Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2017] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Roacher]

Kuroko and Haikyuu are the most recent examples of them capitalizing on this big female audience in sports series. They've been capitalizing on the female audience since the early 2000s with Prince of Tennis and the like. Prince of Tennis' generation was generally believed to be the beginning of "Bishounen Jump". Both Kuroko and Haikyuu did similar amounts to Free in BD sales but YOI is an anomaly. It definitely had that "homoerotic tension" that some groups of readers will see between male characters but it went even further and made it legit. Jump is now starting Full Drive, which looks to at least continue in that category of bishounen characters. It can even be argued that without bishounen/cute boy characters, Jump series simply cannot take off anymore. It may possibly be the reason why Sumou didn't take off despite having a great story, though there may be other factors involved there.

In general though, most sports series have designs that appeal to female characters because its almost become norm to appeal to them. These series definitely have male fans, but the female audience seems to outdo the male audience. The actual type of sport is almost secondary. Yowamushi pedal is about cycling and now we have golf (Robo) in Jump. These aren't particularly popular sports in manga in general but one (cycling) has become a big mainstay in recent sports manga and the other (golf) seems to also be doing well and has a bright future if its able to keep up its rankings and sales.

I know that sport and Jump have big female audience.The problem is that many females want real homo action (kiss, engagement rings). Jump is shonen magazine for boys, boys really don't like male gays so no homo. For Shonen magazine male fans are more important than female fans. Even if manga has bigger female audience. One of the factors why Yoi sold better then KnB and Haikyuu because of very hard pander to fujoshi. Conclusion is that shonen manga can't full pander to girls because every series to a certain extent must appeal to boys.

 

[shoyoboyo]

It's not about pandering to one gender or the other. It's about pandering to tastes. Manga in shounen magazines pander to fans of the shounen audience.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 19, 2017, Original Post Date: Oct 19, 2017 ---

Niche sport can be successful but typical sumo player is unatractive for girls so 30k club.
Are golf, cycling, swimming more popular in Japan? I seriously don't know.

Golf is more of an upper class sport i believe because there isn't a lot of land to make golf courses.
Cycling actually had an explosion of popularity after Yowamushi Pedal, especially amongst women. It's part of the reason why it gets multiple seasons and movies even though it has only decent disc sales.
I'm not sure about swimming.

 

[randimari]

Any female (or male if you’re into that stuff) coming to Jump looking for serious homosexual and gay connotations between male and female character will be disappointed every time. Jump is not in the business to lose money. I didn’t even know Naruto and Sasuke had this huge wave of shippers riding for them to be canon until I was introduced to tumblr. Worst mistake I made in a while clicking on the hashtag.

 

[Leoat12]

With this many votes in such a short amount of time it certainly proves that people are invested in the characters. But with these numbers compared to the volumes sold you'd think that the manga should be able to sell more or at the very least have a greater online presence.

Compare that to Assassination Classrooms voting number which seems paltry by comparison on the other hand has impressive volume sales.

Is there any real difference between the old and new voting systems?

Assassination Classroom has pretty unremarkable characters and everybody would vote for Korosensei, basically. That would be my reason for not voting.

Its online presence is huge on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/search?q=鬼滅の刃&src=typed_query
2chan presence is pretty big too.
http://futabalog.com/?sw=鬼滅&so=1
Tweets from its official account regularly get over 1k retweets/likes, the tweet of Vol 8's cover for example:

Comparing with what exactly? How much the other series do in comparison?

 

[ChocoBar9]

Assassination Classroom has pretty unremarkable characters and everybody would vote for Korosensei, basically. That would be my reason for not voting.

Funnily enough he was third in the poll and lost the 1# position to Karma. I agree in that none of the characters are particularly interesting. But I d wonder if popularity polls are decided by the editor once the series has gained enough status or the author itself it seems odd that a series as popular as AssClass didn't get another poll hell Death Note didn't get any either.

 

[Leoat12]

Funnily enough he was third in the poll and lost the 1# position to Karma. I agree in that none of the characters are particularly interesting. But I d wonder if popularity polls are decided by the editor once the series has gained enough status or the author itself it seems odd that a series as popular as AssClass didn't get another poll hell Death Note didn't get any either.

A character popularity poll for Death Note would be very complex because the story is complex. Although people know that what Light was doing was wrong, a lot of people would agree with what he was doing. Many people would feel uncomfortable because he is the protagonist and the most interesting character by far, so...

 

[SharkBait]

Any female (or male if you’re into that stuff) coming to Jump looking for serious homosexual and gay connotations between male and female character will be disappointed every time. Jump is not in the business to lose money. I didn’t even know Naruto and Sasuke had this huge wave of shippers riding for them to be canon until I was introduced to tumblr. Worst mistake I made in a while clicking on the hashtag.

SasuNaru was and is canon from the start, they even kissed way early. How anyone could miss this is odd.

 

[Doughboy]

I'm starting to see the casuals get super triggered over MHA's current events, it's like I get and understand the complaints but still don't think it's close to trash or boring but this arc should definitely end soon.

 

[Nakura]

I'm starting to see the casuals get super triggered over MHA's current events, it's like I get and understand the complaints but still don't think it's close to trash or boring but this arc should definitely end soon.

When you read a series weekly, people tend to blow a lot of things out of proportion. Issues that are small in the grand scheme of things are made to seem like huge deals when you're reading 1 chapter a week. I've been guilty of having these thoughts from time to time too.

 

[Scruffy8642]

Interesting thoughts about fujos and HZ. I think many would be turned off early because Kawada was still refining his art style, plus it did take almost 100 chapters to properly introduce most of the characters. Looking at recent chaoters though, I think the series has waay more fujo appeal than the likes of HQ and Kuroko. Most of the characters are sexy af to even me as a male, and not even fat besides 2 or 3, just thic. Like thinking about every team from the last arc, there were usually 4 attractive dudes and 1 fat dude each. Then in addition, theyre actually fighting while gripping each other tightly... I honestly ask anyone to look at the current state of the series and tell me it doesnt have considerably more fujo appeal than HQ (which doesn’t even have many attractive characters) or Kuroko (which has a decent amount I guess). This was just emphasised even more with the recent timeskip and new change in character designs. Though I am a male, so take this with a grain of salt. But damn these characters are sexy af.

...aaaand I just said that.

 

[Caiops]

HZ character design is bishie, there's a lot of beautiful male characters, Kirihito, Ushio, Sousuke, Yuuma...

Even Toriko was popular with fujoshi, there's a lot of TorikoxKomatsu, TorikoxCoco doujins out there, i really don't know it why still doesn't have an anime, maybe there was no offer, or Shueisha don't want to invest in it.

 

[ChocoBar9]

Fujoshi likes degeneracy over bishounen that's why Osomatsu-san and Yowamushi Pedal are popular despite of the generally unappealing character designs and the fact that most of the respective casts have generally unattractive aspects towards them.

 

[xAsum0x]

When you read a series weekly, people tend to blow a lot of things out of proportion. Issues that are small in the grand scheme of things are made to seem like huge deals when you're reading 1 chapter a week. I've been guilty of having these thoughts from time to time too.

Most of the complaints are about pacing so I'm 80% sure the arc would be alot more liked in the anime

 

[SharkBait]

If pretty characters were the only thing, then Best BLue and Tokyo Wonder Boys would still be in the magazine #NeverForgetWhatCouldHaveBeen

 

[razerxs]

When you read a series weekly, people tend to blow a lot of things out of proportion. Issues that are small in the grand scheme of things are made to seem like huge deals when you're reading 1 chapter a week. I've been guilty of having these thoughts from time to time too.

Do you really think the series' longest arc is really going to be small in the grand scheme of things? Horikoshi is writing the story he wants to write. People are upset because they're realizing it's different from the story they signed up to read.

It's the same situation as how poorly people responded to Azami in Food Wars.

...aaaand I just said that.

The appeal is more in parings rather than the design.

 

[Doughboy]

Not only the arc being long, another problem is people start to look way too deep into certain things that aren't meant to be that deep. It causes fake outrage to come out when certain things aren't going as expected and become tiring. Still, it's easy to see the difference regarding constructive criticism which is always welcomed.

 

[ChocoBar9]

Do you really think the series' longest arc is really going to be small in the grand scheme of things?

Pacing varies differently reading from week to week versus reading per volume. You cover a lot of ground in one volume.

Horikoshi is writing the story he wants to write. People are upset because they're realizing it's different from the story they signed up to read.

There's nothing in this arc that's different from what was promised where the manga started.

It's the same situation as how poorly people responded to Azami in Food Wars.

And this isn't true at all. Souma's decline was a number of things that led up to Azami and that soon followed after. Funny thing is that much like BC you have to look outside the TOC to see how fans really feel about an arc or else you'll be caught up in the delusion yourself.

 

[Tanzo]

Comparing with what exactly? How much the other series do in comparison?

On 2chan, there are little threads for Neverland, RxL, and Stone, WNL is higher in thread popularity than Yuragi but still can't beat Kimetsu.
On Twitter, comparing search results to Neverland, RxL, Yuragi, WNL, and Stone, Kimetsu has higher presence. RxL can match it somewhat on high likes/RTs on its official account but not on fanart or other tweets.

 

[shoyoboyo]

Interesting thoughts about fujos and HZ. I think many would be turned off early because Kawada was still refining his art style, plus it did take almost 100 chapters to properly introduce most of the characters. Looking at recent chaoters though, I think the series has waay more fujo appeal than the likes of HQ and Kuroko. Most of the characters are sexy af to even me as a male, and not even fat besides 2 or 3, just thic. Like thinking about every team from the last arc, there were usually 4 attractive dudes and 1 fat dude each. Then in addition, theyre actually fighting while gripping each other tightly... I honestly ask anyone to look at the current state of the series and tell me it doesnt have considerably more fujo appeal than HQ (which doesn’t even have many attractive characters) or Kuroko (which has a decent amount I guess). This was just emphasised even more with the recent timeskip and new change in character designs. Though I am a male, so take this with a grain of salt. But damn these characters are sexy af.

...aaaand I just said that.

Fujos like cute or handsome characters with "gay tensions" between them. Those tensions typically come in rivalries and such. Zumou doesn't really have much in terms of rivalries because a lot of the characters that Hinomaru defeats are sidelined for the rest of the story. The only rivalry he really has is the one with the captain, but that guy is fat, so that's thrown out the window.
My guess as to why HZ isn't popular among fujos is because they just don't find the characters attractive. I've said this before, it's just a matter of character design. HZ characters are either stocky or fat. Then again, it is a sumo manga.
Also, I have to disagree on the characters in HZ being more attractive than Haikyuu. Oikawa and Kuroo are some sexy mofos.

 

[savethecat]

I liked Ole Golazo more than RxL. Still wish that took off