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Is it Tokugawa? I thought echizen might be up next.
Sorry, it's not a fact, but rather I expect both matches to run at the same time. I should have made that clearer, my apologies.Is it Tokugawa? I thought echizen might be up next.
?@Airgrimes
I don't think it's right to call the rivalry one-sided, since in the fanbook it says in Byoudouin's profile that his and Tokugawa's fates are connected.
Agreed.Well, from what I've read in the manga, Tokugawa wants to defeat Byodoin because he's the first person ever to defeat Tokugawa effortlessly.
And this is pretty much my point. Byoudouin isn't playing the role of Tezuka or Ryoma's dad who is helping Ryoma train so he can challenge them as a stronger player.Its not because he wants the No. 1 badge. Probably just a plus. Also because Tokugawa had his dream of being a professional tennis player shattered by this one person. I don't see Tokugawa and Byodoin a one-sided rivalry. If you ask me, he seems to be the high schooler version of Ryoma. Ryoma kept losing and strives to defeat his father and Tezuka, which he eventually did right at the end of the anime. Whose to say Tokugawa won't? Working hard to beat your senpai may payoff (to some people)
Just because he's goal is common doesn't mean you have to loathe his character, or for anyone else here. I'm sure (hopefully), Konomi will give him more character and more background. Then maybe you'll like him more. Hating his character from just no real official matches is kind of low (Fayte's reasonng is unjustified [irrelevant]). I'm sure Konomi wouldn't have introduced him if he was too fodder. Tokugawa is the 2nd/3rd favourite high schooler and because his voice actor is even more popular, I think it'll be a complete waste for Konomi to introduce him then wipe him out a second time. Not only that but Tokugawa fans will be furious. I wouldn't be, but I would be disappointed. Hype = nothing. Just to let you know, Tokugawa's character is someone I can relate with.?
But isn't that just... Well... Like so many others in the series? It makes Tokugawa's goal so common.
Kirihara has the same goal against Rikkai's Big 3. Kirihara and the whole of Rikkai train ridiculously hard.
Tokugawa's reason for not caring about representing his country is just annoyingly weak. Since Ryoma and Kirihara are both able shift their focus to representing their nation as well as defeating someone that wiped them.
And this is pretty much my point. Byoudouin isn't playing the role of Tezuka or Ryoma's dad who is helping Ryoma train so he can challenge them as a stronger player.
Byoudouin wiped Tokugawa and went and followed his dreams of challenging people around the world. He doesn't even waste a thought on Tokugawa and quite rightly so.
That's why I say Tokugawa's case isn't the same as Ryoma's.
"low"? Careful with your words there.Just because he's goal is common doesn't mean you have to loathe his character, or for anyone else here. I'm sure (hopefully), Konomi will give him more character and more background. Then maybe you'll like him more. Hating his character from just no real official matches is kind of low
But what does this prove in Tokugawa's favour? It just shows that Tokugawa's rivalry is nothing different to the MSers like Kirihara to the Big 3, Hiyoshi to Atobe there are probably others.Byodoin didn't give a rats ass about Tokugawa, of which, I believe effortless defeat is not worth your time. But if Tokugawa was to defeat Byodoin, then Tokugawa will be acknowledged by Byodoin as a worthy opponent. That is what its like for every tough opponent in the series. Thats how Tezuka came to be too. He didn't give a rats ass about Atobe's/Sanada's rivalry with him but after his defeat, he did acknowledge both. You only acknowledge people who defeat you. That's why Byodoin is barely harsh to Oni.
No, we know Tokugawa well enough. I've found it interesting that he has taken a liking to Ryoma as a younger brother and is a little jealous Ryoga according to the fanbook actually.I think the reason you guys don't find Tokugawa interesting is because you barely know much about him. I like him because what happened to him happened to me (unrelated to tennis). I had a complete douche ruin my life for 5 years. After that time, I finally had the courage to punch him right in the face. Then he wanted to be friends. But I didn't.
How am I being biased? Nobody is being biased.I'd be careful with words if people here stopped being biased.
?Wow. So much pessimism. I can agree that Tokugawa is nothing special but because I've been through something similar to him, I think he deserves some support. I did find that he might be the main High schooler character so Konomi might make him a more likeable character in the upcoming chapters.
There are similar hard working characters who I dislike in the series. I don't understand why you want to ignore my reasoning then.I find that even though most characters are similar they're not hated. So I don't find your reason for that justified. He's reason for training hard isn't weak. Everyone trains hard if they want to improve. Tokugawa wants to improve to defeat one person. Yes I can agree that his tunneled vision is Byodoin is a lame ass reason but because (not sure) whether you've sat on the same boat, you could feel the same way.
So? Then it means he is just wasting his youth in Japan, a country he has already acknowledged as being weaker in tennis than the a lot of places in the world all for his pride that he lost at 16?Also, we all know Tokugawa is 1st stringer material but maybe he actually doesn't want to become one? Think about that?
I haven't jumped to "pessimistic conclusions". I haven't stuck the storylines that Konomi has given us.He already travels abroad for other tennis training and possibly matches. And he has even said that the world is far bigger than Japanese tennis. Maybe he wants to play for another country and not Japan. There's many reasons, you just have to think through them rather than jump to pessimistic conclusions. Don't stick to the storylines that Konomi gives us. Try think outside of that. When you do, I'd give you points for proper justification.
We don't know what it means, but their fate being intertwined has no effect on whether or not people wish to be Tokugawa fans or not.Tokugawa giving his life to defeat Byodoin is something we haven't had yet. Sure its not great reasoning but there might be something more to that. Remember that his fate and Byodoin's is interwined? What do you think that could mean? I had a silly thought that Tokugawa knew Byodoin's younger sister and Byodoin got all over-protective and crushed Tokugawa. Silly but you never know.
In other words, he didn't give a crap. He doesn't care about the rivally jsut like Atobe or Sanada do. Both of them would play outside of S1 just to face him, but Tezuka doesn't care. You said it yourself, he thinks some other things (Seigaku / Ryoma's improvement) are more important than a silly rivallyActually, Tezuka playing S2 in the nationals isn't because he didn't give a crap but because he knew Atobe would have improved and decided Ryoma should take the S1 slot to give Ryoma a boost of improvement.
How is his role minor compared to Higa and Shiten, who were just introduced to be defeated by Seigaku? I can understand Shiten as it has some interesting cahracters (a super Kamio, a super Ishida, a Muga Master, Konomi's protagonist, etc...) but Higa? No way.Your example of Tachibana is kind of...I don't know...not that great. He's pretty much forgotten at this point. I found his role to be more minor supporting compared to say Higa, Seigaku, Hyotei, Rikkaidai, and Shitenhoji. Higa and Shitenhoji were introduced exclusively to the Nationals and have been really popular. But other schools (excluding top 3) in the original anime aren't that great.
Well, the fact that you like a character for a personal matter is another thing. Read it backwards. You only like him because you can relate to him, not because he's an interesting character.I think the reason you guys don't find Tokugawa interesting is because you barely know much about him. I like him because what happened to him happened to me (unrelated to tennis). I had a complete douche ruin my life for 5 years. After that time, I finally had the courage to punch him right in the face. Then he wanted to be friends. But I didn't.
Again, we don't hate him.I find that even though most characters are similar they're not hated.
Why the crap is he in Japan then? Why did he even join a camp if he thought everyone was inferior? and why would I make silly theories if Konomi didn't hint anything at all? What's the point of it? it'll end up being the character I want, not the one that is in the manga. I could think outside of what Konomi has drawn and think that Sengoku, even if he was Jr. Saibatsu material (something that not many acomplished) he decided to let other players beat him so Japan level could grow a lot more, and that he's been hiding his luck until he faces Byoudouin... what do I win with that?Also, we all know Tokugawa is 1st stringer material but maybe he actually doesn't want to become one? Think about that? He already travels abroad for other tennis training and possibly matches. And he has even said that the world is far bigger than Japanese tennis. Maybe he wants to play for another country and not Japan. There's many reasons, you just have to think through them rather than jump to pessimistic conclusions. Don't stick to the storylines that Konomi gives us.
My theory is that he's asexual, like at least 50 % of the characters in PoTI had a silly thought that Tokugawa knew Byodoin's younger sister and Byodoin got all over-protective and crushed Tokugawa. Silly but you never know.
I don't think that anyone said something like that at all, nor that everyone is ¨pessimistic¨. Ken, Sai and Kaoz (among others) have him in their first string (we all think he's 1st string material, yet we doubt he's as strong as someone with ¨a power from a different dimension¨ that isn't really impressed watching people go PoP); some others have him in their fav characters list. Again, if I read it backwards, you're calling everyone but Airgrimes immature and stupid, not cool lol.From what I've seen, only you have been able to come up with some justified reasons to not like Tokugawa, compared to everything else has about 1-2 reasons. Myabe biased wasn't a good word, but I recon people would be more pessimitic towards me if I called them narrow-minded. Many people are that but "screw you" if you tell them. They're just immature and stupid.
I don't want to wait till I'm 80 (cause I dn't see NPoT ending any time soon) to make a judgement about every character , thank you.The characters I didn't like I waited until the final episode to make a judgment. By then you'd have enough information to judge. Since NPoT is still going, both anime and manga, its not enough to make a judgment.
Thanks for the info!I don't wanna spoil you nor anything like that, but Sanada's match conclusion is already out, check the chapters 109, 110 and 111 thread.
From the wikia:
No. 1 - Hōō Byōdōin
No. 2 - Shūji Tanegashima
No. 3 - Duke Watanabe
No. 4 - Ryoga Echizen
No. 5 - Kazena Kaji -> Jūjirō Oni (3rd year, former 3rd Court Leader, originally 5th Court Leader and 2nd Stringer)
No. 6 - Ryūji Ōmagari
No. 7 - Ikuto Kimijima
No. 8 - Atsukyō Tōno
No. 9 - Tsukimitsu Ochi -> Keigo Atobe (Hyotei 3rd year, Middle School 2nd Stringer)
No. 10 - Juzaburō Mūri -> Masaharu Niō (Rikkaidai 3rd year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 11 - Tetsuhito Fuwa -> Seiichi Yukimura (Rikkaidai 3rd year, Middle School 2nd Stringer)
No. 12 - Danji Date -> Takashi Kawamura (Seigaku 3rd year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 13 -Ban Rikiya -> Munehiro Kabaji (Hyotei 2nd year, Revolutionary Brigade) ->DISQUALIFIED in Chapter 77 Current No. 13 is Unknown
No. 14 - Izou Hakamada -> Kintarō Tōyama (Shitenhoji 1st year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 15 - Yūma Mutsu -> Masaharu Niō (Rikkaidai 3rd year, Revolutionary Brigade) -> BADGE RETURNED Current No. 15 is Unknown
No. 16 - Yūho Mutsu -> Shuichiro Oishi (Seigaku 3rd year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 17 - Akuto Mitsuya -> Yanagi Renji (Rikkaidai 3rd year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 18 - Yoshiyuki Taira -> Kenya Oshitari (Shitenhoji 3rd year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 19 - Tetsuya Hara -> Takeshi Momoshiro (Seigaku 2nd year, Revolutionary Brigade)
No. 20 - Akiba Kōyō -> Kanata Irie (3rd year, former 5th Court Leader, originally 3rd Court Leader and 2nd Stringer)
Some people here work in the wikia, it has a ton of legit info (well, I'd say all of it lol) so I'd say that you should check it out if you can't find something.
Marui didn't get the spot, it's still Tohno's. Kabaji is out, Yukimura will leave, and Niou's status is unknown right now. Also, Kintarou might had returned his badge.