Discussion Laxus Dreyar Thread

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

Natsu wouldn't have been able to activate dragon force because the only time that he could have was when Igneel left his body sooooo, again argument is invalid. The fact that Natsu went all out with a LFD secret art attack and didn't one-shot Tempesta shows that it still would have been a problem.

I don't remember it being stated but I will admit that you are right on this one. However, one-shot doesn't mean anything. You don't have to one-shot your opponent to defeat them. Therefore, even there would still be a problem, LFD Natsu may just be able to defeat Tempesta. Also, looking at Natsu's feats against Mard Geer and comparing his stats to Tempsta's, I think Natsu has sufficient power to have the edge.

Yes your are. All your doing is refuting characters statements, from Makarov, to Hades, to Mirajane, all that you've done is attempt to say that they're statements have no base, even though they are characters in the series, witnessing the powers of said characters that they're basing their statements off. How on earth were Makarov's words proven inaccurate by feats when Jura had just smashed the MPF world record right in front of his eyes, the only way fairy tail won that was because they basically cheated. The Spriggan 12, Zeref, Acnologia and the Gods of Ishgar were all ranked on statements, because that is the power that they exude.

I already told you. Feats and hype are two separate matters. You can't go straight to hype when there are feats already involved.

Makarov even said that August was on a whole other level from the rest, what are you going to say now? That Lucy is stronger than August because this is just a statement? You talk about feats and hype, yet you tried to make the argument earlier in this thread that Mystogan would have defeated Laxus if the fight went on and I know for a fact Mystogan is your favourite character.

No, actually I will believe Makarov here. Why? Because August has no feats so far and we know for a fact that Makarov had intel on some of the Spriggans. However, this is subject to change once we see August in action. Feats come first. Hype second. Because we have no feats as of now, we have to rely on hype and even so, I would never call August the strongest definitely. I'm glad you know that Mystogan is my favorite character. I mean we all have one, right?

Again, here you forget the glaring reason why Jura didn't take out the leader, you refuse to point out the fact that Jura had to sacrifice himself to save Natsu, Lucy, Gray and Happy. Why have you refused to mention this? The fact is that Jura single handedly saved them all and forced the OS back in the first fight of the arc, when they were being destroyed, the Hoteye and fight didn't even get to conclude and then Jura proceeded to easily defeat Brain, who was the strongest member of the OS before Zero was born. This was also the much weaker Jura, Laxus defeated the Jura who had been training for seven years after his return.

Actually I never denied that. Look back at my post and you'll see I clearly stated that he defended Fairy Tail. Please don't twist my words. Okay, Jura was taken out because of an explosion; therefore, he couldn't defeat Zero. According to you, Jura is so strong that his defense and durability must be godly, right?

When did I say he needed to scream to break the illusion? Yes Laxus screamed, but when he was screaming he was setting up a spell around Mystogan, the whole time and he cought Mystogan with it. "Calm, cool and collected." Pure and utter BS, Laxus caught him off-guard with an attack that he set up while he was under the illusion and your saying I'm spinning things, here's the proof.

Spoiler: Laxus outplaying Mystogan

Spoiler: Laxus landing an attack and Mystogan and Laxus being hit

Spoiler: Mystogan being hit AGAIN

Cool calm and collected my ass, Mystogan was clearly taking damage and Laxus outwitted him by placing a spell around him while under the illusion.

The point here is that he didn't need to scream, unless he panicked? Or you're trying to tell me that Laxus needed to scream to set up an attack? That would be quite disturbing. I can give you that Laxus got caught off-guard but who was caught off-guard first? I'll leave that for you to answer as it is pretty obvious. At no point in the fight did Laxus outplay Mystogan. He caught him off-guard. Note the difference. At the same time, Mystogan was not hit by the second attack, he clearly transformed to Mist Body before escaping it. That is the confusion that many have and I've already pointed it out in the past.

I'm not saying mistakes don't count. When on earth did I say that? All I said was Natsu and Gajeel needed a lot of outside interference (fairy law, Mystogan, Erza, Gajeel being used as a rod) to win that fight and without it, Laxus clearly displayed he was head and shoulders above the two. You keep saying you don't deny that he is one of the strongest people in fairy tail like that's a complement, when Laxus was already one of the strongest people in fairy tail since the beginning of the series, when the fact is and everything has indicated that he is one of the strongest in the entire series period. I'm not hating, all i'm doing is refuting your false claims and downplaying of Laxus and Jura as a result of Laxus defeating Jura. I think i'll trust the claims and statements of actual characters in the series over your claims thank you.

If you are not implying that mistakes don't count, then why do you keep repeating the fact that Laxus used Fairy Law which made him weaker and thus lead to his defeat? He couldn't defeat Gajeel and Natsu. It was fair and square. Outside interference? Last time I checked, Erza's and Mystogan's fight lasted less than 10 minutes together, and that is at the max. He was not head over shoulders over Erza or Mystogan. Laxus even told Mystogan that the title for Fairy Tail's Strongest was either him or Mystogan, of course excluding Gildarts.

 

[Stormsfury]

I already told you. Feats and hype are two separate matters. You can't go straight to hype when there are feats already involved.

Yes and Makarov stated this right after Jura pulled the feat of breaking the MPF world record, he clearly backed up the statement, yet here you are saying he didn't prove it, when you didn't even get to see him and Laxus' fight. What on earth are you on about? Even Mavis said that she had no idea how she was going to deal with Jura during the final day, because of his great display of power.

No, actually I will believe Makarov here. Why? Because August has no feats so far and we know for a fact that Makarov had intel on some of the Spriggans. However, this is subject to change once we see August in action. Feats come first. Hype second. Because we have no feats as of now, we have to rely on hype and even so, I would never call August the strongest definitely. I'm glad you know that Mystogan is my favorite character. I mean we all have one, right?

Yes we do and mine is Laxus, yet you keep on repeating that he's my favourite character over and over again to try and make me look bias for the sake of your arguments and I really don't appreciate it and i'm still waiting for you to prove that Mystogan would have definitely won without pure speculation and bias.

Actually I never denied that. Look back at my post and you'll see I clearly stated that he defended Fairy Tail. Please don't twist my words. Okay, Jura was taken out because of an explosion; therefore, he couldn't defeat Zero. According to you, Jura is so strong that his defense and durability must be godly, right?

And if he didn't put his body on the line to save them, then he would have been all right and would have been able to keep going, but that wasn't the case now was it? The plot clearly called for him to sacrifice himself so that Natsu could defeat the big bad as always. Do tell me, who do you thing the powerhouse of the OS arc was then if not Jura? Also again, the Jura that Laxus beat is the Jura who is superior in every way than the Jura back in the OS arc.

The point here is that he didn't need to scream, unless he panicked? Or you're trying to tell me that Laxus needed to scream to set up an attack? That would be quite disturbing. I can give you that Laxus got caught off-guard but who was caught off-guard first? I'll leave that for you to answer as it is pretty obvious. At no point in the fight did Laxus outplay Mystogan. He caught him off-guard. Note the difference. At the same time, Mystogan was not hit by the second attack, he clearly transformed to Mist Body before escaping it. That is the confusion that many have and I've already pointed it out in the past.

Speaking of screaming, why did Mystogan scream when Laxus hit him with the lightning attack before he went into mist body? How was he in pain despite not being hit my the attack as you claim? It was clear the mist body perhaps negated part of the attack or saved him from another attack that was coming, but he was clearly his by the attack as the panel's show. If he wasn't actually affected then why did he scream? The fact is that Laxus was freaked out by the illusion, but despite that fact he still managed to catch Mystogan off guard and nail him with an attack without him even noticing the attack around him. How on earth did he not outplay him when Mystogan had no idea the magic circles were around him until Laxus basically told him?

If you are not implying that mistakes don't count, then why do you keep repeating the fact that Laxus used Fairy Law which made him weaker and thus lead to his defeat? He couldn't defeat Gajeel and Natsu. It was fair and square. Outside interference? Last time I checked, Erza's and Mystogan's fight lasted less than 10 minutes together, and that is at the max. He was not head over shoulders over Erza or Mystogan. Laxus even told Mystogan that the title for Fairy Tail's Strongest was either him or Mystogan, of course excluding Gildarts.

How was it fair and square when all of those outside elements took a toll against Laxus? Yes mistakes do count, but are you actually going to completely ignore every single event that Laxus went through leading up to his defeat? Are you for real? A ten minute fight is a long long time, he clearly took hits from Mystogan and drained magic by attacking Mystogan, he drained magic by attacking Erza and then the Natsu Gajeel fight happened and he still stomped them and then he made the mistake of casting fairy law and draining most of his magic. Natsu and Gajeel didn't suffer from any outside interference and were completely fresh, while Laxus was put through a whole bunch of different events that were unfavourable to him.

The fact that you actaully thought the Natsu and Gajeel fight against Laxus was "fair and square" shows that all your doing is downplaying him again. I have never heard someone say it was fair and square. Every time the fight is brought up, people always note the events that lead up to the fight.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 13, 2016, Original Post Date: Mar 13, 2016 ---

Gray speculating that Erza always had SO shows that he doesn't know if she has it. If he could accurately sense Erza's power level and take into account SO, then he would have noticed a spike in power and concluded that Erza had gotten SO from Ultear. Since Gray doesn't know Erza's power level, there is no way Mira, who hasn't even seen Erza fight for 3+ years, knows. And Mira has no way of knowing Jura's power level.

I don't know what you mean by the "power level thing" in the Sting and Rogue fight, but if Mira could accurately sense Natsu's power level and Sting's power level, she would know the fight would be a stomp, right? The same way Mira supposedly knew Erza's and Jura's power levels without them ever fighting. And same with everyone else in the guild. Dunno why Makarov and the others were even worried about the outcome of the fight.

Characters do make stupid statements when they know nothing. Like how Sting and Rogue said they could beat Acnologia. Makarov stated that he has met 6 of the Spriggan 12 while in Alvarez and seen their magic (except for Dimaria), so he can compare them to each other. However, Makarov does not know how much FT has improved over the timeskip, so that is why he was surprised.

Again as I stated on the Erza's SO, we still have no idea how SO is activated the way Erza went and did it because that was never explained. I've already said that people in this manga can sense power level's as seen with Kagura with Dimaria and Team Natsu with Brandish, they had never met Brandish or Dimaria before, yet they sensed the level of power from them. So I see no reason why Mirajane couldn't sense Jura and Erza's power.
It wasn't even Mira sensing the power level's during the Natsu and Gajeel vs Sting and Rogue fight, it was Makarov and Mavis and the two of them commended the twin dragons on their power and tenacity but they still said that Natsu was on another level.
Those two were the same people who were in awe of Jura's strength, Makarov compare it to Gildarts and Mavis said she had no idea how to deal with him on the final day.

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

Yes and Makarov stated this right after Jura pulled the feat of breaking the MPF world record, he clearly backed up the statement, yet here you are saying he didn't prove it, when you didn't even get to see him and Laxus' fight. What on earth are you on about? Even Mavis said that she had no idea how she was going to deal with Jura during the final day, because of his great display of power.

Makarov knew Jura's power at the time, but not Gildarts. While traveling, Gildarts could have gotten stronger and he most likely did considering that means he is somewhat training. First, Jura's MP was 8544. Cana's Fairy Glitter broke the scale. That same Fairy Glitter used on Bluenote did no damage. Gildarts defeated Bluenote. You can say that it was because Cana trained during the timeskip. True. But read my second sentence. You can see Makarov's statement was either false or was comparing GMG Jura to Tenrou Gildarts.

Spoiler

It's such a coincidence why Gildarts never participates in any event Fairy Tail has. Probably because he will easily win the GMG for Fairy Tail.

Yes we do and mine is Laxus, yet you keep on repeating that he's my favourite character over and over again to try and make me look bias for the sake of your arguments and I really don't appreciate it and i'm still waiting for you to prove that Mystogan would have definitely won without pure speculation and bias.

I never repeated that Laxus is your favorite character... In fact, I never hinted it. I say that you guys are bias and fanboys for not fairly assessing the feats. I even say it to people whose favorite character is not Laxus. You can be biased in other ways besides favorite characters. Let's just say I like Gray's character more than Natsu. I can still be biased for Gray even though he is not my favorite character.

And if he didn't put his body on the line to save them, then he would have been all right and would have been able to keep going, but that wasn't the case now was it? The plot clearly called for him to sacrifice himself so that Natsu could defeat the big bad as always. Do tell me, who do you thing the powerhouse of the OS arc was then if not Jura? Also again, the Jura that Laxus beat is the Jura who is superior in every way than the Jura back in the OS arc.

The powerhouse of the Oración Seis Arc? It was pretty much everyone combined as a team. Nobody really stood out more than the other. Each one of the members contributed to the defeat of Oración Seis as one another. Sure, Laxus beat GMG Jura and not OS Jura, but Laxus improved a lot during that time too, so proportionally, it is the same.

Speaking of screaming, why did Mystogan scream when Laxus hit him with the lightning attack before he went into mist body? How was he in pain despite not being hit my the attack as you claim? It was clear the mist body perhaps negated part of the attack or saved him from another attack that was coming, but he was clearly his by the attack as the panel's show. If he wasn't actually affected then why did he scream? The fact is that Laxus was freaked out by the illusion, but despite that fact he still managed to catch Mystogan off guard and nail him with an attack without him even noticing the attack around him. How on earth did he not outplay him when Mystogan had no idea the magic circles were around him until Laxus basically told him?

He was grunting, but sure you can call it scream. Plus, Mystogan never came close to the pitch that Laxus did when he was screaming. Outplaying would be that Laxus dodged Mystogan's attack and proceeded to attack Mystogan with a hit. In this case, both were "hit". Therefore, you cannot say that Laxus outplays Mystogan, unless you also add in that Mystogan outplayed Laxus. That would be pointless though because that would cancel out, resulting in nobody being outplayed.

How was it fair and square when all of those outside elements took a toll against Laxus? Yes mistakes do count, but are you actually going to completely ignore every single event that Laxus went through leading up to his defeat? Are you for real? A ten minute fight is a long long time, he clearly took hits from Mystogan and drained magic by attacking Mystogan, he drained magic by attacking Erza and then the Natsu Gajeel fight happened and he still stomped them and then he made the mistake of casting fairy law and draining most of his magic. Natsu and Gajeel didn't suffer from any outside interference and were completely fresh, while Laxus was put through a whole bunch of different events that were unfavourable to him.

You're the one that told me that Laxus was toying around with Mystogan, am I right? So how can that take a toll on him? Even so, Erza's battle with him was way shorter, so it would be insignificant. I get a feeling you are trying to pull any sort of scenarios you can find. I admit Laxus casted Fairy Law but he wanted to do that with the intent of killing everybody around him. Yes, Laxus is little bit stronger than Natsu and Gajeel combined.

The fact that you actaully thought the Natsu and Gajeel fight against Laxus was "fair and square" shows that all your doing is downplaying him again. I have never heard someone say it was fair and square. Every time the fight is brought up, people always note the events that lead up to the fight.

It was fair and square. No PoF or Nakama Power was involved. There were no nonsense spells or hax magic... I even said Laxus was a little stronger than the two dragon slayers. Seriously, what more do you want from me? That Laxus casually defeated and won the battle against Natsu and Gajeel like they were fodders?

 

[Laxus chan-yo]

Laxus showed he had far more in his tank than Mystogan ever did. Fighting Festival Laxus (showed he wasn't remotely going all out against Mystogan) easily gets the benefit of the doubt over Mystogan who hasn't showed much beyond what he showed against Laxus. Also lol at Gildarts improving much. He reached his prime before Acnologia attacked. There is no evidence he improved a lot like the younger characters who are the primary focal points of all development within the story. Can't wait for Gildarts to come back and be a hype tool for Cana's development.

 

[Stormsfury]

Makarov knew Jura's power at the time, but not Gildarts. While traveling, Gildarts could have gotten stronger and he most likely did considering that means he is somewhat training. First, Jura's MP was 8544. Cana's Fairy Glitter broke the scale. That same Fairy Glitter used on Bluenote did no damage. Gildarts defeated Bluenote. You can say that it was because Cana trained during the timeskip. True. But read my second sentence. You can see Makarov's statement was either false or was comparing GMG Jura to Tenrou Gildarts.

Well of course he's comparing him to Tenrou Gildarts.......... when on earth did I say otherwise. Are you actually trying to say Gildarts rose that much in power during the few days in which Makarov didn't see him? Makarov showed Gildarts Lumen Histoire, then Gildarts wrote a note and went on another journey and then the grand magic games started after that if i'm not correct. Straight off the bat you've said something entirely false again in an attempt to downplay Jura, the Fairy Glitter that Cana cast against Bluenote didn't even freaking work, she didn't have the right method to cast it but she did achieve the right method during the 3 months of training. So that argument is completely and utterly invalid.

I never repeated that Laxus is your favorite character... In fact, I never hinted it. I say that you guys are bias and fanboys for not fairly assessing the feats. I even say it to people whose favorite character is not Laxus. You can be biased in other ways besides favorite characters. Let's just say I like Gray's character more than Natsu. I can still be biased for Gray even though he is not my favorite character.

HAHAHA!!!! "I never repeated that Laxus is your favourite character... In fact, I never hinted it." Are you serious right now?

If we don't know whether Hades knew who was on the island or not, then we can't use the assumption. I'll repeat myself. What Makarov said was just words, let alone, those words are proven inaccurate by feats. I'm not refuting any character statements. I agree with all of them unless feats show otherwise. That is why we have to distinguish between feats and hype. Instead, I think you are just using any possible evidence you can find and trying to prove your point about your favorite character.

There, I even provided evidence.

The powerhouse of the Oración Seis Arc? It was pretty much everyone combined as a team. Nobody really stood out more than the other. Each one of the members contributed to the defeat of Oración Seis as one another. Sure, Laxus beat GMG Jura and not OS Jura, but Laxus improved a lot during that time too, so proportionally, it is the same.

I am asking you about the powerhouse, not the the powerhouses? Please state who was the strongest of the alliance during the OS mission. Your attempting to avoid the question here, Jura was clearly the strongest person in the alliance, he displayed that when he single handedly forced the OS to retreat during their first engagement while everyone else got wrecked.

He was grunting, but sure you can call it scream. Plus, Mystogan never came close to the pitch that Laxus did when he was screaming. Outplaying would be that Laxus dodged Mystogan's attack and proceeded to attack Mystogan with a hit. In this case, both were "hit". Therefore, you cannot say that Laxus outplays Mystogan, unless you also add in that Mystogan outplayed Laxus. That would be pointless though because that would cancel out, resulting in nobody being outplayed.

No, that wasn't a grunt........ that was a scream, pure and simple, I already provided you with the panels, i'm not going to do it again, the only way you would think that's a grunt is if your blind. Are you seriously now bringing up the pitch of the scream? For real? A scream is a scream, I'm not even going to head more into that territory because I will feel like an idiot arguing about who's scream had the highest pitch.
The fact is that Mystogan was on the offensive and Laxus waited for the attack to come, Mystogan never saw Laxus' attack coming, in the end Laxus managed to land two solid physical hit's on Mystogan while Mystogan only landed a single pyhsical hit on Laxus, the panels are there, so please don't go around miscounting

You're the one that told me that Laxus was toying around with Mystogan, am I right? So how can that take a toll on him? Even so, Erza's battle with him was way shorter, so it would be insignificant. I get a feeling you are trying to pull any sort of scenarios you can find. I admit Laxus casted Fairy Law but he wanted to do that with the intent of killing everybody around him. Yes, Laxus is little bit stronger than Natsu and Gajeel combined.

Didn't say he was toying around, I said never really got serious, they were clearly both testing each other out, but the fact is that Laxus was hit by Mystogan and did use magic power against him. You're the one who is arguing that Laxus was effected by the attacks from Mystogan, so why are you saying the fight between him, Natsu and Gajeel was fair and square? The Erza battle wasn't insignificant because he still ended up using magic power attacking and defending against Erza's attacks. WHAT SCENARIO?! The panels and all the evidence is there, Laxus wasn't at 100% of his magic power and wasn't at 100% physically, when he fought Natsu and Gajeel. The only way you can't see that is either if your blind or you just didn't read the chapter or watch the anime. He didn't cast fairy law with the intent of killing everyone. If he did that with the intent, then he would have killed everyone and won the fight, it clearly showed that his hear wasn't in it and that is the only reason why everyone survived. If Laxus had gone all out with a clear vision of his goal and cast fairy law, he would have defeated everyone and taken over the guild, but that didn't happen because deep down he never really wanted that.

It was fair and square. No PoF or Nakama Power was involved. There were no nonsense spells or hax magic... I even said Laxus was a little stronger than the two dragon slayers. Seriously, what more do you want from me? That Laxus casually defeated and won the battle against Natsu and Gajeel like they were fodders?

aaaaaaaaaand again, your ignoring all the events that lead up to the fight, why? It wasn't fair and square because when Laxus wasn't nearly completely drained of magic he was stomping Natsu and Gajeel into non-existence. How do you explain Laxus stomping them and then all of a sudden losing to them after casting fairy law? He wasn't a little stronger, he was much stronger than them. I never told you to say that they are fodder or that Laxus won against them, stop saying that crap. The fact is that the only reason they stood a chance was because of all the unfavourable events that led to his defeat happened.

 

[iDooom]

Again as I stated on the Erza's SO, we still have no idea how SO is activated the way Erza went and did it because that was never explained. I've already said that people in this manga can sense power level's as seen with Kagura with Dimaria and Team Natsu with Brandish, they had never met Brandish or Dimaria before, yet they sensed the level of power from them. So I see no reason why Mirajane couldn't sense Jura and Erza's power.
It wasn't even Mira sensing the power level's during the Natsu and Gajeel vs Sting and Rogue fight, it was Makarov and Mavis and the two of them commended the twin dragons on their power and tenacity but they still said that Natsu was on another level.
Those two were the same people who were in awe of Jura's strength, Makarov compare it to Gildarts and Mavis said she had no idea how to deal with him on the final day.

Saying that we don't know everything about SO doesn't nullify my point. Gray did not know about Erza having SO, so his assessment of Erza's power was inaccurate. Mira knew even less about Erza's power, so her statement on them not being able to take on Jura is meaningless.

So what you're basically saying is that Makarov, Mavis, and Mira knew the outcomes of every fight before they happened just by sensing magic power. (Except when it came to fights like Elfman vs Bacchus, Erza vs Kagura vs Minerva, Gray vs Rufus, etc.) And you're saying that somehow Laxus broke their 100% accurate MP senses and beat Jura? It should be apparent sensing MP doesn't always give an accurate account of the fight.

And if he didn't put his body on the line to save them, then he would have been all right and would have been able to keep going, but that wasn't the case now was it? The plot clearly called for him to sacrifice himself so that Natsu could defeat the big bad as always. Do tell me, who do you thing the powerhouse of the OS arc was then if not Jura? Also again, the Jura that Laxus beat is the Jura who is superior in every way than the Jura back in the OS arc.

Erza handled Cobra and Racer at the same time and only lost when Hoteye interfered + Cobra's incredibly hax snakebite. Plus she soloed Midnight, who was stated to be the strongest of the Oracion Seis (minus Zero). Jura was always portrayed to be one of the powerhouses of the group.

 

[Stormsfury]

Saying that we don't know everything about SO doesn't nullify my point. Gray did not know about Erza having SO, so his assessment of Erza's power was inaccurate. Mira knew even less about Erza's power, so her statement on them not being able to take on Jura is meaningless.

So what you're basically saying is that Makarov, Mavis, and Mira knew the outcomes of every fight before they happened just by sensing magic power. (Except when it came to fights like Elfman vs Bacchus, Erza vs Kagura vs Minerva, Gray vs Rufus, etc.) And you're saying that somehow Laxus broke their 100% accurate MP senses and beat Jura? It should be apparent sensing MP doesn't always give an accurate account of the fight.

No that is not what i'm saying, stop twisting my words, I was saying that people can base their views on the evidence at hand, which is the power levels, I choose to accept the statements of the actual characters in the story and base my arguments of them and not off a fans viewpoint. I choose the logical way of doing things. When did I say that it was 100% accurate? There are many factors that come into play when two people fight, some may be advantageous to one participant and disadvantageous to the next, all these need to be taken into account.

Erza handled Cobra and Racer at the same time and only lost when Hoteye interfered + Cobra's incredibly hax snakebite. Plus she soloed Midnight, who was stated to be the strongest of the Oracion Seis (minus Zero). Jura was always portrayed to be one of the powerhouses of the group.

Yeah. Erza could only handle two of them at once, when Jura recovered from the sneak attack by Gemini and returned, he saved everyone and single handedly forced the entire OS to retreat, not two of them, he forced all of them to retreat, you also didn't mention the fact that Erza had a very convenient way of defeating Midnight, which was her eye that can see through illusions and the fact that Jura soloed their leader with ease has also been forgotten. The only reason why he wasn't the one to take down Zero, was because the plot calls for the MC to take down the main big bad and that's why he used his body to save Lucy, Natsu and Happy. It was clear that Jura was the powerhouse of the alliance, not one of the powerhouses. Are you actually making the claim that Erza was stronger than Jura back then?

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

Laxus showed he had far more in his tank than Mystogan ever did. Fighting Festival Laxus (showed he wasn't remotely going all out against Mystogan) easily gets the benefit of the doubt over Mystogan who hasn't showed much beyond what he showed against Laxus. Also lol at Gildarts improving much. He reached his prime before Acnologia attacked. There is no evidence he improved a lot like the younger characters who are the primary focal points of all development within the story. Can't wait for Gildarts to come back and be a hype tool for Cana's development.

As I argued before, how do you know when a person is at their prime? You don't. Except when you have Third Origin. Gildarts has shown the most impressive feats of all characters and he is probably the most well-balanced. Okay, just wait till Gildarts shows himself in Alvarez Arc...

Well of course he's comparing him to Tenrou Gildarts.......... when on earth did I say otherwise. Are you actually trying to say Gildarts rose that much in power during the few days in which Makarov didn't see him? Makarov showed Gildarts Lumen Histoire, then Gildarts wrote a note and went on another journey and then the grand magic games started after that if i'm not correct. Straight off the bat you've said something entirely false again in an attempt to downplay Jura, the Fairy Glitter that Cana cast against Bluenote didn't even freaking work, she didn't have the right method to cast it but she did achieve the right method during the 3 months of training. So that argument is completely and utterly invalid.

Well then, why even mention it as reliable information when you're comparing characters from two different timeskips. No, Gildarts had the same amount of training time as the rest of Fairy Tail including Cana. Gildarts left prior to the note he gave which was in Chapter 259. Then the following chapters after Chapter 260, Fairy Tail had just begun their 3 months training. It sped up afterwards because of the Celestial Spirit World mess.

Before your criticize me, do some research. Cana's Fairy Glitter was sucessful but Bluenote had the power to channel it away from him.

Spoiler

Yes, I was wrong about the DF Natsu vs Etherious Tempesta, and I take full credit for my mistakes. It was my fault. However, it was never stated. Only implied which led to my confusion.

HAHAHA!!!! "I never repeated that Laxus is your favourite character... In fact, I never hinted it." Are you serious right now?

There, I even provided evidence.

How many could you find? One post? Is that repeating?

Also, I intentionally said your favorite character without every putting Laxus in it. Note the word, Laxus. I made sure of it considering that I already knew who your favorite character is. How do you know I wasn't talking about Hades or Makarov? It's okay, your post here just made your favorite character a dead giveaway.

I am asking you about the powerhouse, not the the powerhouses? Please state who was the strongest of the alliance during the OS mission. Your attempting to avoid the question here, Jura was clearly the strongest person in the alliance, he displayed that when he single handedly forced the OS to retreat during their first engagement while everyone else got wrecked.

The team combined was a powerhouse. The reason why I can't name one is because they contributed to the defeat of Oración Seis almost equally. However, Natsu defeated two opponents so I guess I can say him. Is this fair? No.

No, that wasn't a grunt........ that was a scream, pure and simple, I already provided you with the panels, i'm not going to do it again, the only way you would think that's a grunt is if your blind. Are you seriously now bringing up the pitch of the scream? For real? A scream is a scream, I'm not even going to head more into that territory because I will feel like an idiot arguing about who's scream had the highest pitch.
The fact is that Mystogan was on the offensive and Laxus waited for the attack to come, Mystogan never saw Laxus' attack coming, in the end Laxus managed to land two solid physical hit's on Mystogan while Mystogan only landed a single pyhsical hit on Laxus, the panels are there, so please don't go around miscounting

The reason I'm being so precise in my answers is because you keep pressing me on the same topic. If you don't like my answers, stop being so nit-picking. I'm pretty sure there are different levels of screaming that measure the urgency of a situation. Compare Natsu's and someone else like Gray, Erza, or Lucy if you want to know what I mean. I counted 2 hits for Mystogan and 1 hit for Laxus. But I'll be lenient and give Laxus his 2 hits if you count the scene with Mystogan using Mist Body. Are you counting the one when Mystogan was caught off-guard? If so, you must be really desperate at this point.

Didn't say he was toying around, I said never really got serious, they were clearly both testing each other out, but the fact is that Laxus was hit by Mystogan and did use magic power against him. You're the one who is arguing that Laxus was effected by the attacks from Mystogan, so why are you saying the fight between him, Natsu and Gajeel was fair and square? The Erza battle wasn't insignificant because he still ended up using magic power attacking and defending against Erza's attacks. WHAT SCENARIO?! The panels and all the evidence is there, Laxus wasn't at 100% of his magic power and wasn't at 100% physically, when he fought Natsu and Gajeel. The only way you can't see that is either if your blind or you just didn't read the chapter or watch the anime. He didn't cast fairy law with the intent of killing everyone. If he did that with the intent, then he would have killed everyone and won the fight, it clearly showed that his hear wasn't in it and that is the only reason why everyone survived. If Laxus had gone all out with a clear vision of his goal and cast fairy law, he would have defeated everyone and taken over the guild, but that didn't happen because deep down he never really wanted that.

Laxus was affected by Mystogan attacks in my eyes. If you don't believe so, then we disagree. Simple. I only stated once in another thread that Mystogan would have the upper hand considering how I saw the battle go down as well as the type of magic used. You're the one who sought out my post and tried to bash Mystogan because you thought I was bashing Laxus. Tell me, how was the fight with Natsu not fair and square? How much damage did Laxus really take from Mystogan? Sure, he was affected but it was so minimal that it shouldn't hinder him from victory against Natsu and Gajeel. Not to mention, everyone had to go to Laxus while he sat around waiting for them. See how ridiculous it is to argue about a fight that was as inconclusive as this? I mentioned in the past that this fight will remain inconclusive till the end but we all have our own opinions on how we think it'll go down, with evidence of course..

His intent was to kill everyone... It didn't happen because of his heart like you said. The fact still stands that Laxus couldn't successfully cast Fairy Law.

Speaking of anime, to answer your question in the last post, Mystogan was grunting and not screaming like Laxus.

aaaaaaaaaand again, your ignoring all the events that lead up to the fight, why? It wasn't fair and square because when Laxus wasn't nearly completely drained of magic he was stomping Natsu and Gajeel into non-existence. How do you explain Laxus stomping them and then all of a sudden losing to them after casting fairy law? He wasn't a little stronger, he was much stronger than them. I never told you to say that they are fodder or that Laxus won against them, stop saying that crap. The fact is that the only reason they stood a chance was because of all the unfavourable events that led to his defeat happened.

I'm sorry that I just don't think that he was that much stronger than Natsu and Gajeel. I mean if he were, then he should have stomped them. But fine, he was noticably stronger than Natsu and Gajeel. How about that? Not much different from a little stronger but happy? Yes, unfavorable events happened to him but it was his own doing.

 

[Laxus chan-yo]

As I argued before, how do you know when a person is at their prime? You don't. Except when you have Third Origin. Gildarts has shown the most impressive feats of all characters and he is probably the most well-balanced. Okay, just wait till Gildarts shows himself in Alvarez Arc...

No he doesn't. Laxus's nuke against Ajeel shits on anything Gildarts has done. Also, you are kidding yourself if you think Gildarts is going to have the semblance of growth that the third generation of Fairy Tail will have. I have rarely seen such terrible arguments ever.

 

[Yunkers]

His intent was to kill everyone... It didn't happen because of his heart like you said. The fact still stands that Laxus couldn't successfully cast Fairy Law.

To be honest, he did successfully cast Fairy Law, but because of his heart, it didn't damage his friends. The spell is intended to defeat enemies and protect allies, so it worked correctly.

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

To be honest, he did successfully cast Fairy Law, but because of his heart, it didn't damage his friends. The spell is intended to defeat enemies and protect allies, so it worked correctly.

Well the spell, Fairy Law, was made so that it obliterates anyone that the caster deems an enemy. The fact that nobody died means that he didn't use it right. So you can change my wording successfully cast to successfully work or however way you prefer but he still didn't make it work correctly. Again, not because he is too weak, his MP is too low, or he didn't know how to use it. He just didn't meet it's criteria.

 

[Yunkers]

Well the spell, Fairy Law, was made so that it obliterates anyone that the caster deems an enemy. The fact that nobody died means that he didn't use it right. So you can change my wording successfully cast to successfully work or however way you prefer but he still didn't make it work correctly. Again, not because he is too weak, his MP is too low, or he didn't know how to use it. He just didn't meet it's criteria.

Now I can agree with you. Saying "he couldn't cast it" is mistake, because he could and he did and it worked like it should--allies were protect, but there weren't enemies. "He didn't meet criteria" is correct, "he couldn't" is wrong.

 

[Stormsfury]

As I argued before, how do you know when a person is at their prime? You don't. Except when you have Third Origin. Gildarts has shown the most impressive feats of all characters and he is probably the most well-balanced. Okay, just wait till Gildarts shows himself in Alvarez Arc...



Well then, why even mention it as reliable information when you're comparing characters from two different timeskips. No, Gildarts had the same amount of training time as the rest of Fairy Tail including Cana. Gildarts left prior to the note he gave which was in Chapter 259. Then the following chapters after Chapter 260, Fairy Tail had just begun their 3 months training. It sped up afterwards because of the Celestial Spirit World mess.

That does not matter, Gildarts is a mage in his prime and we're not even sure how much stronger he's gotten, so now all your doing is speculating, we know for a fact tenrou Gildarts wass insanely powerful, far far more powerful than Natsu and anyone from Team Natsu and Hades likened Laxus to him and Makarov likened Jura to him who was in turn defeated by Laxus, those are the facts, but your going to choose to ignore all these statements in your attempts do downplay Laxus.

Before your criticize me, do some research. Cana's Fairy Glitter was sucessful but Bluenote had the power to channel it away from him.

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Are freaking kidding me right now?

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Spoiler

It was not successful at all, in anyway shape or bloody form. She cast it but she didn't have enough power as she just said and was incapable as Bluenote just said. Character statements >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Your claims and observations, because they actually live in that world and even if I were to give you the benefit of the doubt and say Bluenote channelled it away from himself, that doesn't mean that Bluenote tanked the attack. How are you even trying to use this argument to justify downplaying Jura?

Yes, I was wrong about the DF Natsu vs Etherious Tempesta, and I take full credit for my mistakes. It was my fault. However, it was never stated. Only implied which led to my confusion.



How many could you find? One post? Is that repeating?

Also, I intentionally said your favorite character without every putting Laxus in it. Note the word, Laxus. I made sure of it considering that I already knew who your favorite character is. How do you know I wasn't talking about Hades or Makarov? It's okay, your post here just made your favorite character a dead giveaway.

My mistake, you didn't repeat it to me but you did repeat it to other Laxus fan's and that made our arguments seem bias and in your post above, you said that you never even implied it when you clearly did. Also WHAT?! Stop trying to treat me like i'm an idiot, it's either that or your a complete idiot. This is a Laxus Dreyar thread, we are discussing Laxus Dreyar, where the hell are Hades and Makarov coming from, quit with your bullshitting, the dead give away for my favourite character was the fact that I'm defending him on his own damn thread, with an avatar of said character against someone who is downplaying him so damn much. Only someone illiterate wouldn't be able to see what you're trying to pull. Freaking low man.

If we don't know whether Hades knew who was on the island or not, then we can't use the assumption. I'll repeat myself. What Makarov said was just words, let alone, those words are proven inaccurate by feats. I'm not refuting any character statements. I agree with all of them unless feats show otherwise. That is why we have to distinguish between feats and hype. Instead, I think you are just using any possible evidence you can find and trying to prove your point about your favorite character.

The team combined was a powerhouse. The reason why I can't name one is because they contributed to the defeat of Oración Seis almost equally. However, Natsu defeated two opponents so I guess I can say him. Is this fair? No.

That is an outright lie and completely unfair, you are completely ignoring the side events of the arc that effected and sidelined Jura. Let me put it in very simple terms for you so that you can understand. Natsu vs Jura during OS arc, who would win in a fight?

The reason I'm being so precise in my answers is because you keep pressing me on the same topic. If you don't like my answers, stop being so nit-picking. I'm pretty sure there are different levels of screaming that measure the urgency of a situation. Compare Natsu's and someone else like Gray, Erza, or Lucy if you want to know what I mean. I counted 2 hits for Mystogan and 1 hit for Laxus. But I'll be lenient and give Laxus his 2 hits if you count the scene with Mystogan using Mist Body. Are you counting the one when Mystogan was caught off-guard? If so, you must be really desperate at this point.

Wait........ WHAT?! Are you feeling ok? I'm going to provide the panels for you again just in case you missed them and I'll even count the hits for you.

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1 hit for Laxus and 1 hit for Mystogan

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another hit for Laxus and that makes it 2 hits for Laxus and 1 for Mystogan, if you count the illusion that Mystogan used to set up his first attack and that Laxus tore through then I completely and utterly give up on you. Provide me the panel of Mystogan's hit on Laxus. Also provide me with the proof that Mystogan wasn't hit by the attack before he went into Mist Body, because I've just shown you that he was hit by that attack very clearly.

I'm not even going to go into the topic of pitch screams because I will feel like an idiot, that topic is just plain stupid.

Laxus was affected by Mystogan attacks in my eyes. If you don't believe so, then we disagree. Simple. I only stated once in another thread that Mystogan would have the upper hand considering how I saw the battle go down as well as the type of magic used. You're the one who sought out my post and tried to bash Mystogan because you thought I was bashing Laxus. Tell me, how was the fight with Natsu not fair and square? How much damage did Laxus really take from Mystogan? Sure, he was affected but it was so minimal that it shouldn't hinder him from victory against Natsu and Gajeel. Not to mention, everyone had to go to Laxus while he sat around waiting for them. See how ridiculous it is to argue about a fight that was as inconclusive as this? I mentioned in the past that this fight will remain inconclusive till the end but we all have our own opinions on how we think it'll go down, with evidence of course..

No you brought the "Mystogan would have beaten Laxus" to this very thread, it's on either page 2 or 3, yes you brought that argument to a thread where we were talking about Laxus............ why?
Please quote me if I said that Mystogan's attacks didn't affect Laxus, because all i've been doing is saying that the attacks affected Laxus, in the post above, you're trying to justify the claim that Laxus was hit by two of Mystogan's attacks and was losing to Mystogan but then in the post below, you're trying to say that it was so minimal that it doesn't matter. Are you for real right now? Even if it is minimal as you claim, Laxus still hade to endure attacks from Mystogan, he still had to use magic power against Mystogan and he still had to use magic power against Erza, fact. Mystogan and Gajeel are some of my favourite characters, Gajeel is in my top 3 and Mystogan is in my top 5, so why the hell are you assuming that I'm bashing them? I'm stating the facts, you also forget to mention the fact that Natsu, Gajeel and Mystogan all came to Laxus without any trouble at all, Erza came with trouble from Evergreen but that's irrelevant because she only exchanged a few blows with Laxus and then left. Natsu and Gajeel were full on magic power and completely healthy, while Laxus wasn't, those are the facts, or are you going to tell me that Laxus' attacks don't use that much magic power now? Or are you going to tell me Laxus was at full health despite taking a hit from Mystogan?

His intent was to kill everyone... It didn't happen because of his heart like you said. The fact still stands that Laxus couldn't successfully cast Fairy Law.

Nope. He successfully cast it, but deep down in his heart, he never meant to hurt any of them, his reluctance is what caused the spell not to kill everyone there. There is also the fact that he learned his grandfather was on death's door when he was casting it screwed up his mind.

Spoiler

And again, the legitimacy of character statements and action completely outrank a fans claims. Also I don't give a damn about whether he cast it right or not, I'm just saying that he did cast it and that he drained a lot of magic power by doing so.

Speaking of anime, to answer your question in the last post, Mystogan was grunting and not screaming like Laxus.

I'm not going to even bring up the grunting and screaming because just like the pitch of the scream argument, this is really wack and frankly kinda pathetic, if I were to go into that argument then we would end up arguing over voice actors and how they were told to portray their characters and that would be retarded. Your desperation is showing here clearly. Grunting and screaming? Just stop.

I'm sorry that I just don't think that he was that much stronger than Natsu and Gajeel. I mean if he were, then he should have stomped them. But fine, he was noticably stronger than Natsu and Gajeel. How about that? Not much different from a little stronger but happy? Yes, unfavorable events happened to him but it was his own doing.

He was stomping them, even after his engagements with Erza and Mystogan, I'm not going to bring in every panel of them getting wrecked by him, just go watch the anime if you've just gone and forgotten, the only time they actually managed to stand a chance was after he cast fairy law............. why do you think that is?

 

[iDooom]

No that is not what i'm saying, stop twisting my words, I was saying that people can base their views on the evidence at hand, which is the power levels, I choose to accept the statements of the actual characters in the story and base my arguments of them and not off a fans viewpoint. I choose the logical way of doing things. When did I say that it was 100% accurate? There are many factors that come into play when two people fight, some may be advantageous to one participant and disadvantageous to the next, all these need to be taken into account.

You were the one who said Jura > Mira and Erza 100% of the time because Mira said so. Never mind that some character statements, such as Sting saying he could beat Acnologia, are laughably false. Mira literally does not know what she is talking about.

Yeah. Erza could only handle two of them at once, when Jura recovered from the sneak attack by Gemini and returned, he saved everyone and single handedly forced the entire OS to retreat, not two of them, he forced all of them to retreat, you also didn't mention the fact that Erza had a very convenient way of defeating Midnight, which was her eye that can see through illusions and the fact that Jura soloed their leader with ease has also been forgotten. The only reason why he wasn't the one to take down Zero, was because the plot calls for the MC to take down the main big bad and that's why he used his body to save Lucy, Natsu and Happy. It was clear that Jura was the powerhouse of the alliance, not one of the powerhouses. Are you actually making the claim that Erza was stronger than Jura back then?

No, Brain launched an attack and left with the Oracion Seis and Wendy without bothering to see what happened. See: http://www.mangareader.net/fairy-tail/135/5, http://www.mangareader.net/fairy-tail/135/9. In no way did Jura force them to retreat. Given that Jura had trouble with Hoteye and got injured by a sneak attack from Angel, he would also have trouble with two of Oracion Seis. Let alone soloing them. Brain being the leader doesn't mean much when Midnight was stated to be stronger. Jura saving FT from the blast was quite similar to Erza saving FT from Jupiter in Phantom arc. Could Erza have done everything that Jura did back then? Yes. Is she stronger? Possibly.

 

[Stormsfury]

You were the one who said Jura > Mira and Erza 100% of the time because Mira said so. Never mind that some character statements, such as Sting saying he could beat Acnologia, are laughably false. Mira literally does not know what she is talking about.

Please bring the quote where I said that Jura > Mira and Erza 100%. If you can't bring the quote than don't make the false claims. Sting and Rogue had never been close to Acnologia, all that they said was because of their arrogance. The only thing you can do now is say that Mira doesn't know what she's taking about? Seriously? Sooo you have more knowledge than a character in the actual series? That is freaking laughable.

No, Brain launched an attack and left with the Oracion Seis and Wendy without bothering to see what happened. See: http://www.mangareader.net/fairy-tail/135/5, http://www.mangareader.net/fairy-tail/135/9. In no way did Jura force them to retreat. Given that Jura had trouble with Hoteye and got injured by a sneak attack from Angel, he would also have trouble with two of Oracion Seis. Let alone soloing them. Brain being the leader doesn't mean much when Midnight was stated to be stronger. Jura saving FT from the blast was quite similar to Erza saving FT from Jupiter in Phantom arc. Could Erza have done everything that Jura did back then? Yes. Is she stronger? Possibly.

My mistake, he didn't force them back, but he was injured by the sneak attack, the fight between him and Hoteye didn't even have a conclusion, so I have no idea why your basing your arguments off this, that same injured Jura took out their leader with ease, Erza couldn't take out Midnight with ease and you failed to mention that Erza had the convenience of her fake eye that allowed her to see through illusions, why on earth have you failed to mention this? You compare Jura saving them from the blast to a completely different situation, yes it was similar, but Jura had to act quickly to do so and as a result used his body, while Erza was able to set up a defence and pull out her strongest armour while the cannon was being prepared to fire.

 

[iDooom]

Please bring the quote where I said that Jura > Mira and Erza 100%. If you can't bring the quote than don't make the false claims. Sting and Rogue had never been close to Acnologia, all that they said was because of their arrogance. The only thing you can do now is say that Mira doesn't know what she's taking about? Seriously? Sooo you have more knowledge than a character in the actual series? That is freaking laughable.

I do have more knowledge than characters in the series. Unlike Sting, I know how strong Acnologia is because I saw him tank every attack from everyone on Tenrou island. I saw him blow up Tenrou island with a roar. Unlike Mira, I saw Erza's fights from BoS to Tenrou. Mira probably hasn't seen Erza fight in 3+ years while she was stuck at the bar not using magic. You admit that sensing magic isn't 100% accurate and that a lot of other factors play a part. So Mira's statement that Jura > Mira and Erza doesn't mean a whole lot. In fact it is false due to SO.

My mistake, he didn't force them back, but he was injured by the sneak attack, the fight between him and Hoteye didn't even have a conclusion, so I have no idea why your basing your arguments off this, that same injured Jura took out their leader with ease, Erza couldn't take out Midnight with ease and you failed to mention that Erza had the convenience of her fake eye that allowed her to see through illusions, why on earth have you failed to mention this? You compare Jura saving them from the blast to a completely different situation, yes it was similar, but Jura had to act quickly to do so and as a result used his body, while Erza was able to set up a defence and pull out her strongest armour while the cannon was being prepared to fire.

Jura was healed by Ichiya's pain-relieving parfum. If Jura could really fight three (or more) of the OS at once, he would have dealt with Hoteye easily, yes? Jura taking out Brain easily could just mean that Brain is weaker than Hoteye and much weaker than Midnight. Given that Jupiter damaged Makarov, who Jura said was incomparably stronger than himself, I could easily say that Jupiter > blast Jura tanked. None of what you have said definitively proves Jura > Erza or that Jura was the only powerhouse in the group.

 

[XXEliteXXAceXX]

That does not matter, Gildarts is a mage in his prime and we're not even sure how much stronger he's gotten, so now all your doing is speculating, we know for a fact tenrou Gildarts wass insanely powerful, far far more powerful than Natsu and anyone from Team Natsu and Hades likened Laxus to him and Makarov likened Jura to him who was in turn defeated by Laxus, those are the facts, but your going to choose to ignore all these statements in your attempts do downplay Laxus.

Hype is only half the facts. They can always change or be proven wrong. Feats are static. Once it happens, there is no twisting it like you're doing. If you don't agree with this simple logic, then I have nothing else to add on. I kept asking how do you know someone is at their prime? Because they're really strong? That is faulty logic.

Are freaking kidding me right now?

Spoiler

Spoiler

It was not successful at all, in anyway shape or bloody form. She cast it but she didn't have enough power as she just said and was incapable as Bluenote just said. Character statements >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Your claims and observations, because they actually live in that world and even if I were to give you the benefit of the doubt and say Bluenote channelled it away from himself, that doesn't mean that Bluenote tanked the attack. How are you even trying to use this argument to justify downplaying Jura?

Actually, I'm not kidding. It was successful whether you like it or not. Stop the back-pedaling. Sure, she didn't have enough power to make it affect Bluenote. Why? Because she was too weak. That is what I've been trying to say the whole time. It did no damage because Bluenote used his hands and magic to fend it off. Watch the anime for a clearer picture. It went straight to the ground and there was a clear explosion.

The first panel you provided only depicts Bluenote saying that Cana's magic didn't hit him because she was too weak. The second panel shows Cana admitting it and realizing that Bluenote is on a whole different level than her.

My mistake, you didn't repeat it to me but you did repeat it to other Laxus fan's and that made our arguments seem bias and in your post above, you said that you never even implied it when you clearly did. Also WHAT?! Stop trying to treat me like i'm an idiot, it's either that or your a complete idiot. This is a Laxus Dreyar thread, we are discussing Laxus Dreyar, where the hell are Hades and Makarov coming from, quit with your bullshitting, the dead give away for my favourite character was the fact that I'm defending him on his own damn thread, with an avatar of said character against someone who is downplaying him so damn much. Only someone illiterate wouldn't be able to see what you're trying to pull. Freaking low man.

I usually say it only once to a person if anything but I rarely point out someones favorite character. Usually it is because they keep pressing me on "favorite characters" or it is so obvious like you. However, for the last time, what is wrong with having a favorite character? As long as you don't fanboy and make up facts to prove that your character is superior, I don't mind. Just read the quote again and you'll see not once did I say Laxus. That is where I got Hades and Makarov from. Laxus Dreyar thread doesn't mean anything because my favorite character is not the title of the thread. I can literally spin this anyway I like... In case you didn't get it already, I don't need to say whether your favorite character is Laxus or not. It is very obvious at this point. I'm just stating how I feel about the chapter with Laxus and his overall character. The person that is taking offense is you. You're telling me that you never said a character is stronger than another or that you liked how every single chapter played out? If so, admit it now, or I'll post one of your quotes. Besides you already stated Laxus is one of the strongest and bolded it, so why are you arguing with me and accusing me of putting down Laxus when we said the exact same thing?

Spoiler

Uhh....... I don't know if you know this but Laux beat the so called "strongest human mage" before the timeskip and his power-up, he most certainly is one the strongest mages on the continent. The twin dragons where hyped up during GMG, Erza even said that Natsu and Gajeel were "most certainly at a disadvantage" when the twin dragons activated their dragon force and people were commenting on Stings power during the match and then Natsu proceeded to solo the two. Hype in Fairy Tail usually leads to disappointment and just bullshit, the fact is that the Gods of Ishgar were fodderdized by Serena, we saw some of their magic and it was nothing special at all.
If Laxus power spiked even half as much as Natsu did over the time-skip than he's probably stronger than the gods of ishgar.

That is an outright lie and completely unfair, you are completely ignoring the side events of the arc that effected and sidelined Jura. Let me put it in very simple terms for you so that you can understand. Natsu vs Jura during OS arc, who would win in a fight?

Jura would. But Natsu went DF against Zero and defeated him. To say Jura can defeat him is unknown. I can't use DF Natsu here because Jellal gave him the power energy source.

Wait........ WHAT?! Are you feeling ok? I'm going to provide the panels for you again just in case you missed them and I'll even count the hits for you.

Spoiler

1 hit for Laxus and 1 hit for Mystogan

Spoiler

another hit for Laxus and that makes it 2 hits for Laxus and 1 for Mystogan, if you count the illusion that Mystogan used to set up his first attack and that Laxus tore through then I completely and utterly give up on you. Provide me the panel of Mystogan's hit on Laxus. Also provide me with the proof that Mystogan wasn't hit by the attack before he went into Mist Body, because I've just shown you that he was hit by that attack very clearly.

I'm not even going to go into the topic of pitch screams because I will feel like an idiot, that topic is just plain stupid.

The proof that Mystogan wasn't hit by the attack before he went into Mist Body was that he was unscathed. That means he dodged it by a fraction of a second it exploded near him. Now the illusion clearly hit Laxus or he wouldn't have seen the "monster". You know not every magic spell has to deal damage, right? Mystogan has Illusion Magic as one of he specialties so it counts as long as it hits.

Spoiler

No you brought the "Mystogan would have beaten Laxus" to this very thread, it's on either page 2 or 3, yes you brought that argument to a thread where we were talking about Laxus............ why?
Please quote me if I said that Mystogan's attacks didn't affect Laxus, because all i've been doing is saying that the attacks affected Laxus, in the post above, you're trying to justify the claim that Laxus was hit by two of Mystogan's attacks and was losing to Mystogan but then in the post below, you're trying to say that it was so minimal that it doesn't matter. Are you for real right now? Even if it is minimal as you claim, Laxus still hade to endure attacks from Mystogan, he still had to use magic power against Mystogan and he still had to use magic power against Erza, fact. Mystogan and Gajeel are some of my favourite characters, Gajeel is in my top 3 and Mystogan is in my top 5, so why the hell are you assuming that I'm bashing them? I'm stating the facts, you also forget to mention the fact that Natsu, Gajeel and Mystogan all came to Laxus without any trouble at all, Erza came with trouble from Evergreen but that's irrelevant because she only exchanged a few blows with Laxus and then left. Natsu and Gajeel were full on magic power and completely healthy, while Laxus wasn't, those are the facts, or are you going to tell me that Laxus' attacks don't use that much magic power now? Or are you going to tell me Laxus was at full health despite taking a hit from Mystogan?

Okay, so I brought Mystogan in to counter another user's argument. And Mystogan is one of your top 5 favorite characters? Impressive. Besides, what did you have to relate to my comments with someone else, except trying to disprove one of your top 5 favorite characters? Are you going to go back more than 10 pages and hold me against it? It is my opinion. You can have one too and you did. Look at the your quote. Yes, Mystogan affected Laxus minimally. I think I stated it very clearly, it makes sense. You just admitted Erza was barely relevant, which is what I've been saying. When Laxus fought Natsu, he was healthly and close to full magic power. Don't lie here. Full health? As in HP? This is not a card game. This is manga/anime. You mean healthy. We replace it with stamina/endurance and Laxus clearly was not diminished of it.

He was stomping them, even after his engagements with Erza and Mystogan, I'm not going to bring in every panel of them getting wrecked by him, just go watch the anime if you've just gone and forgotten, the only time they actually managed to stand a chance was after he cast fairy law............. why do you think that is?

Obviously, because he casted Fairy Law. I never denied that he didn't get his magic energy drained. Nobody forced him to though. He wanted to.

 

[Stormsfury]

I do have more knowledge than characters in the series. Unlike Sting, I know how strong Acnologia is because I saw him tank every attack from everyone on Tenrou island. I saw him blow up Tenrou island with a roar. Unlike Mira, I saw Erza's fights from BoS to Tenrou. Mira probably hasn't seen Erza fight in 3+ years while she was stuck at the bar not using magic. You admit that sensing magic isn't 100% accurate and that a lot of other factors play a part. So Mira's statement that Jura > Mira and Erza doesn't mean a whole lot. In fact it is false due to SO.


Jura was healed by Ichiya's pain-relieving parfum. If Jura could really fight three (or more) of the OS at once, he would have dealt with Hoteye easily, yes? Jura taking out Brain easily could just mean that Brain is weaker than Hoteye and much weaker than Midnight. Given that Jupiter damaged Makarov, who Jura said was incomparably stronger than himself, I could easily say that Jupiter > blast Jura tanked. None of what you have said definitively proves Jura > Erza or that Jura was the only powerhouse in the group.

As the good panels that you brought above suggested, the perfume was only temporary. If you can confirm that it's effect was working on him throughout the entirety of the OS arc then I will give this to you. You also keep on ignoring the fact of Erza conveniently having an eye that allows her to see through illusions, illusions are midnights only type of magic and even then she had an extremely tough time beating him. You also keep on ignoring the fact that Jura vs Hoteye didn't even get to conclude because Hoteye became good, Jura was having no trouble whatsoever with him and then he proceeded to easily defeat Brain.
Makarov tanked Jupiter in his titan form and it didn't effect him nearly as much as it effected Erza.
You're also judging characters statements as inaccurate, yet you choose to take Jura's statement at face value. Talk about double standards. You're also ignoring the fact that Erza was prepared for the blast, she prepared her strongest armour that is made specifically for defense while Jura had to act quickly on instinct and chose to use his body to protect Natsu and the rest.

 

[Laxus chan-yo]

Elite Ace you keep on saying Laxus is 'one of the strongest' of the guild as if to prove you aren't biased. But that much even the biggest Laxus detractor on the planet will admit. So tell me your honest opinion. Where exactly do you estimate Laxus ranks in the FT guild? I'd like to know your top 5 strongest FT guild characters right now and if Laxus is in them. Take all feats and hype and portrayal into consideration. If you don't adequately know right now give me your best guess.

 

[Stormsfury]

Elite Ace you keep on saying Laxus is 'one of the strongest' of the guild as if to prove you aren't biased. But that much even the biggest Laxus detractor on the planet will admit. So tell me your honest opinion. Where exactly do you estimate Laxus ranks in the FT guild? I'd like to know your top 5 strongest FT guild characters right now and if Laxus is in them. Take all feats and hype and portrayal into consideration. If you don't adequately know right now give me your best guess.

It's not a complement at all, the fact that he's one of the strongest in the FT guild is obvious, because the statement has been made over and over again since the beginning of the series.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 13, 2016, Original Post Date: Mar 13, 2016 ---

Hype is only half the facts. They can always change or be proven wrong. Feats are static. Once it happens, there is no twisting it like you're doing. If you don't agree with this simple logic, then I have nothing else to add on. I kept asking how do you know someone is at their prime? Because they're really strong? That is faulty logic.

You call my logic faulty, yet you're the guy who basing everything about Gildarts' increase in strength off speculation and hype, what on earth are you smoking? Yes I have no way of knowing whether Gildarts is in his prime, but you have no way of knowing whether he has increased in magic power either, the fact it that Makarov compared Jura's strength to that of Tenrou Gildarts, who was by far and away more superior than anyone else from Team Natsu and superior to everyone else in the guild, the fact is that Hades directly compared Laxus to him as well and all that you can do is try and dismiss both these glaring statements

Actually, I'm not kidding. It was successful whether you like it or not. Stop the back-pedaling. Sure, she didn't have enough power to make it affect Bluenote. Why? Because she was too weak. That is what I've been trying to say the whole time. It did no damage because Bluenote used his hands and magic to fend it off. Watch the anime for a clearer picture. It went straight to the ground and there was a clear explosion.

The first panel you provided only depicts Bluenote saying that Cana's magic didn't hit him because she was too weak. The second panel shows Cana admitting it and realizing that Bluenote is on a whole different level than her.

Here you go again dismissing character statements, so are you telling me Bluenote doesn't know what he's talking about? The fact is that GMG Cana > Tenrou Cana. There is also the fact that the attack never hit Bluenote in the first place, yet your still trying to compare it to when Cana used it on the MPF in the GMG's. This argument is completely irrelevant, because either the attack never got to hit Bluenote in the first place, or it was never cast properly as Bluenote and Cana's reactions and comments actually suggest.

I usually say it only once to a person if anything but I rarely point out someones favorite character. Usually it is because they keep pressing me on "favorite characters" or it is so obvious like you. However, for the last time, what is wrong with having a favorite character? As long as you don't fanboy and make up facts to prove that your character is superior, I don't mind. Just read the quote again and you'll see not once did I say Laxus. That is where I got Hades and Makarov from. Laxus Dreyar thread doesn't mean anything because my favorite character is not the title of the thread. I can literally spin this anyway I like... In case you didn't get it already, I don't need to say whether your favorite character is Laxus or not. It is very obvious at this point. I'm just stating how I feel about the chapter with Laxus and his overall character. The person that is taking offense is you. You're telling me that you never said a character is stronger than another or that you liked how every single chapter played out? If so, admit it now, or I'll post one of your quotes. Besides you already stated Laxus is one of the strongest and bolded it, so why are you arguing with me and accusing me of putting down Laxus when we said the exact same thing?

Yeah, keep spinning it any way you want, I literally don't care, because I know exactly what you were implying and anyone with a brain knows exactly what you're implying, the only way that anyone wouldn't see what your statement is implying is if that person is illiterate or if they are suffering from mental retardation (I'm serious).
I have said time and time again that Laxus was one of the strongest in the series, all you keep saying is that he's one of the strongest in the fairy tail guild, as if that's a complement, we know this for a fact, all I'm saying is that he's one of the strongest in the series, period.

Jura would. But Natsu went DF against Zero and defeated him. To say Jura can defeat him is unknown. I can't use DF Natsu here because Jellal gave him the power energy source.

Well you finally said it. Thank You.

The proof that Mystogan wasn't hit by the attack before he went into Mist Body was that he was unscathed. That means he dodged it by a fraction of a second it exploded near him. Now the illusion clearly hit Laxus or he wouldn't have seen the "monster". You know not every magic spell has to deal damage, right? Mystogan has Illusion Magic as one of he specialties so it counts as long as it hits.

Spoiler

Skyscraper is an illusionary spell that doesn't effect anyone physically.

Okay, so I brought Mystogan in to counter another user's argument. And Mystogan is one of your top 5 favorite characters? Impressive. Besides, what did you have to relate to my comments with someone else, except trying to disprove one of your top 5 favorite characters? Are you going to go back more than 10 pages and hold me against it? It is my opinion. You can have one too and you did. Look at the your quote. Yes, Mystogan affected Laxus minimally. I think I stated it very clearly, it makes sense. You just admitted Erza was barely relevant, which is what I've been saying. When Laxus fought Natsu, he was healthly and close to full magic power. Don't lie here. Full health? As in HP? This is not a card game. This is manga/anime. You mean healthy. We replace it with stamina/endurance and Laxus clearly was not diminished of it.



Obviously, because he casted Fairy Law. I never denied that he didn't get his magic energy drained. Nobody forced him to though. He wanted to.

No this isn't a card game, but the fact is that Laxus was hit by Mystogan, he did waste magic power in his skirmish with Mystogan and in his skirmish with Erza and he was clearly stomping Natsu and Gajeel without much effort until he cast fairy law. The fact is that when he did cast it, then he lost.

I'll give you a battle scenario.
Fighting festival Laxus vs fighting festival Natsu and fighting festival Gajeel.

Restrictions: Fairy Law, outside interference, plot induced stupidity, character induced stupidity.
All combatants start with maximum health and maximum magic power.
Who wins?