Hangout The Games Hangout Thread

[z.5]

I believe they were even teetering on illegality at least in the UK if they weren't going to honor existing preorders.

Well, I doubt that anyone wouldn't have honoured those preorders - I'm pretty sure it would've never come to court

... and not only because I'm sure Steam would have offered a full refund (I mean, they already have to do this for any game, for any reason), nor because they [the game designers] would've straight away been taken to court/forced to give back the money [thus they are actually losing sales this way], but also due to the fact that it'd look really bad on them to do so.

What I could've seen them doing, which I'm glad they didn't, was to not offer updates on the steam platform - or to offer keys to the customers [who had preordered the game] to download Metro on the Epic game store (thus forcing them to either cancel their order, or create accounts for the other software).

The fact they didn't do either of those kinda speaks well for them - but it's a very small 'kinda'

 

[xi0]

The fact they didn't do either of those kinda speaks well for them - but it's a very small 'kinda'

I don't think it means much personally. They're "smart" enough to account for these sorts of things, as an FAQ addressing these concerns is not only on the Steam Forums but also on the Epic Game Store, even mentioning when the game comes out on Steam (found that weird). But they're slimy enough to do this kind of deal anyways, knowing that what they're doing isn't illegal, but it's definitely questionable ethically. Not to mention that in some locales people can't even buy the game on EGS, lol.

It's as much their fault as it is Deep Silver though, but according to THQ Nordic (their parent company), they weren't involved in the decision making. Not sure about the truth there but it'll probably be known eventually. I won't have much problem avoiding Deep Silver titles in the future though, as aside from the Metro series and Kingdom Come Deliverance, nothing they've put out in recent history seems worth my time. Pathfinder: Kingmaker seems like it might have ended up being a dud.

 

[z.5]

Pathfinder: Kingmaker seems like it might have ended up being a dud.

Well, it did come out into a rather saturated market (I'm pretty stoked that isometric RPGs appear to be making a comeback, however)

That's probably the next game I will put cash into (well, excluding random buys here and there). Not Pathfinder, but a new isometric RPG.
Maybe if someone makes something like an elder scrolls game (the freedom of action I mean), but isometric and punishing (like Baldur's is).

Something gritty, preferably where you aren't 'the chosen one' - but rather are some random schmuck, who might/might not do heroic things from time to time

I'd play the hell outta that

 

[xi0]

Well, it did come out into a rather saturated market (I'm pretty stoked that isometric RPGs appear to be making a comeback, however)

That's probably the next game I will put cash into (well, excluding random buys here and there). Not Pathfinder, but a new isometric RPG.
Maybe if someone makes something like an elder scrolls game (the freedom of action I mean), but isometric and punishing (like Baldur's is).

Something gritty, preferably where you aren't 'the chosen one' - but rather are some random schmuck, who might/might not do heroic things from time to time

I'd play the hell outta that

True, I think I scratched my itch for the time being with PoE and saw some bad reviews, bummer.

Good, boycott Deep Silver!

Did you try out Tyranny or Seven: The Days Long Gone? The premises seemed cool but I saw mixed things about how they both turned out. Wolcen seems pretty hyped up as well, but that's Early Access so who knows how that'll turn out. There's also Lost Ark, but that's more of an MMO and it's *shudders* Korean...

 

[z.5]

Did you try out Tyranny or Seven: The Days Long Gone? The premises seemed cool but I saw mixed things about how they both turned out. Wolcen seems pretty hyped up as well, but that's Early Access so who knows how that'll turn out.

Not Seven, but did see a friend play a load of Tyranny.

I dunno, I actually wasn't a huge fan of the story.
I liked the premise of the world, but the story execution didn't do anything for me.

There's also Lost Ark, but that's more of an MMO

Speaking of genres which I have no intention of ever getting back into

I work hard enough as it is, to earn the cash I want.
Why would I work a 2nd job (as that's what these games kinda are), grinding away on pointless tasks, and paying for the 'pleasure'?

MMOs also, recently at least, tend towards the WoW style combat system (yeah, I know it was around before them, but they certainly helped to ensure that every damn MMO now follows the same gameplay choices) and the same class systems.
Neither of those interests me greatly - in fact, the 'class' system (Rogue, Warrior, Mage) is one of my biggest turnoffs from RPGs in general (an issue I'm willing to overlook due to how much I enjoy everything else in RPGs).

I was talking to a friend recently about MMO stagnation and wondering how well a classless RPG set in a world with localized (and limited) resources/monsters/items would work.

• One which encourages trade and interactions, purely due to the distance separating things.
• One without forced difficulty zones (as in, there may be a place which has more punishing monsters than another, but not in the way where only level 95s need apply [where, for them, it will be similar to 'easier' areas at lower levels as the zones difficulty follows level requirements relatively symmetrically]), or even fixed levels.
• Perhaps something back to the old UO days, with stats which progressed based upon use?
• Maybe a twitch/skilled based combat system (maybe similar to Witcher's 3rd person melee combat)?!?
• One which enables players to be dicks (like old MMO's and more modern ones like EVE allow)

I dunno if it'd ever work, but I feel that these kind of ideas might be one of the only ways to ever rekindle my desire to play a modern MMO.

As this is all pretty unlikely, I think that I'm just not the right target audience for that genre anymore.

 

[xi0]

I dunno, I actually wasn't a huge fan of the story.
I liked the premise of the world, but the story execution didn't do anything for me.

Yeah I heard the same sort of thing from elsewhere actually lol

Speaking of genres which I have no intention of ever getting back into

I work hard enough as it is, to earn the cash I want.
Why would I work a 2nd job (as that's what these games kinda are), grinding away on pointless tasks, and paying for the 'pleasure'?

MMOs also, recently at least, tend towards the WoW style combat system (yeah, I know it was around before them, but they certainly helped to ensure that every damn MMO now follows the same gameplay choices) and the same class systems.
Neither of those interests me greatly - in fact, the 'class' system (Rogue, Warrior, Mage) is one of my biggest turnoffs from RPGs in general (an issue I'm willing to overlook due to how much I enjoy everything else in RPGs).

Yeah sometimes I'll get in the mood to play and I stick with it for a while but then eventually get bored. There's so many other games to sink time into, that the grind eventually feels pointless. For what it's worth though, Wolcen is classless

I was talking to a friend recently about MMO stagnation and wondering how well a classless RPG set in a world with localized (and limited) resources/monsters/items would work.

• One which encourages trade and interactions, purely due to the distance separating things.
• One without forced difficulty zones (as in, there may be a place which has more punishing monsters than another, but not in the way where only level 95s need apply [where, for them, it will be similar to 'easier' areas at lower levels as the zones difficulty follows level requirements relatively symmetrically]), or even fixed levels.
• Perhaps something back to the old UO days, with stats which progressed based upon use?
• Maybe a twitch/skilled based combat system (maybe similar to Witcher's 3rd person melee combat)?!?
• One which enables players to be dicks (like old MMO's and more modern ones like EVE allow)

I dunno if it'd ever work, but I feel that these kind of ideas might be one of the only ways to ever rekindle my desire to play a modern MMO.

As this is all pretty unlikely, I think that I'm just not the right target audience for that genre anymore.

I think that sort of Wild West mentality for MMOs is dead. Griefing is downright against the ToS in some of them. Companies like Blizzard and SquareEnix just can't allow their paying customers to have any sort of negative experience in the game, or else they think they risk losing them. Market research really doing well for them there . It would take a special kind of indie developer to do something like that again, I guess. Too bad almost all indie MMOs have too many shortcomings elsewhere for it to even matter. But it would be cool to see something more cutthroat and not set up as every single nobody playing the game being the hero, it's so fucking boring.

A faster, more dynamic combat style would be cool, but it'd also cost developers way more money so the netcode is decent and the servers tick fast enough for it to matter. I think WoW-style combat is still good and there's obviously skill involved but it's still pretty outdated at it's core. WoW does have scaling difficulty though, and FF14 has had it longer, should be doable by anyone really.

You mentioned MMOs being like a second job... as cool as something like this seems like it could be, I think we'd need second lives for a game like you described

 

[Jammin]

Well, it did come out into a rather saturated market (I'm pretty stoked that isometric RPGs appear to be making a comeback, however)

That's probably the next game I will put cash into (well, excluding random buys here and there). Not Pathfinder, but a new isometric RPG.
Maybe if someone makes something like an elder scrolls game (the freedom of action I mean), but isometric and punishing (like Baldur's is).

Something gritty, preferably where you aren't 'the chosen one' - but rather are some random schmuck, who might/might not do heroic things from time to time

I'd play the hell outta that

FYI, you just described Divinity Original Sin 2. Best game of the last 5 years.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 30, 2019, Original Post Date: Jan 30, 2019 ---

Correction. 4 Years. I'm not quite sure I'm willing to put it above Witcher 3 for me. It crushes everything else though.

 

[z.5]

FYI, you just described Divinity Original Sin 2. Best game of the last 5 years.

Pretty sure I didn't

I completed Div Orig Sin 2 and it wasn't like that at all.

It wasn't that freeform - forcing you into the main storyline pretty hard.

... also, you certainly weren't some random guy, at all, you were a damn god chosen


All that said, I did enjoy the game.
Especially in coop, where it really shined.

 

[Jammin]

Pretty sure I didn't

I completed Div Orig Sin 2 and it wasn't like that at all.

It wasn't that freeform - forcing you into the main storyline pretty hard.

... also, you certainly weren't some random guy, at all, you were a damn god chosen


All that said, I did enjoy the game.
Especially in coop, where it really shined.

Well I was purely referring to the bit I bolded. You can't get more "freeform in action" that Divinity 2 right? What does more free form than that even look like? Or did you mean more in like a narrative sense?

 

[z.5]

Or did you mean more in like a narrative sense?

yeah, I meant narratively.

Like in the Elder Scrolls games (less so in [unmodded] Skyrim, unfortunately), one of my favourite things about RPGs is feeling like I'm part of a living world (one which doesn't solely revolve around me).

RPG provide the ideal setting to handle this kind of thing in a competent manner.

Well I was purely referring to the bit I bolded.

Sorry, am checking phone whilst working and didn't notice the emboldening.

 

[Jammin]

yeah, I meant narratively.

Like in the Elder Scrolls games (less so in [unmodded] Skyrim, unfortunately), one of my favourite things about RPGs is feeling like I'm part of a living world (one which doesn't solely revolve around me).

RPG provide the ideal setting to handle this kind of thing in a competent manner.


Sorry, am checking phone whilst working and didn't notice the emboldening.

That's fair.

I think I'm pretty similar, honestly, though I'd say the type thing I wish I'd see is more variety in the RPG settings more than anything else. There are so many similar types of games out there in terms of setting. Like you got you high fantasy, apocalyptic, and sci-fi but there are so many other types of settings to explore that are so rarely done.

Like what about contemporary fantasy? Or low fantasy. Or a western. Or a thriller. I would love to see a modern attempt to making a game like Bloodlines or Alpha Protocol. Or Gladus. Or even something like Freelancer.

Now every game has RPG progression but few really try to give the gamer a role and have them play it. Which more than anything else is the appeal of the genre for me. Variety in those roles is one of the things I love too.

 

[z.5]

Man, I'd love to play an awesome low fantasy RPG.

One RPG which I'd really like, is another one in the Vampire the Masquerade setting.
Bloodlines has to be one of my favourite RPGs of all time

Another setting I'd love to see would be the old Warhammer Fantasy setting (not 40k and certainly not that bullshit Age of Sigmar bullshit).

I love how grimdark that world is and considering how willing Games Workshop has been to give out their Warhammer IP, recently, it's not entirely impossible for someone to make one.
- I can but hope

 

[Jammin]

Man, I'd love to play an awesome low fantasy RPG.

One RPG which I'd really like, is another one in the Vampire the Masquerade setting.
Bloodlines has to be one of my favourite RPGs of all time

Another setting I'd love to see would be the old Warhammer Fantasy setting (not 40k and certainly not that bullshit Age of Sigmar bullshit).

I love how grimdark that world is and considering how willing Games Workshop has been to give out their Warhammer IP, recently, it's not entirely impossible for someone to make one.
- I can but hope

I'd love all of those and more. Like even just a Gortex and Felix Warhammer game. I would enjoy that so much.

That's one of the reasons I'm so stoked for Mechwarrior 5. Because, in terms of sci-fi a setting, the Inner Sphere is so unique. I'm not sure how many RPG aspects it's going to have but to be able to play a mech sim where we run our own mercenary company in that universe. Hell yeah.

And I feel like we're getting closer and closer to a real attempt at a true Conan the Barbarian game.

It feels like only recently are we getting any attempt to explore these very different worlds and settings. I'm sure we can both think of like six dozen other fiction series that could be the foundation for an distinct game universe that we'd love to play around in.

 

[z.5]

I'd love all of those and more. Like even just a Gortex and Felix Warhammer game. I would enjoy that so much.

Oh hell yeah!

Not an RPG, but I would love a God of War-esque game where you play as a slayer (it doesn't even have to be Gotrek).

That's one of the reasons I'm so stoked for Mechwarrior 5. Because, in terms of sci-fi a setting, the Inner Sphere is so unique. I'm not sure how many RPG aspects it's going to have but to be able to play a mech sim where we run our own mercenary company in that universe. Hell yeah.

Mechwarrior games have always been heavy on the customisation - that does sound good, I'll have to keep an eye open.

And I feel like we're getting closer and closer to a real attempt at a true Conan the Barbarian game.

I doubt it - I re-read the old Conan books recently. Pretty sure that that level of non-political correctness would turn more than a few heads.

Conan isn't really a 'hero' in the modern sense of the word.

 

[Jammin]

I doubt it - I re-read the old Conan books recently. Pretty sure that that level of non-political correctness would turn more than a few heads.

Conan isn't really a 'hero' in the modern sense of the word.

There is a market for that though. Like Conan Exlies is getting close to a true Conan experience in way. Full frontal nudity. Capturing npc's and attaching them to the "wheel of pain" then turning them into thralls. Ripping out hearts and sacrificing them to the gods. Funcom is inching closer and closer to what a Conan game needs to be. It's just a matter of creating something singleplayer and a better combat system.

I'm sure the delicate types would be clutching their pearls but I feel like it's getting to the point on PC where that just doesn't matter anymore. What matters is getting noticed. And like you said a Conan game would turn heads.

 

[xi0]

Yeesh, what a clusterfuck

 

[z.5]

Man, that's a pretty shitty move - advertising on Steam I mean.

Wonder if Valve will take action (as in, delete all comments/advertisements).
Doubt it - probably not worth the effort.

Also, I thought the creator wasn't getting involved...

 

[xi0]

First this Metro nonsense and now this...

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 31, 2019, Original Post Date: Jan 31, 2019 ---

Man, that's a pretty shitty move - advertising on Steam I mean.

Wonder if Valve will take action (as in, delete all comments/advertisements).
Doubt it - probably not worth the effort.

Also, I thought the creator wasn't getting involved...

I've seen people bring this up but I'm not really sure myself. Would probably be better to not make a retaliatory move.

Not involved in what way? In the games? He collaborated with 4A for the first game and helped write Last Light, everything I've seen says he's doing the same for Exodus, since it's new story territory (Like Last Light was before he wrote Metro 2035).

People are disputing the authenticity of the screenshot, but there's supposedly multiple sources for it, so I'm not too sure.

 

[z.5]

Not involved in what way? In the games?

Nah, in all the controversy.

I recall reading him stating how he had no say in the move - he just imagines worlds (or something). Also that he thought Steam didn't give 2 shits.

I can guess that the screenshots might be real, but it sounded like he was just trying to absolve himself from it all and let it play out without him.

to be honest, other than generally being against exclusivity in gaming, I've not put too much effort into this whole controversy

 

[xi0]

Nah, in all the controversy.

I recall reading him stating how he had no say in the move - he just imagines worlds (or something). Also that he thought Steam didn't give 2 shits.

I can guess that the screenshots might be real, but it sounded like he was just trying to absolve himself from it all and let it play out without him.

to be honest, other than generally being against exclusivity in gaming, I've not put too much effort into this whole controversy

Yeah I've read that as well. Why anyone would be faking such things when he's already made a statement is anyone's guess, but maybe he saw the controversy not really going away, dunno.

Being against exclusivity in gaming is really all the effort you need.