One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[nik87]

Other swordsman are not as swords focused as Mihawk/Zoro/Ryuma

Is this based on manga or based on headcanon?

 

[Aliocha]

Did Roger have a black blade like Mihawk?
The two are different generations, there is no direct way to compare them but Yoru speaks in Mihawk's favor.

Roger fought with Prime Whitebead in the past, and it was your rival. This is good enough for me, and we don't know anything about the black blades yet

In context, I think Mihawk meant that becoming Pirate King means surpassing him and more.

And is that not accurate? On theory, the Pirate King will compete against Whitebeard or Kaido, who are stronger than Mihawk.

Exactly, become pirate king means surpass all them

 

[Pirate Queen]

Is this based on manga or based on headcanon?

Mihawk is called the WSS
Ryuma is called the Sword God
Zoro is aiming for WSS and shon interest in WSS

No one else is aiming to be the strongest swordsman.

Do you not know the difference between headcanon and canon anymore?

 

[nik87]

Mihawk is called the WSS
Ryuma is called the Sword God
Zoro is aiming for WSS and shon interest in WSS
No one else is aiming to be the strongest swordsman.
Do you not know the difference between headcanon and canon anymore?

Why is Zoro pulling things off with a scythe or barehanded which he pulls off with swords? Doesnt seem too focused on a sword...
Your argument is simply headcanon, if they arent sword focused why arent they using axes or something else?

 

[Pirate Queen]

Why is Zoro pulling things off with a scythe or barehanded which he pulls off with swords? Doesnt seem too focused on a sword...
Your argument is simply headcanon, if they arent sword focused why arent they using axes or something else?

You pick one tiny incident, and the weapon in question is a bladed weapon? Cute.

Name another person more focused on being the best swordsman than Zoro.

You can't. You just don't know the difference between headcanon and canon anymore.

 

[nik87]

You pick one tiny incident, and the weapon in question is a bladed weapon? Cute.
Name another person more focused on being the best swordsman than Zoro.
You can't. You just don't know the difference between headcanon and canon anymore.

There ya have it, I give you an example and you dont like it...
Zoro needs any bladed weapon to pull off what he pulls off with swords, not so sword focused as you claim.
He even pulls off things barehanded which he pulls off with swords.

Other swordsmen being less sword focused than Zoro/Mihawk/Ryuma is your headcanon, manga has nowhere stated such.
You are telling me it's not your headcanon? Provide evidence from the manga for that in that case.

 

[Pirate Queen]

There ya have it, I give you an example and you dont like it...
Zoro needs any bladed weapon to pull off what he pulls off with swords, not so sword focused as you claim.
He even pulls off things barehanded which he pulls off with swords.

Other swordsmen being less sword focused than Zoro/Mihawk/Ryuma is your headcanon, manga has nowhere stated such.
You are telling me it's not your headcanon? Provide evidence from the manga for that in that case.

He's a 3 sword style user and used a 3 sword style to end the fight and your goi ng to use that to say Zoro isn't committed to being a swordsman?

Name another swordsman that is as committed as them. If it's my headcanon, you can give me names. Name some one. One person that aims to be the greatest swordsman outside of them.

 

[nik87]

He's a 3 sword style user and used a 3 sword style to end the fight and your goi ng to use that to say Zoro isn't committed to being a swordsman?
Name another swordsman that is as committed as them. If it's my headcanon, you can give me names. Name some one. One person that aims to be the greatest swordsman outside of them.

It seems like he was 2 swords+1 scythe style user. Is lack of swords stopping him from performing exactly the same?
I cant give you any names for who else wants to be WSS, still your headcanon.
Everyone else fighting with a sword is a swordsman and is in direct comparison to Zoro, whether they wish to be WSS or not.
As Zoro himself said it: If it's a swordfight, I'm up for it. He doesnt care whether someone wants to be WSS or not, he will still challenge them.
People have room to wiggle around until Black Blade gets explained, after that, if it is what I think it is, there will be no room for headcanon.

 

[Holt]

Honestly, I can't possibly see Mihawks being on par with Rogers. At all. Roger was an absolute monster. Imo, Mihawk/Rayleigh/Shanks/EoS Zoro is the debate here. The fact that Roger didn't awaken his blade imo means nothing. Luffy has defeated two powerful awakened users (DD and Katakuri) even though he hasn't awakened his. Zoro beat shadow Ryuuma who was wielding Shisui. Yoru being a permanent blade blade means nothing tbh.

On Mihawk vs Shanks, Mihawk holds the title, but as far as we know, the battles between him and Shanks were inconclusive. It goes both ways. At the end of the day, neither have decidedly defeated the other so that means they always drew or the win/lose ratio is the same. Mihawk was also someone that actively sought out stronger fighters. Imho, it doesn't matter if Mihawk is the WSS and Shanks is a Yonko. When they last talked about this, Shanks asked if Mihawks came to settle the score; in other words- there was still no clear superior fighter and Mihawks replied saying "As if I'd come to settle the score with a one-armed man" Mihawk also acknowledges the score is unsettled so there's no superior fighter however, he is no longer willing to do that either out of pride or because he thinks Shanks is weaker. This is pretty much the most accurate information about both of them, at least going by their last known status. Mihawk could have fought one-armed Shanks once more to prove he is indeed the superior one, and Shanks also believed he would have no problems fighting Mihawk with one-arm. I'm more of a Shanks fan and based on general hype I personally believe Shanks is stronger but at the end of the day, all we have is both characters acknowledging that as at their last battles, they were still equal.

 

[nik87]

Honestly, I can't possibly see Mihawks being on par with Rogers. At all. Roger was an absolute monster.

Did Roger defend an entire country singlehandedly like the Sword God who had a black blade?

Yoru being a permanent blade blade means nothing tbh.

If it is the peak of CoA it means Roger's CoA<Mihawk's and Ryuma's.

 

[Pirate Queen]

It seems like he was 2 swords+1 scythe style user. Is lack of swords stopping him from performing exactly the same?
I cant give you any names for who else wants to be WSS, still your headcanon.
Everyone else fighting with a sword is a swordsman and is in direct comparison to Zoro, whether they wish to be WSS or not.
As Zoro himself said it: If it's a swordfight, I'm up for it. He doesnt care whether someone wants to be WSS or not, he will still challenge them.
People have room to wiggle around until Black Blade gets explained, after that, if it is what I think it is, there will be no room for headcanon.

So you got no names lol. Someone else wants to be the WSS other than Zoro lol.

Please tell us who.

You throw around the word headcanon like it's your job. Especially when you are backed into a corner.

Zoro is the most dedicated to being the strongest swordsman in the manga and the only one so far with that goal. Lie to me all you want, but why lie to yourself?

Anyone else think Zoro being the most dedicated swordsman aiming to be the WSS is my head canon? Or is it a manga fact? Or does him wielding a scyth one time change all this? Lol

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Apr 12, 2020 ---

If it is the peak of CoA it means Roger's CoA<Mihawk's and Ryuma's.

Which doesnt mean Mihawk > Roger

 

[nik87]

So you got no names lol. Someone else wants to be the WSS other than Zoro lol.
Please tell us who.

I cant give you any names for who else wants to be WSS, still your headcanon.

You throw around the word headcanon like it's your job. Especially when you are backed into a corner.

I throw that word around when you use something that manga never stated such as others not being sword focused like those who want to be WSS.

Zoro is the most dedicated to being the strongest swordsman in the manga and the only one so far with that goal. Lie to me all you want, but why lie to yourself?

Why is he using a scythe then if he is so dedicated to a sword?

Anyone else think Zoro being the most dedicated swordsman aiming to be the WSS is my head canon? Or is it a manga fact? Or does him wielding a scyth one time change all this? Lol

Is not wanting to be WSS stopping you from getting stronger as swordsman?

Which doesnt mean Mihawk > Roger

Yes, it doesnt mean that Mihawk>Roger but it doesnt mean that Roger>Mihawk but it sure as hell means that Mihawk's CoA>ROger's CoA, if it ends up being what I think it is. We would have a fact that Mihawk is better than Roger in something while no facts that Roger is better than Mihawk in anything.

 

[Pirate Queen]

If I'm using headcanon name another person who is aiming to be the WSS. If you cannot provide a single name, it isn't head canon but a fact.

I said only Zoro the only one committed enough to go after the title. You say that head canon when it is actually a fact.

So again, give a name

 

[nik87]

If I'm using headcanon name another person who is aiming to be the WSS. If you cannot provide a single name, it isn't head canon but a fact.
I said only Zoro the only one committed enough to go after the title. You say that head canon when it is actually a fact.
So again, give a name

If Shanks suddenly wishes to be WSS will he be stronger because of that?

 

[HereNThere]

If it is the peak of CoA it means Roger's CoA<Mihawk's and Ryuma's.

Unless blackening is revealed to be related to the internal destruction, which is the highest form of haki currently, that isn't confirmed and isn't the case.

And if Rayleigh (and Luffy) know internal destruction, it's highly likely Roger knew it as well.

 

[nik87]

Unless blackening is revealed to be related to the internal destruction, which is the highest form of haki currently, that isn't confirmed and isn't the case.

And if Rayleigh (and Luffy) know internal destruction, it's highly likely Roger knew it as well.

I bet Kokuto reveal will clear it up.
And internal destruction seems useless especially for swordsmen when even swordsmen who can use it have no use for it...
There may be plenty of people with internal destruction, there are only 2 Kokutos in history.

 

[Pirate Queen]

If Shanks suddenly wishes to be WSS will he be stronger because of that?

Not even the point that was made.

If Shanks or any swordsman doesnt commit themselves to living by the way of the sword like Ryuma, Mihawk, or Zoro... Shanks will never achieve a black sword. No one will, which is the point. Which is why we only have 2 black blades to date.

We have not met a single person as committed to being the best swordsman other than Zoro. No one else has stated it, he has no rivals, no one even cares about black blades unless you are Zoro. That's a fact, backed by the Manga. In all of Marineford, Mihawk's Yoru wasn't even noted once. Not a single time, even by Vista who was possibly the 2nd strongest swordsman at marineford.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Apr 12, 2020 ---

Unless blackening is revealed to be related to the internal destruction, which is the highest form of haki currently, that isn't confirmed and isn't the case.

And if Rayleigh (and Luffy) know internal destruction, it's highly likely Roger knew it as well.

Fucking this! Yes, exactly. Luffy confirmed has the highest tier of CoA to date.

 

[nik87]

If Shanks or any swordsman doesnt commit themselves to living by the way of the sword like Ryuma, Mihawk, or Zoro... Shanks will never achieve a black sword. No one will, which is the point. Which is why we only have 2 black blades to date.

We have not met a single person as committed to being the best swordsman other than Zoro. No one else has stated it, he has no rivals, no one even cares about black blades unless you are Zoro. That's a fact, backed by the Manga. In all of Marineford, Mihawk's Yoru wasn't even noted once. Not a single time, even by Vista who was possibly the 2nd strongest swordsman at marineford.

If Shanks, Rayleigh, Oden, Roger commit themself to the way of the sword and occasionally the way of a scythe, will they forge a black blade if it turns out that Black Blade is simply the highest level of CoA achievable even without committing yourself to a sword and occasionally a scythe?

 

[Holt]

Did Roger defend an entire country singlehandedly like the Sword God who had a black blade?

If it is the peak of CoA it means Roger's CoA<Mihawk's and Ryuma's.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. You're speculating that having a black blade somehow makes Mihawk stronger than Roger? Same for Ryuma? If so, I'm not sure there's anything else to say XD

 

[HereNThere]

I bet Kokuto reveal will clear it up.
And internal destruction seems useless especially for swordsmen when even swordsmen who can use it have no use for it...
There may be plenty of people with internal destruction, there are only 2 Kokutos in history.

It will, which is why it's irresponsible to make claims before any sort of evidence has been revealed.

Same could be said for any high tier without a blackened sword. What's the point of blackening a sword when I could, seemingly, get the same affect by temporarily applying haki to my weapon? Especially in cases when you already have a Supreme Grade sword? There really be no reason for someone like Whitebeard and, potentially, Shanks to go any higher because they already have the highest quality sword without blackening it.

There are only two people because we've only seen 2 people. That doesn't mean that there are not others out there. I wouldn't be surprised if, after the introduction of the concept, we may be seeing more people with blackened blades as we get closer to the end of the series. Shiryu may be a candidate to get one. Vista could've achieved it recently. We don't know.