Characters and abilities with unknown Nen categories

[Demonspeed]

Morel is definitely either manipulation or Emission- he is confirmed as using both extensively.



As for Netero, his statue is definitely materialized. I think most of you are simply forgetting that a materialized object is an object- and as such, Netero can use reinforcement on it to make it stronger.

He basically use a Reinforcement/Manipulation/Emission/Materialization combo. The only style i haven't seen him use is Transformation.

I don't think Netero uses Materialization, is it even sure that he is an enhancer? I always thought he was emitter. Emission is near manipulation and enhancement so it would explain all his abilities.I really can't imagine Netero use so many nen types which are not suited to him.

For me his hatsu is similar to Gon:

Jajanken=enhancement 100%, transmutation 80%,emission 80%.

Hyakushiki Kannon=emission 100%,enhancement 80%, manipulation 80%.

 

[Uriel]

Netero is officially Enhancement. In all books, data, etc.
And it's more convenient for his type to enhance the statue that He materialize since He can't enhance the physical damage of an object emitted.

Being one Hatsu doesn't mean "You will use the other wrong" or "You can't do that". It means some things will cost you more. In the case of Netero, He spent 50 years throwing a fist to understand what it means to pray. Enough cost to make his beastly technique.

Techniques doesn't have percentage as well...They use everything they have. What is more important in case of Netero? The statue itself, controlling the 1000 arms it has or deal enough damage to be something to consider?
The Kannon is anyway a special technique since it's "all the life force" in a blast that it's either trow or connected. It's purely Enhancement and Emission.

 

[Demonspeed]

I used the nen diagram to show affinities according to the nen type.OK, Netero is an enhancer but i don't see why it would be impossible for him to enhance physical damages of Kannon(it's even easier with this type according to the diagram),i don't say that it couldn't be materialized but according to his type it's almost sure that Kannon is emitted .The difference between emission and materialization is only that emission is invisible to those who don't use nen.To control Kannon Netero should use manipulation skills too.

Here is my explanation of Hyakushiki Kannon: Netero emits the statue,he can use his enhancement skills to enhance power of the object emitted and finally he uses manipulation skills to control members(like Shoot). The combo enhancement/emission/manipulation is easier for him and more efficient than enhancement/materialization/manipulation(this is the same combo that Kastro used).

 

[Uriel]

Different from Kastro, Netero has sufficient Space Memory :P
And both are plausible, actually. But why Netero would use Emission primary when the object is always near him? Isn't Emission the ability to produce large amount of Aura that are FAR from the user? Aren't Materialization objects always near from the user?

 

[Demonspeed]

Different from Kastro, Netero has sufficient Space Memory :P
And both are plausible, actually. But why Netero would use Emission primary when the object is always near him? Isn't Emission the ability to produce large amount of Aura that are FAR from the user? Aren't Materialization objects always near from the user?

Emitted aura is not necessarily far from the user, it can be near but there is no physical contact. It's why it's often combined with manipulation. All materialized objects that we have seen are on contact with the user's body.

 

[kkck]

I maintain that you can't use nen to enhance emitted stuff. Emitted stuff is at large made out of pure nen. Enhancement works by adding and concentrating nen into stuff to make it stronger. If the statue is emitted then it would be made out of 100% nen. Adding nen to it would make it stronger or bigger or whatever but it would not quite be enhancement, it would just be more emission. You could however use enhancement on a conjured thing since it is a real object though. Still, would this make sense? Conjured things cannot go beyond certain limits. In this regard we have the scenario that netero being an enhancer is conjuring a complex object of a rather huge size which moves just at about his speed and enhances it. Wouldn't this imply an inherent huge waste?

Emission is used to keep aura separated from the user. Even if it is a small distance emission would still be required. A larger distance makes things harder though. With conjured objects distance or even contact is not an issue. As they are actual objects they do not require any actual emission skills.

 

[Demonspeed]

. If the statue is emitted then it would be made out of 100% nen. Adding nen to it would make it stronger or bigger or whatever but it would not quite be enhancement, it would just be more emission.

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This is exactly the fact to make it stronger which is enhancement.This is the PURE definition of enhancement type:to increase the power of something or an object.

You could however use enhancement on a conjured thing since it is a real object though

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Emitted aura is real too, it's just invisible for normal men.

Emission is used to keep aura separated from the user. Even if it is a small distance emission would still be required. A larger distance makes things harder though

This is not a problem for emitters and it's easier for enhancers than to materialize something because emission is near of their category.

 

[Uriel]

It's easier, but it doesn't mean that Enhancers are unable to materialize something.
Take Kurapika Chains, for example. They need to be enhanced to resist the strength of Uvogin. One could say that you could make that as the special property, but this is difficult without Enhancement.

Forget two seconds about what is near and what's not...When an user has enough experience, every Hatsu is used at some point for a particular purpose inside a well-made and complete technique.

 

[kkck]

This is exactly the fact to make it stronger which is enhancement.This is the PURE definition of enhancement type:to increase the power of something or an object.

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Emitted aura is real too, it's just invisible for normal men.



This is not a problem for emitters and it's easier for enhancers than to materialize something because emission is near of their category.

Well, under that logic any form of emission would already be enhancement. It plainly does not make sense that merely putting power into an emitted attack is enhancement in the same context as with the enhancement nen type. If you use an emitted attack then the amount of damage it causes is determined by the speed of impact and the amount of nen(in very general terms). Whats the point of merely emitting more nen and calling it enhancement? Saying you can enhance pure energy with pure energy is every bit as dumb as trying to get water wetter with more water.

I am not saying emitted nen is not real. The issue is that emitted nen is just that, nen, pure life energy and whatnot. Nothing more or less. A conjured sword for instance would be actual metal, not nen.

---------- Post added at 11:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:06 PM ----------

Well, as for netero's nen I don't think it can be conjured either. It is perfectly possible for someone to learn nen types other than his own however there will always be drawbacks to it. We saw the percentages and those pretty much show that learning other nen types is increasingly inefficient and requires more time than your own nen. As we have seen, hatsu's seem to be developed by people at a young age. Even if mastering them would take decades it requires but a few months to actually get it close to what will be its final shape. Do we assume netero for some reason put of developing his hatsu until he was able to use every nen type to the level he would require to use his current hatsu? This not only does not make sense because it is clearly different from what everyone else does when learning and developing nen but also because netero's very school actually teaches that enhancers at large do not need complicated techniques (wing told that to gon).

We don't know whether netero's hatsu can be seen or not by non nen users however this is how it would break down in terms of how it could be made:

The first alternative is that the kannon requires emission, transmutation and manipulation. Emission to maintain the power of his nen at a distance, transmutation to shape it like a Bodhisattva and manipulation to control it. Not only none of this nen types is his own but manipulation is remarkably far away.

The other alternative is that the Bodhisattva is plainly conjured. It avoids netero the need for emission, transmutation and manipulation at large and to boot he could actually use his nen to enhance it (however as netero is not actually in contact with the thing he would require emission to do that). Theoretically it would be simpler than using 3 nen types to create it however to actually be effective in battle having to use emission to enhance the thing with nen would be a pain one way or another.

In my eyes the statue at large does not fit any particular nen type nor combination of them if we consider that netero is an enhancer. At some point in the manga it was said that you could actually become a specialization nen type later in life(although it was more common with manipulators or conjurers). Now, we at some point saw that netero retreated to the mountains for his training. During this time we saw that netero spent every waking hour punching and praying. As we have seen, that is pretty much EXACTLY what netero does to attack with kannon. He makes a prayer and then kannon imitates netero's movements. Its not like netero went to do that training to get stronger, he went there with the idea of showing gratitude for everything he had gotten of martial arts. More so, once he got faster at his routine he simply prayed more. By the manga's words this pretty much enlightened netero or something. What if the sheer insanity of the little training netero put himself through actually developed this nen as a specialization nen? It would make sense as specialization is not even a nen type per say, it is simply the category that techniques which fit in nowhere (cough kannon cough) go to.

 

[Demonspeed]

It's easier, but it doesn't mean that Enhancers are unable to materialize something.
Take Kurapika Chains, for example. They need to be enhanced to resist the strength of Uvogin. One could say that you could make that as the special property, but this is difficult without Enhancement.

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It's because Kurapika use his specialization nen :Emperor Time which allows him to use all hatsu types at 100%.I haven't said that they can't materialize something but it's more difficult.I don't think he was trying to create a great technique and preferred to use materialization instead of emission but the two are possible.

It's true but not in all case,Biscuit herself said that it's better practice a little other nen types.

---------- Post added at 11:00 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:47 AM ----------

Well, under that logic any form of emission would already be enhancement. It plainly does not make sense that merely putting power into an emitted attack is enhancement in the same context as with the enhancement nen type. If you use an emitted attack then the amount of damage it causes is determined by the speed of impact and the amount of nen(in very general terms). Whats the point of merely emitting more nen and calling it enhancement? Saying you can enhance pure energy with pure energy is every bit as dumb as trying to get water wetter with more water.

Exactly.Enhancement is very basic,everyone use it(Ren and Ko are enhancement technique)so just the fact to increase your aura is enhancement.

I am not saying emitted nen is not real. The issue is that emitted nen is just that, nen, pure life energy and whatnot. Nothing more or less. A conjured sword for instance would be actual metal, not nen.

It would be metal, but a it would still be nen.If it was not Kuroro would be able to materialize his book when Kurapika caught him and Zetsu would be inefficient on Materialization users.

Well, as for netero's nen I don't think it can be conjured either. It is perfectly possible for someone to learn nen types other than his own however there will always be drawbacks to it. We saw the percentages and those pretty much show that learning other nen types is increasingly inefficient and requires more time than your own nen. As we have seen, hatsu's seem to be developed by people at a young age. Even if mastering them would take decades it requires but a few months to actually get it close to what will be its final shape. Do we assume netero for some reason put of developing his hatsu until he was able to use every nen type to the level he would require to use his current hatsu? This not only does not make sense because it is clearly different from what everyone else does when learning and developing nen but also because netero's very school actually teaches that enhancers at large do not need complicated techniques (wing told that to gon).

We don't know whether netero's hatsu can be seen or not by non nen users however this is how it would break down in terms of how it could be made:

The first alternative is that the kannon requires emission, transmutation and manipulation. Emission to maintain the power of his nen at a distance, transmutation to shape it like a Bodhisattva and manipulation to control it. Not only none of this nen types is his own but manipulation is remarkably far away.

The other alternative is that the Bodhisattva is plainly conjured. It avoids netero the need for emission, transmutation and manipulation at large and to boot he could actually use his nen to enhance it (however as netero is not actually in contact with the thing he would require emission to do that). Theoretically it would be simpler than using 3 nen types to create it however to actually be effective in battle having to use emission to enhance the thing with nen would be a pain one way or another.

In my eyes the statue at large does not fit any particular nen type nor combination of them if we consider that netero is an enhancer. At some point in the manga it was said that you could actually become a specialization nen type later in life(although it was more common with manipulators or conjurers). Now, we at some point saw that netero retreated to the mountains for his training. During this time we saw that netero spent every waking hour punching and praying. As we have seen, that is pretty much EXACTLY what netero does to attack with kannon. He makes a prayer and then kannon imitates netero's movements. Its not like netero went to do that training to get stronger, he went there with the idea of showing gratitude for everything he had gotten of martial arts. More so, once he got faster at his routine he simply prayed more. By the manga's words this pretty much enlightened netero or something. What if the sheer insanity of the little training netero put himself through actually developed this nen as a specialization nen? It would make sense as specialization is not even a nen type per say, it is simply the category that techniques which fit in nowhere (cough kannon cough) go to.

Yes there are many possibilities but i think the most probable combo is enhancement/emission/manipulation.

 

[kkck]

Under your logic emission itself would be enhancement though. The manga does not work that way, adding more power to an emitted attack is not reinforcement, its just more emission. Reinforcement in principles requires you to use nen to enhance something other than nen basically. Making rocks of fists harder, making a sword stronger, you name it. Just adding nen to nen is not really going to do anything to actually reinforce nen, it is merely going to behave as more nen.

The manga has made a clear distinction between materialization and anything else. A materialized object might have in origins in nen however the object itself is not nen. It is a physical thing which a non nen user would not actually be able to distinguish from a normal object. Since a conjured object is an actual physical thing with the properties and limitations of whatever it is supposed to be, it can be enhanced with nen as you could enhance pretty much any object. Emission is intrinsically different, adding or concentrating more nen into it is simply more emission, not reinforcement.

Kinda like kurapica's chain for that matter. Kurapica does not have the option to materialize the hell out of it to make it stronger, his only alternative would be the use reinforcement on it (which he could). If kurapica had a chain made of, say, emission and transformation though, he would be able to make a stronger chain by simply emitting more nen into it.

---------- Post added at 10:28 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 AM ----------

Also, if netero is making the whole thing the standard way (and not with some sort of weird acquired specialization) then he would require transformation, not just emission and manipulation. Kannon could not possibly have a shape that complex without transformation.

 

[Demonspeed]

Like Uriel said,nen techniques are all related to other types.For example,Hisoka and Machi's hatsu are purely transformation techniques, but the weak point of their hatsu is emmission. Hisoka can't extend Bungee Gum more than 10 meters because his emmision skills are weak,the more Machi's threads are far ,the more their power is weakened. Enhancement is a nen type very basic. Even Wing said that they just have to train Ten and Ren to become stronger.When Gon has developped "Rock", he learnt later that it's just Ko etc.Enhancement is an ameliorated version of Ten,Ren and Ko. It's why they have the best offense and defense.Even when you are adding more Nen into something,you are using enhancement but enhancers do it better. When you increase your aura or add more aura into something you do it via basic techniques Ten,Ren,Shu etc...This is enhancement.

 

[Uriel]

Not quite. Actually kkck has a strong point about"You can't strength your aura by putting more aura". What you enhance is your body. The edge, the speed, whatever that is a property able to be strengthen.

In Machi case, I think She materializes the thread.

 

[Demonspeed]

Machi is confirmed transformation(this is shape transformation).

And about "You can't strength your aura by putting more aura" i think that it's a problem of vocabulary.
It's true that you can't do that.To enhance your aura you don't need to add more aura but just to strengthen it even if you keep the same volume. Example:Gon and Killua have the same volume of aura but Gon has better Ten,Ren and Ko because is aura is naturally strengthened by his enhancement type. You can reinforce your aura without necessarily add more volume to it.It would be a waste.

Now with emission types, even if they emit aura they just have to strengthen it via basic techniques(like Ten,Ren,Ko,Shu) which are all enhancement. They don't put more volume,they reinforce it. The aura has the same volume but has better qualities(offense and defense boost).

 

[Uriel]

I know She's Transformation, I'm saying that it's very likely that She uses as a secondary type instead of Emission, Materialization.

And Killua is better, and it was shown many times in GI. Look the scene when they jump.

And no, basic techniques ARE NOT Enhancement. Enhancement IS to ENHANCE something and basic techniques is what you do with aura alone. Let me be more clear: You can Enhance a knife to cut trough most things. If you apply your aura to the kinfe, it doesn't mean that will cut trough most things. It could be that it cuts dimension, throws fireballs, open gates, summon something...Am I being clear?

 

[Umibouzu]

From being an abilities mod on a HxH RP forum, i can tell you that there's a clear notion behind this discussion thats being unnoticed: Many complex abilities use multiple strengths from different hatsu, not just Enhancement or Conjuration. So labeling Knuckle's Hakoware as Emission OR Conjuration is crazy, because he could easily be using a combination of the three to do it (Conj. Emiss. Manip.) but the key to finding what Affinity he has would be to find out how his hatsu works, since it doesnt work at all when away from the user, we could assume it has very little Emission skill, and since he conjures it on someone else, we can assume he has higher than average Conj/Manip skills in order to stick it onto someone, and keep it conjured there. We could assume he's the best at Conjuration by understanding the strengths and weaknesses of his hatsu. Same with Morel,

Gon proves that people can have abilities other than their Affinity, but the rules of Nen tell us that Gon will have a hard time using Manipulation and Conjuration, and will take longer to use effectively. Which is why Biscuit had him work on the his best categories, Enhancement, Emission and Transmutation because he could learn them faster and use them better.

And no, basic techniques ARE NOT Enhancement. Enhancement IS to ENHANCE something and basic techniques is what you do with aura alone. Let me be more clear: You can Enhance a knife to cut trough most things. If you apply your aura to the kinfe, it doesn't mean that will cut trough most things. It could be that it cuts dimension, throws fireballs, open gates, summon something...Am I being clear?

Enhancement and Basic Nen abilities go hand and hand. for example, Enhancement is a purely supportive thing, it makes someone stronger, faster, more durable and can be used on any thing in the body. But the problem is that's all it can do, Enhancement doesnt break someone's face, Enhancing your fist does. So when Enhancers like Gon, or Uvogin, or Palm use Enhancement Hatsu, they take that all that aura they dont need since their body is now stronger, faster and more durable and put it into a Ko or Ken or Ren. Uvogin was a master or Ko and Ken, because his body was so superhuman, he did this:

Natural Strength + Enhanced Strength + Ko = Big Bang Shot

Thats why Gon's Rock is just a Ko strike, because adding all that aura with the above formula makes for one hell of an attack. And adding aura to a blade, that's Shu. Everyone can do it.

 

[Uriel]

In GON goes hand to Hand. Most of Enhancers use basic techniques because they're that: simple. It doesn't mean that Enhancement is basic techniques, because if you look closely everything is made of basic techniques.

 

[kkck]

I actually agree on his point. Rock is ultimately nothing complicated at all, rock is simply ko. Nothing less and nothing more. Gon simply gets a bonus for it (knuckle pointed it out) because it suits him or something. Enhancement ultimately is simply using simple techniques to extremes. The same could be said for uvogin's big bang, it is simply ko, a punch packed with nen.

Still, ultimately enhancement is about enhancing the properties of something. Ko enhances whatever limb it is being used on for example. As far as the shu bit for blades and other weapons though, I think there are techniques which we haven't been shown. Shu is basically extending ren over something and making it as if it was a part of your body. However how about a version were you extend ken over it? And what about if you concentrate your aura on it as if with ko?

As for machi, I doubt she uses emission for the most part. As long as she has contact with the string she does not need it at all. Separating it from herself does require emission but in turn it was already said it weakens significantly from it. I have my doubts that the string uses any level of materialization. As far as we know the string does not have the properties of any given actual thing, it is simply a nen string.

---------- Post added at 11:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:38 PM ----------

Machi is confirmed transformation(this is shape transformation).

And about "You can't strength your aura by putting more aura" i think that it's a problem of vocabulary.
It's true that you can't do that.To enhance your aura you don't need to add more aura but just to strengthen it even if you keep the same volume. Example:Gon and Killua have the same volume of aura but Gon has better Ten,Ren and Ko because is aura is naturally strengthened by his enhancement type. You can reinforce your aura without necessarily add more volume to it.It would be a waste.

Now with emission types, even if they emit aura they just have to strengthen it via basic techniques(like Ten,Ren,Ko,Shu) which are all enhancement. They don't put more volume,they reinforce it. The aura has the same volume but has better qualities(offense and defense boost).

Well, that wouldn't be enhancing aura though, I would argue that is simply concentrating aura. Basically more aura not enhanced aura.

 

[TheAmericandream]

I have to admit, reading all this only has me more confused about Netero's Hatsu... :P

Could it be at least said his ability could be done with either Materialization or Emission? At that point I'd assume he'd chose the one closer to his natural typing. Even as skilled as he is, that makes sense to me.

I'd like to talk about Zeno in this thread as well. Is it official that he's a transmutation type like Killua? Because his various Dragon Hatsu seem to involve both Manipulation and Emission. If there was no record of his typing I'd sear he's Emission type. Could someone make the argument for him being Transmutation? It's never made sense to me (him being transmutation)

 

[Uriel]

I felt the same about him. It was so...confusing. I guess Togashi has to explain a bit more about Hatsu to make things more clear. If I can take ANY conclusion from Zeno is that when you're badass you ignore the whole system :P