Huh? I was talking about Blackbeard talking to Luffy in Impel Down:
I'm talking about before? How long did they know? But of course, I guess it's all moot question given despite Luffy's father being known, his bounty hasn't rocketed up to represent that and the danger he possesses to the World Government.
Ah, well, that is impossible to know lol. I am going to venture the guess garp did not quite go out of his way to tell sengoku at least. I mean, garp isn't the brightest one around but even he probably would not be very keen on going "sup sengoku! Beautiful weather today. Also, years ago I found and adopted roger's son. Want some crackers?".
Yea Ace never really beat anybody top tier IIRC. He briefly fought Smoker and Aokiji and lost to B.B. and tied with Jinbei. Most of the time he was just wrecking mooks. In the small sample size of evidence we have my guess is he probably wasn’t in the top three strongest of the WB pirates.
Only reason I'm asking you is because I was hoping the manga did state it, and you'd know, as I tend not to remember much. I don't think Garp is as dumb as one would think, but he's far too free spirited most of the time to care. He most likely kept it a secret, but Sengoku and others found out somehow. though maybe Garp may have confirmed Sengoku's suspicions like that, actually
What? Where did you get that? He was a Pirate for 3 years. We barely have a history of his life, yet you state he never been any top tiers? That's absurd. He lost to people of the highest tier. Admirals and someone capable of being an Emperor.
Ace was in line to become Pirate King. Whitebeard was grooming him. Chinjao also points out that if Ace wasn't killed so early, he'd likely have become Pirate King and Sengoku also said the same thing. Ace was an exceptional Pirate.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/79zisa/sbs_87_information/
Just because BB has an ability to nullify other abilities does not mean he didn't use haki. We can certainly make the point that BB did not use haki hardening though. Considering ace and BB were both experienced NW pirates and BB even comments a number of times on haki then it seems clear he at least was familiar with it. Anyways, since we are talking about haki, a generic skill which anyone can learn and two experienced NW pirates then I would argue the most likely scenario is that both of them used haki during the fight. It's not like BB using his yami fruit would mean he doesn't need haki. It's a similar scenario to jinbe. Up to the big mom arc we never saw him use hardening however that doesn't mean he wasn't using the less advanced versions of haki before.
how do we know he didn't uses haki? He and Ace had a hand-to-hand fight or close to it, so clearly his devil fruit power wasn't enough to take down Ace. Where is your evidence for anything you said???
He did use Armament.
Oh, that episode confused the sh*t out of me when I rewatched the series last time. But now it cleared up.
I don't think BB used Haki in that fight mainly because the series made it a pretty big deal that the Darkness Fruit can seal other fruit user's abilities during that time, which, in hindsight, seems like a weird thing to point out when Haki allows folks to touch Devil Fruit users as well. In the context of when that chapter first came out, this was way before Haki was a solid concept in the series, so I think it's safer to assume that Haki played no role in that fight and it was the Darkness Fruit that was inhibiting Ace.
Doesn't have to. There's no rule or functioning logic that makes it impossible to use something except it's mentioned. King's Haki wasn't mentioned until chapter 500+. but it was used in chapter 1, so that really isn't a valid point.
Realistically speaking the biggest reason to think BB used haki is just how ordinary a skill haki is, specially among strong and experienced people. Both of which apply to ace and BB. Haki isn't something that people magically started using after the war, during it we simply didn't see it because the most common forms of haki are largely invisible to the naked eye. Haki is a generic and ordinary skill which any pirate worth a fraction of a damn would be perfectly capable of using. The most reasonable scenario here is, by far, that both of them used haki. For the same reason it is certain that virtually anyone who mattered during the great war was using haki.There is no solid proof of that being the case.
Ace threw out his Fire Lance before BB touched him...
So your example with Ace doesn't really work as this doesn't prove or disprove the notion that BB attacked Ace with Haki or with his DF, as Ace's attack had already hit BB a bit before BB hit him.
In Luffy's case, Luffy had hit BB with a surprise attack while BB wasn't using the DF ability. Though, it is likely that Luffy's speed would have negated any long term sealing as his fist didn't stay connected with BB for very long, again, there is no evidence that that couldn't have been the case.
Whitebeard's case is similar to Luffy's. BB had just been slashed by Whitebeard while he had his abilities activated. In the next panel, while he's rolling in pain, his abilities are clearly inactive, meaning that Whitebeard could now use his powers on him. It's within the realm of plausibility that if BB had kept his cool and reactivated his powers, then Whitebeard wouldn't have been able to use his Quake like he did. Though BB would still be open to another slash with the Naginata.
There is nothing wrong with believing that BB used haki back then, but I don't think there is any solid proof leaning towards either conclusion.