Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[Fox666]

Who is stronger again?

The horse

Tho Lafitte was shown to fly since Impel Down arc

 

[Pro Ban Corps]

Let’s not entertain a troll trying to get a bite out of Sanji fans.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

smh this troll trying to bait with lafitte
true sanji fans know stronger is sanji's parallel

 

[kkck]

So I was looking at a recent SBS and found this:

Hello Odacchi! In chapter 931, Sanji says that Soba Mask's ability to over-poison is the power of the raid suit, is it the power of the raid suit that allows Reiju to create and manipulate poison? If Reiju had a suit and she wasn't there when I ate poison, would my life be saved? P.N. Nine

O:

Em. First of all, the ability is the power of the suit, but since Judge systematically started by creating a human body suitable for each "ability", Reiju is a person who is somewhat resistant to poison. So, you can do it with your own body as much as sucking up poison. The rest is whether or not Reiju wants to save you. (laugh)

The translation is somewhat iffy IMO because as far as I can tell the vinsmoke sibblings can use their abilities even without their suits. But it does look like judge designed each kid to fit each raid suit. In context perhaps the situation is that each kid was born with an ability that gets further enhanced and strengthened by the raid suit. This also makes sense in regards to what happened with sanji while he fought queen. He wore the suit and the suit drew out his mutations.

However there's something weird here... Sanji's raid suit ability is to make him invisible. but sanji himself does not have any such ability. Sanji's primary technique is diable jambe which coats his body in fire. If we make the case that diable jambe is sanji's equivalent to poison pink and such then there's a clear gap between his innate ability and his suit's ability. The vinsmoke trademark abilities seem to be old enough to even be in that one comic book. Queen who replicated all abilities didn't have diable jambe. I am thinking that perhaps sanji's ability is the result of his mother's intervention. It derailed the experiment enough to give sanji fire instead of invisibility.

And then... this would also come with the implication that sanji's raid suit, in spite of drawing out his ability, was not exactly synergistic with it. As the suit lacked fire based abilities. Meaning the suit would be less effective for him than the other suits are for his siblings. If this is correct then I kinda wonder what it would look like if sanji ever gets a raid suit that draws out and enhances his diable jambe.

 

[Sachsenhesse]

Imagine you could get invisible and then just get fire.

Thanks mom.

 

[kkck]

It's at least a bit funny that there's a non zero chance that sanji's dream of invisible in order to spy on women's bath was thwarted by his mother. Bless her heart (though not sanji's). more than a combination of fire and invisibility, I find the prospect of a suit bringing out sanji's full potential fire wise more interesting. Sanji got to the point where he could defeat queen without a suit... Imagine a suit specifically substantially boosting his current diable jambe capabilities. And speed and overall offensive power... I suppose there's a bit of a question of whether a raid suit can even handle YC1-3 or higher combat.

 

[HereNThere]

However there's something weird here... Sanji's raid suit ability is to make him invisible. but sanji himself does not have any such ability. Sanji's primary technique is diable jambe which coats his body in fire. If we make the case that diable jambe is sanji's equivalent to poison pink and such then there's a clear gap between his innate ability and his suit's ability. The vinsmoke trademark abilities seem to be old enough to even be in that one comic book. Queen who replicated all abilities didn't have diable jambe. I am thinking that perhaps sanji's ability is the result of his mother's intervention. It derailed the experiment enough to give sanji fire instead of invisibility.

And then... this would also come with the implication that sanji's raid suit, in spite of drawing out his ability, was not exactly synergistic with it. As the suit lacked fire based abilities. Meaning the suit would be less effective for him than the other suits are for his siblings. If this is correct then I kinda wonder what it would look like if sanji ever gets a raid suit that draws out and enhances his diable jambe.

I think the answer is both yes and no.

Diable Jambe is the result of his mother's intervention. But only because her actions to protect his emotions resulted in him keeping them and Diable Jambe/Ifrit Jambe is fueled by his emotions.

As far as we know, Sanji's fire abilities are completely unrelated to his father's genetic shenanigans. During WCI, Oda had plenty of moments where he could've had Judge comment on Sanji's ability to produce fire, yet that never happened. None of the siblings ever brought up or questioned it either. He was still regarded as a failure so.

And that would make sense that they are unrelated as the implications were that, if Sanji were to continue to wear the Raid Suit, he would lose his emotions. And if he lost his emotions, he would certainly lose the ability to use Diable Jambe.

I don't know if we'll actually get an explanation on Sanji's flames, but I don't think it'll be linked to Judge's experiments. So I don't think a Raid Suit could be created for him. And, again, Diable Jambe is fueled by his emotions. Ifrit Jambe was, apparently, something he could always do, but his body just couldn't withstand the flames. His body couldn't keep up with his passion, is basically what I'm assuming.

 

[kkck]

I think the answer is both yes and no.

Diable Jambe is the result of his mother's intervention. But only because her actions to protect his emotions resulted in him keeping them and Diable Jambe/Ifrit Jambe is fueled by his emotions.

As far as we know, Sanji's fire abilities are completely unrelated to his father's genetic shenanigans. During WCI, Oda had plenty of moments where he could've had Judge comment on Sanji's ability to produce fire, yet that never happened. None of the siblings ever brought up or questioned it either. He was still regarded as a failure so.

And that would make sense that they are unrelated as the implications were that, if Sanji were to continue to wear the Raid Suit, he would lose his emotions. And if he lost his emotions, he would certainly lose the ability to use Diable Jambe.

I don't know if we'll actually get an explanation on Sanji's flames, but I don't think it'll be linked to Judge's experiments. So I don't think a Raid Suit could be created for him. And, again, Diable Jambe is fueled by his emotions. Ifrit Jambe was, apparently, something he could always do, but his body just couldn't withstand the flames. His body couldn't keep up with his passion, is basically what I'm assuming.

Ok, a few points:

1.- by all appearances sanji's flames being produced by emotions is not something we should take literally. Mostly on account of this not explaining. Queen framed sanji's body bursting into flames as something that humans can't just do, going as far as to compare sanji to lunarians, a race perpetually on fire. There are others who have fire based attacks however it's fairly clear they don't simply burst into flames. Kinemon and zoro use flames through their swords, luffy's red hawk falls well short of diable jambe.

2.- None of that actually amount to reasons to think his fire is unrelated to his genetics. The most likely reason for his family to not comment on this is likely their figurative or literal inability to give a shit. Add to that, queen did comment on the impossibility of a human doing that.

3.- The story proved beyond doubt that the raid suit never affected sanji's emotions. Sanji thought there was a chance of this happening because he ran into that one geisha girl queen liked who was terrified out of her mind. But in reality she was simply scared because queen attacked her quile invisible. There's zero evidence sanji's emotions were in any way ever compromised by the suit and sanji's suspicions were in fact misplaced. The suit simply awakened at least the physical mutations the vinsmokes have access to. During the fight sanji commented on this and made the point that his newfound physical strength and endurance are part of the reason why ifrit jambe is so powerful and therefore impossible before the mutations fully awakened. This unfortunately does fall short of confirming or denying the flames being related to his genetics.

Overall the case remains that diable/ifrit jambe being the result of sanji's mutations is a much better explanation than the alternatives at least.

 

[HereNThere]

Ok, a few points:

1.- by all appearances sanji's flames being produced by emotions is not something we should take literally. Mostly on account of this not explaining. Queen framed sanji's body bursting into flames as something that humans can't just do, going as far as to compare sanji to lunarians, a race perpetually on fire. There are others who have fire based attacks however it's fairly clear they don't simply burst into flames. Kinemon and zoro use flames through their swords, luffy's red hawk falls well short of diable jambe.

2.- None of that actually amount to reasons to think his fire is unrelated to his genetics. The most likely reason for his family to not comment on this is likely their figurative or literal inability to give a shit. Add to that, queen did comment on the impossibility of a human doing that.

3.- The story proved beyond doubt that the raid suit never affected sanji's emotions. Sanji thought there was a chance of this happening because he ran into that one geisha girl queen liked who was terrified out of her mind. But in reality she was simply scared because queen attacked her quile invisible. There's zero evidence sanji's emotions were in any way ever compromised by the suit and sanji's suspicions were in fact misplaced. The suit simply awakened at least the physical mutations the vinsmokes have access to. During the fight sanji commented on this and made the point that his newfound physical strength and endurance are part of the reason why ifrit jambe is so powerful and therefore impossible before the mutations fully awakened. This unfortunately does fall short of confirming or denying the flames being related to his genetics.

Overall the case remains that diable/ifrit jambe being the result of sanji's mutations is a much better explanation than the alternatives at least.

1. I don't see why we shouldn't take it at face value at this point. We're in the final arc and we're no closer to getting a solid answer for this. Sanji's flames get stronger the more emotional he gets. That is the only answer Oda keeps going to when asked and he doesn't seem like he's interested in giving a clear answer. With all the other reveals we've been getting recently, I'm fine taking it literally. Oda has had a couple of arcs to address Sanji's flames and has not taken any time to do so, including the Sanji-centric arc. If he doesn't address it in this current arc, I don't expect it to be addressed at all, honestly. I think we're supposed to just take it as is just like Zoro's Asura technique.

Queen questioning Sanji, I feel, was just a red-herring by Oda to set up intrigue for the Lunarians. It's never addressed again after that comment and after King gives Queen the side eye.

2. I think it does. Judge, the character who should have the best idea of what his experiments would entail, did not recognize the flames nor did he even muse at the possibility that Sora's actions would've led to a separate mutation. He tested Sanji multiple times to see if there was any sort of mutation within him and everything came up normal.

3. The story did not prove that at all. The story told us that the Raid Suit was awakening Judge's genetic modifications within Sanji. Along with the physical enhancements and the exoskeleton, it was repeatedly highlighted that the boys' lack of emotions was the most important aspect of their modifications to make them into perfect soldiers. So, because the Raid Suit was bringing out all of Sanji's modifications, it is exceedingly likely that it would have eventually brought out that lack of emotion.

And, most importantly, Sanji has been using Diable Jambe long before he awakened his genetic abilities. It does not make sense that it would be a part of his modifications when they all came out with his use of the Raid Suit. If it were, other aspects of his genetic mutations should have also popped up in due time. But they didn't.

Maybe Oda will address it in the future, but at this point in time, there is nothing that makes me think it's related to his modifications.

 

[Fox666]

The problem is that the manga showed that Sanji was using friction to set his leg on fire

According to Sanji himself, he can use Diable Jamble not because of some genetic enhancement like his simblings

You would think he would have figured it out if he was magically producing fire

In the world of One Piece, Zoro can use a sword technique to create a fire dragon, and Wanze can produce ramen from his nose... if anything, Diable Jamble is much closer to reality

 

[Pirate Queen]

The problem is that the manga showed that Sanji was using friction to set his leg on fire

According to Sanji himself, he can use Diable Jamble not because of some genetic enhancement like his simblings

You would think he would have figured it out if he was magically producing fire

In the world of One Piece, Zoro can use a sword technique to create a fire dragon, and Wanze can produce ramen from his nose... if anything, Diable Jamble is much closer to reality

When you can do something no one else can do your mind tends to rationalize it the easiest way it know how.

When I was in grade school I was the only one in my class that could fold my tongue into a clover and I rationalized it was because I had better control of my tongue than everyone else in the class. The truth was, it's just genetics.

Sanji learned how to catch fire by spinning and rationalized that it was the friction.

Be we the readers knew(or SHOULD have known) that was nonsense the second he could produce fire without friction.

 

[HereNThere]

The problem is that the manga showed that Sanji was using friction to set his leg on fire

According to Sanji himself, he can use Diable Jamble not because of some genetic enhancement like his simblings

You would think he would have figured it out if he was magically producing fire

In the world of One Piece, Zoro can use a sword technique to create a fire dragon, and Wanze can produce ramen from his nose... if anything, Diable Jamble is much closer to reality

Pre-Time skip was closer to reality. Oda always showed him spinning back then when Diable Jambe was activated.

Post-Time skip Sanji's flames are generated instantaneously though, thus prompting this particular discussion. It's a mystery.

 

[JStackz26]

I don't know what these latest posts are about but you know when it comes to the chatter with Zoro to Sanji..


Oda did the Dōriki thing with CP9. It says

Sanji and Zoro are close in range and nearly twice as strong as both of them.


He said Franky and Monster Point Chopper are close in strength apparently.


Anyway he said Luffy is not twice as strong as both of them, and while Zoro and Sanji are not as strong as Luffy both of them combined are possibly stronger. Basically the Dōriki reading said Kidd and Law vs Big Mom is Zoro and Sanji to Luffy. Next it seems another thing that happened is this...

Oda had Chopper say carnivore Zoans are more aggressive in battle and the Zoan transformation raises physical ability is what Lucci said. As others have said, Dōriki was done in base form. So whether Kaku had his Devil Fruit or not didn't affect that. Now when the Devil Fruit comes into play you have Kaku just learning the ability and Jabra actually having been seasoned with his.


Now my guess is this, this was the rare case where Sanji faced off a main opponent who was actually stronger than Zoro's. As a result, Oda weakened Sanji with the Kalifa battle. And Oda may have reinforced this with the current arc where there is no Jabra but there is a Kaku is CP-0. That technically Kaku is meant to be stronger but Jabra was stronger at the time. But due to Kaku having the disadvantage to Jabra and Lucci of being a none carnivorous Zoan and a new ability user, Zoro fought an opponent that was handicapped. Further shown by this, Jabra and Lucci had a dynamic as if they were the number 1 and number 2 of CP-9. And Kaku the 3rd. But Kaku and Lucci on the mission together was likely Oda making it a point to make those to the main people. Furthermore when you see the rivalry within that top 3 bunch that is pre-timeskip, suddenly post-timeskip we get the story of Who's-Who was a genius on par with Lucci. However we then get a breakdown of

Kaido-Luffy- Lucci

King-Zoro-Kaku

Queen-Sanji-Jabra

Jack-Side Character(Inuarashi)-Blueno-Luffy

Who's Who-Jinbe-Kumadori

Not to say Who's-Who was low on the CP-9 list but rather that Who's Who was apparently closer to Lucci on the CP-9 levels but it was shown to have Jabra in the top 3. Which technically implies Who's-Who was in the Top 3 of CP-9 and actually swaps out with Jabra due to the weird power scaling regarding Jabra and Kaku which is more a result of Kaku lack of familiarity with his devil fruit. Further shown with Sabo vs Fujitora where Sabo is just learning his devil fruit and then later trains his ability. In other words at that point in time Kaku was meant to be the less capable fighter and Jabra stronger slightly.

At least from my perspective.


Now in that battle Zoro struggled vs Kaku for a bit. Whereas Sanji had pretty much an easy time with Jabra. For the record, Luffy did cause Lucci to kind of have his eyes roll to the back of his head in Water 7 briefly on a surprise hit. Sanji was the first to actively do so while we knew Tekkai was active with Blueno. And that was with a base kick. And Sanji, according to Kaku was regarded as a no bounty at the time. Then with Jabra, at base level Jabra was in pain from Sanji's attacks from the start and bluffed it off. Technically if Kaku had Jabras time of training with his Devil Fruit, Zoro probably loses that fight. Oda basically implied Kaku had room for growth, Lucci had an interesting backstory that could make him a Dark-Garp in a sense. And Jabra was not a gag character but what you see is what you get type actually.


Now again this emulates Queen and King, without the whole Queen being the Stronger fighter than King. The whole Sanji level of difficulty. Oda even again had to weaken Sanji with the Black Maria stuff. But technically, the whole time Queen and Sanji fought, Sanji was basically in advantage. Again Sanji's issue was basically "my attacks are hurting him but how do you break through Tekkai." Zoro full on was outmatched by his opponent until basically powerup. In Sanji's case, if the Oda Germa stuff doesn't happen he likely dodges the sword attack using CoO as he'd be less distracted. How the fight goes without the Germa genes is probably more even. But Zoro with Shisui instead of Emma is basically Zoro is probably dead as he'd have no clue how to use Conqueror's Haki. Which Luffy needed the Hyougoro training to do.


My guess is that Sanji will have Conqueror's Haki and his awakening it will be similar in that Sanji will learn how to control his exoskeleton and genetic stuff while eventually releasing Conqueror's Haki.



And for the record I said Sanji's opponent at Eniesu Lobby was superior than Zoro's at the time, not that Sanji was stronger than Zoro in Enies Lobby. This goes into the whole Luffy vs Cracker territory. Where technically Luffy was stronger but probably loses with Nami. Weird to explain, excuse if contradicts. But basically what Oda did was basically say Sanji and Zoro are relatively close in strength.

To use the Dōriki scale again let me try this.

Lucci was 4000.

So let's say in a crew

number one is 4000, number two is 3000, number three is 2000

Luffy - 4000 (technically slightly under) usually ends up above 4000

Zoro - 3000 but same as Luffy in brackets usually ends up above 3000

Sanji - between 2500 and 2800, usually has a handicap that brings him to his opponents level. Usually ends up above or near 3000.

Kurorobi-Sea Creature battle underwater, easily defeat after.

Mr. 2 - Kept transforming into Nami

Satori - Team battle no real opponent for Sanji that arc.

Jabra - Weakened from the Kalifa fight but was basically not at a disadvantage against Jabra and Tekkai.

Absalom - Nami issue

Vergo - weakened by what happened with Nami in his body

Doflamingo - Didn't know his ability, whether Sanji could do what Fujitora did to bird cage unknown.

Daifuku - Sanji focused on rescue aspect

Oven - Sanji focused on saving WCI

Katakuri - Oda made sure to not give him future sight since it would have led to Katakuri defeat. Obviously not serious on this one here.

PageOne - Unfamiliarity with the raid suit and whether he could use Diable Jambe

XDrake - Technically protected by plot importance

Queen - The Black Maria handicap. Technically if Sanji wasn't focused on the germa stuff he probably dodged Queens attack that he breaks. The other one would be Sanji defeated by a Surprise attack basically. But was mostly in control of the battle

Kaido & Big Mom - Sanji wanted to face them. Denied by way of the plot. Not saying they were weaker.


Speaking of this stuff, it pretty much indicates Oda plans to add more strawhats.

The Jinbe gap was an indication. When a side character defeated one of the main bosses and Jinbe took the lesser fighter. Seems a hint:

Luffy - ACoC - Kaido #1

Zoro - ACoc - King #2 (though technically Big Mom was the 2nd strongest enemy)

Sanji-No ACoC yet - Queen #3

Jack #4 defeated by Inuarashi

Jinbe - No ACoc - Who's-Who #5 or #6 (depending on XDrake rank)

The next character mentioned as joining is Yamato who has ACoC. So it seems clear that she was meant for the Jack slot and also that Sanji likely gets ACoC.

When you look at it Zoro didn't face Kaido and Big Mom then go up against King in the way that Kaido took on everyone. Zoro has the Minks boosts like Luffy had the Caribou thing. So lets say Zoro doesn't use that and Luffy doesn't fall off onigashima, the battle is basically one on one with no Yamato involvement. Which leaves King for Yamato and Sanji to face Queen. Lets say Yamato is occupied then that leaves Sanji to face off against Queen and King for the whole time. Which then means Marco has to take on King. In other words, possible hint at those two later joining.


Another interesting thing in here, Caribou. He has quite a few signs. Technically it is said that Oda said a former enemy joins. Jinbe wasn't ever an enemy and had no idea what Arlong was doing. Next would be Bellamy but he retired. I believe Robin joined before the claim. And Franky wasn't really an enemy since he befriended Usopp. Then Law is more rival than enemy and Kidd mentioned being enemies upon leaving Wano. Seeing as Kids allied with other supernova, he could have allied with Luffy. XDrake is a Marine which makes him an enemy but not really an enemy known as enemy.

But look at the current chapters and what it features. Saboady all over.

Sentomaru, Kizaru, Celestial Dragons (CP-0 as their agents), Kuma, Pacifista, Supernova (Bonney), legendary person (Rayleigh to Vegapunk), G-14 (Marineford), Egghead Mechanical sea beasts like sea kings of calm belt. Something like an auction and Camie matter with the small little control stuff pertaining to the Seraphim's. Sanji and Duval lookalike to the Jinbe and younger Jinbe. The bull to the sea creatures. Huge mangroves to huge science laboratory.

All the things are there in this stuff. When you look at it, and it just so happens that Caribou just keeps repeatedly stowing away on the ship. We just had, Nekomamushi, Inuarashi stowed away on Whitebeards ship and ended up joining. Oden was forced by Whitebeard to be dragged through water. Caribou keeps getting locked in a barrel. Barrel, would also relate to XDrake father, the marine turned Pirate. Where Caribou is a Pirate, turned revolutionary, turned pirate again. Luffy father the revolutionary. And here's another thing Impel Down is the arc between Saboady and Saboady. And who was there? Crocodile. Whom Luffy put there basically. And he was someone who had the intent of going after Whitebeard, which would have severely screwed over that crew if Crocodile was successful. Instead someone Crocodile ends up helping Save Ace, who is important to Whitebeard and a key fighter as well as helping save Luffy. And I mention him because Caribou, although I said his ability seems to have Blackbeard devil fruit aspects, well if you look at it his Devil Fruit is close in appearance alto Crocodiles. Now technically in real life sand and a swamp probably don't mesh as swamp is a like water, a marsh. A swamp could be a body of water that is found within a mass of land. So an impurity in a desert land crocodile creates. Anyway, the same way Luffy meets Crocodile in Impel Down is the same with Caribou in Udon. Then you have the whole aspect of if not for Caribou, that war is very likely lost. Technically he was one of the biggest allies and wasn't even credited for it. But now here is another thing, Caribou is showing up again in the arc that is bring backing a lot of Saboady elements. Even the return. If I recall Sanji came across Zoro on ship. And basically Caribou appeared during the recruitment by the fake Straw hats which was shut down by Sentomaru and Pacifista. Caribou was planning to kill Luffy. Brings me back to Crocodile trying to Kill Whitebeard and ending up helping him instead. Ace himself tried to kill Whitebeard numerous times and instead became a commander (odd Whitebeard had this rule of no killing but Ace tried to kill him numerous times, Roger probably really wondering if Ace isn't one of the children of a Rocks members), though although Ace went after Whitebeard the fundamental nature of Ace wasn't evil as Caribou is depicted to be evil. But Luffy did befriend Kidd who was deemed very evil. And Luffy is Yonko level even if not Whitebeard level. There are a lot of details that make it possible for Luffy to accept Caribou as a Strawhat. Plus Caribou already knows about the Ancient weapon. Good and bad as it means he likely gets used to assist a Villain or good because it means he technically knows what the crew knows and in a sense makes it seem he's one of them. As per how he'd be written by Oda is Unknown but here's another thing interesting about Caribou, he is a logia which the crew doesn't have. And technically he only wanted a ride to the next Island. So now we have Vegapunk who just happened to say something about difficulty with artificial Logia powers. So that there pretty much can tie Caribou to having some Vegapunk importance (nothing to do with joining the crew but could soften up his character a bit). Of course Caribou would fit with the coward group and bring balance to the addition of other powerful members. Where my thinking is Yamato, Marco, and Hancock with a hope for Bonney. He serves as pretty useful for infiltration and concealing things. Though his design just says villain or at least non Strawhat. But his Devil Fruit ability could be useful if trained and definitely one of those non overkill Logia. Possibly a good aid to countering Greenbull. There may have been some other things in this stuff that hint to it too. But again, his design seems a bit villainous. He looks like that Vito guy. The long tongue thing, I mean Vegapunk has a long tongue too but those two (Vito and Caribou) have a more sinister look regarding such a thing. Vegapunks looks more geeky than sinister. But Caribou had whole cover stories based on him so more than likely he has a different purpose. Interesting his ability is similar to Vegapunk in terms of the storage capacity.
Swamp and Sand. Crocodile has the ability to destroy/wither the land/strip it of its nutrients/life. Caribou has the ability to store nutrients and objects inside of him.
Crocodile is teamed up with Buggy who is like the anti-Luffy (hence both their ascension to Yonko at the same time although Luffy had the 5th Emperor title). While Caribou is on Luffy's ship all post Wano.


Back to Sanji, Oda just introduced an something regarding Shanks called Color of Observation killer. Which is a title but we basically now got future sight and the ability to put a stop to future sight. So now Sanji's speciality does happen to CoO. And Shanks has three scars over his eye, Sanji is Germa #3. So now Sanji had the whole Katakuri exchange who is the first New World person we see use future sight. This is during Sanji's retrieval arc. Possibly now killing the ability of future sight also probably goes to the lower level of nullifying lower observation Haki. Meaning making opponents easier to land blows on. Meaning for a speed guy like Sanji it would allow him to keep his defensive edge while weakening another enemies defensive edge. Remember when Diable Jambe was first introduced, Sanji won the battle by letting Jabra strike him with an attack to keep him in place to land the next blow. So now CoO killing would limit dodging which is similar in nature. Plus with Sanji's speed it limits an opponents time to react which we saw with Lucci and Sentomaru where Sentomaru said he saw the attack coming and thought he blocked it. The difference between landing a winning blow and an opponent still able to continue. Of course possibly this will go to Luffy but as a CoO specialist it would make sense for Sanji. Someone like Katakuri or Fujitora for example would be a much more different match for Sanji in that way. Someone like Kizaru who moves at high speed becomes more hittable because it takes away one of his traits that makes him tougher to hit, he'll still have the speed but not the prediction. And of course again, you have Sanji moving at high speed. The ability would be heavily advantageous to Sanji.

Also this green blood stuff now, Oda has Vegapunk say Zoan devil fruits can be made artificially. But Paramecia abilities can be recreated from the lineage factor and given. Which explains the Germa abilities. They are Paramecia abilities very likely. What Niji is, would be difficult to pinpoint but Reiju is clearly using poison. An what did Oda do? He had Logia Caesar (Logia's difficult to recreate) say don't compare him to that Paramecia Magellan. Hint there. Again enel's lightning is Logia but we have seen Ace's Devil fruit then the Don Achino guy, and Oven has a heating up ability. So Niji and Ichiji basically seem to have paramecia/Oven like versions of Ace's fruit and Enel's fruit. Judge calls his ability Electromagnetic crack. Now that goes to say this, the Germa can possibly swim and don't suffer the Devil Fruit weakness stuff. My guess is that incorporation of the Green Blood thing doesn't come with inability to swim since only the ability is being taken rather than it being an actual devil fruit. Which means two things, well Franky didn't want to be unable to swim so he refused to eat Ace's fruit. Both he and Sanji just experienced limitations in their cyborg stuff, Franky's armor messed up a bit. And Sanji and his fear of mutations. In other words Franky can possibly now have an extra ability without sacrificing swimming. Sanji can have extra ability without worry. Sanji now well if you consider Oda said Senor pink's devil fruit would be Sanji's type for Oda to give Sanji well Oda basically is implying:
1)Since Vegapunk may be coming with them and we saw Seraphim Jinbe with it, that it may happen
2)Sanji may be a devil fruit and now we saw the Seraphim with ability Oda said he would give Sanji, and Sanji attacked that Seraphim as well as he just recently fought Queen that has his and his whole family abilities. So Oda is trying to hint Sanji is like the Seraphim as and is a product of that research as well.

Then since Jinbe was done with Senor Pink ability then this happened as recent as WCI. And that also means a Seraphim, way stronger than Sugar can have the hobby hobby ability. As we see Paramecia aren't linked to the original user since Jinbe isn't Senor Pink. It also indicates anyone that has been in Impel Down who is a Paramecia can possibly be victim to this. So Buggy, Mr. 1 (more for Zoro I guess though it would be redundant, but Buggy's ability would make Zoro ridiculous), Shiki, Magellan, Ivankov, Mr. 2, Mr. 3, Morley, San Juan Wolf, other level 6 people (before they died), and of course he has copies of the Warlord and likely every Marine ability, possibly any Zoan (the jailers and Luffy was in there as well as a Zoan, Who's-Who also). But to keep it simple one of the most useful abilities for Sanji would be,
Sanji (Ifrit Jambe): "with this increased speed and weight behind my kicks"
Kizaru: "Speed is weight"
Technically the two abilities that would best fit Sanji is the Machivise ability and Miss Valentine. There is probably a reason Oda had Golden week escape just to being in a similar devil fruit used and put them in Impel Down. But if there were such an ability Sanji could add without being ridiculously overpowered it would be one or both of these two. As basically he can make his attacks extremely destructive. It would be like Burgess's ability except only on a physical contact level. Since Sanji is already modified it wouldn't be ridiculous. And it is interesting that he and Luffy were two people to receive blood transfusion. In fact if we have seen anything:
Sanji - Blood transfusion with Ivankov types
(Would it be odd if Sanji ended up having ability like who trained him, strangely enough Oda did, or the anime did, have Sanji in a dress and also had Sanji swap bodies with Nami. Seems more of a foreshadow now, and he cooked hormone soup that same arc. Possibly Oda will incorporate that ability into Sanji as it would be useful to Luffy and crew as we saw on Punk Hazard and after two years he's be familiar with it. Just like Oda had Zoro saying a behavior of Mihawk working under Buggy sounds off, based on the 2 years Zoro spent around Mihawk, yet no remark about Crocodile who also is very known quantity). Basically the aspect of Blood transfusion and Green blood possibly signifying them as candidates.
Jinbe - Blood transfusion with Luffy, his Seraphim receives a Devil Fruit Oda linked to Sanji, Senor Pink surrounded by women (link to Sanji personality)
Luffy - Blood Transfusion from Jinbe (Was in impel down).
Franky - Past story and him ending up at abandoned labratory and doing repairs on himself. Likely had to do blood transfusions.

But anyway, I say they are candidates for this Seraphim stuff. But narrowed down to Franky and Sanji as they are the two cyborg people. One is like Kuma (Franky and one is like Seraphim (cyborg from birth Sanji, even the incomplete Jinbe hinting to Sanji as Sanji is just awakening Germa abilities).
But definitely if you look at the Machivise guy and Miss Valentine their abilities would be best for Sanji. Sanji being able to move faster by lightening his weight. Then transferring the weight back to a heavier one right before impact to make a stronger attack. Increased weight to withstand attacks paired with exoskeleton. All of which likely doesn't affect his ability to swim. All mixed with Armament Haki. The principle of Ifrit Jambe is basically.. Armament Haki (Burgess Devil fruit) (Jozu Devil Fruit), Fire (Ace and Oven ability), Miss Valentine and Machivise ability. Basically if he had one or both of the latter two devil fruit abilities that would basically exponentially increase his ability. And attack power is basically the one thing Sanji is behind Luffy and Zoro in basically.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 13, 2023, Original Post Date: Dec 31, 2022 ---

Another piece to add. Sanji really gets way less credit that he deserves. Oda really needs to start making him more Big time like he does for Zoro and Luffy, as Sanji deserves.

-Mr. Prince Twice
-Nami and Usopp Skypiea
-Usopp rescue Sea Train
-Sabotage buster call (now I don't know if Oda, factored this into his bounty or not because technically it shouldn't be known)
-Possibly the Duval stuff
-If not for his weird situation: Luffy would have had to find a way to infiltrate and escape Whole Cake Island without the help of the Germa, possibly Bege and possibly Jinbe. As Bege was waiting for the right timing. Jinbe maybe still defects. You notice even Blackbeard, waited until Big Mom was in Wano yo make a move towards Whole Cake Island, whether it is possibly the opportune time or maybe (as we see Blackbeard vs Law's awakening) he knew he didn't have the manpower to handle the entire group of them. Plus a good amount of them were in Wano plus Katakuri and Oven distracted by the Germa possibly and a still injured Cracker. Basically Luffy is possibly short a WCI road Poneglyph if not for Sanji.
-Also, you have the main fact that he even rescued Kin'emon. Which he did while using Nami's body rather than his own. Even while Zoro was present. (Though Technically without his torso he was still able to see but his torso would have been eaten by a shark so Sanji did save him). Which led to the whole Zou stuff and the road poneglyph, which Law didn't orginally get access to.
-Saves Momonosuke from King in the execution. Which technically it is possible if anyone else tried that king or Queen would have been swift in executing Momonosuke (as you see his personality vs Zoro). And technically he did try to execute Momonosuke.

Also, who are the only non-scabbards, non Oden allies (technically Shinobi kinda is an Oden vassal unofficially) that saved Momonosuke in Wano?
Sanji and Yamato. Possible hint to him eventually having Conquer's Haki and her joining.
The Sanji part, is just again, nothing substantiated yet but something that if it happens can possibly be realized as a clue/hint.
The other one now, Yamato joining is this:
If Yamato was a strawhat and this was a different island this would be like the strawhats working together in rescuing someone within the plot from within the island. Basically she represents an outsider as Kaido invaded Wano. So given her allegiance to Luffy, she fits the whole pirate crew comes in to rescue townspeople role. Also her fighting Kaido is similar to Franky asking Luffy to attack Lucci in Enies Lobby. And Franky ended up joining. In Eniesu Lobby Franky wasn't anywhere near strong enough to clash with Lucci. Yamato, while weaker, could stall him (as Jinbe said).

Funny my last two posts traveled into that terrority of Yamato and joining lol.

But that sabotaging a Buster Call, since it is an Admiral issued order should pretty much have pushed his bounty up too. As Usopp got a bounty raise over the flag thing.

 

[XXGenesis]

So which explanation as fans do we like the most?

Personally I always accepted the burning passion but thought it was silly..It’s One Piece so silly is often quite enjoyable..

But when Queen mentions the Lunarians and Sanji actually awakens his Germa DNA..I immediately grasped unto this explanation much more.

So I prefer It being from Sanji’s DNA; Over he’s passionate and just sets his body on fire….

Yes Onr Piece is fantastical; Queen’s monologue should hold weight and it’s a simple enough explanation.

 

[grey matter]

So which explanation as fans do we like the most?

Personally I always accepted the burning passion but thought it was silly..It’s One Piece so silly is often quite enjoyable..

But when Queen mentions the Lunarians and Sanji actually awakens his Germa DNA..I immediately grasped unto this explanation much more.

So I prefer It being from Sanji’s DNA; Over he’s passionate and just sets his body on fire….

Yes Onr Piece is fantastical; Queen’s monologue should hold weight and it’s a simple enough explanation.

I prefer the passion one lol.

Why can Luffy use fire attacks, when his power is rubber? Why can Zoro and Kin'emon (and even Shanks if we're going by movie) light their sword on fire?

I think some stuff is just anime logic really lol.

But it being lunarian may also explain why Sanji's natural durability is also high, apart from just fire.
IIRC Niji needed some machines or soemthing to "fix" his broken bones....meaning this is beyond what regular exoskeleton is capable of. While Sanji did it naturally.
It could maybe just be a function of awakening exeskeleton for the first time.
Or it could be because of lunarian DNA as well, since King is also implied to have high endurance and not just defence (Kaido talked about govt putting him through endurance experiments)

 

[HereNThere]

I prefer burning passion as well.

It's just one of those deals where his character trait is turned up into a supernatural ability, much like Brook's music being able to instantly put people to sleep or Nami's ability to sense weather to a crazy degree. Him being a main fighter, it's obvious his trait is going to be more closely linked to his combat ability, but I feel it's within the same lane.

Also, thematically, Sanji is living proof that his mother was right and his father was wrong. Those very same emotions that his father sought to stamp out and his mother died to preserve are basically the root of his power at this point. And while his father's genetics did indeed increase his power, in the end, Sanji used those benefits to basically bring more power out of Diable Jambe and turn it into Ifrit Jambe. The implications are that Sanji always could increase the heat of Diable Jambe, his body just couldn't handle them. But with improved haki and his exoskeleton, he can go even hotter than before. Basically, his body couldn't keep up with his passion.

Honestly, Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji's power-ups all followed that same theme. Their true power-ups were abilities they were always capable of, but just needed the right circumstances/factors to bring them out. Luffy's mind and body finally caught up to allow him to Awaken. Enma forced Zoro to get into the right mindset of a conqueror, unlocking CoC. Sanji's genetics allowed his body to withstand the flames of his passion.