Mag Talk Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk

[◆ T.D.A ◆]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Kishi will get a place in the museum one day, he'll be a legend by default, considering Naruto is the most popular manga in the world, especially in the west, plus the fact Naruto will still be here in 3-4 years time probably, so it's going to continue getting high sales.

 

[Koshi_Inaba]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Kishi will get in someday, but he's not going to be a legend.Sure he and Naruto are popular but he didn't set up the standard in shonen manga the way Dragon Ball, Hokuto no Ken, Slam Dunk, YYH, etc. did

 

[◆ T.D.A ◆]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

But for the next gen he will be, I mean you become a legend after you retire or when you are at the last stage of your career, Naruto, One Piece etc wil inspire young kids, who are about 6-13 years old right now, they'll be inspired by them, and then the future mangakas of this world will base their work on Kishi or Oda's work, like they did themselves. Obviously right now, the current gen is not going to view him as a legend.

 

[Koshi_Inaba]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Naruto is popular but it's won't be as legendary as OP or dare I say, Fullmetal Alchemist. FMA especially, is not only popular but acclaimed in Japan. This is a list of top 50 manga series, as ranked by Japan’s Agency for Cultural Affairs:
http://www.japanprobe.com/2007/06/08/the-top-50-manga-series/
I know it's still opinion, but considering they must have chosen for it's impact, any manga on the list is probably very influential in japan and not just popular. Naruto didn't even make the cut

 

[Crude]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Kishi will probably have to draw/write some other (different) series before he can be considered for a spot in the museum. As I see it Oda has much more of a chance.

 

[StrangerAtaru]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

I think Oda isn't quite there yet...but he is the closest of many of the Jump mangaka from his era and beyond. If OP is complete and is a perfect masterpiece from start to finish that influences generations after him, then he'll secure his place easily. I can't say he's in yet because his tale is still being told.

Kishi...I say we have to hold off and let time tell. If he has another series that proves he has more to him or isn't merely a flash in the pan, or if Naruto sort of becomes more influential in a way we don't see it yet...then it may just. But as it stands, I can't say he will. I sort of see him like Yudetamago: sure they had a great series that was really popular...but is it important enough to bring them in alongside Tezuka, Urasawa or Toriyama?

 

[◆ T.D.A ◆]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

IIRC Kishi said he would one day like to write his other manga Mario which is a gag manga.

 

[Drmke]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

IIRC Kishi said he would one day like to write his other manga Mario which is a gag manga.

If he ever did that, it would probably have initially popularity considering Naruto fans flocking to his next work, but then later either die off or just get decent popularity like Toriyama's Cowa!, Kajika, and Sandland.

He will probably never see anything close to the success he has had with Naruto with another manga.

 

[Kaiten]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

I think Oda isn't quite there yet...but he is the closest of many of the Jump mangaka from his era and beyond. If OP is complete and is a perfect masterpiece from start to finish that influences generations after him, then he'll secure his place easily. I can't say he's in yet because his tale is still being told.

Oda will get in by default. Best selling manga ever overshadows objective criticism. Weather he deserves to or not remains to be seen; chapter 1 - 562 deserve, how he finishes would seal the deal. Kishi is a no. His storytelling is to erratic; sometimes good, sometimes okay, never classic. He stretches to much and has had to many superfluous arcs. A very good series but Naruto does not rank with the greatest of all time, doesn't even come close. And Naruto is all Kishi can be judged on. Having the best selling international manga deserves no more than a mention, international sales form an insignificant percentage of manga sales.

As for Renkin: getting an after the fact anime is a pretty big accomplishment. It is a bit shonen by numbers, especially in comparison to Kenshin. Watsuki is good enough to get in but I would not vote for him in his first year of eligibility and when I do I would second guess my vote a bit. Developing three successful assistants is quite the accomplishment as well.

 

[◆ T.D.A ◆]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Deserves more than a mention. Manga isn't a big industry, it's pretty niche, like someone said Naruto introduced a lot of people to the world of manga through its popularity, and attracted soft core readers, who some have become hard core manga readers.

Most things are not regarded classic when they are in thing or a present thing, Microsoft XP only really became known as a classic, after Vista and its failure.

Plus I wouldn't blame all the abnormity on Kishi, considering he himself during interviews has said that the editor made him implement some things and stopped him from doing others. BTW the editor was changed after Part 1, I guess maybe that's why Part 2 is quite different from Part 1 in feel.

 

[Koshi_Inaba]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

A lot of manga is considered classic in japan even if it's not popular internationally, Ushio to Tora, Doubutsu no Oishasan, Tale of Genji, Ookiku Furikabutte, Banana Fish. Naruto is popular, but in term of quality and impact on the medium itself it isn't among the greatest. It's good but far from being the best. From the infromation I gathered, those titles by the Agency of Cultural Affairs is what considered classics, in Japan at least

 

[Josl]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Deserves more than a mention. Manga isn't a big industry, it's pretty niche, like someone said Naruto introduced a lot of people to the world of manga through its popularity, and attracted soft core readers, who some have become hard core manga readers.

I think you are wrong. Dragonball(Z) made Manga popular worldwide. Naruto just surfed on the wave made by Toriyama.

Does anyone know how much a Volume of Naruto sells in the USA?
I read somewhere around 20 000 per Volume but i can't belive such a low number considereing the size of america.

 

[◆ T.D.A ◆]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Does anyone know how much a Volume of Naruto sells in the USA?
I read somewhere around 20 000 per Volume but i can't belive such a low number considereing the size of america.

Please this is basic stuff you judge on the size of the market more than the size of the country, especially when it's a niche industry.

By your logic, we're suppose to expect more manga sales in USA than in Japan?

 

[StrangerAtaru]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Oda will get in by default. Best selling manga ever overshadows objective criticism. Weather he deserves to or not remains to be seen; chapter 1 - 562 deserve, how he finishes would seal the deal. Kishi is a no. His storytelling is to erratic; sometimes good, sometimes okay, never classic. He stretches to much and has had to many superfluous arcs. A very good series but Naruto does not rank with the greatest of all time, doesn't even come close. And Naruto is all Kishi can be judged on. Having the best selling international manga deserves no more than a mention, international sales form an insignificant percentage of manga sales.

I'm not saying Oda isn't getting in. Personally I say he gets in easily, super easily. I just don't want to see him get in while he's still telling the story he needs to. Kishimoto "could" get in eventually but he has to prove either that Naruto is that important to the history of manga...or that he can tell other stories and be really, really good at them. (and that a lot of Naruto was merely just the pressure of his first major series) I never listed Kishi as an immediate or even as getting in, just as someone who needs to prove himself further in a way that Naruto isn't doing.

As for Renkin: getting an after the fact anime is a pretty big accomplishment. It is a bit shonen by numbers, especially in comparison to Kenshin. Watsuki is good enough to get in but I would not vote for him in his first year of eligibility and when I do I would second guess my vote a bit. Developing three successful assistants is quite the accomplishment as well.

I think that one of the few signs that maybe Watsuki has more to him than Kenshin is Buso Renkin. That could help him eventually get into a museum/hall-of-fame...but as I said: whereas Kenshin essentially was one of the defining action series of the 90s, Renkin is more a cult classic of the current decade that's now ending. It's not enough to establish Watsuki as massively important but it's a step in a direction.

 

[Negative Syndicate]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

絵大　新世紀アイドル伝説　彼方セブンチェンジ(新連載巻頭36P)

Seven Change's first chapter is 36 pages long. If it is true, is this too short for chapter 1 of regular series?

 

[Kaiten]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

ITA that One Piece is hard to evaluate right now. Despite the impact it has had already there is a long road ahead. Oda may well only be half way down, if that. Plenty of series have; DBZ after the Freezia arc, Inuyasha after the Shichininyai. There is nothing to say One Piece won't suffer the same fate.

I'm surprised Morita and Katsura don't get more love. I left Morita off my list, undeservedly. Rokudenashi Blues, Rookies, and Beshari Gurashi are more than enough to earn high honors. Rookies has developed into a massive mixed media franchise and one of the biggest catalog sellers in Japan. He may not be the flashiest shonen mangaka but he is one of the best writers and artists. I thought Katsura had an online following, at least for I"S and Zetman. No love, apparently.

 

[Rejuvenation]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

^Katsura is good. Very under appreciated in my opinion.

Kishi gives me the feeling he could be a one hit wonder. Granted his one hit is right behind Slam Dunk in manga sales. To expect him to write anything as popular as Naruto is too high a standard really. The fact that he changed editors between the two parts could also mean that it was his Part 1 editor that helped him become as huge as he did. In Part 2 he introduces Taka and was just going to have them sitting around doing nothing but his Part 2 editor made him do something with them. You should not create superfluous characters or have others standing around doing nothing.

Despite that, Kishi would probably get in eventually just because Naruto was one of the few that sold 100,000,000 volumes. Much like Oda as of now would already be in due to having the #1 selling manga ever. I doubt it will come down to Naruto changing the way shounen is done or anything like that.

Though I guess even number of sales shouldn't automatically qualify someone considering Kubo is fairly high in numbers at this point too...

But for the next gen he will be, I mean you become a legend after you retire or when you are at the last stage of your career, Naruto, One Piece etc wil inspire young kids, who are about 6-13 years old right now, they'll be inspired by them, and then the future mangakas of this world will base their work on Kishi or Oda's work, like they did themselves. Obviously right now, the current gen is not going to view him as a legend.

I sure as hell hope they stop when Part 1 ends.

 

[kewl0210]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

Kishi wrote this in the author's comment column on the cover of this volume. It's sort of a response to the last one, which I mentioned he said he's almost done.

"Last time in the comment column in volume 47 when I said 'I'll be going all out writing towards the end.' I got a lot of comments saying 'Is it already ending?'. I've decided the plot, but it'll keep continuing for a while! That I'm going to draw with all I've got hasn't changed, but I hope you enjoy "Naruto" from here on!"

I got that from the picture of the cover Heiji posted, here:
http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1661816&postcount=645
So it seems this is the last arc but it'll be long. How long you think it'll last? Maybe a year or so...

 

[Kaiten]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

This discussion is better left for the Naruto forum. Please post about individual series in their thread.

 

[Akiyama]

Re: Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk v.3

When I was reading some of the achieve posts in the ToC over the years and I found this great site. Database Google does a decent job of translating. Has all the series that have started from the beginning. 4 digit number are last two digits of the year then the issue number. Example 2003 Issue 12 will be 0312. Automatically updated every Monday.

Sorry if the link was messed up, copy and paste the link and use translate.google.com, it may or may not work,