One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[catagon87]

It's difficult to judge, Kaido was also weaker than he's now ! He was not yet a Yonko at that time.
Oden even ask Kaido to become stronger !

Would Oden, who was at his prime at that time could do the same feat to Kaido at his prime ? We will never have reply.

I think one thing to note is that it's been heavily emphasized that to grow powerful in OP you have to fight powerful people. You can only train yourself so far. So I think people such as Whitebeard, Oden, Roger, Garp, etc.. probably peaked out at some point when the amount of enemies available to "grow" against went down. It's also been implied that you can go down in strength if you don't do any self-maintenance (Moriah for example).

So basically I assume Kaido is quite a bit stronger now than he was when he fought Oden, but the amount he could grow and his overall potential are much less than say, Luffy's potential growth between Marineford and Dressrosa. Luffy went up in strength several orders of magnitude over a two year period, and I suspect Kaido probably has increased less than one order of magnitude over twenty years given that he has very few on the planet who could challenge him.

It's like expecting a UFC fighter to get stronger by fighting middle schoolers.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Oden did it in his weakest form while zoro did it in his strongest form that why I see both scars as a similar feat. Plus big mom warn kaido in his dragon form to dodge zoro Emma attack which says something IMO. Now I don’t think zoro is stronger than oden yet but I do think that damage output is similar.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 16, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 16, 2021 ---

Like how can it now be lol it doesn’t matter it was for a second like the guy held arguably the strongest attack shown on one piece just to save the rest of the SN

Kaido fighting skills flunctuate but his actual durability remains kinda constant in all forms
There’s nothing to imply that his that there’s a difference in durability in his dragon or hybrid form
And once again kaido is still super spooked by oden strength so really it doesn’t matter

Kaido was 38/39 when he fought oden , he was very very close to his peak already

 

[albertwv]

I believe younger Kaido > Oden when they fought. Yes we saw Oden scar him and temporarily knock him out of his Dragon form, but Kaido did not use his Hybrid form to take on Oden. We know Hybrid form > Animal form. Don't attempt to say otherwise as we've seen plenty of examples of Hybird Zoans being stronger than human and animal forms. Look at all CP9 members. To add onto Kaido > Oden, it seem to me that it only took 1 regular swing to knock out Oden even if Oden was distracted it still means Kaido was able to recover quickly from the slash and knock out Oden.
Kaido has gotten stronger since 20 years ago, maybe not by much but still stronger. Im sure if Oden was alive he would also be Yonko level.

Katakuri having ACoA, doubt it, he already has ACoO/FS. Oda gave him enough with that. Katakuri mentioned there were levels among CoA, which may mean alot of things. I think he meant levels as in his level of hardness was stronger than Luffys at that time. To add to that, he may also be aware of ACoA, his mother has it and im sure hes encountered it before or whatever hes a New World veteran so he knows about it but I dont think he can wield it.
I agree that Kata > WCI Luffy/Act 1 Wano Luffy. Kata let Luffy win that battle by impaling himself and even encouraging Luffy to get up and finally by allowing Luffy to take the win by him falling backwards. Kata dealt way more damaged than what Luffy dealt.

It would have been cool to see Luffy have fought another YC level like Jack or Queen.

 

[LadyVados]

How is King > Marco? Marco got 2v1'd, held them for hours and he's still not down.

I don't know what's up with that character, he seems to be somewhat trolling. He was seemingly down for the count, but got up soon after, healed Zoro and decided to sit back? Weird guy

Marco honestly seems to be the strongest Yonko commander.

The man can't even walk

 

[grey matter]

The man can't even walk

He was down for a while, after fighting a 2v1 for quite a while

HE later came back and blocked King's attack

Spoiler

Then he decided to sit back after healing Zoro, since he's trolling/not motivated. He wants to leave the rest to Sanji and Zoro
But clearly he can continue fighting if he wishes to

It wasn't that he couldn't walk later.
He was spacing out/ having flashbacks/dreaming.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

I believe younger Kaido > Oden when they fought. Yes we saw Oden scar him and temporarily knock him out of his Dragon form, but Kaido did not use his Hybrid form to take on Oden. We know Hybrid form > Animal form. Don't attempt to say otherwise as we've seen plenty of examples of Hybird Zoans being stronger than human and animal forms. Look at all CP9 members. To add onto Kaido > Oden, it seem to me that it only took 1 regular swing to knock out Oden even if Oden was distracted it still means Kaido was able to recover quickly from the slash and knock out Oden.
Kaido has gotten stronger since 20 years ago, maybe not by much but still stronger. Im sure if Oden was alive he would also be Yonko level.

Katakuri having ACoA, doubt it, he already has ACoO/FS. Oda gave him enough with that. Katakuri mentioned there were levels among CoA, which may mean alot of things. I think he meant levels as in his level of hardness was stronger than Luffys at that time. To add to that, he may also be aware of ACoA, his mother has it and im sure hes encountered it before or whatever hes a New World veteran so he knows about it but I dont think he can wield it.
I agree that Kata > WCI Luffy/Act 1 Wano Luffy. Kata let Luffy win that battle by impaling himself and even encouraging Luffy to get up and finally by allowing Luffy to take the win by him falling backwards. Kata dealt way more damaged than what Luffy dealt.

It would have been cool to see Luffy have fought another YC level like Jack or Queen.

We see it all the time in media , clean unawares attack will do a lot of people in
Also oden was already super exhausted after fighting kaido
Oda hid his other forms for narrative purposes

 

[LadyVados]

He was down for a while, after fighting a 2v1 for quite a while

HE later came back and blocked King's attack

Spoiler

Then he decided to sit back after healing Zoro, since he's trolling/not motivated. He wants to leave the rest to Sanji and Zoro
But clearly he can continue fighting if he wishes to

It wasn't that he couldn't walk later.
He was spacing out/ having flashbacks/dreaming.

Wasn't Izu carrying him away ?

 

[XXGenesis]

Kaido’s whole fear of Oden stems from,

Wano’s Daimoyo, Underworld, Samurai would have defeated the Animal kingdom when Oden returned initially.

Oden if he wasn’t dancing around for years setting himself up for his death, and actually lived to current day. would have grown stronger than what we see Kaido to be now. Oden’s potential was greater than Kaido’s.

Instead Oden challenges Kaido with only his scabbards, their plan is leaked by a mole; Oden hurts Kaido in the battle but is tricked and defeated. If only Oden just attacked with all of Wano when he had the chance. He would have won and the world of OP would be very different

 

[grey matter]

Wasn't Izu carrying him away ?

Yes, cause he was spacing out/ dreaming. The guy just last chapter blocked an attack from king just fine, before healing Zoro. He took no damage last chapter, no reason for him to be crippled now

He's shown to be unserious/trolling the entire arc.

 

[LaGOAT]

Yes, cause he was spacing out/ dreaming. The guy just last chapter blocked an attack from king just fine, before healing Zoro. He took no damage last chapter, no reason for him to be crippled now

He's shown to be unserious/trolling the entire arc.

There is a theory that he might come help luffy Yamato and momonosuke

 

[grey matter]

There is a theory that he might come help luffy Yamato and momonosuke

Wouldn't by surprised.

The guy is acting weird the entire arc. Seems like there is more to his presence in the arc than just what was shown so far

I want so see him fight seriously, instead of the troll face he had given us so far. Like in marineford arc

 

[albertwv]

We see it all the time in media , clean unawares attack will do a lot of people in
Also oden was already super exhausted after fighting kaido
Oda hid his other forms for narrative purposes

So Oden was exhausted after fighting Kaido is the reason he lost to Kaido therefore Kaido > Oden.

Kaido’s whole fear of Oden stems from,

Wano’s Daimoyo, Underworld, Samurai would have defeated the Animal kingdom when Oden returned initially.

Oden if he wasn’t dancing around for years setting himself up for his death, and actually lived to current day. would have grown stronger than what we see Kaido to be now. Oden’s potential was greater than Kaido’s.

Instead Oden challenges Kaido with only his scabbards, their plan is leaked by a mole; Oden hurts Kaido in the battle but is tricked and defeated. If only Oden just attacked with all of Wano when he had the chance. He would have won and the world of OP would be very different

Kaido did fear if all of Wano got together Kaido would have a huge problem and harder time to deal with, but he didnt say he wouldve lost.

 

[XXGenesis]

So Oden was exhausted after fighting Kaido is the reason he lost to Kaido therefore Kaido > Oden.



Kaido did fear if all of Wano got together Kaido would have a huge problem and harder time to deal with, but he didnt say he wouldve lost.

Kaido’s mentioned he was at a disadvantage, Oden & Wano would of had the numbers; It would have been a difficult battle(faith in his crew’s power).

We are watching a numbers game play out right now. Even if Oden was knocked out by Kaido. He would of had the support of Hyogoro, those samurai locked up etc to hide him so he can recover and continue the battle..The numbers, King & Queen wouldn’t run rampart.

Wano would of most likely won, Kaido also didn’t have his gifter army.

overall as an individual Oden IMO had more potential as a conqueror than Kaido.

 

[kkck]

Oden did mention he had just about peaked at the time he fought kaido. And it's very likely kaido has grown stronger since then. Oden might or not have been stronger than kaido back then but it doesn't seem like oden having more potential than kaido is likely. It's also worth noting that oden overwhelemed kaido but kaido didn't exactly get the chance to go all out. Oden landed a rather devastating hit on kaido's dragon form but after oden was defeated by a single hit from kaido AND kaido didn't even have to use his hybrid form.

 

[Gallon]

I'm not sure how I'd compare the two. Kaido fights like a dumbass, initially taking all of his opponents' blows in his dragon form simply because he believes they can't do shit to him; Oden was advantageous in this aspect, because it allowed him to land a nigh-decisive blow on Kaido.

If it were a serious, Hybrid Kaido from the get-go, I assume he would have won in a direct confrontation. But then again, Kaido wasn't the first opponent Oden fought that day, so if both fighters were "fresh" and not messing around, it's unclear to me as to how it would have ended.

 

[grey matter]

Meh, Kaido would've mid diff'd Oden at worst

The fact that Oden was strong enough to injure Kaido and give him difficulty is commendable, but let's be real, he has no chance to win in a 1v1.

Kaido's reputation is that he can never be defeated in a 1v1

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Man this oden downplay is crazy lmaoooo
Oda hid the form to create later hype
The way kaido respects oden strength is crazy
He’s fought a ton of poweful guys
Guess who scarred him of all the beasts he fought ( well the others could )

We had multiple Yonkou commander level guys jumping kaido ( suulong Inu and neko , denjiro , kawamatsu, ashura Doji ) and 3 decently strong dude and kaido remarked all 8 of them are not even comparable in strength to oden

Kaido still reckons that oden is the only samurai who is still capable of killing him if it comes down to it

also Gahdamn oden is likely the last person that defeated and beat kaido , cause vivre card states the last person to get kaido this excited in a fight is oden up until fighting luffy

 

[Crimson Ice]

Thats before he had advance CoC I’m talking about current G4 luffy with CoC

No, I'm talking about when Luffy got advanced CoC. Luffy didn't magically lose the ability to activate G4.

 

[Pirate Queen]

No, I'm talking about when Luffy got advanced CoC. Luffy didn't magically lose the ability to activate G4.

This last chapter was the first time we've seen Luffy use G4 was advanced coc against kaido

 

[Ellenate]

Man this oden downplay is crazy lmaoooo

*rubs chin*

Kaido did take Oden out with one hit... that's weaksauce if you ask me.

and-

Kaido got right back up from oden's hit like nothing.



---

Oden is trash and would've lost versus Kaido even without the cheap trick.