One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

goldb

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Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

  • For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
  • Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
  • Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
  • We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

  1. Shanks v Mihawk
  2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
  3. Zoro > Luffy
  4. Zoro v Sanji
  5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
  6. Mihawk's rank within the story
  7. Law having CoC currently.
  8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.
 
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thedude

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Thank you for reinforcing my argument with Cracker.
He had trouble against a guy who had 4 attack sources while Zoro defends with 3 most 2. Lucci doesnt use Yontoryu style to overwhelm Zoro.
Asura Zoro claps Lucci easily lol, they only look tough against Luffy who has no means of clapping them in one hit like Zoro.
I didn't reinforce your argument. Luffy beat a Swordsman, something you say he doesn't/can't do. This Swordsman was a Yonko Commander, stronger than anyone Zoro has ever faced.

I don't even understand "4 attack sources while Zoro defends with 3"...english please.

Cracker fought with a sword, and he created super tough golems with their own swords. He attacked Luffy with 8 swords at a time and was powerful enough to take a Gear 3 haki fist and not be hurt. A guy so strong the WG didn't even have his real face for his bounty.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

The only difference between Lucci's and Kaku's Shigan was that his finger in hybrid form was longer and has gone through Luffy while Kaku's shorter finger wasnt long enough to go out on the other side through Zoro. While piercing through is more damage than not going all the way through, Zoro took 3 Shigans.
Rankyaku, like all other cutting damage, is nerfed so yes, no matter whose Rankyaku you pick the result is the same. Sanji took it on without any serious damage while it has split huge towers and steel warships. If he took Mihawk's slash without any serious damage what's Amenadachi compared to that?
The difference between Lucci's and Kaku's shigan was...LUCCI WAS 2X STRONGER THAN KAKU.

Sorry for yelling, hopefully you'll see your error that way.
 

Aki1991

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Zoro is strong but he is clearly weaker than Luffy. I can see him surpassing Jinbei in Wano, which is a big step forward.
 
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nik87

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Wtf do you consider a fight?

Luffy had a FIGHT with Cracker. Zoro and Mihawk wasn't a fight that was akin to a father disciplining his son. I had no idea Zoro fought Kizaru could you show me the link to where Zoro fought him? Didn't know someone could fight while face down in the dirt. Zoro did not fight Aokiji, Luffy, Zoro and Sanji attempted to attack him and were each swatted. I'm not doing this all the people you tried to say Zoro "fought" thats stronger than Cracker clapped Zoro with no damage taken. Let's correct faced since you use the term so loosely, lets use defeated. The NW list is right back down to Hyouzou, Monet, Pica who are jokes when compared to Cracker. You can bring up irrelevant points, you can try to demean Cracker's df, whatever it doesn't matter Cracker is miles stronger than anyone Zoro has defeated.

Was Cracker's swordsmanship the issue or was Luffy figuring out how to fight his df? Thats what happens when you fight someone skilled in more areas than just swinging a sword.

Congrats you took me out of my original point the debate of Zoro being more baby sat than Luffy. You admit Luffy fight different opponents but he is kept away from swordsmen because he can't fight them only Zoro can. But Luffy beats Cracker who is a stronger swordsman than all of Zoro's opponents he has defeated so you are wrong . Luffy has defeated all types of fighters with a variety of skills and powers including a df wielding yonko commander swordsman stronger than anyone Zoro has defeated ever while Zoro only fights people that fight like him who are always notably weaker than Luffy's opponents. Always fighting in your comfort zone literally all the time is being baby sat. Luffy has proven to be able to fight top opponents that contrast his fighting style Zoro has not.
Yes, Luffy had a fight with Cracker and what did he do? Nothing, for 11 hours. With Nami's help and Hommies under her control. How did he beat Cracker?
By doing nothing except being a fat ball of biscuit mash that cant even move from the spot. If that is proof of Luffy dealing with swordsmen, that's great for u.
So, your point that Zoro never faced anyone close to momma's boy worth 860mil has been proven wrong and now you complain?

You want to change from faced into defeated, fine by me. You will have to wait after Wano because Luffy's greatest feats come from an arc where Zoro wasnt even present. You are welcome to write off WCI and compare until then, be my guest. In case you didnt realize that same Monet came closer to killing Luffy than your boy Cracker. I am not trying to demean Cracker's DF, it is an awesome counter for Luffy's ability. However, it is no challenge against Zoro.

Cracker's swordsmanship was used for entire 3 panels, that's it when it comes to Cracker's swordsmanship, rest if clapping his hands. That's what happens when you fight someone who prefers to attack with biscuits than with his sword. Yes, Luffy cant fight swordsmen and in case you still didnt realize, Luffy did nothing to defeat Cracker aside from being a fat dump of biscuit mash. Eating biscuits with Nami's help and being fat is proof of Luffy handling swordsmen?

"Zoro fights only people who fight like him." Someone didnt read the manga. Zoro is not fighting in his comfort zone, he fights weapon users because they are the only ones who stand a chance against him otherwise they get trashed instantly. Why would Oda waste characters on Zoro to trash them in a single page when he can use them against Luffy or Sanji and make the fight chapters long...

I didn't reinforce your argument. Luffy beat a Swordsman, something you say he doesn't/can't do. This Swordsman was a Yonko Commander, stronger than anyone Zoro has ever faced.
I don't even understand "4 attack sources while Zoro defends with 3"...english please.

Cracker fought with a sword, and he created super tough golems with their own swords. He attacked Luffy with 8 swords at a time and was powerful enough to take a Gear 3 haki fist and not be hurt. A guy so strong the WG didn't even have his real face for his bounty.
Yes, you did. Cracker only works for my argument that Luffy cant handle swordsmen. He didnt do anything to Cracker, he had 0 answers. And all of that is with Nami's and Hommies help who were babysitting him when his G4 expires and he ends up helpless. Again, thanks for reinforcing my argument.
Yontoryu vs Santoryu. Do you understand now?

I'll correct your sentence. "He attack Luffy with 8 biscuits at a time..."
A guy so strong who hides behind his biscuits because he dislikes pain with the main biscuit so strong to withstand G3 which is basically fodder tier in NW standard. Fodder Chinjao was going against a lot stronger G3 move... Without G4, Luffy is nothing in the New World.

The difference between Lucci's and Kaku's shigan was...LUCCI WAS 2X STRONGER THAN KAKU.
Sorry for yelling, hopefully you'll see your error that way.
Shigan is a pistol that uses a finger instead of a bullet. This isn't a punch. Whether you shoot that bullet at 4000km/h or at 2200km/h, the result is the same.
It makes a hole for the length and thickness of the finger and that's it. It's not like Kaku was missing physical strength to make holes in Zoro which is what your precious Dorikki represents lol.
 

King Moe

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I can see Sanji and maybe Zoro surpassing Jimbei after the arc, but know for sure they be top guys with Luffy as his Left-Hand and Right-Hand for the crew.
 
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Aki1991

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I can see Sanji and maybe Zoro surpassing Jimbei after the arc, but know for sure they be top guys with Luffy as his Left-Hand and Right-Hand for the crew.
Please no Sanji fanatics now. I am reading one piece again from the beginning I am currently at volume 32. It's clear that Zoro > Sanji in all arcs. I did not have this impression in the past, but it is clear now after reading it again after more than 15 years

Sanji has much more to offer in comparison to Zoro besides fighting though. Zoro has only his power to offer and it was shown that Luffy > Zoro > Sanji. Sanji is more intelligent than Zoro and he is strong, too.

However, Jinbeis feats are > Zoro & Sanji together currently. Both have to show that they can surpass him. I can see Zoro doing it after Wano and Sanji maybe later, but not now. Jinbei is a monster. But who know, maybe he will die this Arc like rumours are telling. Currently Luffy > Jinbei > Zoro > Sanji.

I am bored reading all the time the bulls... of Nik or other fanboys.
 
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King Moe

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Please no Sanji fanatics now. I am reading one piece again from the beginning I am currently at volume 32. It's clear that Zoro > Sanji in all arcs. I did not have this impression in the past, but it is clear now after reading it again after more than 15 years

Sanji has much more to offer in comparison to Zoro besides fighting though. Zoro has only his power to offer and it was shown that Luffy > Zoro > Sanji. Sanji is more intelligent than Zoro and he is strong, too.

However, Jinbeis feats are > Zoro & Sanji together currently. Both have to show that they can surpass him. I can see Zoro doing it after Wano and Sanji maybe later, but not now. Jinbei is a monster. But who know, maybe he will die this Arc like rumours are telling. Currently Luffy > Jinbei > Zoro > Sanji.

I am bored reading all the time the bulls... of Nik or other fanboys.
Not fanatics. You were the one to call Sanji out and it's clear they are equals, no one is better than other especially failed to see that in Zoro's past 4 fights that made no progress him being better unlime Sanji taking bigger threat of T6H and showing dominance.

Right now it's Luffy > Jimbei = Sanji > Zoro especially by performance and enemies they taken on so far. Please stop confuse fanatics every time somehow put out honest update of what's up so far. Sanji and maybe Zoro will surpassed Jimbei. They younger and haven't reach their Prime yet. Didn't disagree on you on that.
 

Aki1991

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Seriously now?

It was shown several times by Oda that Zoro > Sanji. Zoros duty is to be strong and to fight. Sanji has so many more things to do and to offer in this crew. It's not a shame for him to be (a little bit) weaker than Zoro.

Zoro will be Luffys right hand. This was foreshadowed since this Manga started. Zoro was also the first to join the crew.
 

nik87

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I wish I could skip to the end of Wano just to see the reactions of all the nay sayers when they see that I have been right all along. :teehee
 

Pirate Queen

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Not a single person has said Zoro wouldn't be stronger after Wano.

It's natural for everyone to get stronger by the end of the arc. No naysayers here.
 

nik87

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Not a single person has said Zoro wouldn't be stronger after Wano.

It's natural for everyone to get stronger by the end of the arc. No naysayers here.
Zoro being stronger after Wano than before is the last thing that interests me.
 
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Pirate Queen

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Zoro being stronger after Wano than before is the last thing that interests me.
Zoro now is stronger than Zoro that emerged from the timeskip... you can't accept that even tho you KNOW Zoro is the hardest trainer of any strawhat and trains the most out of them
 
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nik87

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Zoro now is stronger than Zoro that emerged from the timeskip... you can't accept that even tho you KNOW Zoro is the hardest trainer of any strawhat and trains the most out of them
What is Zoro now capable that he wasnt capable of back on FI?
 
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Fox666

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No. There are plenty of things in the past that can be judged after we see future events.
I bet Zoro wont pull any new PU and will trash King and kill Kaido which will cement him coming back stronger than Luffy after TS.
I want to see reactions about that.
If Zoro is strong enough to trash King and kill Kaido, why he had trouble with Kyoshiro?
 

nik87

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If Zoro is strong enough to trash King and kill Kaido, why he had trouble with Kyoshiro?
Because he didnt? They clashed and went each others way, it wasnt a fight. You draw weird conclusions from pointless clashes.
And it turned out Kyoshiro was an ally and Oda didnt want him trashed perhaps?
 

Pirate Queen

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If Zoro is strong enough to trash King and kill Kaido, why he had trouble with Kyoshiro?
Exactly Zoro hella struggled while Byoshito basically trolled him the entire time and Zoro wa furious he couldn't get past him but Nik like to say " Zoro wasn't trying to get past Kyoshiro, he was trying to get to Orochi" and now its "Kyoshiro was an ally" which is even worse for Zoro because that means Kyoshiro was REALLY not even trying while Zoro was

His excuses for Zoro knows no limits lol, but it can be funny to watch at times
 

nik87

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Exactly Zoro hella struggled while Byoshito basically trolled him the entire time and Zoro wa furious he couldn't get past him but Nik like to say " Zoro wasn't trying to get past Kyoshiro, he was trying to get to Orochi" and now its "Kyoshiro was an ally" which is even worse for Zoro because that means Kyoshiro was REALLY not even trying while Zoro was

His excuses for Zoro knows no limits lol, but it can be funny to watch at times
Apply same logic to Luffy vs Queen.
Luffy got trashed. :kappa
 

Fox666

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Luffy only tried to punch Queen once. But Luffy surely couldn't do anything without Gear 4. I would say that even with Gear 4 he may loose.
 

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Apply same logic to Luffy vs Queen.
Luffy got trashed. :kappa
Luffy couldnt use haki and was weakened by seasoned so THATS a flase equivalence buddy. Zoro was fully capably of utilizing his swordsmanship but just wasn't good enough. And Queen IS a Yonko Commander, of course Queen can block a hakiless, weakened BASE punch by even someone as strong as Luffy.

Even BM was trapped and weakened by seastone. So I can accept it. Can you accept Zoro couldn'tget past Kyoshiro despite trying?
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Luffy only tried to punch Queen once. But Luffy surely couldn't do anything without Gear 4. I would say that even with Gear 4 he may loose.
Luffy lose to Queen in G4 despite being as strong at Katakuri? Lol no
 

King Moe

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Seriously now?

It was shown several times by Oda that Zoro > Sanji. Zoros duty is to be strong and to fight. Sanji has so many more things to do and to offer in this crew. It's not a shame for him to be (a little bit) weaker than Zoro.

Zoro will be Luffys right hand. This was foreshadowed since this Manga started. Zoro was also the first to join the crew.
Not really. Always equally with each other. Their rivalry is Naruto and Sasuke type to one up the other. Sanji been stronger than him at times as well Zoro. It's back and forth between them.

Yes Zoro is right-hand to Luffy, but Luffy see Sanji as his left-hand. They are Gaban and Rayleigh to Luffy's Roger. The dynamic is there is what I am saying.
 
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nik87

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Luffy only tried to punch Queen once. But Luffy surely couldn't do anything without Gear 4. I would say that even with Gear 4 he may loose.
Shanks and WB clashed only with a single move, doesnt stop it from being a clash...
Luffy couldnt use haki and was weakened by seasoned so THATS a flase equivalence buddy. Zoro was fully capably of utilizing his swordsmanship but just wasn't good enough. And Queen IS a Yonko Commander, of course Queen can block a hakiless, weakened BASE punch by even someone as strong as Luffy.

Even BM was trapped and weakened by seastone. So I can accept it. Can you accept Zoro couldn'tget past Kyoshiro despite trying?
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



Luffy lose to Queen in G4 despite being as strong at Katakuri? Lol no
Luffy was able to use haki and wasnt in seastone and wanted to save Kidd and Killer. If you want to play trashing game, I am sure I can play it better so I suggest to stop thinking too much about pointless clashes and instead let Wano arc speak for itself.
 
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