Match Weekly Match-up thread (Fuji vs Seda)

[Hardy]

ROUND IS OVER

Spoiler: Winner

Mares de Colón

34th Round:

We are back and with one Math's suggestions. Can Fuji stand a chance against Spain's troublemaker?

Picture	Fuji Hardy Jan 15, 2024	Seda Hardy May 13, 2024
Name	Fuji Shuusuke	Seda
Title	Genius	Troublemaker
Rank	No. 9 (MSer Year 3)	Spain Representative (MSer Year 1)
Height	167cm	-
Weight	53 kg	-
Dominant Hand	Right	Right (Ambidextrous?)
Playstyle	Counter puncher	-
Stat Total	18	?
Speed	3	?
Power	3	?
Stamina	3	?
Mental	4	?
Technique	5	?
Techniques / Styles	Phoenix Return (1st+) Kirin Drop (2nd+) White Dragon (3rd+) Dragonfly Illusion (4th) Gate Keeper of Hecatoncheires (5th) Star Fireworks (6th) Closed Eyes Hollyhock Blizzard Light Wind Kitsune Fireball	Reverse Copy Olympian Iris' Light

Fuji's 10.5 profile.

Fuji's 23.5 profile.

Fuji's Tenipuri Party profile.

Zeus' 23.5 profile

"I'm not listing Seda's hypnosis since he seemingly stopped using it and it can be countered with freaking ear plugs.

...tho, for all intents and purposes, he can play aggressively as he did against Japan."

Will add a poll on Wednesday.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

But Shiraishi got the Star Bible vs France and got a massive boost, being able to score on an established pair that each had 30 in total stats. He was dominating TnK! Kin 1 on 1 (and the gap between them was only increasing), which is a much better feat than anything Sanada has done in NPoT. It was because he knew Kin's weaknesses and exploiting it was doubles, sure, but it's a great feat nevertheless. Meanwhile we don't even know if he can rally with TnK users, Atobe only managed to do so a day before the finals

The implied future (that may not be real) doesn't really tell us anything about how they can perform nowadays. We know Sanada abandoned that strategy against Tokugawa. So, at the very least, right now he isn't ready.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 2, 2023 ---

Something funny about Sanada: because he upgraded his initial move, I'm referring the new one as "Forest" and the old one would be "Woods". Pretty sure it tracks their translations, too.

Yes. He unlocked star bible. And still lost.lol No offense to Tristan/Timothe, but you know. Hahaha. But i dont see them as very strong.

Yes. Its only because he knows Kin weakness. Actually it is same case as Yuki doing well vs Tezuka cause of data. But even better advantage because Shiraishi literally knows every detail of kin weakness. And Kintaro was bad in doubles.

Sanada took 3 games vs Tokugawa. I doubt Shiraishi can.

Also, Toku black hole kinda counters Sanada's techniques for real

 

[Hardy]

Yes. He unlocked star bible. And still lost.lol No offense to Tristan/Timothe, but you know. Hahaha. But i dont see them as very strong.

Yes. Its only because he knows Kin weakness. Actually it is same case as Yuki doing well vs Tezuka cause of data. But even better advantage because Shiraishi literally knows every detail of kin weakness. And Kintaro was bad in doubles.

Sanada took 3 games vs Tokugawa. I doubt Shiraishi can.

Also, Toku black hole kinda counters Sanada's techniques for real

Why don't you see them as strong? They are a HS pair in the No.3 in the world, with stats on Pro level. Their raw stats are literally stronger than anyone in Japan minus Byoudouin and maybe Oni.

Yeah but there's just so much you can do with data.Yanagi is probably the strongest pure data player rn in Japan and he couldn't fight head on against Kin, as observed by Ohmagari. His contribution was limited, looking for openings so that Yukimura could score.

While he probably wouldn't dominate without that data, I don't see why Shiraishi wouldn't be able to rally normally against Kin, at the very least. Shiraishi kept getting better and better in that match up, too.

Why wouldn't Shiraishi take games off Tokugawa holding back? With Star Bible and Kazuya's balanced stats, Shiraishi should overwhelm him in every way possible.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 4, 2023, Original Post Date: Oct 3, 2023 ---

Poll is up!

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Suggestions:

Romeo VS QP

Atobe VS Bismarck

 

[-Ken-]

I think it's mention that Osval ninjutsu work against Prince who had pretty good showing against Echizen? Sanada did pretty well against him.

Too bad the fight is skip over in the anime.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

I think it's mention that Osval ninjutsu work against Prince who had pretty good showing against Echizen? Sanada did pretty well against him.

Too bad the fight is skip over in the anime.

I will probably do a france thread. Lmao

 

[Hardy]

I think it's mention that Osval ninjutsu work against Prince who had pretty good showing against Echizen? Sanada did pretty well against him.

Too bad the fight is skip over in the anime.

His ninjutsu worked on everyone not named Camus, yeah.

The match itself was the prime example of something the anime should had enhanced... instead they just skipped it lol.

I think the ninja was too reliant on his gimmicks and once Sanada got them out of the way with In, he was way too much for the French. Kinda like removing Data from Yanagi.

If you think about it, Sanada kinda never got a good match in NPoT which may be why his shadow gets so much screen time against Atobe (besides the history they already have). The best he got may be the match against Tokugawa but like 3 chapters later we find out the Hser wasn't even trying.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

His ninjutsu worked on everyone not named Camus, yeah.

The match itself was the prime example of something the anime should had enhanced... instead they just skipped it lol.

I think the ninja was too reliant on his gimmicks and once Sanada got them out of the way with In, he was way too much for the French. Kinda like removing Data from Yanagi.

If you think about it, Sanada kinda never got a good match in NPoT which may be why his shadow gets so much screen time against Atobe (besides the history they already have). The best he got may be the match against Tokugawa but like 3 chapters later we find out the Hser wasn't even trying.

Is it mentioned that Osval beats other reps bar Camus? Or it just worked on them? But not necessarily beat them?

wait, I did a france thread already. hahah. I put a poll who is france second best player. lol

 

[-Ken-]

Yeah, Sanada got trashline (not even sideline) by NPoT a fair bit. I wasn't even Sanada fan but even I was disappointed by the way he was treated. I wish he would get at least 1 full good singles match but it's probably not going to happen. His match against Osval should have been a lot better. Osval didn't even use his secret hidden tech

I can't imagine how it would feel reading NPoT as someone who was hardcore fan of Sanada.

On that note, Fuji also surprisingly was treat pretty badly although he was an extremely popular character. But at least Fuji fan get to know he improve and manage to fight Echizen pretty evenly.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Sanada

Yeah, Sanada got trashline (not even sideline) by NPoT a fair bit. I wasn't even Sanada fan but even I was disappointed by the way he was treated. I wish he would get at least 1 full good singles match but it's probably not going to happen. His match against Osval should have been a lot better. Osval didn't even use his secret hidden tech

I can't imagine how it would feel reading NPoT as someone who was hardcore fan of Sanada.

On that note, Fuji also surprisingly was treat pretty badly although he was an extremely popular character. But at least Fuji fan get to know he improve and manage to fight Echizen pretty evenly.

Imo. The plot demanded it.

If Osval uses the technique. I think he beats Sanada

Then we will have Camus VS Duke.

I personally dont buy much the "Duke can Beat Camus" thing. I think Camus is stronger than Duke. Ngl

Then Japan will lose to France.so yeah not good plot.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 5, 2023, Original Post Date: Oct 5, 2023 ---

Lol

Sanada is winning by a landslide

Sorry Shiraishi, but you might be down to Kite tier now.

Sad for someone who once stronger than Fuji

 

[Ganonslayer101]

Sanada


Imo. The plot demanded it.

If Osval uses the technique. I think he beats Sanada

Then we will have Camus VS Duke.

I personally dont buy much the "Duke can Beat Camus" thing. I think Camus is stronger than Duke. Ngl

Then Japan will lose to France.so yeah not good plot.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 5, 2023, Original Post Date: Oct 5, 2023 ---

Lol

Sanada is winning by a landslide

Sorry Shiraishi, but you might be down to Kite tier now.

Sad for someone who once stronger than Fuji

Kite isn't scoring a single point against Shiraishi let's not be crazy here

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Kite isn't scoring a single point against Shiraishi let's not be crazy here

Nah. I think Shiraishi will win. But Kite will score some points for sure.

 

[Hardy]

Sanada is winning by a landslide

Sorry Shiraishi, but you might be down to Kite tier now.

Sad for someone who once stronger than Fuji

The problem with that is that it means Sanada must be stronger than Kin which I'm not a fan of.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

The problem with that is that it means Sanada must be stronger than Kin which I'm not a fan of.

I mean Kintaro will have his own powerup in the Finals

It will be in doubles instead of singles though.

It is nice to see Kintaro to be a good doubles player or specialist.

But I hope he still be more of a Singles Player. Isnt he implied to be the rival of Ryoma in his same age and bracket?

 

[Hardy]

I mean Kintaro will have his own powerup in the Finals

It will be in doubles instead of singles though.

It is nice to see Kintaro to be a good doubles player or specialist.

But I hope he still be more of a Singles Player. Isnt he implied to be the rival of Ryoma in his same age and bracket?

To explain myself better. I currently have:


-Shiraishi thanks to data and taking advantage of positioning in doubles >>> Kin. The gap between them was only getting bigger, even.
-Removing those advantages, Shiraishi =~= Kin. I think saying he's better is too much but I find it reasonable to think he can normally rally with a TnK user.
-Kin => Dorgias.
-As such, Shiraishi =~= Dorgias.
-Atobe (up until he lost to Irie) < Dorgias. He cannot rally with a TnK user.

But then Sanada is comfortably better than all of them? He can easily beat Dorgias while Atobe was strictly worse? When has he shown he can keep a rally against a TnK level player? This was a big deal in Yukimura vs Tezuka, Kirihara vs Sieg and Fuji vs Ryoma. They all got upgrades that boosted their stats.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

To explain myself better. I currently have:


-Shiraishi thanks to data and taking advantage of positioning in doubles >>> Kin. The gap between them was only getting bigger, even.
-Removing those advantages, Shiraishi =~= Kin. I think saying he's better is too much but I find it reasonable to think he can normally rally with a TnK user.
-Kin => Dorgias.
-As such, Shiraishi =~= Dorgias.
-Atobe (up until he lost to Irie) < Dorgias. He cannot rally with a TnK user.

But then Sanada is comfortably better than all of them? He can easily beat Dorgias while Atobe was strictly worse? When has he shown he can keep a rally against a TnK level player? This was a big deal in Yukimura vs Tezuka, Kirihara vs Sieg and Fuji vs Ryoma. They all got upgrades that boosted their stats.

Why dont you want Sanada to be stronger than Atobe and Kintaro during the QF VS France?

I mean Sanada was selected to be in S2 right? Maybe he is really stronger than the two during that TIME.

However Ryoma was in S3. I am not sure if I will say that France Version Sanada (VS Osval) > France Version Ryoma (VS Ludovic)

So yeah sometimes power scaling in confusing especially if there is huge power up or evolution off screen or on screen or in middle of a match

 

[Hardy]

Why dont you want Sanada to be stronger than Atobe and Kintaro during the QF VS France?

I mean Sanada was selected to be in S2 right? Maybe he is really stronger than the two during that TIME.

However Ryoma was in S3. I am not sure if I will say that France Version Sanada (VS Osval) > France Version Ryoma (VS Ludovic)

So yeah sometimes power scaling in confusing especially if there is huge power up or evolution off screen or on screen or in middle of a match

The team selected against France has no reasonable justification at all since they picked 4 Msers. Sanada was selected at S2 over Byoudouin, Tanegashima, Oni and Tokugawa, does that mean he was stronger than all of them?

 

[-Ken-]

Why dont you want Sanada to be stronger than Atobe and Kintaro during the QF VS France?

I mean Sanada was selected to be in S2 right? Maybe he is really stronger than the two during that TIME.

However Ryoma was in S3. I am not sure if I will say that France Version Sanada (VS Osval) > France Version Ryoma (VS Ludovic)

So yeah sometimes power scaling in confusing especially if there is huge power up or evolution off screen or on screen or in middle of a match

Since when did the position is really the strength of the player? The easiest thing to see here is doubles pro being in D2 rather than D1. And Niou/Duke that beat them is also in D2 instead of D1. That's the 2 strongest pair in the entire tournaments. And Oni is S3 over Yukimura in S2.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

The team selected against France has no reasonable justification at all since they picked 4 Msers. Sanada was selected at S2 over Byoudouin, Tanegashima, Oni and Tokugawa, does that mean he was stronger than all of them?

No.

These Japan Coaches just like to field different lineup every round. Lmao

And maybe they are reserving Genius 5 against Germany? Since Genius 5 have a tendency to overuse and damage their bodies in a match?

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 7, 2023, Original Post Date: Oct 7, 2023 ---

Since when did the position is really the strength of the player? The easiest thing to see here is doubles pro being in D2 rather than D1. And Niou/Duke that beat them is also in D2 instead of D1. That's the 2 strongest pair in the entire tournaments. And Oni is S3 over Yukimura in S2.

I agree.

But why are we considering Romeo to be Spain's Second Strongest Player (pre Ryoga) just because he was originally locked in S2?

Anyway you and hardy are both right. Since you can use a quick kill lineup like Switzerland did against Japan

 

[Hardy]

No.

These Japan Coaches just like to field different lineup every round. Lmao

And maybe they are reserving Genius 5 against Germany? Since Genius 5 have a tendency to overuse and damage their bodies in a match?

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 7, 2023, Original Post Date: Oct 7, 2023 ---

I agree.

But why are we considering Romeo to be Spain's Second Strongest Player (pre Ryoga) just because he was originally locked in S2?

Anyway you and hardy are both right. Since you can use a quick kill lineup like Switzerland did against Japan

They wanted to play Byoudouin so it's not like they were saving him for Germany. Also they could had played Irie or had Ohmagari or Ochi instead of Yanagi in doubles but didn't.

A lot of teams play their lineups in different ways. Some honour their players' wishes. Romeo is proud of being the second strongest singles player and wants that S2 position to represent it (much like how Atobe in Hyotei is always S1 no matter what except for his match against Mizuki). But this doesn't always apply and there's a lot of bizarre cases. Yamabuki up until the Nationals for example drafted lots and left the singles positions to luck.

 

[Ganonslayer101]

They wanted to play Byoudouin so it's not like they were saving him for Germany. Also they could had played Irie or had Ohmagari or Ochi instead of Yanagi in doubles but didn't.

A lot of teams play their lineups in different ways. Some honour their players' wishes. Romeo is proud of being the second strongest singles player and wants that S2 position to represent it (much like how Atobe in Hyotei is always S1 no matter what except for his match against Mizuki). But this doesn't always apply and there's a lot of bizarre cases. Yamabuki up until the Nationals for example drafted lots and left the singles positions to luck.

I think it's a matter of the coaches, particularly Mifune, just trusting the MSers growth and synergy with the High Schoolers. Japan as a whole has the best MSer pool in the tournament from what we see. They don't have the best MSer, but definitely the largest number of high tier ones. And each one evolves remarkably quickly.
Also Mifune does just pick on whims, man literally paired Kimijima and Shiraishi just because they are handsome.
Arguably he is fishing for Howlings.
Also from a meta sense, it would be boring if every match was Byoudin, Oni, Duke, Tanegashima, Yukimura, Kintarou, Ryoma
It's the same reason Seigaku kept fielding Fuji/Takashi despite the pair sucking and wasting #2 Fuji on it or why Eiji was in S2 against Higa. It's more fun for the viewer
As for other countries, they're hardly relevant after their match with Japan besides Germany so there's no point in making more than the minimum number of guys

Long post short, the match order is largely irrelevant for deciding strength outside of S1 usually