Sure, you can believe what you want. It's your opinion to have your mindset. If facts from the manga can't change your fanbased mind, then all the more power to you. I didn't undermine your arguments, I straight up debunked and countered them word for word, considering your content had so many flawed inaccuracies, straw-men, red herrings and fallacies. Gray is on Base Natsu level in portrayal, not hard to understand. I bet Mashima himself would admit to that much. My arguments and claims stand true here as I'm going by what the manga is presenting to us.
and if you want to be fair with yourself, then put Erza above a tier over Mira. Otherwise the double standard statement easily stands.
As many people claim here, you make your own assumptions and you believe them to be true and strong arguments, while you believe mine to be flawed, inaccurate, and even hypocritical. Well, that's your problem, not mine.
Saying we've plenty of proof that BASE Gray has surpassed Ur (as in, the Gray that cannot eat her ice, or cannot slay a demon) is just "flawed, innaccurate, straw-men, a red herring and a fallacy". Ur is a tier (if not more) above base Gray.
I'm not the one overhyping Natsu here, you are the one overhyping Gray. That they've always been classed as equals on portrayal doesn't mean it'll be that way here in Alvarez. Natsu's made MASSIVE improvements in that year gap, whereas Gray has done reasonably good improvements as far as we could see. If we do not take into account their small false brawl, which is not a feat nor a portrayal of anything at all, Natsu's base flames have improved in terms of power and control to the extent they outclass anything Gray's shown to this point.
Saying Natsu could one-shot BN is not overhyping Natsu (he actually did that!), saying Gray could oneshot BN is overhyping Gray. I mean, you're clearly a Gray fan and it is only natural that you have a tendency to hype him and defend him over other characters. I'm no fan of either so my opinion is rather impartial and based on what I've seen on their development.
(...) Now you're going to tell me something convenient to help support your flawed statements. I can't believe you also haven't clued in on the Ul fight whatsoever. This is like the third ignorant user who hasn't clued in yet. As for Ur kicking their "asses", (...)
Clearly, making such statements makes us less ignorant (if we were ignorant to begin with) and makes you look like you don't know what to say to defend your arguments. What cannot be defended, cannot be defended. You're making yourself look ignorant, a few users have noticed that already. Please stop doing this.
Just one point I'd like to clarify is that I'm not a Natsu fanboy. In fact I don't really like Natsu that much. Actually. I would probably choose Gray over Natsu. But it seems we have a difference of opinion and that doesn't mean either of us is more ignorant than the other. We see differencies in the facts, we interpret them differently and we come out with different conclusions. There's no need to call anyone an ignorant or worse.
Guys, he may be a little more aggresive than he should be, but
@Tinitus makes quite a bit of sense. This is just my unbiased opinion of the situation. Take it or leave it. Good debate going on though. I don't think Natsu was in BDKM when he defeated the War God though... at this point in the story Natsu has far surpassed Grey and i will keep that opinion until Grey proves himself
He makes sense because his interpretation of the events makes sense. But he could make much more sense if he sticked to the argument and stopped spamming "natsu tards", "ignorants" and things like that
Then I'd gladly have read all his following arguments but I had to stop due to the disrespect.
