Discussion The Outside World

[Nii]

Considering that the children will most likely leave the orphanage at some point, the world outside probably is of the biggest importance to the plot so far. There's hardly anything we know yet, the story has avoided giving any clear info even when jumping outside of the orphanage. What do you think the outside is going to look like?
Is it going to be a huge wasteland, with former human cities being reduced to rubble or ruins? Or is everything intact, with a rich environment and barely any destruction? Were most humans eradicated, or could they possibly be slaves to the "creatures" outside of the orphanages as well?

Personally I think there's a high chance that there's a rebel group of sorts, I can't see how Emma and Co. could put up a significant resistance otherwise. Besides that I'm honestly not sure what to expect. A complete wasteland sounds unlikely, but I could imagine that there's going to be quite a lot of destruction.

The biggest twist probably would be if all humans are actually alive, and formed some sort of peace treaty with the creatures, which allows them to take away their children. Or them actually living in co-existence with the humans, who are completely unaware of everything that happens in the background. As you can see, there are lots and lots of possibilities, feel free to discuss everything that comes to mind Pointing out hints given in the manga is more than welcome too

 

[Brandish μ]

Society - Demons don't necessarily rule all humans, but the humans that are not farmed/enslaved by demons are actually okay with demons killing humans and farming them for food. So there's some weird co-existence going on. It does seem human society stopped in 2015(?).

Rebels - there has to be some. Or at least there was. William Minerva is probably the only hint of a rebel atm.

Environment - Given there are demons, there is a chance of a widespread nuclear or cosmic/environmental/biological catastrophe that might have caused great environmental change. However I assume that nothing much happened (Grace Fields, albeit just a small propert, seems alright). Even if all the humans stopped impacts on the environment, the change over a 3 decade removal should be minimal. The demons were in a dark room that looked all mechanical/weird so Idk. I'll say I won't be surprised by any outcome in this regard (but I hope if there is change it fits well).

 

[Belserion]

I don't believe the outside world is a wasteland. It seemed quite technologically advanced from what little we saw in Krone's story.

After what Krone revealed it would not be surprising if there was co existence happening outside. I can't shake the feeling that the outside world might be worse than the orphanage. As for William Minerva, I can see his (?) books being some sort of test, a way to recruit "special" ones to their cause, so I do believe there is a resistance of sorts, whether it's effective is another thing. I mean the situation seems to be firmly in the demons favor and for how long those books were being published, that's a long time for them to remain in the shadows. So on one hand we have the kids willing to put their faith in Minerva's organization and on the other hand we have Krone recommending that they blend in with the "co-existing" humans. Neither of those choices seem that great to me.

 

[Spirit]

I'm sort of getting a Fallout Vibe, or wanting to. Maybe not necessarily with the Post-Nuclear Destruction or anything but I feel like Grace Fields is located far, far away from any population centers, Human or Demon in nature. Since it's so far away, the Demons have to expend a lot of resources (Again, both Natural and Human) to maintain supply lines and such. If the Children were to escape the Orphanage, Grace Fields would lose credibility, and the Mama responsible would be killed along with any remaining humans. So Krone's plan might not pull through anyway. I think the first thing that will happen after the kids escape will be to find a small village or town.

 

[Hermit]

I don't think there's an outside world, contrary to popular belief, I think the orphanage, the Momma and Kids right now we're seeing and following are the last of humanity left.
That's why the series is called 'The Promised Neverland.'
In this context, Neverland refers to a place that will never be reached. That means the outside world is a dystopia. It would be a perfect contrast with the inside of the orphanage which is a utopia, no?

 

[Spirit]

I don't think there's an outside world, contrary to popular belief, I think the orphanage, the Momma and Kids right now we're seeing and following are the last of humanity left.
That's why the series is called 'The Promised Neverland.'
In this context, Neverland refers to a place that will never be reached. That means the outside world is a dystopia. It would be a perfect contrast with the inside of the orphanage which is a utopia, no?

But that's already impossible considering that we know that there are humans living among the Demons. So yes it's a cool idea, but I don't think this world is as Black and White as that.

 

[Hermit]

So yes it's a cool idea, but I don't think this world is as Black and White as that.

Isn't it already as black and white as that though?
Think about i, there is no middle ground in the series, at least so far anyway.
Everything so far is as its being portrayed.
Demons are evil, humans are food.
Kids want to escape, Isabella also wants to escape.
There's no room for splitting hairs here.

 

[Spirit]

Then again don't think i'm just debunking your idea
I really do think that this story has the potential to be as dark as you say.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 11, 2017, Original Post Date: Jan 11, 2017 ---

Isn't it already as black and white as that though?
Think about i, there is no middle ground in the series, at least so far anyway.
Everything so far is as its being portrayed.
Demons are evil, humans are food.
Kids want to escape, Isabella also wants to escape.
There's no room for splitting hairs here.

There's always room for an alternative, for things to not be as they seem. Like you said, it's so early on in the series, but that's also a reason to not close off possibilities. Whatever we're shown for some time into this manga i'm not just going to take at face value, because this manga has earned my respect. It's devious, not to be wholly trusted

 

[Brandish μ]

I'm sort of getting a Fallout Vibe, or wanting to. Maybe not necessarily with the Post-Nuclear Destruction or anything but I feel like Grace Fields is located far, far away from any population centers, Human or Demon in nature. Since it's so far away, the Demons have to expend a lot of resources (Again, both Natural and Human) to maintain supply lines and such. If the Children were to escape the Orphanage, Grace Fields would lose credibility, and the Mama responsible would be killed along with any remaining humans. So Krone's plan might not pull through anyway. I think the first thing that will happen after the kids escape will be to find a small village or town.

The main reason I think there is a Fallout situation is that these demons might have come from some catastrophe, like mutants/ghouls did in Fallout. There's so little we know about the outside world atm that a lot is possible.

On the credibility of Grace Fields, I think it will take a hit should the kids escape (mainly Isabella) but this farm produces the highest quality kids... so it really depends what is more important to the higher ups.

 

[Kato756]

Demons

Judging by Sister Krone reaction, I don´t think they are something supernatural. I WOULD bet on them being something of a mutated human subrace, but this would be pretty much copying AoT (sure AoT is not the first one to do this Trope, but on the current manga market it is THE holder of this trope), and I think wheneter this happens or not is subject to editor meedling, since lets be fair, YN is Shone´s aswer to AoT.

Outside World

As I have said previously, I believe the world is normal, pretty much like ours, but the demons have some sort of underground deal to do this to people, which explains Krone not knowing about the "outside" world. The obvious role in this theory (why the books only go up to 2016?) is something I have struggled with, but I think I have found a aswer: What if it is just the demons cutting costs? Like 2016 level of science is all they need to develop the brains. I would love for something in this manga to feel like something casual, that not everything is 100% pre planed with lots of mental battles. Such a dumb reason would also make the children more weary in their planning.

 

[Aonori]

The main reason I think there is a Fallout situation is that these demons might have come from some catastrophe, like mutants/ghouls did in Fallout. There's so little we know about the outside world atm that a lot is possible.

On the credibility of Grace Fields, I think it will take a hit should the kids escape (mainly Isabella) but this farm produces the highest quality kids... so it really depends what is more important to the higher ups.

Well consideering how much of Fallout I got to experience, I see it as a very likely scenario, the demons working as some sort of aliens will feel weirder than this option, and for all intents as purposes, these demons could just be something like the Super mutants for all we know and have been made under "war motivations".

 

[Arjuna]

I think the outside world is post-Apocalypse world.

Demons suddenly appeared and took over the world.Some humans are cooperating with them(like humans helping 10C in NNT) and the Demons harvest human child for their food(like Vampires in Owari No Seraph harvest human children for their blood).

But there are some rebel groups fighting against the Demons(like the Moon Demon Company in Owari No Seraph).

How does this story sound like?

 

[Haya-san]

I've made a few observations and came up with a few theories about the outside world:

-First of all, the 'demons', am I the only one who thought they could actually be aliens? The children thought they were demons because they look like the closest thing they saw in books, and sister Krone's brushed that word off with 'oh, you mean them'. Also, it seems humans couldn't defeat them with the technology available before 2015, which leads me to believe either something happened that ended the human's age of technology or the demons are even more technologically advanced than humans Also, it seems that the author intends to have the children overcome their trials with strategy and machinery, not superpowers. At the beginning I thought Emma and co might develop psychic powers or something like telekinesis to fight against the demons later on, but it seems they'll remain normal human beings. The possibility of the demons being mutated humans occurred to me, but then they used non-human language characters to refer to that 'thing' Emma and co are going to be sacrificed to.

-The last book William wrote that could be found in the library was written at least a year after the farms existed. Either humans no longer could publish books after the demons took over or the adults are intentionally keeping out any books that talk about the world after 2015 to not disturb the children and alert them to their fate.

-The prizes that Ray received and how they are not the newest models. Like I mentioned, either the age of technology ended with the arrival of the demons and those were relics of the past, or the outside world is still advancing and it's due to the adults controlling the information the children receive. The fact that there are no TVs or radios in the houses could be hinting at the latter possibility.

-the farms could only be a sacrifice to the demons to spare the humans in the outside world.

 

[syx]

-First of all, the 'demons', am I the only one who thought they could actually be aliens? The children thought they were demons because they look like the closest thing they saw in books, and sister Krone's brushed that word off with 'oh, you mean them'. Also, it seems humans couldn't defeat them with the technology available before 2015, which leads me to believe either something happened that ended the human's age of technology or the demons are even more technologically advanced than humans

If they really are aliens which came to earth, it is safe to assume that they are hundreds of years, if not thousands of years ahead of human technology considering that the current setting of Neverland's planet earth seems similar to ours. That's why I find it hard to believe that this is the case. The gap between humans and the aliens would/should be too big.

 

[Kadir0]

I am interested in which country we are in right now, I have my doubts that our characters are in Japan.

 

[James Rye]

Like Ray said northern hemisphere so probably somewhere in europe, maybe France or Germany, some country with lot of forests and mountains to hide some kids in.

I'm more curious if our children will discover destroyed cities and villages or maybe even camps where humans are kept alive to produce like cattle for the low-born/common demons or to work on fields and factories for the orphanages, after all those clothes, food, medicine and other stuff has to come from somewhere and I doubt the demons would bother much using their high technology to make pajamas for children. If so then the demons must control a way to gain the basic resources for lets say clothes as well as workers and equipment as well as transportation. So there are probably tons of humans working just to keep this luxus meat/brain facility running.

Given the talk of the two demons the kids are only for the rich, given the talk of that demon meeting the special kids are for the Tifari, a ritual, most likely religious. So the demons are living in a theocratic oligarchy where your money and religious high standing is important, humans are probably the lowest standing in there, some might be able to go up high enough in rank to be able to talk to some demons eye to eye like Krone saw with that one human, but most are either slaves or "products".

 

[Kurisubestwaifu]

I don't think there's an outside world, contrary to popular belief, I think the orphanage, the Momma and Kids right now we're seeing and following are the last of humanity left.
That's why the series is called 'The Promised Neverland.'
In this context, Neverland refers to a place that will never be reached. That means the outside world is a dystopia. It would be a perfect contrast with the inside of the orphanage which is a utopia, no?

The only reason why i don't agree with your theory, (though i find it quite interesting) is the following: Supposing these demons intend to keep living of feeding themselves of the child that come from the "farms" for many more years, there needs to be women and men to give birth to more children to keep the non-stop cycle going. Most likely, there is some kind of "agreement" that was done between these demons and the human race, that alows people to live in safety, but in exchange they have to hand them their child? I don't know, just theorizing aswell.

P.S: (Sorry for any grammar mistakes).

 

[Hermit]

The only reason why i don't agree with your theory, (though i find it quite interesting) is the following: Supposing these demons intend to keep living of feeding themselves of the child that come from the "farms" for many more years, there needs to be women and men to give birth to more children to keep the non-stop cycle going. Most likely, there is some kind of "agreement" that was done between these demons and the human race, that alows people to live in safety, but in exchange they have to hand them their child? I don't know, just theorizing aswell.

P.S: (Sorry for any grammar mistakes).

Yeah, I think I ended up being wrong here, oops
The chapter where Isabella shows Emma that she can choose to be a Mama, and also shows how she herself became a Mama, definitely portrays some kind of civilization on the outside world. Also last chapter there seemed to be some humans that were going to collaborate with the demons on the hunt for the kids, so you could actually be right on the 'agreement' between humans and demons.
It's either that or when the demons first appeared, some humans fought back, but were all defeated/beaten, so the remaining ones decided to subdue themselves due to their own wellbeing.
Or, the humans who made the agreement with the demons helped to eliminate those who fought back? Personally I'd love that a lot, it would help explain the allegiances of people like Grandma and William Minerva.

 

[Kurisubestwaifu]

Yeah, I think I ended up being wrong here, oops
The chapter where Isabella shows Emma that she can choose to be a Mama, and also shows how she herself became a Mama, definitely portrays some kind of civilization on the outside world. Also last chapter there seemed to be some humans that were going to collaborate with the demons on the hunt for the kids, so you could actually be right on the 'agreement' between humans and demons.
It's either that or when the demons first appeared, some humans fought back, but were all defeated/beaten, so the remaining ones decided to subdue themselves due to their own wellbeing.
Or, the humans who made the agreement with the demons helped to eliminate those who fought back? Personally I'd love that a lot, it would help explain the allegiances of people like Grandma and William Minerva.

What you said about they fighting back, seems indeed an interesting theory! I don't thinkg they would bow to them without a fight.. We will discover sooner or later i guess. I was earlier discussing with a friend, that William Minverva might be working alongside the demons, inside the plants, which would explain the fact that he seems to know so much about how it works, and tried to help the kids with the hints on his books but then again this is just speculation though ^^

 

[Brandish μ]

So, any predictions about the humans' society (on the humans side)?

The promise was made centuries ago, and some humans were left as gifts. This is the information Sung-Joo relayed to us, and for now we should assume this to be true. However, this doesn't mean it's common knowledge on the human side. History is what is written, and really I could see it going a few ways. Here's a few scenario's that could come to be...

1. The human gifts are a cover up. For political reasons, this makes sense. In this scenario, I could picture William Minerva being a part of a group who know the truth, and need the kids from Neverland as evidence (they'd need more than just the kids I presume, but the kids would be the smoking gun).
2. The human gifts are known to all. This means they live with the shame of what their predeccesors did, and presume that all the humans were eaten after the great war. Then they find out the kids are alive somehow and things move from there.
3. Perhaps a more thought provoking scenario is that the human gifts are known to all, and human farming is known to all (which niichan suggested in the OP). If we think to our own histories as humans (individually and as a society), much has been done in the past that we have to live with but cannot change. The humans in Neverland, under this scenario, have a chance to make up for the past. I do find this unlikely based on centuries of neglect.

Personally, I think option 1 is most likely. An alternative to the first scenario, in regards to WM, is that he's a part of the government and is rescuing the kids to prove to the public there are humans on the demons side... so they must go to war (this can fit in the second scenario as well).

Why go to war? I have no basis for it so far, but we go to war for resources and land. In this manga, farming has been shown on the demon side. For us, cattle and crops take up a heap of land. The Promise halved it. And from what we've seen on the demon side, the only structures we've seen are at HQ... which could mean the rest of it is 'untouched'. Well, Sung-Joo says there is nothing but wilderness. And judging from the toys/items Ray procured, their human industry seems to be similar to ours. So this could work out too imo.

Didn't mean for this to be such a wall...