Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2017] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[TM2]

It's no excuse... It's just my opinion... If MHA have that much "writing quality" why it still is not the best high selling manga of JUMP? It's not even the 3rd...

So yeah... I remain with the "highly subjective".

To me it's just a bunch of dialogues pretending to have HXH depth and One Piece characterization.

Come on that's the argument you're making? You've been here much longer than most people on this site.

Regarding the One Piece and HxH comparison, they had years to develop their stories and characters. More time to develop plot points and side characters, not all of which were entirely spotless in their own right. MHA's or any other long-runner hopeful's total runtime cannot really compare without the advantage of time and hindsight. So unless you're using specific examples of characterization a comparison between the two is a rather unfair.

 

[G_I_A]

Yeah I'm here waaaay longer and pretty much translate seeries waaaay before the majority of people here...

Manga are made TO SELL. It does not matter my opinion about the quality of the series... Yours, or the majority of this community... If it don't sell it won't last...

It's as simple as that.

 

[Koi Kage]

I like both Black Clover and MHA, I'm in the minority I think, I like both of them for different reasons: Black Clover for it's art and simplified storytelling, MHA for it's action senes and it's side characters (I don't like Deku personally).

I've seen that the people who love one of the series and not the other often point out the short comings, but often forget that there own series has it's short comings as well. Take some of the more outspoken MHA fans for example they point out that Black Clover's plot is not good, I attribute it to being a simplified story that's thought on the fly but I digress, MHA has it's short coming with plot also it's take the safe to almost mediocre route story wise since the Bakugo rescue arc.

Yeah I'm here waaaay longer and pretty much translate seeries waaaay before the majority of people here...

Manga are made TO SELL. It does not matter my opinion... Yours, or the majority of this community... If it don't sell it won't last...

It's as simple as that.

People seem to be forgetting that in order to sell a manga has to be popular. That is the one and only lesson you learn from the Bakuman series that actually applies to the real world.

 

[TM2]

Not just as something made to sell manga, comics, books, games movies or what have you are also a type of art. Yes sales are important, I don't think anyone here is going to dispute that but that doesn't mean we are going to ignore a series' flaws and achievements just because its selling well or poorly. Keep in mind, we're not a marketing committee here as far as I can tell we are just a bunch of nerds whose obsession with numbers and chinese cartoons happen to intersect.

 

[G_I_A]

Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey sure sold a lot as well. Not seeing anyone call them literary masterpieces; absent of glaring flaws.

Yes, to US they are shit. But we are not majority.

 

[WyldViolet]

Yeah I'm here waaaay longer and pretty much translate seeries waaaay before the majority of people here...

Manga are made TO SELL. It does not matter my opinion about the quality of the series... Yours, or the majority of this community... If it don't sell it won't last...

It's as simple as that.

What sells isn't always what is of quality though.
Kafka barely made a penny his entire life. Didn't gain success till after his death, same with many other artists.
Also, take a look at a lists of top grossing films in decades past and compare them to lists of the retrospective best films of those years.
Often times the best works are ignored by the general public while the shit is eaten up by the masses.
It sometimes takes time for true art to be truly appreciated.

 

[tirakai]

Well, Hungry Marie was pretty unremarkable.

It felt like it relied on you being a big Beelzebub fan to enjoy it much which isn't a great way to start a new series.

 

[savethecat]

U19 chapter 3 was cool. It would have been more interesting from the jump if Eiji was already a member of the Garage Kids in the beginning

 

[Tamil]

My best moments in Jump (2016)
1. HxH's return - It's amazing seeing Togashi balance a chaotic arc so nicely. Although it was more chaotic in the previous return like with the tactics that Ging & Pariston were playing.
2. Toriko's ending - For a rushed manga it did incredibly well. Shimabu made great use of the extended pages for the wedding chapter and encompassing the entire journey. The final chapter did raise a few questions but answered a lot with an excellent ending/world building. I look forward to his next work.
3. Spider Family Arc (KnY) - Such a thrill to read each week and really excited to see it animated in all of it's glory. KnY's serialization in general was fun I must say. It's a shame to see people not giving it a try but end up giving newer series like Demon's Plan a try.


You did say Jump SQ and I know this is a ToC talk for weekly shonen jump but I'll just say the anime announcement of Kekkai Sensen & BEYOND. Kekkai Sensen was a really fun anime and that ED is so addicting to listen to and even watch (prob. the best ED I've seen, check it out if you havent). I know S2 may not be as fun as S1 but still looking forward to it, the cast of characters are fun. Plus, I want to read Kekkai Sensen B2B, it seems to have a good reception from the Japanese audience. I wish I knew how to read Japanese at times like these.

 

[Leoat12]

In this day and age where many people just upload shit on YouTube and get a lot of audience we should be even more aware that popularity doesn't mean quality. Popularity can be achieve by many means, not just doing a work based on quality.
Since we are talking about Bakuman, in Bakuman they also say that there are two types of mangakas: the geniuses, who make whatever they want and still make success, and the one who prepare their work for the market seeking for success (don't remember the word they used for them now). In which category do you think Black Clover author is included?

 

[G_I_A]

In this day and age where many people just upload shit on YouTube and get a lot of audience we should be even more aware that popularity doesn't mean quality. Popularity can be achieve by many means, not just doing a work based on quality.
Since we are talking about Bakuman, in Bakuman they also say that there are two types of mangakas: the geniuses, who make whatever they want and still make success, and the one who prepare their work for the market seeking for success (don't remember the word they used for them now). In which category do you think Black Clover author is be included?

The category that gets 1º TOC, is selling very good and receiving an anime...

Pretty much the category of the majority of mangaka are not.

 

[Koi Kage]

In this day and age where many people just upload shit on YouTube and get a lot of audience we should be even more aware that popularity doesn't mean quality. Popularity can be achieve by many means, not just doing a work based on quality.
Since we are talking about Bakuman, in Bakuman they also say that there are two types of mangakas: the geniuses, who make whatever they want and still make success, and the one who prepare their work for the market seeking for success (don't remember the word they used for them now). In which category do you think Black Clover author is included?

Currently I'd say he's in the grey area not really one or the other

 

[Leoat12]

The category that gets 1º TOC, is selling very good and receiving an anime...

Pretty much the category of the majority of mangaka are not.

You avoided the question, but I will answer for you, it is the second, it is clearly the second given the patchwork the series seems to be.

You are losing all your critical sense basing everything on sales. Do you really read the series thinking about sales and ignoring its flaws because it sells well?
One Piece must be an unquestionable god for you. XD

 

[SharkBait]

Poro 2 was great...and he was even ON Yuto. I feel bad for liking this manga for a really vain reason but its everything I want.

 

[IHateAsta]

the Kyano scene is AssClass was annoying, but I wont hate the series or drop for that 1 thing , heck Kuro-sensei is enough for me to love it!
+
I dont hate BC because of the writing ( Reborn! is my favorite and I like Bleach ) , I care about characters ( supporting characters most of the time ) and Battles , sadly BC failed miserably at those.

 

[Nakura]

In this day and age where many people just upload shit on YouTube and get a lot of audience we should be even more aware that popularity doesn't mean quality. Popularity can be achieve by many means, not just doing a work based on quality.
Since we are talking about Bakuman, in Bakuman they also say that there are two types of mangakas: the geniuses, who make whatever they want and still make success, and the one who prepare their work for the market seeking for success (don't remember the word they used for them now). In which category do you think Black Clover author is included?

Definitely the latter. That's not a bad thing on it's own though. Horikoshi is the same.

 

[Tamil]

You avoided the question, but I will answer for you, it is the second, it is clearly the second given the patchwork the series seems to be.

You are losing all your critical sense basing everything on sales. Do you really read the series thinking about sales and ignoring its flaws because it sells well?
One Piece must be an unquestionable god for you. XD

Worst fans ever. How insecure do you have to be to equate popularity/sales to the quality of a series? Have people been clueless and not notice that FT sells more than a lot of series...

 

[G_I_A]

You avoided the question, but I will answer for you, it is the second, it is clearly the second given the patchwork the series seems to be.

You are losing all your critical sense basing everything on sales. Do you really read the series thinking about sales and ignoring its flaws because it sells well?
One Piece must be an unquestionable god for you. XD

No doubt. The best and biggest manga of all time. Deal with it.

 

[TyVip]

So Viz didn't pick up We Never Learn/We Can't Study. Let's see if it gets the KnY/Yuragi treatment
or Ole Golazo/Demon's Plan/Almagram treatments

 

[Doughboy]

Best moments :
Bleach fans (+salty shippers) losing their sh*t over the ending.

I wish I used internet forums when Naruto's ending happened. I thought it was great but the internet and shippers didn't.