Discussion The Ten Commandments

[Tragicdeath]

Im just wondering what Estarossa's commandment, "Thou shallt have no other God"...!?!

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

I'm pretty sure Merascylla's was 'You shall have no other gods before Me', because it's about having an unwavering faith in God.

Personally I believe that Dolor's commandment is 'Honour your father and your mother', because he could technically be seen as being the 'father' of the Giant Clan (and by extension all of the other races, because at one point I'm pretty sure it was said that the Giant clan was the race that all other clans originated from.) Also, from what little we've seen of him, the other commandments seem to listen when he gives them a straight order too; for example, when he told Galan not to lie and when he told Gloxinia not to call him Balor, neither of them fought him on it. Though that could also just be Glox being a decent person and Galan not wanting to set off his precept. Who knows.

That commandment is about respect and following orders, so in a tournament situation it would also be ideal - if any of the competitors failed to follow the rules set out by Glox and Dolor, it could be seen as being disrespectful, which might set off his precept. Which means Escanor might suffer its effects next chapter, if it does happen to be Honour...

"Thou shalt have no other gods before me" is about idolatry, not only about faith in god.

"Thou shalt have no other gods before me" is one of the Ten Commandments found in the Hebrew Bible (לא יהיה־לך אלהים אחרים על־פני; Exodus 20:3 = Deuteronomy 5:7).[1]

This commandment establishes the exclusive nature of the relationship between the nation of Israel and its national god, Yahweh the god of Israel,[2] a covenant initiated by Yahweh after delivering the Israelites from slavery through the plagues of Egypt and the Exodus.[3]

In a general sense, idolatry is the paying of divine honor to any created thing.[4] In ancient times, opportunities to participate in the honor or worship of other deities abounded. However, according to the Book of Deuteronomy, the Israelites were strictly warned to neither adopt nor adapt any of the religious practices of the peoples around them.[5] Nevertheless, the story of the people of Israel until the Babylonian Captivity is the story of the violation of the first commandment by the worship of “foreign gods” and its consequences. Much of biblical preaching from the time of Moses to the exile is predicated on the either-or choice between exclusive worship of God and false gods.[6] The Babylonian exile seems to have been a turning point after which the Jewish people as a whole were strongly monotheistic and willing to fight battles (such as the Maccabean Revolt) and face martyrdom before paying homage to any other god.[7]

The Shema and its accompanying blessing/curse reveals the intent of the commandment to include love for the one, true God and not only recognition or outward observance.[8] In the gospels, Jesus quotes the Shema as the first and greatest commandment,[9] and the apostles after him preached that those who would follow Christ must turn from idols. The Catholic Catechism as well as Reformation and post-Reformation theologians teach that the commandment applies in modern times and prohibits the worship of physical idols, the seeking of spiritual activity or guidance from any other source (e.g. magical, astrological, etc.), and the focus on temporal priorities such as self (food, physical pleasures), work, and money, for examples.[10] The Catholic Catechism commends those who refuse even to simulate such worship in a cultural context, since “the duty to offer God authentic worship concerns man both as an individual and as a social being.”[11]

While it established the exclusive nature of the relationship between God and his worshippers, it also bans them from worshipping other deities, in other words idolatry. The second commandment "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image" also deals of idolatry, but when it comes to Mera I find that the opening phrase applies to her more than any commandment.
"I am the LORD thy God"
And it happens that both are part of the same commandment.

There isn't a specific commandment about faith alone, the first commandment is about faith and idolatry. Which is why it could be used rather loosely here.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 15, 2016, Original Post Date: Apr 15, 2016 ---

Okay. We know what Gloxinia's Commandment is but what about Dolor?

I think it could be one of either three

1. You shall have no other gods before Me.
2. You shall not make idols.
3. Honor your father and your mother.

I think this because he is obviously worshipped as a deity by the giants. He also chose to make his golem servant in his own image. King confirmed that a golem only becomes complete and unleashes it's full potential if it was made with a clear image in mind. Diane drew her power from her feelings for her friends - the same principles apply to Dolor's golem yet he chose his own image. Which leads me to believe he has only faith in himself, so he must either not trust or believe in anyone else or he is extremely confident or it somehow plays into the favor of his Commandment decree.

What do you think?

Btw, what was Merascylla's corresponding Commandment if she was the Commandment of "faith" ?

I find that "Thou shall not take the name of the lord in vain" suits him, it's about blasphemy.He seems rather polite, but the graven makes sense.

...but doesn't that mean he broke is commandment since he made graven images?

 

[kkck]

I am curious as to who will each f the remaining commandments. Nakaba seems to be going out of his way to have matchups not be entirely obvious. We had escanor dealing with merascylla and galan and then we had meliodas dealing with gloxinia and dolor, provided they are defeated. WIth that there should be 6 commandments for the sins to defeat. And mel could perhaps take a while to recover considering the volume of magic people with his strength handle is no small amount. Even galan whose Pl is probably mostly strength took a while to recover.

I think escanor will end up taking on estarrosa. If it is a PL thing then it is the only alternative that makes sense. I am guessing zeldris will eventually confront meliodas.

Which leaves fraudrin, greylord, moonspiet and deriere.

And the matchups are not ability related but rather plot related...

Honestly, I have no idea of what to think at this point.

 

[HereNThere]

If this is the end of Glox and Dolor, I guess I'll go back to my theory that Monspiet and Derriere are going to fight King and Diane. Lovers versus lovers.

 

[kkck]

If this is the end of Glox and Dolor, I guess I'll go back to my theory that Monspiet and Derriere are going to fight King and Diane. Lovers versus lovers.

Well, by that logic we might as well rule them out. King and diane did not fight dolor and gloxinia, the rather obvious pairing.... So they might not fight the other obvious pairing. Merlin has yet to do something so perhaps she will face either of them. And if we go by random then it should be diane and king that deal with fraudrin and greylord. Ban is won't to do something as well... it'd be interesting to see him along with merlin dealing with deriere and moonspiet.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

I was just bringing this topic in last chapter's discussion, but no one seemed to care. I'm just gonna quote myself.

Yep that's a possibility, a pretty strong one, although I think it could be the DK who ressurects them, and then the Sins will have to deal with them at their full power.
The thing is other than Estarossa, Zeldris, Dolor and Gloxinia, and maybe Merascylla it's hard to figure out who is the perfect match for them in the Sins. Here are some of the matchups I can think of right now:
Estarossa-Escanor (their magic is from the same caliber)
Zeldris-Mel
Dolor-Diane
Gloxinia-King
Merascylla-Merlin(lol even their names start with the same 3 letters)

And the rest, I could see
Derrierie-Ban
She strikes as a physical fighter, who could be pretty fast, just like Ban. Dunno why.Maybe because she's not wearing clothes that could get in the way.
Fraudrin-Gowther
Gowther could invade his mind or something. It could basically be the second round of their fight.

Of course Ban could also face Galan, because of how Snatch works.

But even then there's still Monspiet and Gray Lord whom I really can't figure out who would be a good matchup for them among the Sins, so maybe we could see other characters join in the battle. For example Matrona could help with Dolor, and some of the festival contestants could help out too if they're still around.

It would be interesting to know how Suzuki plans on having the Sins deal with the resurrected demons who could have all their magic back this time around. But it's just a theory at this point.

Other than Monspiet and Gray Lord I can figure out who should fight who, and of course this is taking into account that the commandments who were thought to be dealt with make a come back.

So maybe in the first round it will be Mel and Escanor who deal with them, then on the second round we finally get the real fights with the remaining sins. Without that it's hard to see who could be an obvious matchup for King and Diane, or Merlin because in terms of abilities Dolor and Gloxinia on one hand, and Merascylla on the other should be the perfect match for them.

At any rate I can see Ban facing Derrierie, I feel she could be a physical fighter, with high speed. The rest is already explained.

 

[gnut]

i've been wondering lately(since we seen zeldris in camelot)....why didn't the demons go after possession of the sealed goddess clan in liones(fraudrin knows about them)?

besides mel...wouldn't the goddess clan be top of their list?
i guess since the goddess clan are sealed the demons feel that they are no threat.
but,that's kinda lame because they were sealed just days ago

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

i've been wondering lately(since we seen zeldris in camelot)....why didn't the demons go after possession of the sealed goddess clan in liones(fraudrin knows about them)?

besides mel...wouldn't the goddess clan be top of their list?
i guess since the goddess clan are sealed the demons feel that they are no threat.
but,that's kinda lame because they were sealed just days ago

Sealed Goddess clan? Nah they just lost the ability to manifest their physical bodies most likely because their power was drained after fighting the demons.

Yeah there's no reason for the demons to bother with them right now....

 

[Yakkun]

If you look closely, it seems like Dolor already had the scar around his eye when he was supposedly allied with Meliodas and Gloxinia 3.000 years ago priot to becoming a demon. So he must've already lost it or given it to Merlin voluntarily.

Spoiler: Dolor on the #173 cover

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

If you look closely, it seems like Dolor already had the scar around his eye when he was supposedly allied with Meliodas and Gloxinia 3.000 years ago priot to becoming a demon. So he must've already lost it or given it to Merlin voluntarily.

Spoiler: Dolor on the #173 cover

If that's true, then this give closure to the totally unnecessary debate we had in the chapter discussion, about his eye being "demonic".
It would mean he lost it prior to becoming a demon.
And Gloxinia doesn't have his demon mark either.

So I was right.

Since he lost it prior to becoming a demon, then it can't be that he gave up his eye willingly to the demon king so that he can have Merlin make the power eyes.
And as far as him losing his eye, I don't think he gave it up willingly. So he must have lost it when he suffered that humiliating defeat.
The person who took it away is either Merlin herself, or her master who was the strongest magician at the time, and she used the eye for one of her experiments.
I'm leaning more towards the master who would have beaten Dolor.

 

[Gallon]

If you look closely, it seems like Dolor already had the scar around his eye when he was supposedly allied with Meliodas and Gloxinia 3.000 years ago priot to becoming a demon. So he must've already lost it or given it to Merlin voluntarily.

Spoiler: Dolor on the #173 cover

Giving it voluntarily seems a bit weird to me. Having lost it in a battle against the demons sounds more plausible, since even Gowther has it implemented in his body, and he lost himself before the Holy War.
That being said, it's not a big surprise that Dolor's eye was missing at that point in time, since it was being used among the military power of the demons before the war itself started.

 

[Yakkun]

If that's true, then this give closure to the totally unnecessary debate we had in the chapter discussion, about his eye being "demonic".
It would mean he lost it prior to becoming a demon.
And Gloxinia doesn't have his demon mark either.

So I was right.

Since he lost it prior to becoming a demon, then it can't be that he gave up his eye willingly to the demon king so that he can have Merlin make the power eyes.
And as far as him losing his eye, I don't think he gave it up willingly. So he must have lost it when he suffered that humiliating defeat.
The person who took it away is either Merlin herself, or her master who was the strongest magician at the time, and she used the eye for one of her experiments.
I'm leaning more towards the master who would have beaten Dolor.

That's fairly plausible. I mean, the magic vs demonic, anyway, I never thought it was demonic in nature to begin with (there's nothing typical about it you'd associate with demons anyway, it's more like a really complex reading device). As for the theory to how he lost it, that part is interesting. I don't think Merlin took it from him either but if it was her master, then I could see that. Besides, giants are still more the physical types in combat even if they use magic. But they manipulate one of the most 'physical' elements on top of things, so other magic might really undo all of their fortes.

Not that I think Dolor is a weakling or anything. He's probably just not suited to fight magic duels or against faster fighters in hand to hand who can match his strength like Meliodas or even exceed it. In military jargon, you could say he is the long-distance siege weapon: highly destructive and huge but takes long to load and long to fire and isn't all that precise either XD

I digress again. I kinda like how Nakaba drops these little things without further commentary. You really only see and can deduct some of these details and facts if you read this manga carefully and with attention. I actually wish we had gotten some more info about Galan before he petrified. We knew so little about him. He kept refering to himself as an old warrior so were there several generations of Ten Commandments before the current ones? Gowther's exisence seems to imply it since Fraudrin basically replaced him "more recently", so to speak.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

That's fairly plausible. I mean, the magic vs demonic, anyway, I never thought it was demonic in nature to begin with (there's nothing typical about it you'd associate with demons anyway, it's more like a really complex reading device). As for the theory to how he lost it, that part is interesting. I don't think Merlin took it from him either but if it was her master, then I could see that. Besides, giants are still more the physical types in combat even if they use magic. But they manipulate one of the most 'physical' elements on top of things, so other magic might really undo all of their fortes.

Not that I think Dolor is a weakling or anything. He's probably just not suited to fight magic duels or against faster fighters in hand to hand who can match his strength like Meliodas or even exceed it. In military jargon, you could say he is the long-distance siege weapon: highly destructive and huge but takes long to load and long to fire and isn't all that precise either XD

I digress again. I kinda like how Nakaba drops these little things without further commentary. You really only see and can deduct some of these details and facts if you read this manga carefully and with attention. I actually wish we had gotten some more info about Galan before he petrified. We knew so little about him. He kept refering to himself as an old warrior so were there several generations of Ten Commandments before the current ones? Gowther's exisence seems to imply it since Fraudrin basically replaced him "more recently", so to speak.

Yeah if it happened prior to him becoming a demon then it's possible that a very powerful magician could beat him. Humans back then were supposed to be stronger too because of the constant state of war, they were in top shape. Magic would totally be efficient.Magicians have a wide range of spells, and amongst them demon techniques as well. Merlin was shown using a few of them. If she's not the one who took it away, then her master is the perfect candidate.

From what I can tell about his power, Dolor was the strongest giant for sure but that doesn't mean he could beat everyone from any other clan. So it's bound to see someone else at some point best him. Doesn't mean he's weak per say, but as someone who aspired to become the strongest warrior it's likely he would pick up fights left and right, that's why humans hated him or feared him which is why they gave him the name Balor. Yes because Balor is the name humans gave him,as opposed to be the name the demon king gave him for example.

So I guess that one day he just picked up the wrong fight, or some mage heard about his ability and wanted it for himself. Magicians are not to be understimated, up till Mel regaining his strength and Escy being introduced, Merlin was the one with the highest PL I think.

Yep that's what I'm leaning more towards now. Maybe there even was some trickery involved that allowed the magician or whoever beat Dolor to win, so that's why he was so salty about it to the point of joining the demons.

I totally want to see a flashback with Mel and ALL the commandments at some point, to know more about their history. I still don't know what Galan is, is he wearing an armor or that's actually his real form... He is a dragoon for sure, with all the jumping thing.

 

[Yakkun]

Yeah if it happened prior to him becoming a demon then it's possible that a very powerful magician could beat him. Humans back then were supposed to be stronger too because of the constant state of war, they were in top shape. Magic would totally be efficient.Magicians have a wide range of spells, and amongst them demon techniques as well. Merlin was shown using a few of them. If she's not the one who took it away, then her master is the perfect candidate.

From what I can tell about his power, Dolor was the strongest giant for sure but that doesn't mean he could beat everyone from any other clan. So it's bound to see someone else at some point best him. Doesn't mean he's weak per say, but as someone who aspired to become the strongest warrior it's likely he would pick up fights left and right, that's why humans hated him or feared him which is why they gave him the name Balor. Yes because Balor is the name humans gave him,as opposed to be the name the demon king gave him.

So I guess that one day he just picked up the wrong fight, or some mage heard about his ability and wanted it for himself. Magicians are not to be understimated, up till Mel regaining his strength and Escy being introduced, Merlin was the second strongest in the group.

Yep that's what I'm leaning more towards now. Maybe there even was some trickery involved that allowed the magician or whoever beat Dolor to win, so that's why he was so salty about it to the point of joining the demons.

I totally want to see a flashback with Mel and ALL the commandments at some point, to know more about their history. I still don't know what Galan is, is he wearing an armor or that's actually his real form. He is a dragoon for sure, with all the jumping thing.

Maybe he was a lot like Matrona, a loner and a hardliner who thought battle and power were the defining factors of existence and anyone who didn't partake in that lifestyle was a coward or a weakling. And, as you said, then he just came to the wrong neighborhood or something and got his ass beat in a really humiliating fashion.

Which I still find odd considering he has the magic eye and what not...

Or wait, maybe it all happened BECAUSE of the eye. You know, when you are so accustomed by nature to foresee what will happen to you in the near future, when you can estimate everyone's powers or see through their plans, you might get so hung up on it that when the eye fortells you that you are going to lose in the most cruelest fashion in your next fight, you start to feel despair... and then you really lose. And born from that despair comes the hunger for more power... Which could have led him right to the demon king's arms.

---

Maybe Galan is a ghost possessing an armor. Or he is a Dullahan or some other mystical creature, only that he prefers attaching his head instead of carrying it under his arm lol

Merascylla.... a banshee?

--- Double Post Merged, May 10, 2016, Original Post Date: May 10, 2016 ---

Okay, the Dullahan thing was just a random thought I had but then I looked up what wikipedia has to say about it... among other things, the Dullahan has black eyes that dart about all the time and flashes a grin from one side of the head to the other. The skin of the head is the colour of mouldy cheese. The Dullahan is afraid of gold.

Maybe Galan IS Nakaba's interpretation of such a creature, only in a more minimalistic and practical style. Galan's armor is green, like the mouldy cheese skin. He was afraid of the gold of the sun that Escanor represents. He sports a huge grin all the time (in fact his head had no mimic at all but the masks on his knees and elbows did that for him). And of course, the Dullahan is the restless spirit of a soldier.

If that's even remotely close to what Nakaba had in mind I'd be impressed. And since the Dullahan is basically an omen of death, much like the Banshee and Merascylla was Galan's partner and she had the power to bring back the dead, maybe there is a connection.


Sorry if that ends up a double post but it excited me a little.

 

[Demonspeed]

What even tells you Dolor had once two eyes? Maybe he is born like that. When you think about it, an ability like that is abnormal with everything we know, just like his four arms. All characters usually have their racial traits and their magics as weapon, when you are not a magician. Dolor is the only Giant with a support magic like that and four arms.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Maybe he was a lot like Matrona, a loner and a hardliner who thought battle and power were the defining factors of existence and anyone who didn't partake in that lifestyle was a coward or a weakling. And, as you said, then he just came to the wrong neighborhood or something and got his ass beat in a really humiliating fashion.

Which I still find odd considering he has the magic eye and what not...

Or wait, maybe it all happened BECAUSE of the eye. You know, when you are so accustomed by nature to foresee what will happen to you in the near future, when you can estimate everyone's powers or see through their plans, you might get so hung up on it that when the eye fortells you that you are going to lose in the most cruelest fashion in your next fight, you start to feel despair... and then you really lose. And born from that despair comes the hunger for more power... Which could have led him right to the demon king's arms.

---

Maybe Galan is a ghost possessing an armor. Or he is a Dullahan or some other mystical creature, only that he prefers attaching his head instead of carrying it under his arm lol

Merascylla.... a banshee?

--- Double Post Merged, May 10, 2016, Original Post Date: May 10, 2016 ---

Okay, the Dullahan thing was just a random thought I had but then I looked up what wikipedia has to say about it... among other things, the Dullahan has black eyes that dart about all the time and flashes a grin from one side of the head to the other. The skin of the head is the colour of mouldy cheese. The Dullahan is afraid of gold.

Maybe Galan IS Nakaba's interpretation of such a creature, only in a more minimalistic and practical style. Galan's armor is green, like the mouldy cheese skin. He was afraid of the gold of the sun that Escanor represents. He sports a huge grin all the time (in fact his head had no mimic at all but the masks on his knees and elbows did that for him). And of course, the Dullahan is the restless spirit of a soldier.

If that's even remotely close to what Nakaba had in mind I'd be impressed. And since the Dullahan is basically an omen of death, much like the Banshee and Merascylla was Galan's partner and she had the power to bring back the dead, maybe there is a connection.


Sorry if that ends up a double post but it excited me a little.

Double posts are ok on the forum no worries.

I'll start with the Dolor stuff before getting to the Galan one. I think giants are supposed to be like that, hard boiled fighters who only care about fighting. Actually it might be it's Dolor who started the whole thing, and since the giants view him as their god they kept perpetuating that.

That's actually a fair point, if he gauged someone and suddenly realized he was out of his league, he can't run can he? It would look cowardly, and he prolly broke mentally. I think so far it makes sense, either that or the other person cheated like I said, but then again he can predict things so he would have seen it, unless it's just like with Escanor and he got distracted.

Interesting stuff about Galan, I always felt that he was a ghost occupying the armor, kinda like Mist Vearn from Dragon's quest.
http://villains.wikia.com/wiki/Myst-Vearn

And if you notice his true form it looks like Mel's and even Fraudrin's so I definitely see Dragon quest as a source of inspiration for Suzuki.

The Dullahan bit is interesting, but aren't they also a headless rider? So I'm not sure how that fits with Galan per say. It's actually one of their main features, since Dullahan in Irish is Gan Ceann which means "without a head".

I'm a big Castlevania fan, so I'm fairly familiar with those creatues like the Dullahan or the Banshie. For Mera imo she could have been a human magician who joined the demons, but you never know. I'd actually like it if she was always demonic, same as Galan.

I don't think all the commandments need to be like Dolor and Gloxinia who became demons somehow, I'd prefer if some of them were born demons.

 

[Yakkun]

Double posts are ok on the forum no worries.

I'll start with the Dolor stuff before getting to the Galan one. I think giants are supposed to be like that, hard boiled fighters who only care about fighting. Actually it might be it's Dolor who started the whole thing, and since the giants view him as their god they kept perpetuating that.

That's actually a fair point, if he gauged someone and suddenly realized he was out of his league, he can't run can he? It would look cowardly, and he prolly broke mentally. I think so far it makes sense, either that or the other person cheated like I said, but then again he can predict things so he would have seen it, unless it's just like with Escanor and he got distracted.

Interesting stuff about Galan, I always felt that he was a ghost occupying the armor, kinda like Mist Vearn from Dragon's quest.
http://villains.wikia.com/wiki/Myst-Vearn

And if you notice his true form it looks like Mel's and even Fraudrin's so I definitely see Dragon quest as a source of inspiration for Suzuki.

The Dullahan bit is interesting, but aren't they also a headless rider? So I'm not sure how that fits with Galan per say. It's actually one of their main features, since Dullahan in Irish is Gan Ceann which means "without a head".

I'm a big Castlevania fan, so I'm fairly familiar with those creatues like the Dullahan or the Banshie. For Mera imo she could have been a human magician who joined the demons, but you never know. I'd actually like it if she was always demonic, same as Galan.

I don't think all the commandments need to be like Dolor and Gloxinia who became demons somehow, I'd prefer if some of them were born demons.

Hmm... good point. Wasn't there an interview where Nakaba said which games he likes? Wouldn't be surprised if Dragon Quest was one of them. I also see so many Dark Souls and Berserk similarities, whether they are intentional or not...enough to fill a thread on its own.

Yeah, the Dullahan thing doesn't really work for Galan because of the head, otherwise you could somehow interprete it in. But then again, it would probably be impractical for him to fight with his style if he had to use one arm to hold the head.

And yeah, I don't think all of the Commandment members are from other clans. Some could be unique creatures, yes, but I reckon there are natural born demons there, too. Like Fraudrin who only occupies Dreyfus. Gowther could be implied to be one, too, since he is only occupying a doll. Grayroad/Graylord might even be one of the oldest if not the first. He could literally be the father of all the grey demon spawns.

 

[TarXan]

YOOOO GUYS

Remember what Galan said to Zeldris before he took off for Camelot ????

I have a feeling he was alluding to his commandment

 

[Gallon]

YOOOO GUYS

Remember what Galan said to Zeldris before he took off for Camelot ????

I have a feeling he was alluding to his commandment

The forgetfulness of the elderly is a terrible thing?

 

[TarXan]

The forgetfulness of the elderly is a terrible thing?

Yeah I have a feeling that was hinting towards his commandment

Whatever Galan did it prevented Zeldris from stopping him, when he ordered Galan to stay rather than rush into battle with no magic