that August's copying ability, if interpreted optimally, is perhaps one of the most broken abilities that can encompass even enchantment and slayer magics, and so the downplaying would usually involve the assertion of additional constraints to what may be copied, or a claim that August has yet to copy some particular spell that would have been useful in dealing with enchantment and/or dragons.
 

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Country, not continent ;)
My bad:verily. It was a huge area though...

Uhm, I don't think that's how magic power works. You can't just stop it from being witnessed by others/affecting nature. It's not something that can be randomly activated by yourself.
Gildarts did it against Natsu to intimidate him. Acno has never done it despite having a huge amount of MP.

Yes, I know. You're just pointing out something in my favor. August indeed doesn't need Dragon Slayer Magic, even though he can control it, to defeat Irene.
I don't think you understood my post. I was saying that even a powerful mage cannot beat a dragon without slayer advantage

Obviously a reference to the fact that he can copy every single magic, except the Holder-type. But that's old news.
It was an assumption made by Gildarts. August wasn't able to copy crash when it was channeled through Gildarts' prosthetic arm even though Crash is a caster type magic. August cannot copy any magic that involves a material.

I'm looking at it like this. August could go Melt the moment the fight starts and nuke Irene before she even transforms into a dragon. So the question is, would Irene be able to survive August's heat pillar. And also, August's Melt is surprisingly very fast, he nuked Natsu and co in an instant (his transformation is also much more faster than Irene's) so he could most defeneatly nuke Irene before she transforms.
Uh... Am I the only one who noticed that Melt didn't even damage Happy:oh
 

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Tbt I am disappointed why August ran out of MP for no apparent reason when casting Ars Magia. I mean, it was already some days after he (along with Serena and Jacob) conquered Bosco. Jacob was headed to Magnolia alone, while August was doing nothing somewhere. After Universe One was cast, he was engaged in two fights: vs CS and vs Gildarts and Cana. Was fighting them that exhausting?

Meanwhile, it turned out that Universe One was being maintained by Irene, and while she's doing that, she extracted Fairy Heart, enchanted one million army, enchanted Neinhart, and fighting Erza&Wendy.

cmiiw
LOL you are right!!! i never thought it before!
Why August decided to use suicidal spell?? Did he really out of option?? if August really out of MP for only 2 fights, can i assume Irene has more MP than August.... because she was using multiple S Class magics and she's still fine.

But if August wasn't out of MP, so my reason why he decided to use Ars Magia is because he think he can't win.
Yes, August has immense magic power, but he is <100 years old human, maybe because he is too old he become weaker in mele combat...so when Gildarts try to fight him with mele combat, August give up and decided to use suicidal spell because he think he can't win. That's why in the manga it never showed he resist mele attacks, he only resisted magical attacks....

This way dragon Irene has a big chance of winning, because her most powerfull attack is her hand stomp and hand swing....
 
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