Discussion Zeldris

[OtakuFreak]

It's really strange how despite him being weaker than the Masters (he even admitted it) he still could hold his own and hurt Mael (holding back). Not to mention being a decent threat to the Sins squad with his ON. He showed way more impressive feats than the Masters themselves and one could argue that he was even more impressive than the Sinner. You could argue that it's just Nakaba's BS writing as usual, but I've come with a theory that could explain it.

Zel had his Father's borrowed magic. What does the DK's magic do? The DK's magic is essentially Inversion and in Purgatory it was stated that it could convert any and all manner of attacks (well, only magical ones later on, lol) into Healing and Fortification.

The theory is quite simple and straightforward, during the whole Camelot fight Zel was getting stronger by absorbing magical attacks from Ludo and King and that's why he could keep up later on with Mael. This would explain why before that he stated that he was weaker than the Masters. He probably got considerably stronger by absorbing King's Sunflower magic attack, surpassing them.

The strange aura he shows after King's attacks maybe shows that he powered up?

What do you think? Maybe I'm reaching, but if this was the case, it could make some sense IMO.

Problem is we've already been told that Zeldris borrowed power from the Demon King is simply immunity to all magical attacks. It hasn't ever been implied that it is inversion, like his father's original magic.

As for why he did so well against Mael? Mael was considerably holding back. That's all to it really. Mael didn't want to kill him, or even injure him from the looks of it and only did so out of a duty to ensure Merlin could get her spell off.

I mean Mael outright shot a Cruel Sun at the Sinner yet never used his grace offensively against Zeldris once in the entire fight.

 

[Shadowlord123]

Problem is we've already been told that Zeldris borrowed power from the Demon King is simply immunity to all magical attacks. It hasn't ever been implied that it is inversion, like his father's original magic.

As for why he did so well against Mael? Mael was considerably holding back. That's all to it really. Mael didn't want to kill him, or even injure him from the looks of it and only did so out of a duty to ensure Merlin could get her spell off.

I mean Mael outright shot a Cruel Sun at the Sinner yet never used his grace offensively against Zeldris once in the entire fight.

Yeah, that's kinda true, but for the looks of the page I posted, it looks like he actually absorbed the attack? Maybe he can partially do what the DK does to some extent? It's some of his borrowed magic after all. Idk.

Mael actually used his Grace against Zeldris. You can see it in the extra pages drawn in volume 36:

Helios Fair, an attack that concentrates the sun power that swirles inside his body in one point. It's an offensive attack from his Grace clearly and Zeldris tanked it. Btw, this description is from FKS's translations. You can find them in page 48 of the "Volume Cover and Official Art Thread" if you're interested.

 

[Samael Morningstar]

Zel didn't tank it, that attack overcame the magic immunity and in the next page made him cough blood

 

[OtakuFreak]

Yeah, that's kinda true, but for the looks of the page I posted, it looks like he actually absorbed the attack? Maybe he can partially do what the DK does to some extent? It's some of his borrowed magic after all. Idk.

If that was the case then it is confusing how the inversion didn't work against Meliodas? Maybe it is Zeldris own power that the aura is emitting, perhaps it has nothing to do with negating sunflower.

Mael actually used his Grace against Zeldris. You can see it in the extra pages drawn in volume 36:

Helios Fair, an attack that concentrates the sun power that swirles inside his body in one point. It's an offensive attack from his Grace clearly and Zeldris tanked it. Btw, this description is from FKS's translations. You can find them in page 48 of the "Volume Cover and Official Art Thread" if you're interested.

Fair enough, Mael used his grace offensively, but looking at the destructive capabilities of ''Helios Fair'' along with the damage Zeldris sustains, I'd still argue Mael was holding back considerably.

From what we've seen from both Escanor and Mael, there are a multitude of attacks associated with the grace that do considerably more damage than ''Helios Fair''.

 

[Shadowlord123]

Zel didn't tank it, that attack overcame the magic immunity and in the next page made him cough blood

He tanked it as he could still continue fighting after that without much of a problem.

 

[Samael Morningstar]

He tanked it as he could still continue fighting after that without much of a problem.

He coughed blood in the next page and said "S.. Such power"

 

[Shadowlord123]

He coughed blood in the next page and said "S.. Such power"

And he continued fighting after that. That fighting sequence is the one we saw in chapter 298 with extra pages.

 

[Samael Morningstar]

And he continued fighting after that. That fighting sequence is the one we saw in chapter 298 with extra pages.

I think for you tank means one can't even stand up after the attack let alone fight but tanking something actually means being able to take that attack straight without any damages, continuing fighting afterwards is not related to tanking, it's the stamina.

For example, like broly taking the super kamehameha at point blank range for goku(in dbz movie 8) and comes out totally unfazed, yes that's called tanking

 

[BurlapJack]

I think for you tank means one can't even stand up after the attack let alone fight but tanking something actually means being able to take that attack straight without any damages, continuing fighting afterwards is not related to tanking, it's the stamina.

For example, like broly taking the super kamehameha at point blank range for goku(in dbz movie 8) and comes out totally unfazed, yes that's called tanking

Tanking is taking damage and continuing regardless

Which is what happened

 

[Shadowlord123]

I think for you tank means one can't even stand up after the attack let alone fight but tanking something actually means being able to take that attack straight without any damages, continuing fighting afterwards is not related to tanking, it's the stamina.

For example, like broly taking the super kamehameha at point blank range for goku(in dbz movie 8) and comes out totally unfazed, yes that's called tanking

I think we have different conceptions of tanking. If I understood correctly for you tanking is someone who takes an attack head on and suffers no damage whatsoever and continues fighting. For me tanking means taking an attack head on and continue fighting, independently of the damage suffered by that attack (as long as he/she can continue fighting, for me that person has tanked the attack).

The point I was trying to make is that Zeldris took an offensive attack from Mael's Grace head on and could still continue fighting without much of a problem.

 

[OtakuFreak]

I mean, an actual tank is something seen as highly powerful, impenetrable and ultimately hard to damage. So in the case of ''tanking'' damage, I'd argue it is more about taking the hit and receiving little to no damage at all, not taking the hit and surviving. Otherwise, we have fodder characters being capable of ''tanking'' top-tier attacks. Like how Gilthunder took Zeldris magic face on and survived.

An appropriate example of ''tanking'' would be Ludoshel attacking Derieri with his magic, whom didn't resist at all and took literally no damage. Zeldris taking a hit from Mael's grace, then groaning in pain afterwards whilst coughing blood (or something of the sort) is not tanking.

It is more down to your own opinion, but I think @BurlapJack point is somewhat silly.

 

[Shadowlord123]

I think y'all got my point perfectly. There's no need to debate whether tanking is taking an attack head on without any damage and continue fighting or taking an attack head on and continue fighting, independently of the damage. Those concepts like @OtakuFreak said are more down to your own opinion. Point is that Zeldris took the attack and continued fighting afterwards.