One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[kkck]

Ah, something I had forgotten to comment on.. It seemed weird to me that yamato would be capable of CoC cladding but surprisingly would be unfamiliar with internal damage haki. Of course, the two belong to two completely different haki categories but it still seemed weird. I wonder if there is a difference between how luffy and yamato deal damage to kaido based on luffy having the extra advantage of internal damage.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Ah, something I had forgotten to comment on.. It seemed weird to me that yamato would be capable of CoC cladding but surprisingly would be unfamiliar with internal damage haki. Of course, the two belong to two completely different haki categories but it still seemed weird. I wonder if there is a difference between how luffy and yamato deal damage to kaido based on luffy having the extra advantage of internal damage.

I keep trying to tell folks
Yamato could can use advanced forms of COA and possible even internal destruction but the precise method of cuff removal is pretty finesse , luffy did it instinctually and again had also seen Rayleigh do it

 

[kkck]

I keep trying to tell folks
Yamato could can use advanced forms of COA and possible even internal destruction but the precise method of cuff removal is pretty finesse , luffy did it instinctually and again had also seen Rayleigh do it

The series as far as I can tell does not evidence there being a specific method of internal destruction for cuff removal. it seems like simply using the generic technique and then throwing the cuffs away before they explode. Sure, luffy had rayleigh as a frame of reference but it seems silly that yamato could have at any point simply broken the cuffs herself and simply didn't.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

The series as far as I can tell does not evidence there being a specific method of internal destruction for cuff removal. it seems like simply using the generic technique and then throwing the cuffs away before they explode. Sure, luffy had rayleigh as a frame of reference but it seems silly that yamato could have at any point simply broken the cuffs herself and simply didn't.

How would she know it sorta delays the removal/explosion tho
I’m just wondering how she would know

 

[kkck]

How would she know it sorta delays the removal/explosion tho
I’m just wondering how she would know

It doesn't delay the explosion though.

 

[albertwv]

Whats this about Kaido being weak, not able to push Luffy to his limits, and Shanks being stronger than Kaido.
So far, Oda has stated through the manga, plus various feats, that Kaido is the strongest living character in OP so far. Kaido has only been stalemated by Shanks, which we have no idea how it happened, and Big Mom which ended in a tie.

Shanks stopping Kaido getting to WB is a feat that should not be overestimated. It doesnt necessarily mean Shanks > Kaido. Kaido, WB, and Big Mom acknowledged Shanks' strength but that doesnt mean he is stronger than any of them.
How I rank the Yonko past and present:

White Beard (non sick)
Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
BB

There is a small difference in strength between the top 4 yonko but with BB seeing how he hasnt been hyped up by anyone in the manga then I still believe he is weakest Yonko. Im sure BB will be stronger soon, by absorbing more and more DFs etc, but right now he is not that strong. I like to point out that Moria singlehandely invaded BB's territory to "kill" him but Moria who holds grudge towards Kaido, has not dared challenged Kaido again. I understand that Moria is not capable of killing BB at all, but hey props to Moria for having the balls to go after BB.

 

[HereNThere]

Kaido screwed Yamato up pretty good emotionally, so it could've been another Sanji situation where he just was too afraid to try anything due to past trauma.

He wasn't even sure if the cuffs were actually explosive until Luffy took them off, so that alone could explain the hesitance.

 

[Ellenate]

The series as far as I can tell does not evidence there being a specific method of internal destruction for cuff removal. it seems like simply using the generic technique and then throwing the cuffs away before they explode. Sure, luffy had rayleigh as a frame of reference but it seems silly that yamato could have at any point simply broken the cuffs herself and simply didn't.

editor: wow, so yamato is really strong.

oda: stronger than luffy!

editor: ...why she stay on the island then?
editor: what could've possibly stopped her?

Oda: I don't know... kaido put explosives on her

editor: couldn't she take them off though?
editor: and would that even hurt her?
editor: and how did she get so strong if she's been a prisoner this whole time?


Oda:
Oda: *calls jump*
Oda: I need a new editor... this one is asking to many questions.


Jump: You mean like the other ones...?

Oda: Yeah "like the other ones" john!


(i'm calling extra bs if they were infact seastone cuffs like someone said)

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Yamato couldn’t also leave the island because she was waiting for the promised ones to free wano
Also wasn’t sure about the cuffs
Even tho imo Yamato could tank it

 

[Dabanagaga]

Whats this about Kaido being weak, not able to push Luffy to his limits, and Shanks being stronger than Kaido.
So far, Oda has stated through the manga, plus various feats, that Kaido is the strongest living character in OP so far. Kaido has only been stalemated by Shanks, which we have no idea how it happened, and Big Mom which ended in a tie.

Shanks stopping Kaido getting to WB is a feat that should not be overestimated. It doesnt necessarily mean Shanks > Kaido. Kaido, WB, and Big Mom acknowledged Shanks' strength but that doesnt mean he is stronger than any of them.
How I rank the Yonko past and present:

White Beard (non sick)
Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
BB

There is a small difference in strength between the top 4 yonko but with BB seeing how he hasnt been hyped up by anyone in the manga then I still believe he is weakest Yonko. Im sure BB will be stronger soon, by absorbing more and more DFs etc, but right now he is not that strong. I like to point out that Moria singlehandely invaded BB's territory to "kill" him but Moria who holds grudge towards Kaido, has not dared challenged Kaido again. I understand that Moria is not capable of killing BB at all, but hey props to Moria for having the balls to go after BB.

To be fair there was no implication that they fought to begin with

Shanks doesn't even seem to be the kind of an person who even fights unless he absolutely has to, he seems more so to be an diplomatic, chill person
The convo/reasoning behind it was most likely connected to the "promised war" or "void century", either way that whole shabang. Maybe they scuffed a bit, but that would be all they'd do, or so I think.

Even tho it seems like, story wise, it is implied that Shanks has the strongest, abnormal Haki in the world, as some people have said that even abstract, if one can say so, things, like time, bends to his will.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 13, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 13, 2021 ---

Yamato couldn’t also leave the island because she was waiting for the promised ones to free wano
Also wasn’t sure about the cuffs
Even tho imo Yamato could tank it

Could, would, should, doesn't matter

The reason Yamato wouldn't do that is because, well maybe because, of her feelings towads her dad.
Kaido might wanted a son, which in return made him dismiss Yamato's gender, and as that, her persona, that was the first instance where she just wanted to be loved by daddy.
Maybe one of the reasons why she chose to identify as Oden, was not just because she did admire him, but so did Kaido - even enemies can show respect and admire one another.
To be fair, she didn't believe Kaido did place explosive handcuffs.
Even now, she's still talking about "How you could do that to your own child, how could YOU take MY freedom?!"
Even now she shows some sort of stupid wishfullness of unconditional love, one way or another, and as that she may expect it from that person too.

More likely she didn't break them was more so due to her emotional chains towards that place and who lives there.
Also, maybe the "promised day" as also the reason.
But it would be kinda funny if she did have this unconditional love, which even she couldn't explain if she wanted to beyond "it just is".
Maybe on Kaido's deathbed he'll ask for forgivness from her, and thats where Blackbeard swoops in. No way he'd miss Kaido's DF.

 

[albertwv]

I just mentioned that we have no idea what happened between Shanks and Kaido, but I would like to add onto that a possibility.
Reading chapter 1001 when Kaido thinks back about the people who were able to harm him: Roger, WB, Shanks etc. Shanks was one of those few.
So what if Shanks fought Kaido, maybe just one attack, a small skirmish that made Kaido acknowledge Shanks' strength. If not then what other occassion would Kaido and Shanks have fought?
I still havent changed my mind that Kaido > Shanks

 

[Dabanagaga]

I just mentioned that we have no idea what happened between Shanks and Kaido, but I would like to add onto that a possibility.
Reading chapter 1001 when Kaido thinks back about the people who were able to harm him: Roger, WB, Shanks etc. Shanks was one of those few.
So what if Shanks fought Kaido, maybe just one attack, a small skirmish that made Kaido acknowledge Shanks' strength. If not then what other occassion would Kaido and Shanks have fought?
I still havent changed my mind that Kaido > Shanks

Pure Haki alone probably, IF they did not fight
But when you think that Oden was liked by Shanks, Roger, whole Rogers crew in general, and Kaido is responsible for fucking Oden over... They MUST of danced a bit, question is when.
As for Kaido>Shanks, who the fuck knows.
Rocks had him as an apprentice for a reason, but then again Shanks's haki seems to be literally abnormally strong, to the point that just by flexing it a bit he damaged physicall objects, so far seems like he's above everyone when it comes to it.
And Haki does seem to be the main tier ascending requirement.
Discussing characters without quantifiable feats is hard chore to do.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Also I’m sorry but Yamato is putting katakuri in the blender imo

 

[HereNThere]

So what if Shanks fought Kaido, maybe just one attack, a small skirmish that made Kaido acknowledge Shanks' strength. If not then what other occasion would Kaido and Shanks have fought?

Probably. Honestly, at this point, it really seems like the Yonkou mainly kept to their own domiciles.

Big Mom and Kaido clearly hadn't seen each other since they ditched Xebec.

WB hadn't seen Shanks since his apprentice days according to his words when they met up to speak about Ace and BB.

Given Marco's reaction to Big Mom and Pero's reaction to Marco, they seemed to have clashed before, so they might have been the only two Yonkou crews to do so.

So with that in mind, I think it's highly likely that Shanks and Kaido had never met before he intercepted him at Marineford.

 

[Fox666]

Strongest means - Able to lift heavy weight or physically demanding task ; Able to withstand
Great force or pressure.

Maybe in English, but Japanese has a more vague meaning of strength

I.e. Kaido's blast breath definitely counts as "strength"

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 13, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 13, 2021 ---

The series as far as I can tell does not evidence there being a specific method of internal destruction for cuff removal. it seems like simply using the generic technique and then throwing the cuffs away before they explode. Sure, luffy had rayleigh as a frame of reference but it seems silly that yamato could have at any point simply broken the cuffs herself and simply didn't.

The cuffs were not properly explained

But it was clear that it's not just a matter of strength or speed, internal destruction is essential in removing the cuffs

There's even a panel of Rayleigh removing Camie's necklace with his hand coated in black Haki

I think the internal destruction damages the components of the cuffs that detect if they were removed or not, delaying the explosion

 

[Core D. Roy]

Yamato could easily have advanced Conquerors and not understand the intricacies of advanced Armament flow.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Yamato could easily have advanced Conquerors and not understand the intricacies of advanced Armament flow.

Yamato can already use a form of advanced armament tho

 

[hokageji]

Yamato can already use a form of advanced armament tho

then the question is why wasnt she able to break-through the shackles?

 

[kkck]

The cuffs were not properly explained

But it was clear that it's not just a matter of strength or speed, internal destruction is essential in removing the cuffs

There's even a panel of Rayleigh removing Camie's necklace with his hand coated in black Haki

I think the internal destruction damages the components of the cuffs that detect if they were removed or not, delaying the explosion

Ok, I could buy that rayleigh would be able to pull that off. As in, him targeting the components in the cuffs to slow down the mechanism and throw them away... but luffy? REAAALLY? Are you telling me luffy did this on purpose at least once (I am conceding dumb luck could be plausible on the first try but not the time he removed yamato's cuffs)? The first time we saw this at the auction house the gang could not even see what happened. One moment rayleigh grabbed the necklace and in an instant it exploded elsewhere. Luffy is a blunt instrument. He isn't going to target the mechanism which controls the explosion to delay it. The bit with the exploding necklace and cuffs is super simple. Break them, throw them away super fast.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Ok, I could buy that rayleigh would be able to pull that off. As in, him targeting the components in the cuffs to slow down the mechanism and throw them away... but luffy? REAAALLY? Are you telling me luffy did this on purpose at least once (I am conceding dumb luck could be plausible on the first try but not the time he removed yamato's cuffs)? The first time we saw this at the auction house the gang could not even see what happened. One moment rayleigh grabbed the necklace and in an instant it exploded elsewhere. Luffy is a blunt instrument. He isn't going to target the mechanism which controls the explosion to delay it. The bit with the exploding necklace and cuffs is super simple. Break them, throw them away super fast.

Luffy ability to learn new combat techniques and utilize them in various scenarios have been highlighted over the course of 1000 chapters.

He's a battle genius