Quarterfinal God Serena vs Natsu Dragneel

[Tirl]

Thats the exact same attack as the one used on the god mate. And it is clearly leagues above Serenas attack. Not only is the destruction hundreds of times larger then Serenas attack, but it destroyed Jacob (who had not taken a lot of damage prior) while Serenas attack wasn't even close to taking out an injured Jura.

1. Yes. But attack on God was x9999999999 times stronger. Attack on Jacob is nothing compare with Serena's attacks. It is simple kick.

2. Yoy try to compare def of Jacob, who weakest than more sprigans (besides Nainheart) and even mages Lyon lvl AND Jura (and Wolf, Warrod and Hyb) who is maybe has highest def in entire manga (like Wolf. And even Warrod).

Kill mage like Jacob who use stealth magic and kill Jura who use stone magic and has high lvl def are different things.

 

[Crimson Ice]

Are we really claiming Jura>Jacob now............

 

[Tirl]

Are we really claiming Jura>Jacob now............

Jacob has more mp, has cheat ability. Ofc Jacob>Jura. But without transport Jacob the weakest spriggan. Weaker than Bickslow

 

[Hermit]

Are we really claiming Jura>Jacob now............

Oi oi, don't underestimate the power of baldness....Jura low diffs Jacob because he made that snarky comment about his hair when they first met..
Also it would be hard for Jacob to move when Jura is altering the earth around him so he isn't that much of a pushover

 

[Crimson Ice]

Jacob has more mp, has cheat ability. Ofc Jacob>Jura. But without transport Jacob the weakest spriggan. Weaker than Bickslow

This doesn't deserve s serious reply. Weaker than Bickslow? *Sigh*

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 11, 2016, Original Post Date: Jun 11, 2016 ---

Oi oi, don't underestimate the power of baldness....Jura low diffs Jacob because he made that snarky comment about his hair when they first met..
Also it would be hard for Jacob to move when Jura is altering the earth around him so he isn't that much of a pushover

Kira was matching Natsu and Lucy in CQX granted Natsu was holding back its impressive regardless. Jacob beats Jura.

 

[Char]

Take a look at the purgatory dragon spell and compare it to the Flame Dragon King Roar Natsu used in chapter 463.

Spoiler: Purgatory Dragon's Infernal Hell

Spoiler: Flame Dragon King's Roar

Comparing those, its pretty clear that Flame Dragon King's Roar is much more impressive a spell than the Purgatory Dragon's Infernal Hell. Not only does the Roar look a lot stronger, its also a lot bigger, so it has that going for it too.If his spells are stronger why can't he do the same to GOI.His spells have also better feats.One demolition fist defeated a Spriggan.And Serena needed 2+unknown no. of spells to take down mages below a Spriggan level.His 1 year training puts him in high tier Spriggan level in FDKM.In his base state he was able to match Ajeel who is stronger than Hyberion.And most important of all after Natsu's attacks the entire ground vanished i don't see Serena doing this.

The scale of Natsu's attack is larger, the AoE is larger, but that's because he needed to cover that entire area, and we could "consider" it was a full power attack; whereas GS was only fighting 4 opponents so he might've probably wanted to focus on damage not on AoE.

Again, AoE shouldn't be what counts the most. I'm positive GS could cover that AoE if he wanted to (he's not a Spriggan 12 for no reason), but he didn't need to.

I'd seriously like to witness whether Natsu's roar could actually KO the 3 GoI + Jura... in my humblest opinion, no, it wouldn't be that easy. You claim "one demolition fist beat a Spriggan"; well, yes, but that Spriggan would've fodderized Natsu hadn't Lucy and Happy been there. Let's remember that they won just because Lucy's intellect and Happy preventing him from using his space magic again; and his beating was a conjunction of Makarov's punch + Natsu's attack. So the fact they defeated Jacob, who is a Spriggan, doesn't necessarily imply that his punch would defeat the three GoI+Jura because Jacob might've had low durability but very high MP and abilities. As a matter of fact it makes sense, since his type of magic consists of "not getting hurt", since he can disappear, he mustn't have trained his durability a lot.

When it comes to the subject of maturity, age and prime, I understand it's a highly subjective topic. But let's be honest, power scales in this manga are also absolutely subjective and sometimes arbitrary and senseless... Particularly after timeskips.

Do people not understand that Natsu's growth rate is wayyy higher than any of the GoI. By saying it makes no sense for Natsu to be that strong so quick is assuming he has a low growth rate.

Relatively speaking, how can his progression be such that in one year he managed to become superior to the strongest mages in his continent? And it is not only Natsu, Erza and Gray have also managed to grow during this year to extents that seem ridiculous. For example, following that logic, Erza should be above the GoI + Jura since she gave Ajeel a much better fight than the GoI + Jura gave to GS. So, Erza, who was below Jura a year ago, is now stronger than the GoI?

It's much more sound to infer that GS is simply above Ajeel, and that Erza is not superior to the GoI, because such a progression wouldn't make sense. Because your "Natsu's growth rate" also applies to Erza and Gray. I know he was the one who progressed the most, but still, since some people tend to think that Gray is on par with him because of "portrayal", and Erza should be around there too... It simply makes no sense.

 

[THE ALMIGHTY CRYBABY]

Relatively speaking, how can his progression be such that in one year he managed to become superior to the strongest mages in his continent? And it is not only Natsu, Erza and Gray have also managed to grow during this year to extents that seem ridiculous. For example, following that logic, Erza should be above the GoI + Jura since she gave Ajeel a much better fight than the GoI + Jura gave to GS. So, Erza, who was below Jura a year ago, is now stronger than the GoI?

It's much more sound to infer that GS is simply above Ajeel, and that Erza is not superior to the GoI, because such a progression wouldn't make sense. Because your "Natsu's growth rate" also applies to Erza and Gray. I know he was the one who progressed the most, but still, since some people tend to think that Gray is on par with him because of "portrayal", and Erza should be around there too... It simply makes no sense.

Well, Natsu oneshoted Bluenote who was in Tenrou arc and still is due to no development on wizard saint tier. It was stated that the average spriggan is stronger than the GoI of Ishgar, so it makes sense that Erza, Base Natsu, Base Gray and Base Gajeel are on GoI tier, otherwise ft would stand absolutely no chance against alvarez empire! Besides, it's clear that Laxus and Gerard are on spriggan tier level! I think that Erza and co are stronger than the GoI in a 1 vs 1, but it's questionable if anyone of them could have defeated GoI+ Jura alone!
The conclusion of this: FT powerhouses received a huge power up during the timeskip!!!

Base Natsu vs Serena; low diff win for Serena
FDKM Natsu vs Serena; high diff win for one of them ( I cannot still decide)
DF Natsu vs Serena; low or mid diff for Natsu, because DF Gajeel destroyed Bradman ( who I consider stronger than Serena) with only physical attacks and without the need of using spells

 

[Shoutmon]

Alright let's do this.

I'd seriously like to witness whether Natsu's roar could actually KO the 3 GoI + Jura... in my humblest opinion, no, it wouldn't be that easy. You claim "one demolition fist beat a Spriggan"; well, yes, but that Spriggan would've fodderized Natsu hadn't Lucy and Happy been there. Let's remember that they won just because Lucy's intellect and Happy preventing him from using his space magic again; and his beating was a conjunction of Makarov's punch + Natsu's attack. So the fact they defeated Jacob, who is a Spriggan, doesn't necessarily imply that his punch would defeat the three GoI+Jura because Jacob might've had low durability but very high MP and abilities. As a matter of fact it makes sense, since his type of magic consists of "not getting hurt", since he can disappear, he mustn't have trained his durability a lot.

First of all, Base Natsu's roar one-shotted Bluenote, and while Jura's likely stronger than Bluenote, I really doubt their difference in power is vast(In fact I peg them to be around the same level).So if Bluenote got one-shotted by base Natsu's roar, I'd say Jura would go down after taking about 3-5 roars(max).

Now as for the GoI, imo the fact that they thought that Jura would be an asset in their fight against the spriggans tells me that the gap in power isn't as large as everyone thinks (especially since he endured GS's attacks just as well as they did), meanwhile there's a massive gap in power between Natsu's base spells and his FDK spells, for eg.

Here's what Iron fist did to Ikusatsunagi:

Spoiler

Here's what Demolition fist did:

Spoiler

Keep in mind that that demolition fist was performed by base Natsu, not BDKM Natsu.

Second of all, it doesn't matter that Jacob can clap Natsu away in a 1-on-1 fight, what matters is that FDK spells have the damage output to essentially one-shot a spriggan (yes, a restricted Natsu, Lucy and Makarov got some hits in, but let's be honest, those attacks barely did anything,Demolition Fist did around 85-90% of the damage)

Now as for Jacob's defense, the fact that he took a stronger version of an attack that obliterated a mountain-sized deity and still remained alive and intact, should tell you that he's not just some glass cannon. The GoI ,on the other hand, got manhandled by a God Serena who wasn't even using his primary magic and were about to get destroyed by attacks that I definitely don't see as having the power to one-shot Ikusatsunagi like Demolition Fist did.

Relatively speaking, how can his progression be such that in one year he managed to become superior to the strongest mages in his continent? And it is not only Natsu, Erza and Gray have also managed to grow during this year to extents that seem ridiculous. For example, following that logic, Erza should be above the GoI + Jura since she gave Ajeel a much better fight than the GoI + Jura gave to GS. So, Erza, who was below Jura a year ago, is now stronger than the GoI?

It's much more sound to infer that GS is simply above Ajeel, and that Erza is not superior to the GoI, because such a progression wouldn't make sense. Because your "Natsu's growth rate" also applies to Erza and Gray. I know he was the one who progressed the most, but still, since some people tend to think that Gray is on par with him because of "portrayal", and Erza should be around there too... It simply makes no sense.

Well it might not make sense to you, but it is what it is.

 

[Char]

Well, Natsu oneshoted Bluenote who was in Tenrou arc and still is due to no development on wizard saint tier. It was stated that the average spriggan is stronger than the GoI of Ishgar, so it makes sense that Erza, Base Natsu, Base Gray and Base Gajeel are on GoI tier, otherwise ft would stand absolutely no chance against alvarez empire! Besides, it's clear that Laxus and Gerard are on spriggan tier level! I think that Erza and co are stronger than the GoI in a 1 vs 1, but it's questionable if anyone of them could have defeated GoI+ Jura alone!
The conclusion of this: FT powerhouses received a huge power up during the timeskip!!!

Base Natsu vs Serena; low diff win for Serena
FDKM Natsu vs Serena; high diff win for one of them ( I cannot still decide)
DF Natsu vs Serena; low or mid diff for Natsu, because DF Gajeel destroyed Bradman ( who I consider stronger than Serena) with only physical attacks and without the need of using spells

It'd be ok if Natsu, Gray, or Erza were GoI tiers. Then it would be something like Natsu = Hyberion, or Erza = Hyberion. I could accept that.

But we are talking about Erza > 3 GoI + Jura (because she managed to give Ajeel a better fight than the four gave God Serena), right? So, Erza wouldn't be GoI tier, she'd be at the level or above 3 GoI + Jura, and it does not make sense, does it? Well it doesn't for me. So I'm willing to think that GS is simply superior to Ajeel.

On a side note, I don't consider Bradman stronger than Serena. I might consider him to be superior if he managed to properly use his hax-y curses. But he didn't even use macro to begin with, so, yeah.

My point here is that I don't believe base Natsu is Spriggan tier, and I'm having a lot of trouble trying to assume FDKM Natsu MIGHT be spriggan tier. And God Serena being a mid to high tier spriggan for me, well, I just cannot conceive him losing to Natsu.

We haven't seen God Serena being serious either so all we can say is that, feat wise, FDKM Natsu's may be more impressive (in terms of AoE).

First of all, Base Natsu's roar one-shotted Bluenote, and while Jura's likely stronger than Bluenote, I really doubt their difference in power is vast(In fact I peg them to be around the same level).So if Bluenote got one-shotted by base Natsu's roar, I'd say Jura would go down after taking about 3-5 roars(max).

I agree.

Now as for the GoI, imo the fact that they thought that Jura would be an asset in their fight against the spriggans tells me that the gap in power isn't as large as everyone thinks (especially since he endured GS's attacks just as well as they did), meanwhile there's a massive gap in power between Natsu's base spells and his FDK spells, for eg.

I agree on the GoI and Jura being on similar levels, this is why I always refer to the GoI + Jura as 4x Jura, since they should be around the same level. As for BDKM being vastly superior to base, well, I never thought the gap was so massive. Maybe these pages show a feat I may've overlooked.

Second of all, it doesn't matter that Jacob can clap Natsu away in a 1-on-1 fight, what matters is that FDK spells have the damage output to essentially one-shot a spriggan (yes, a restricted Natsu, Lucy and Makarov got some hits in, but let's be honest, those attacks barely did anything,Demolition Fist did around 85-90% of the damage)

Fair enough. I mean, yeah, of course, feat wise, BDKM Natsu has proven to output damage equal to that a Spriggan could output. The whole point is that I don't see BDKM Natsu winning against any Spriggan 1 vs 1 (maybe Neinhart), which makes me think he's just not spriggan tier. I mean, there's more to just attack power in being a Spriggan tier, right?

Now as for Jacob's defense, the fact that he took an attack that obliterated a mountain-sized deity and still remained alive and intact, should tell you that he's not just some glass cannon. The GoI ,on the other hand, got manhandled by a God Serena who wasn't even using his primary magic and were about to get destroyed by attacks that I definitely don't see as having the power to one-shot Ikusatsunagi like Demolition Fist did.

But again, attempting to quantify durability as if it was a measurable feat is nonsense. So I don't think that "durability" is too well layed out in this manga, I think it doesn't make sense to attempt to quantify it. I mean, I think people in this manga (save for Simon) never die unless it's plot necessary. My point being, had the GoI+Jura received 3 or 8 attacks, they wouldn't have died; had Jacob received 1 attack like Natsu gave him or 3 woudln't have made a difference, he wouldn't have died. But I know people is going to think "wtf is he saying?" It's just that it makes sense if you stop and think about it. So, is Jacob more durable than a mountain-sized deity? Well it's simply absurd to think he is but OK.

 

[Shoutmon]

I agree on the GoI and Jura being on similar levels, this is why I always refer to the GoI + Jura as 4x Jura, since they should be around the same level. As for BDKM being vastly superior to base, well, I never thought the gap was so massive. Maybe these pages show a feat I may've overlooked.

Alright, I may have exaggerated a bit with the size of the gap,think of it as being "moderately massive", not "super massive".

Fair enough. I mean, yeah, of course, feat wise, BDKM Natsu has proven to output damage equal to that a Spriggan could output. The whole point is that I don't see BDKM Natsu winning against any Spriggan 1 vs 1 (maybe Neinhart), which makes me think he's just not spriggan tier. I mean, there's more to just attack power in being a Spriggan tier, right?

While it is true that some spriggan can beat Natsu, you have to remember that those spriggan use hax. Even Laxus, who's a confirmed spriggan tier, would lose just as quickly as Natsu would against spriggan like Jacob or Dimaria. You and I both know that Laxus has the power to stomp those 2 , but because they have hax, they can one-shot him with minimal effort. It's the same with Natsu, give him a brawler-type spriggan to fight, like Wahl for example, and it's much easier to envision him winning.

But again, attempting to quantify durability as if it was a measurable feat is nonsense.So I don't think that "durability" is too well layed out in this manga, I think it doesn't make sense to attempt to quantify it. I mean, I think people in this manga (save for Simon) never die unless it's plot necessary. My point being, had the GoI+Jura received 3 or 8 attacks, they wouldn't have died; had Jacob received 1 attack like Natsu gave him or 3 woudln't have made a difference, he wouldn't have died. But I know people is going to think "wtf is he saying?" It's just that it makes sense if you stop and think about it. So, is Jacob more durable than a mountain-sized deity? Well it's simply absurd to think he is but OK.

I haven't read the spoilers (nor do I want to),so I don't know what happens between Natsu, Lucy, Mest, Happy and August(If anything does happen), but if they (Mest, Lucy and Happy)do endure such powerful attacks, It's usually because the enemy isn't taking them seriously, or because something is preventing the enemy from obliterating them from the start. I'm not sure, but I wouldn't spend too much time thinking about it. If Lucy, Mest and Happy endures the attacks that August is throwing out, just assume that guys like Jacob could as well.

 

[Stormsfury]

What Serena conjured is not even remotely close to Tsunami size. That volume of water is literally hundreds of times less then what is the bare minimum that constitutes a tsunami (see Ajeels Tsunami as reference). Also, depends on what the lake and the size of a tsunami. The biggest Tsunami is probably only going to have as much water as a small lake. Maybe thats being generous.

Spoiler

A lot of people seem to forget this. Natsu was not able to eat Zancrows flames at first because they were a cut above what he could initially chew, only when he emptied his own MP tank was he capable of eating the flames. Serena might be able to eat normal flames, its highly doubtable that he could eat Natsus FDKM ones.

And I don't understand why you and a few others believe that Natsus power only increased marginally, Juras durability was Laxus level prior to the time skip. Now Jura is one-shottable for someone of Laxuses caliber, and I don't view Natsu that far behind Laxus.

Edit: the scan is in Spanish for whatever reason, but you could see what is happening so I don't believe a english scan is needed.

Uhh..... this was already explained, God Slayer flames are different and that's why God Slayers can eat normal flames while Dragon Slayers can't, it doesn't mean that it's a cut above the rest...... that's just what the ability is.
FDKM hasn't been shown to have different properties, the flames are just hotter, the only thing your doing to justfy your argument is assuming that FDKM flames are different. Use facts please.

 

[Eternal Dragon Of ChaOZ]

I think God Serena wins but it would be difficulty with Natsu's powers up.

Serena did defeat the other Ishgar Gods which is why I am leaning towards him.

 

[The President]

Uhh..... this was already explained, God Slayer flames are different and that's why God Slayers can eat normal flames while Dragon Slayers can't, it doesn't mean that it's a cut above the rest...... that's just what the ability is. FDKM hasn't been shown to have different properties, the flames are just hotter, the only thing your doing to justfy your argument is assuming that FDKM flames are different. Use facts please.

Fair enough, the god flames are different in some sense. Though why ask for facts when you have so little to go off of with Serena? Let me ask you this, do you believe that any version if Natsu could eat any form of flames? Even a fire dragons roar? That's much. There should only be a certain amount one could eat depending on their own level and circumstance (ie Serena not eating Juras rock, Gray not eating Urs Ice, Sherria not eating Wendys wind etc.....). Its the fact you want, but it holds just as much (if not more) weight then the argument that Serena can eat any level of fire (highly unlikely).

 

[Nemispelled]

Natsu wins mid-diff.

 

[SirSamuel016]

And? It is just a punch. Serena's punch was much stronger than that embarras. Natsu just kick Jacob. His attack on God of War was more same with Serena's punch

Natsu's punch is far stronger than God Serena's. What he did to Jacob was proof enough as Jacob had taken next to no damage beforehand, and one Fire Dragon King's Demolition Fist defeated him. Natsu essentially one-shotted Jacob there (as he wasn't serious beforehand as well) so one-shotting a Spriggan is definitely more impressive than needing using a few attacks to finish off already tired opposition. And if you still don't think that Natsu's punch is better than Serena's, then let me remind you of what Natsu did to the war god Ikatsunagi.

Spoiler: Natsu destroys Ikatsunagi

Its the same spell that was used on Jacob, but this time it was in Base Mode and not FDKM. So as you can see, Base Natsu alone has a lot of destructive power, and Flame Dragon King Mode makes his attacks even more potent. I've made my points before in my previous points so I won't repeat myself again, but this definitely shows Natsu has much stronger attacks, and that his punch is far better than Serena's.

 

[Arjuna]

The scale of Natsu's attack is larger, the AoE is larger, but that's because he needed to cover that entire area, and we could "consider" it was a full power attack; whereas GS was only fighting 4 opponents so he might've probably wanted to focus on damage not on AoE.

Again, AoE shouldn't be what counts the most. I'm positive GS could cover that AoE if he wanted to (he's not a Spriggan 12 for no reason), but he didn't need to.

I'd seriously like to witness whether Natsu's roar could actually KO the 3 GoI + Jura... in my humblest opinion, no, it wouldn't be that easy. You claim "one demolition fist beat a Spriggan"; well, yes, but that Spriggan would've fodderized Natsu hadn't Lucy and Happy been there. Let's remember that they won just because Lucy's intellect and Happy preventing him from using his space magic again; and his beating was a conjunction of Makarov's punch + Natsu's attack. So the fact they defeated Jacob, who is a Spriggan, doesn't necessarily imply that his punch would defeat the three GoI+Jura because Jacob might've had low durability but very high MP and abilities. As a matter of fact it makes sense, since his type of magic consists of "not getting hurt", since he can disappear, he mustn't have trained his durability a lot.

When it comes to the subject of maturity, age and prime, I understand it's a highly subjective topic. But let's be honest, power scales in this manga are also absolutely subjective and sometimes arbitrary and senseless... Particularly after timeskips.



Relatively speaking, how can his progression be such that in one year he managed to become superior to the strongest mages in his continent? And it is not only Natsu, Erza and Gray have also managed to grow during this year to extents that seem ridiculous. For example, following that logic, Erza should be above the GoI + Jura since she gave Ajeel a much better fight than the GoI + Jura gave to GS. So, Erza, who was below Jura a year ago, is now stronger than the GoI?

It's much more sound to infer that GS is simply above Ajeel, and that Erza is not superior to the GoI, because such a progression wouldn't make sense. Because your "Natsu's growth rate" also applies to Erza and Gray. I know he was the one who progressed the most, but still, since some people tend to think that Gray is on par with him because of "portrayal", and Erza should be around there too... It simply makes no sense.

I will come to you point by point:-
i)Inside the guild hall Natsu had to restrain his powers.Jacob had taken damages but it didn't affect him a bit.Even Makarov's Titan punch did only surprise him.No visible damages.On the other hand Natsu and Lucy took many damages there were visible damages on their bodies.It was not like that fresh Natsu defeated damaged Jacob.It was the other way round.Damaged Natsu used 1 major attack to defeat Jacob.This was when he could fight seriously without restrictions.Compare this Serena who needed many attacks.And As Shoutmon his defense is not bad.
ii)In his FDKM his aura itself is mountain level.Tell me Ajeel,GOI or Wahl have these kinds of feats.In his Base state he casually destroyed Ant pit.In his FDKM his DC surpasses Laxus's.It's much better than GOI.

 

[Holt]

This is actually a rather tough battle. Serena is pretty powerful and so is Natsu. Plus there's his resistance to fire to consider. I'd say that Serena is undoubtedly stronger than Base Natsu. He probably still has the upper hand against FDKM Natsu as they're strength should be quite equal while Serena's resistance makes up for the excess or extra. However, with DF, I have to say that I consider Natsu stronger. In addition, Natsu should still have access to Lightning flame mode so if he imbues that with his attacks, he could do damage. It's a very high diff battle either way, but I guess most of it comes down to if DF Natsu has enough brute strength to overcome Serena and I think he does. Even if Serena is resistant to fire, Natsu's DF still has a lot of raw power and can potentially best Serena on that.

 

[Char]

This is actually a rather tough battle. Serena is pretty powerful and so is Natsu. Plus there's his resistance to fire to consider. I'd say that Serena is undoubtedly stronger than Base Natsu. He probably still has the upper hand against FDKM Natsu as they're strength should be quite equal while Serena's resistance makes up for the excess or extra. However, with DF, I have to say that I consider Natsu stronger. In addition, Natsu should still have access to Lightning flame mode so if he imbues that with his attacks, he could do damage. It's a very high diff battle either way, but I guess most of it comes down to if DF Natsu has enough brute strength to overcome Serena and I think he does. Even if Serena is resistant to fire, Natsu's DF still has a lot of raw power and can potentially best Serena on that.

I think we're meant to stick to what we've seen, so Alvarez DF Natsu doesn't play a role because he still hasn't appeared. Therefore, if you think that FDKM Natsu would lose to God Serena, then God Serena wins, since Alvarez Natsu hasn't shown either LFDM (nor a combination of FDKM+LFDM) nor DF.

Some people claim that FDKM overpowered LFDM so LFDM is not an advisable powerup anymore, in which case, we should consider FDKM Natsu's most powerful state until he shows whether or not LFDM proves to be more powerful, or he can combine it with FDKM and so on ^^

It's rather clear that DF Natsu is going to be superior to God Serena (unless GS happened to have a DF we never saw, and we'll never see).

 

[Holt]

I think we're meant to stick to what we've seen, so Alvarez DF Natsu doesn't play a role because he still hasn't appeared. Therefore, if you think that FDKM Natsu would lose to God Serena, then God Serena wins, since Alvarez Natsu hasn't shown either LFDM (nor a combination of FDKM+LFDM) nor DF.

Some people claim that FDKM overpowered LFDM so LFDM is not an advisable powerup anymore, in which case, we should consider FDKM Natsu's most powerful state until he shows whether or not LFDM proves to be more powerful, or he can combine it with FDKM and so on ^^

It's rather clear that DF Natsu is going to be superior to God Serena (unless GS happened to have a DF we never saw, and we'll never see).

Not quite actually. Speculation is allowed provided it's reasonable. The restrictions in place was that characters who haven't shown access to advanced modes don't have them. So in this case, though we can consider DF Natsu (since he's shown it before and did so at will the last time), we can't do the same for Serena since he hasn't shown the ability (despite being a DS). If we had to solely stick to what we've seen, then we'd have very little to go on or we'd have to consider abilities at their last shown power level even though the characters have grown stronger and thus so will their abilities.

Basically, we can consider prior abilities and scale them to the current power level of the characters to determine how powerful such abilities plausibly are if used.

 

[Rain Cloud]

Not quite actually. Speculation is allowed provided it's reasonable. The restrictions in place was that characters who haven't shown access to advanced modes don't have them. So in this case, though we can consider DF Natsu (since he's shown it before and did so at will the last time), we can't do the same for Serena since he hasn't shown the ability (despite being a DS). If we had to solely stick to what we've seen, then we'd have very little to go on or we'd have to consider abilities at their last shown power level even though the characters have grown stronger and thus so will their abilities.

Basically, we can consider prior abilities and scale them to the current power level of the characters to determine how powerful such abilities plausibly are if used.

But the the issue is, no one here would likely agree on that power level. E.g, some say Natsu's DF multiplies his power by 3x, but others say that only applied to pre-pre ts Natsu or that if DF is 3x, then FDKM might already be something like 2.5x already (only a 0.5x difference).