Discussion General Episodes Discussion

[deffkryz]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

I'm not trolling/spamming the wonder that is One Piece; just a regular guy who likes good animation. (I know animation can be costly/time consuming; I've watched Avatar: The Last Airbender).

So what? I've watched Choujikuu Yousai Macross which was done by painting and photographing cels... That scene Milia flew through the Macross' inner city in Episode 18 was so greatly done even today's Macross Frontier looked pale sometimes with all its CGI and HDTV, and repeated scenes. And ATLA had a rather low frame rate... BTW... how were silence and intense moments done there?

What's it worth to say "Animation was bad, I liked that of that other show more"? Not everything that looks good in anime is in fact animation... it's more like the kind of story-telling that makes it different from what people used to know from European or US comic series... Who needs animated parts in intense moments where silence is best suited?

Hell, I'll never forget the barely animated but intensely told end of the same Macross episode from above - and it weights as much as the end of the 20th episode of Macross Frontier.

 

[Lee-tyme7]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

damn ... the starting of the episode feels so slow.

8 minutes of people looking shocked ... ughh, get your **** together toei or whoever is animating this, enough of the one episode per chapter crap.


however, the ending was epic though, which is expected because of the excellent writing so it was almost forgiveable. but damn ... the slow pace is pissing me off too much.

Not only does it have a slow paste but the opening and intro took most of the episode. They are just extending times to reach the 25 min mark.
What ever happen to the OP ending songs nowadays? They don't have it anymore. I miss the earlier episodes when they used to show it.

 

[deffkryz]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

So, the "critics" have of course the best knowledge of how to create films and especially how to create dramatically moments.

Not only does it have a slow paste but the opening and intro took most of the episode. They are just extending times to reach the 25 min mark.

*pulls out the ts of Ep 471*
No, most of the episodes are content:

opening ..................................... 4493 frames .... ~ 2:30 minutes
sponsor I ................................... 302 frames ..... ~ 10 seconds
commercials ................................. 1799 frames .... ~ 1 minute
introduction ................................ 1440 frames .... ~ 48 seconds
recap ....................................... 1238 frames .... ~ 41 seconds
title + part one ............................ 18900 frames ... ~ 10:31 minutes
eyecatcher I (Luffy)......................... 210 frames ..... ~ 7 seconds
commercials ................................. 1798 frames .... ~ 1 minute
sponsor II .................................. 300 frames ..... ~ 10 seconds
commercials ................................. 4495 frames .... ~ 2:30 minutes
eyecatcher II (Nami) ........................ 225 frames ..... ~ 8 seconds
part two .................................... 15001 frames ... ~ 8:21 minutes
trailer (with "please tune in next week") ... 1047 frames .... ~ 35 seconds

Spoiler: Technical stuff

Using DGIndex, AviSynth, and Virtualdub to determine @ 29.97fps... most fansubbers go down to 23.97fps.

So it's 18:52 minutes of content vs. 11:08 minutes of non-content within the half an hour slot 9:30-10:00am. Sure not nice - but what do you expect from a TV show that is depending on commercials?

What ever happen to the OP ending songs nowadays? They don't have it anymore. I miss the earlier episodes when they used to show it.

It's good to have no endings since Crazy Rainbow anymore... One song is way enough.

 

[Lord Rayleigh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

I'd like it more if it were 80's.

Anyone remember Dragon Ball and it's awesome animation? More than 20 years ago. A long time not to learn anything new.

It's because we were kids and it's a time when we didn't complain much about entertainment. And it was a time when we couldn't read always the manga before watching the anime, because we didn't have much money at this age, and because internet did not exist yet.

To me, One Piece's anime is far above Dragon Ball in terms of quality.

 

[k-dom]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

Since when are One Piece forums "troll swales" in which so called critics may smash some eggs anytime? It's only natural to post more positive stuff in a ... wait a second, I know the term ... ah, yes ... fan section of a forum. MH sure isn't OP only but here's the subforum as harbor for OP fans, and I'm pretty sure this "criticism" here isn't covered by the criticism but no bashing policy.

Some guys seem not to be satisfied with the current episodes. So what? They don't have nothing else to do but watching a show they obviously simply don't like anymore? Not that they ever seem to have, nor are able to go into detail what exactly is their problem...

So you are allowed to make critics when there is a filler part you don't like but we cannot make some. I've just check some of your old posts and most of them feel negative...

And I'm sorry but by copy/pasting the manga in that intro they made a big nonsense. In the manga all this was on a single double spread, so that you see everyone in shock at the same time. It was a very strong moment that to me has been completely lost in the animation.
The animation is good to... animate. It should work perfectly with a battle scenario. Instead, we have suspended time moments that are simply out of the subject here.

 

[Razh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

It's because we were kids and it's a time when we didn't complain much about advertising. And it was a time when we couldn't read always the manga before watching the anime, because we didn't have much money at this age, and because internet did not exist yet.

To me, One Piece's anime is far above Dragon Ball in terms of quality.

We were kids? I re-watched original Dragonball a while ago. I haven't noticed a lot of improvement in fighting animations since then. Which is sad. I'd like to see more Luffy vs Lucci type fights.

Just awesome.

And quality should be constant. Last 2 arcs of One Piece were mostly crap, with a couple of awesome parts. That's just not good enough. I blame it more on bad direction than on animation to be honest.

Of course, some other popular animes have the same problem.

EDIT: Lol, imagine what Jet Gatling could do now.

 

[deffkryz]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

So you are allowed to make critics when there is a filler part you don't like but we cannot make some. I've just check some of your old posts and most of them feel negative...

Fillers that alter the original plot to make other fillers fit into the episode and ones that make well defined characters behave out-of-character are crap by definition - I didn't change my opinion about that. Where have those been in episode 472? They left out one scene where Squard pushes Marco away but with the minor error mentioned above it's no big deal after all.

There's nothing to discuss about altering fillers being inappopriate changes to the storyline, and it's something extremely different from how an episode's conception is realized in general (aka drawing style, animation and pacing). And yes, IMO such fillers can crap the whole arc. I've stopped watching Shippuuden and Bleach because of their fillers, and halted OP for the Amazon Lily arc because of Naoki Tate.

It's one chapter per episode, for quite some time now and whining about that won't change anything, since for Toei and Fuji there's absolutely no need to change that: One Piece is #3 of all anime TV shows in Japan thus the most successful modern anime TV show.

If you take your time to read a chapter with all its details, you'll easily take a quarter of an hour too, don't you? At least I do, because I want to enjoy reading and watching OP - what altering and ooc fillers just simply disrupt. (And yes, as a Hancock fan I hated the fillers in episodes 470 and 471)

I just started to compare "canonical" episodes and chapters to list up the changes for the German One Piece wikia - and believe me, I'm pretty much pissed about that starting with Robin's wrong color of eyes and the more I go into details...

And I'm sorry but by copy/pasting the manga in that intro they made a big nonsense. In the manga all this was on a single double spread, so that you see everyone in shock at the same time. It was a very strong moment that to me has been completely lost in the animation.
The animation is good to... animate. It should work perfectly with a battle scenario. Instead, we have suspended time moments that are simply out of the subject here.

Aha... well, if you think so. I'll keep sticking with that anime is more than simple "animation" but story-telling beyond European and US standards, so there may be scrolling stills for minutes. And that's why I take these "copy/pasting" scenes as dramaturgical breaks which were realized better than last week's purple shots.

Maybe it's because I just didn't swept over the images in the manga noticing many shocked characters but looking into each one's facial expression to feel their horror. My bad one...

 

[Lord Rayleigh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

We were kids? I re-watched original Dragonball a while ago. I haven't noticed a lot of improvement in fighting animations since then. Which is sad. I'd like to see more Luffy vs Lucci type fights.

Just awesome.

And quality should be constant. Last 2 arcs of One Piece were mostly crap, with a couple of awesome parts. That's just not good enough. I blame it more on bad direction than on animation to be honest.

Of course, some other popular animes have the same problem.

EDIT: Lol, imagine what Jet Gatling could do now.

I'm talking about quality here. If you prefer Dragon Ball animated fights which is also linked to Dragon Ball's manga fights, that's different. I took a random Dragon Ball video on Youtube. Compare it with the quality of any One Piece episode. The difference is obvious.

 

[Black Lagoon]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

Yeah, but if the quality is good but the animation is crap why bother watch it and in times where we have HD and 3D the quality shouldn't be an option it's an obligation to attract people.

Edit : This is a shōnen where we have fights. ^^

 

[Razh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

I'm talking about quality here. If you prefer Dragon Ball animated fights which is also linked to Dragon Ball's manga fights, that's different. I took a random Dragon Ball video on Youtube. Compare it with the quality of any One Piece episode. The difference is obvious.

There you go again. You're talking about cosmetics. I'm not talking about textures and color. I'm talking about how cool the fight is. Punches, kicks, counters, speed. Choreography. That's why I liked Lucci vs Luffy and all the similar fights. Nowadays, animation is mostly sloppy and the good stuff is saved for cool moments. I really dislike that.

Also, I've been repeating I prefer Dragonball. Fuck DBZ, especially after Namek. That video you pulled out is crap.

 

[ish3]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

There you go again. You're talking about cosmetics. I'm not talking about textures and color. I'm talking about how cool the fight is. Punches, kicks, counters, speed. Choreography. That's why I liked Lucci vs Luffy and all the similar fights. Nowadays, animation is mostly sloppy and the good stuff is saved for cool moments. I really dislike that.

Also, I've been repeating I prefer Dragonball. Fuck DBZ, especially after Namek. That video you pulled out is crap.

To date for the most part DB or DBZ has had the best choreographed fights in my opinion. My all time favorite is 17 vs Piccolo. DB Kai did somewhat of a better just but the openings always feel like a teaser.

On topic here we're not getting any one on one fights. I see where you're getting at I miss those too. But this is the marineford arc. Of course it's gonna look somewhat sloppy. Very few fights last five seconds. I mean they could put in work but personally it would be wasted effort. But one can dream.

 

[Lord Rayleigh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

There you go again. You're talking about cosmetics. I'm not talking about textures and color. I'm talking about how cool the fight is. Punches, kicks, counters, speed. Choreography. That's why I liked Lucci vs Luffy and all the similar fights. Nowadays, animation is mostly sloppy and the good stuff is saved for cool moments. I really dislike that.

Also, I've been repeating I prefer Dragonball. Fuck DBZ, especially after Namek. That video you pulled out is crap.

Then, we were not talking about the same thing. You were talking about fight animation while I was talking about animation.

On a side-note, one of the best animations ever done in One Piece was the Sabaody Archipelago. It was incredible.

 

[beastboy]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

Shabaody archipelago had good animation, but the drawings were awful... :3

One Piece is lacking good animation, and is not becuase of staff, if you see movie 10 you'll see.
Its just because of budget... crisis affects every market!

 

[Razh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

On a side-note, one of the best animations ever done in One Piece was the Sabaody Archipelago. It was incredible.

The only problem I had with that is how they changed Kuma's sound effect when jumping around. Instead his POP sound, they made it seems like he was using Soru.

It still can't compare with Enies Lobby, in my opinion.

As I said, I realize there's no place in this arc for one on one fights, and that's not what I was getting at. With just a slightly better direction, every episode could be great. Ffs, it takes a real genius to fuck up an arc that shows a giant battle. Oda gave them EVERYTHING!
It's just being ruined by all the forced stalling, giving me the same feel I had watching Bleach "Winter War". You feel like everyone's taking it easy there, especially retarded Boa. If she started throwing her underwear at Luffy next episode, I wouldn't even be surprised.

I hope they pick up the pace now when Whitebeard is on the move. No time to fuck around now, just show us the battle.

---

One Piece is lacking good animation, and is not becuase of staff, if you see movie 10 you'll see.
Its just because of budget... crisis affects every market!

10 may have a good animation, but it's direction sucks. Had some cool moments, but that's it. Judging from the trailer, it should have been 5 times better, at least. Dead End Adventure was a lot better for me.

It's not just crisis. It's the lack of creativity.

 

[El-Thor]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

Did I hear "best animation" ? Water 7 was animated the best imo. Big buildings, huge skylines, lots of flowing water. Just beautiful.

 

[4StepsAhead]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

To date for the most part DB or DBZ has had the best choreographed fights in my opinion. My all time favorite is 17 vs Piccolo. DB Kai did somewhat of a better just but the openings always feel like a teaser.

On topic here we're not getting any one on one fights. I see where you're getting at I miss those too. But this is the marineford arc. Of course it's gonna look somewhat sloppy. Very few fights last five seconds. I mean they could put in work but personally it would be wasted effort. But one can dream.

Man I thought I was the only one that thought that fight was before it's time......I remember watching and freaking out....I wish more fight were like that one.....and sadly it never makes any of the top anime fighting scenes on youtube.

 

[beastboy]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

Did I hear "best animation" ? Water 7 was the animated the best imo. Big buildings, huge skylines, lots of flowing water. Just beautiful.

If only the wave Aokiji froze was animated like the Aqua Laguna <3...

 

[Aikidoka]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

Yeah, not sure what the animation staff is thinking, especially since it's been proven that they can do much better. These episodes were made a few months before though (Iva's VA was arrested in July IIRC, we didn't see the voice change till a month ago), so back then the anime was really close to the manga. They might just have opted to 'waste time' in favor of making good episodes.

Still doesn't explain why they were so lazy though...

 

[Lee-tyme7]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

This WK episode was ok still alot of talk about Sqaud and WB and family stuff, etc... Other than that I thought the fight scene through out this arc was well animated...well some part but it could have been better.
Some ppl complain about this arc not having 1 on 1 fight well I think it's better Oda didn't have every single one of those characters in a single battle because other wise this anime/manga would become Bleach. It's fast paste, and a lot of interruption going on around just like a real war. This arc would still be going right now if it did have 1 on 1 fights.

 

[Razh]

Re: Latest Episodes Discussion

This arc would still be going right now if it did have 1 on 1 fights.

Didn't expect 1 on 1 fights, just to clarify. But If this arc had some 1 on 1 fights instead of lame fillers and stretchers (Boa for example, needlesly long Squad flashback, Luffy's "search" for Ace after landing, Ivankov's conversation with Doflamingo, etc.), it would probably be at the same place now.