One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

I am not sure of what your point is here. I also have not said that big mom was using cladding since she was a child. Big mom was portrayed as monstrously strong as a child but she wasn't portrayed as straight up invulnerable.

she smashed a sword with a raw hand, her skin has been iron tough from the jump , she’s had high invulnerability since her youth

 

[Nie Li]

she smashed a sword with a raw hand, her skin has been iron tough from the jump , she’s had high invulnerability since her youth

If that durability isn't somehow haki-related at all, how do we explain her invulnerability wearing off entirely for a second when she scrapped her knee?

 

[kkck]

she smashed a sword with a raw hand, her skin has been iron tough from the jump , she’s had high invulnerability since her youth

Ah, I had forgotten about that. In this case I would think that rather than her skin being naturally steel like, this is more likely due to haki shenanigans. Probably not conqueror haki though but rather standard armor haki. Mostly because cladding is way higher up the skill tree than normal armor haki but I guess we can't rule out subsconcios cladding. Or maybe it just triggered when she was throwing tantrums... Otherwise there is no conceivable explanation for her defense to wane when she is anguish.

 

[XXGenesis]

So WB never took a scar on his back, why didn’t WB possess this Cladding also??

 

[Nie Li]

So WB never took a scar on his back, why didn’t WB possess this Cladding also??

Probably because he died pre-TS and because he was old. He may also just simply not be a natural-born haki monster like Linlin and use his hard-earned cladding in more focused ways together with his CoO.

I honestly don't expect Shanks either to just walk through any attack like Linlin and Kaido even if he's a match for them and obviously has CoC cladding. Their style is likely to simply be different with his own set of strengths and weaknesses.

Kaido has the race card other than just haki cladding and he still seemed easier to pierce with swords than Linlin. He just regens everything and is further strengthened by his zoan.

 

[grey matter]

Kaido has the race card other than just haki cladding and he still seemed easier to pierce with swords than Linlin.

Agreed generally with the post, but this isn't true IMO.

Kaido's entire shtick was that he cannot be hurt, so he's presumably harder to damage than BM.

It was just that Kaido faced attacks from those having advanced armament or advanced Conqueror's haki. Or those who can bypass defenses, like Law or Killer.
While we saw BM no selling slashes from fodder and hakiless Brook.
They are completely different scenarios.

 

[M3J]

Kaido's entire shtick was that he cannot be hurt, so he's presumably harder to damage than BM.

I thought his strength is that he can absorb pain like no other and keep fighting. He keeps taking damage after damage and doesn't even seem to need a moment to recollect himself.

 

[XXGenesis]

The whole…Brute Force can overpower Haki *Luffy vs Boa Sisters; Boundman Vs Katakuri
&
Haki Vs Haki clash, where the stronger Haki wins.

ACoA never being illustrated in a fight yet is the main function on how Luffy was able to start To hurt Kaido.

Certain Ancient Zoans knowing Haki but not defending at all just using during Zoan durability.

With no extra content to help answer these questions it’s left vague & multiple POV are formed

 

[Fox666]

If that durability isn't somehow haki-related at all, how do we explain her invulnerability wearing off entirely for a second when she scrapped her knee?

The same way Kyoshiro's face changed due to his emotions, or Wanze can produce ramen from his nostrils.

 

[Nie Li]

The same way Kyoshiro's face changed due to his emotions, or Wanze can produce ramen from his nostrils.

I'm sorry, but throwing the ball into a different court isn't convincing to me.

The Wanze thing was actually explained in an SBS. The Kyoshiro thing may or may not be further explained in the future, but it's unrelated either way to the topic at hand.

Big Mom's durability makes sense for it to be haki related, no matter how weird it all is. On the other hand, nothing about Capone's plan and BM's durability going down so drastically that even just falling to the ground makes her bleed makes sense if it's not haki related. Further proof is that her coating wearing off is accompanied by her devastating CoC cry wave (thus her haki being diverted/focused into it).

 

[Crimson Ice]

No Luffy is not a 10 in speed. He is not the benchmark for speed...Kizaru would be the benchmark; Or Brook or Sanji who have raw high speed movement. While Luffy’s Snakeman attack has high raw attack speed; He does not move his body, only his fist at those high speeds.

I’m the member that suggested the idea to assign numbers to stats….So I say, lol jk. but I will not agree with a 10 score for Luffy when there are characters & feats better than his own….I did suggest this, but the hardest part is getting everybody to agree on a shared metric….10 is max; top of verse;



Maybe your are misinterpreting Durability for Stamina.Ex. Durability simply is how hard & resistant to damage something is;

Zoro is only human, he can be shot, bruised, pierced like any other human…Roof Piece he sacrificed breaking all the bones in his body for those few seconds of blocking. He had the stamina to continue fighting in that condition, but not the durability to not have all bones broken.

Sanji is a genetically enhanced human, he will not take damage from normal bullets, blunt force, or piercing attacks his skin is way more durable than normal humans..

Stamina, is the capacity someone has to continue to preform even after exhausting or sustaining injuries. Not the same as durability.

Until any of them can blitz Kaido they are not getting a higher rating than Luffy.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Kizaru has not shown speed faster than what Sanji or Luffy has.

His speed has never been highlighted. Not yet. Even Old Rayliegh was keeping up with him to a degree.

 

[Lord Traffy Law]

Kizaru has not shown speed faster than what Sanji or Luffy has.

His speed has never been highlighted. Not yet. Even Old Rayliegh was keeping up with him to a degree.

Combat and hand to hand speed are different from speed speed

 

[Pirate Queen]

Combat and hand to hand speed are different from speed speed

Agreed. So can you show me a speed speed feat from Kizaru that eclipses what Sanji or Luffy has shown? Because I can't find one.

 

[Fox666]

I'm sorry, but throwing the ball into a different court isn't convincing to me.

The Wanze thing was actually explained in an SBS. The Kyoshiro thing may or may not be further explained in the future, but it's unrelated either way to the topic at hand.

Big Mom's durability makes sense for it to be haki related, no matter how weird it all is. On the other hand, nothing about Capone's plan and BM's durability going down so drastically that even just falling to the ground makes her bleed makes sense if it's not haki related. Further proof is that her coating wearing off is accompanied by her devastating CoC cry wave (thus her haki being diverted/focused into it).

Big Mom's has steel-like skin, it's just how her body is.

But her body becomes weak when she gets too emotional.

There's isn't much more to it.

 

[Nie Li]

Big Mom's has steel-like skin, it's just how her body is.

But her body becomes weak when she gets too emotional.

There's isn't much more to it.

Well, I don't intend to change your mind about it, but if the options are:

- There isn't much more to it. It is like it is and it doesn't matter if it doesn't make sense.

or

- It's haki related, probably subconscious haki cladding since she was a kid (and we already have cases of untrained advanced CoO in a little child (Aisa)), and its working is logical.

I personally prefer option two.

 

[XXGenesis]

Until any of them can blitz Kaido they are not getting a higher rating than Luffy.

Kinda unfair measurement when some characters will never get to fight Kaido. Luffy has gotten blitz’s by Kaido repeatedly.

Sanji imo is just as fast as Luffy. Brook is very light On his foot & Oda has said he would win a foot race amongst the SHP. Kizaru is fast, there are levels to laser beams obviously, Kizaru shoots the strongest & fastest.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Kizaru is fast, there are levels to laser beams obviously, Kizaru shoots the strongest & fastest.

Okay your going to have to start proving some of these claims. This isn't even INSINUATED

 

[XXGenesis]

Okay your going to have to start proving some of these claims. This isn't even INSINUATED

When asked to do the same you refused, jump topic points and/or worst. So no I don’t have to prove my claims to you. Let’s keep our discussion limited…

Now as to what I meant, isn’t stated as a fact.
But Yes I do think it is Insinuated.

Pacifista lasers or Queen’s aren’t as strong as Franky’s laser, and none of them compare to Kizaru’s….Vegapunk invented Laser tech because of Kizaru’s fruit. Kizaru isn’t limited like the cyborgs.

 

[really_jonny]

Kizaru's Yata no Kagami technique gives him the fastest speed blitz in the manga, the problem is that he has to load. He can transform into light matter to dodge attacks and move with speed, as we saw against Whitebeard. I think he's the only one of the admirals in Marineford that in a fair x1 the WB wouldn't have a chance. His pure body speed is equivalent to that of Rayleigh, one of the most powerful characters in the work and top 3 best swordsmen in the world. I hope Kizaru hasn't awakened his fruit, that would be too much of an broken.

In terms of hype, he is the fastest.