Discussion The Football/Soccer Thread

[ElUniversal]

Arsenal had a great team when they had great veterans to carry the young guys and absorb most of the pressure (Vieira, Henry, Campbell, etc)...I think they are not as powerful as Chelsea or Man Utd anymore....they've gone from "great club with good youth scouting program" to "the place where young guys go before they're bought by a bigger club"

And about Boca....well, the whole Argentinian market is constantly raided by pirates in a suit who take away all those who are good...it's gotten kinda ridiculous, guys like Crespo, Almeyda, Aimar, Samuel had a great full year or more and then they were bought....but nowadays all it takes is less than 6 months of relatively good playing....seriously, Boca's Noir is already being scouted by more than 10 spanish teams and he hasn't even played 20 official matches (and no, he hasn't shown signs of being the next Di Stefano/Kempes/Maradona/Batistuta/Messi....he just didn't suck while replacing Rodrigo Palacio)

 

[Lohnt]

I've been noticing a lot of interviews about Gerrard, and Beckham and Lampard/Rooney etc lately, and I really think England is being set up to play in the Fifa final, unless something changes next year.
I don't know about winning, but Gerrard and Lampard have never been better, Rooney has been forced to step up his game due to complaints about his role last year in MU, and Beckham continues to be a part of the heart of the national team, and even on the bench, he inspires young players like Walcott with his words, even when they're outplaying him in his position.

I just think the team is one of the best at the moment, and the athletes are in top shape, I don't know much about the coach, but as long as he is a decent one and not a complete duche like Germany's (during the final at least) he can lead this team past even heavyweights like Argentina and Brazil (but S. America is still not in top form, I'm sure the two giants will get a decent team together by next year).

I dunno, just some random stuff I was thinking about.

 

[Imperium]

FUCK SHITE!!!! Our defence of set-pieces is horrible. We conceded three goals already! And gallas was fucking invinsible...for all three. So much for fucking experience. Now were back to fourth. Im fucking pissed!!!


*Breaths in and calms down*

@ Lohnt - With england, the thing is, on our day we can beat most teams in the world, but we can also lose to any team in the world (and i mean ANY team in the world). But i doubt we can get to the final...its been 40 years since we last won a world cup, and i honestly dont see it changing. But if we do qualify i think we might get as far as the quarters or semi's hopefully. Btw, i wanted to ask is diogo playing good for olympiakos. Because i was seriously shocked when i heard they got him, it was a coup. xD

 

[ElUniversal]

I believe England's national team is one of the top 6 national teams right now, along with Brazil, Argentina, Spain....and, of course, Italy & Germany (dunno how they do it, they're just always there)....England's midfield is, IMHO, the world's best (at least for now) with all-around players like Gerrard & Lampard, then there's Walcott, Joe Cole, Hargreaves, Beckham, Carrick, Wright-Phillips, etc...you can pick any of those and you'll most likely end up outplaying most teams. Also, Terry-Ferdinand is the best central defenders duo IMO.
England's weakness is the keeper....for some reason a Zoff-like keeper hasn't appeared yet. Another thing you could see as a weakness is the lack of a reliable centerforward to help Rooney...Owen is not in his best form.
But, in spite of any weakness England may show, they're currently in better shape than the rest of the "top contenders":
-Brazil is currently...well, playing like crap....Dunga's defensive style just doesn't fit such a team...players don't like him anymore...the press wants him gone....and the fans want him to be publicly executed. Still, they're always dangerous...if Ronaldinho returns to his real level and Dunga manages not to put Diego in matches anymore (seriously, he doesn't look like a brazilian "10"), they might be the best
-Argentina lacks a big centerforward to join our "shorties" Messi/Tévez/Agüero/Zárate/whoever we get in there....Crespo & Cruz are a little over the hill, maybe we should try Diego Milito, Higuaín or Cavenaghi for once. Other issues are how slow Riquelme runs the team and how bad our defense is (you'd think that guys like Demichelis, Heinze, Zanetti, Burdisso, Coloccini, etc could solve that problem...but so far thay haven't). I really want Basile to quit as the manager....he's just a lazy ol' bum
-Spain looks good but I think they'll (yet again) choke midway

Btw, sorry for such a long, uninteresting post

 

[Lohnt]

Btw, i wanted to ask is diogo playing good for olympiakos. Because i was seriously shocked when i heard they got him, it was a coup. xD

Yea, he's doing very well, but I think the problem is he isn't really meant for Olympiacos, which is why I don't see him sticking around past Christmas/Summertime. Olympiacos plays a counterattack gameplan mixed in with a 4-4-2 attacking diamond offense, depending on the game etc. Right now they have Kovačević who is also a strong footballer with a strong high game and Mitroglou (young, fast, killer instinct but not a superstar) as the alternative fowards.

Kova works better with Oly's best player for the past year as well as this year: Luciano Galletti, the man is a monster and I am jealous they have him. Not to say Diogo isn't scoring more goals, but they're mostly personal actions that he's won on his own. Last year they had LuaLua who is someone that can run around the offense and clear out the defense, now their game has to change in order for him to score more goals, especially when guys like Blanco score so easily with half a chance.

I think he needs time to get used to European football, Belluschi is playing great this season in comparison to last season. This will happen with the Uefa Cup if he gets to play, but for now he doesn't really fit into messy non-formatted Greek football where players kill each other to get the ball into the net. A player in his position can't afford to get injured just to win a game like other players on Oly's team, also it is very taxing on the players, because unlike other championships where you play more games, here players get injured twice as much with half a chance. Diogo not doing as well as expected is probably Valverde's fault. Well, actually it's their stubborn president's fault for controlling the team's play style more than their coach, but anyway it would probably be easier to ask an Olympiacos fan.



Aaaanyway, yea England needs a better goalkeeper and Argentina needs a better coach. Greece needs.. well I hate to say a new coach, but at least to have their younger players play.

 

[gdperrin]

I do believe england doesn´t have a good goalkeeper. The major teams in englad dont have english goalkeepers: Arsenal: Almunia (spain) and Fabiański (poland), Manchester united: Van der Sar (Holland) Liverpool: Reina (Spain), Chelsea: Cech (czech rep.) Eventually u have Robinson in tottenham but he´s playing like crap. and the top english GK are Green, James and Robinson. not one in a good shape. And not outstanding at all, i´ve heard Foster is the Future but so far nothing to be excited about.
Argentina needs to replace some players, the style of game is too slow!

 

[ElUniversal]

Argentina needs to replace some players, the style of game is too slow!

Almost everone with brains in my country can see that (about 35% of the population)...the rest are completely biased and want Riqueme to run the team just like he does with Boca....guess what, Riquelme: the international refs aren't gonna "take care" of you like the argentinian refs do! I'm shocked that some people still consider that turtle as Argentina's star....they need to know there's a little shy guy called Messi who can maybe do a bit better than this cold-hearted bastard who is currently killing any chance we have of a fast and effective gameplay
Guys who need to be gone: Basile (coach), Riquelme, Heinze, Abbondanzieri (This is Carrizo's era, retire already!) and, until they play well again, Tévez, Cambiasso and Zanetti
OTOH, I like what I see for the future....Demichelis & Pareja/G.Milito seem like a reliable central defenders duo, Mascherano and Gago are doing great together, Di Maria, Jonás Gutiérrez, Maxi Rodríguez and Monzón give the team a different feel...and of course, we've got Messi, Agüero, Higuaín, Cavenaghi, etc. to attack

 

[Mendes]

Argentina sure is finding trouble replacing some spots. I dont think the problem is the attack, as Aguero and Milito are on top form, but I agree Riquelme should be replaced. In Portugal, I havent seen enough of Aimar to say he's back at the great old times, but Lucho Gonzalez is magic. He runs Porto's game with superb class. Our best player and goes better every season. Still, I was told he's not convincing when playing for Argentina. Aside from the problem finding an attacking midfielder, Argentina has top class defensive midfielders like Cambiasso, Banega, Gago or Mascherano. I wonder if Messi could play as a true number 10 in a classic 4-4-2:

Defense Mid: Banega
Right Mid: Lucho
Left Mid: Cambiasso
10: Messi

strikers: Aguero Milito
Something like this...
Messi likes to organize the play and to break trough the center with 1-2 combinations with the strikers, so I think it'd be worth a try

 

[ElUniversal]

The problem with putting Messi as a "10" is that he isn't prone to passing the ball too often...Cambiasso doesn't work as a left midfielder, we need a guy with high speed and/or technique (we used to have Kily González, Solari, Sorín, Gustavo López...too bad they're kinda old now) and Banega should never be in the national team as long as Mascherano, Gago, Cambiasso, Ledesma and Battaglia are alive.
Lucho had great matches with the NT when he wasn't paired with Riquelme. I'd give that guy a chance as the "10"....D'alessandro is coming back as a reliable option....Aimar is nowhere near NT level
IMO, the best team we can put together:
----------Carrizo----------
--Demichelis----Pareja-----
Zabaleta-------------Monzón
---Mascherano--Gago-------
Maxi R.--------------Di Maria
-----Messi------D.Milito-----

Mendes, are you a Porto fan? could you tell me how is Lisandro López playing? we don't get much portuguese football coverage except for UCL matches...

 

[Lohnt]

No, Aguero should be Messi's partner, I don't care how good Milito is performing, Aguero is an attacking demon and you're making a mistake if you disagree. It's like taking away Torres from Villa, do you really think Villa would score so many goals without him? or Ronaldo without Rooney?

 

[Mendes]

I am a Porto fan, and as far as I can tell, Lisandro is by far the best striker in the league. Our team is based on players from Argentina, but Lucho and Lisandro are clearly on a higher level. Lisandro is excellent at pressuring the opponent defense and he never grows tired. He plays as a striker but he's adept of going to the wings and he helps the defense. His technique and finishing evolved a lot last season and he finished the league as the top goalscorer and by a huge margin (double of the the second's I think).

As for Argentina's NT, Lucho can play the 10 position as well. Still, I think your midfield is too defensive like that. Mascherano and Gago are very defensive midfielders and I think Cambiasso could and should play a little further from his defense. I see alot of Inter's games, and Cambiasso is Not slow. He's got technique and I saw him advance with the ball forward at ease many times. More than Vieira.
Di Maria is still too young and he's not always option in Benfica's 11. In some years I expect him to be prepared for the NT Argentina, but not now. Messi could play at winger instead and let Aguero in charge of the goals at front. But now that you mentioned, where is Andres D'alessandro? He was playing at wolsburg and then changed to zaragoza... where did he go?

 

[Saintz0r]

But now that you mentioned, where is Andres D'alessandro? He was playing at wolsburg and then changed to zaragoza... where did he go?

Now he's playing in Internacional here in Brazil, and last game he totally pwned Grêmio ( one of the greatest derbys here ) scoring 1goal and making 3 assistances in Inter's 4x1 victory

About Riquelme:
I really like him, but you can either choose to play slowly, building your plays carefully and this way he's one of the best, or you can play a fast game and he'll be the worst one.

@Brazil
We stopped in time since 2006, 2 years without making any progress at all and Dunga's still there...

 

[ElUniversal]

We've tried that midfield and it turned out great....Mascherano and Gago play great defense together and they are the starting point of the offense (like Gattuso and Pirlo, there's one who's better at dribbling and passing the ball and the other is good at getting the ball from rivals)...Di Maria is not yet ready but I'd expect him to be important 2 years from now, the alternative to him is Jonás Gutiérrez, the human versión of the road runner...and about Messi playing as a wing with two forwards, I like the idea, and it's basically what he does in Barça with Eto'o and Henry.

Andrés D'alessandro was bought by San Lorenzo not long ago to help them win the Libertadores (other guys they bought for that matter include Diego Placente, Gonzalo Bergessio and most recently, Santiago Solari)....of course, they didn't. Andrés is currently playing for Porto Alegre's Internacional (who won the Lib. cup recently) and he's doing well. In fact, he's been called to join the NT again after Pekerman took him out of the team to make space for his beloved Riquelme.
He still has anger management issues but nobody can argue his talent...

---

No, Aguero should be Messi's partner, I don't care how good Milito is performing, Aguero is an attacking demon and you're making a mistake if you disagree. It's like taking away Torres from Villa, do you really think Villa would score so many goals without him? or Ronaldo without Rooney?

I like Agüero, I just forgot to put him instead of Milito...still, it would be nice to see the 3 of them together, with Messi in Maxi Rodriguez's position and Agüero-Milito as forwards...Higuaín or Tévez would be fine as well instead of Diego

 

[Mendes]

About Riquelme:
I really like him, but you can either choose to play slowly, building your plays carefully and this way he's one of the best, or you can play a fast game and he'll be the worst one.

I totally agree. Riquelme would be the perfect player for Italy. He's a similar type of player as Veron imo. Veron's best years were when he played in Italy and perhaps Riquelme could have given it a try if he werent in Boca like fish in water. But for Argentina's current NT, Riquelme is way off the offset.

As for Brazil, I said this before and I'll say it again: why not a foreign coach? Its always about a national coach and the foreign are ignored when its time to choose a new manager. Of course the pressure would be a little higher coz its very unusual to have a foreign coach in the 2 great potencies in south america, but I think its worth a try. There were always very good european coaches that can handle that kind of pressure and that can control and take the best out of superstar players. Right now, I'd suggest Rijkaard, coz he's unemployed (if i'm correct) and he proved himself in a huge superstar filled team as Barça. He has the player's respect and plays stylish offensive football

---

Well between Gago and Cambiasso I guess its a matter of opinion. The fact that Argentina has so many talented center/defensive midfielders makes me wonder how would they do with one more player for that spot and one less defender. Remember Zanetti is playing at the center midfield alot recently and Argentina doesnt have much talented side backs aside from him imo. This would be a tough system to change to, but if Argentina does change the management (hazta Basile) a new coach could have success with only Coloccini, Demichelis, Milito i.e.

 

[Lohnt]

Well we had some nice games today.

Arsenal came out of nowhere, and had an incredible 4-0 game.
Manchester is back (granted they played a weak opponent)
Zenit once again.. makes me cry, I can't believe this is the same team, Arshavin's goal post miss was.. ugh.. that player deserves to be on a better team, like Liverpool or something, he really is amazing.
Bayern.. I can't say much, I expected their defense to be open, but in general the team even offensively didn't really do so well.

Also, I hate fantasy football again, but whatever, this is a normal part of the process...

Here's to tommorow, Inter - Bremen and Atletico - Marseille

 

[Imperium]

It was some bad defending from Porto and they gave Fabregas far too much space. In the league he usually isnt given so much time to look for passes. >.>; And if it wasnt for our inability to hit a empty net, it might have been more. But still our defence of set pieces needs a lot of work, i was terrified every time they got a corner. -_-''

As for the other games, Berbatov hit the net. Which is a bad thing (for me anyway), i was quite hoping he would flop like keane. But he hasnt and the goals will now come rolling in i suppose. xD The most surprising result though, is BATE drawing with juventus, they were winning 2-0 before juventus came back. Them and cluj seem to be major dark horses.

 

[Lohnt]

The thing about Bate is, they're in the hardest group possible, and they have nothing to lose. With Zenit messing up, and Juve having to worry about RM; Bate has a better chance at second than Zenit, and if Bate can win a single game without losing the rest (ties) they can theoretically pass. Albeit unlikely.

The other dark horse is Anorthosis, because Bremen apparently has a very weak defense, but a strong offense. Panathinaikos also has a weak defense, and a strong middle, decent offense. If inter just beats the other two, and don't care so much about the games with Anorthosis, Anorthosis can pick up a tie with Inter, and also theoretically pass if they win one of the other games..

 

[Mendes]

Congrats Imperium, Arsenal's evil. You guys were winning 4-0 and you still played with 3 center forwards : ( I miss Real, Inter and Liverpool... at least those knew where to stop!

Well, the reasons for Porto's defeat can be explained by our unbelievable lack of defensive concentration. Its very unusual for Bruno Alves to have so much flaws. Also, I've said this before: our side backs are terrible... I cant understand why Porto cant find a decent left back ever since I remember. Its like an accursed position for both Porto and Portugal's NT.
The fact that Porto gave Fabregas too much room is because portuguese teams play in a minor league where such players do not exist. The difference in quality and class between english and portuguese teams is devastating and the gap is increasing. I'm happy this didnt turn out a too humiliating result (still, I had to drink a lot yesterday :P ).
The good things to take from it, was a good performance in the first half by some Porto's players, creating some chances and thus a good match. Tomas Costa played very well (could have offered Rodriguez the 1st goal of the match) and Lisandro, with 2 superb opportunities to make the 0-1. Also, Fenerbahce's home draw with Kyev makes me rejoice. Its a perfect result for us.

I watched the 2nd half of Zenit vs Real. I almost didnt see Real cross to the opponents midfield, while Zenit were playing very well. When it wasnt the posts helping out Madrid, it was Casillas. Because Juve drew with BATE, I think the fight's on for the 2nd spot of tht group. I'd bet on Zenit now, coz they still have 2 games against BATE and they play at home against Juve, who'll now go to Santiago Bernabeu.

What to say of fiorentina's home draw with steua? This result is terrible when you're stuck in a group with Bayern and Lyon.

 

[THE KING]

Haven't been able to watch the champions league because of job making me go early to bed.Never really new a soccer thread existed here, hoping to get nice reviews of the games from this thread.

 

[Lohnt]

Wow.. I would hate to be a Shaktar fan tonight...

Messi just continuously proves he is the second coming of Maradona.

In related news: Gerrard is on steroids. Explain to me how he has a kick like something out of a soccer anime/movie where the ball goes through the net and leaves a firey hole?