One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
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As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[LadyVados]

You said last time that chapter pretty much confirms that Mihawk > Everyone else. Could be the one before that but it's there.

Yeah because it downgraded Kaido’s title from wsc to wsp

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

Spoiler: 997

Zoro > 500 gifters > 2 gifters > Sanji

 

[Pirate Queen]

@Pirate Queen If you don’t think Mihawk’s WSS title is valid, why do you think WB and Kaido’s titles are valid ?

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

Spoiler: 997

Actually, after the latest chapter I can see Kaido being slightly stronger than Mihawk based on what he has displayed until now. Though it’s not impossible that Mihawk has some secret power which he never showed Zoro before...

Because Mihawk is the only one with a title that is skill based

Being a man isn't a skill
Being a creature isn't a skill

Swordsmanship is a skill

I think Mihawk's title is valid only when swords are in play and nothing else.

 

[Nie Li]

Spoiler: 997

Zoro > 500 gifters > 2 gifters > Sanji

Sanji was kicking gifters around during previous chapters. It's not a fair comparison.

Zoro > Sanji, but there's no need to twist things around to prove it.

 

[LadyVados]

Because Mihawk is the only one with a title that is skill based

Being a man isn't a skill
Being a creature isn't a skill

Swordsmanship is a skill

I think Mihawk's title is valid only when swords are in play and nothing else.

That is a very weak argument and you know it.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

Sanji was kicking gifters around during previous chapters. It's not a fair comparison.

Zoro > Sanji, but there's no need to twist things around to prove it.

How many Sanji fans have brought up Zoro struggling with grifters ?

 

[XXGenesis]

Because Mihawk is the only one with a title that is skill based

Being a man isn't a skill
Being a creature isn't a skill

Swordsmanship is a skill

I think Mihawk's title is valid only when swords are in play and nothing else.

Agreed.

A point Nik had but started to troll. Was that Many Ppl are weapon users in One Piece whether it’s a side arm or their main way to fight. & commonly the weapon is a sword or bladed weapon. Still yet doesn’t mean such characters are solely/prime Swordsman. Their true strengths probably lie in their martial arts, DF powers or a mix of both.

So I believe if you try to fight Mihawk solely with a sword or bladed weapon. He will own, be superior or simply disarm you. Mihawk has the greatest skills with a sword and it’s techniques.

Yonkou’s use swords & bladed weapons but have other means of combat. Which imo excell above Mihawk’s swordsmanship. Yes Vista stalled Mihawk & Mihawk showed interest. I believe if Mihawk was serious he would win with very few moves and difficulty.

As for hurting a Yonkou, Mihawk is definitely capable of such. But imo he won’t win. It’ll be a mid diff fight for the Yonkou’s....Shanks excluded because I’m starting to believe he is the weakest Yonkou partly aside from BB

 

[Nie Li]

How many Sanji fans have brought up Zoro struggling with grifters ?

Mostly King Moe, probably some others that I don't remember.

However, what was a bad argument against Zoro is still a bad argument against Sanji, and it shouldn't be brought up unless, of course, you were being ironical and trying to teach to those particular Sanji fans who used the bad argument in the first place.

 

[LadyVados]

unless, of course, you were being ironical and trying to teach to those particular Sanji fans who used the bad argument in the first place.

Exactly

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

If saying sanjitard is threadban-worthy offence then so is saying swordboi, I’d argue it’s more offensive.

 

[Nie Li]

Exactly

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

If saying sanjitard is threadban-worthy offence then so is saying swordboi, I’d argue it’s more offensive.

One is a contraction of the word "retard", the other of the word "boi".

 

[thedude]

@Pirate Queen If you don’t think Mihawk’s WSS title is valid, why do you think WB and Kaido’s titles are valid ?

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

Spoiler: 997

Actually, after the latest chapter I can see Kaido being slightly stronger than Mihawk based on what he has displayed until now. Though it’s not impossible that Mihawk has some secret power which he never showed Zoro before...

Not directed at me, but I don't think any of the epithets are entirely valid.

WB was called "Strongest Man in the World" even when he clearly was no longer that. Kaido's is "WSC", which could literally just mean...he's the strongest Zoan. That's it. And Mihawks is about renown with the sword. We know he didn't beat Shanks. We know he hasn't fought everyone around, like Vista. So his "title" is merely something people give to him based on their opinion.

Oda gives these titles to give hype to a character, but it doesn't actually represent a power triangle that he consciously thought of as the top 3 in the universe.

 

[Nie Li]

WB was called "Strongest Man in the World" even when he clearly was no longer that. Kaido's is "WSC", which could literally just mean...he's the strongest Zoan. That's it. And Mihawks is about renown with the sword. We know he didn't beat Shanks. We know he hasn't fought everyone around, like Vista. So his "title" is merely something people give to him based on their opinion.

Not trying to argue anything about the titles here, but we don't know he didn't beat Shanks. Some people just assume he didn't, but nowhere has that been said or hinted in the manga.

 

[thedude]

Not trying to argue anything about the titles here, but we don't know he didn't beat Shanks. Some people just assume he didn't, but nowhere has that been said or hinted in the manga.

You are right. I should say, we literally have no idea how their duels ended, only that neither was seriously hurt, and that they stopped when Shanks lost his arm.

 

[LadyVados]

Not directed at me, but I don't think any of the epithets are entirely valid.

WB was called "Strongest Man in the World" even when he clearly was no longer that. Kaido's is "WSC", which could literally just mean...he's the strongest Zoan. That's it. And Mihawks is about renown with the sword. We know he didn't beat Shanks. We know he hasn't fought everyone around, like Vista. So his "title" is merely something people give to him based on their opinion.

Oda gives these titles to give hype to a character, but it doesn't actually represent a power triangle that he consciously thought of as the top 3 in the universe.

Oh don’t get me wrong I have no problem with people who ignore epithets entirely. I just have a problem with people who use them selectively.

 

[Pirate Queen]

You are right. I should say, we literally have no idea how their duels ended, only that neither was seriously hurt, and that they stopped when Shanks lost his arm.

The fact that they are considered rivals tells us multiple fights occurred.

And if multiple fights occurred and only Mihawk won... they wouldn't be considered rivals and Mihawk wouldn't have actively sought out someone he could defeat every single time.

It is revealed it was MIHAWK that sought out Shanks. Not the other way around.

Both had to have won against eachother for it to make sense.

I have debated none of the titles are valid at something in my debates. None of them make sense.

I've arguement Akainu could be considered stronger due to performance or that Kaido is titled because he can't be killed not because he is the strongest. Those topics can be argued.

What makes no sense is suddenly declaring Mihawk isn't a Pirate because Kaido is considered the Worlds Strongest Pirate.

 

[Nie Li]

You are right. I should say, we literally have no idea how their duels ended, only that neither was seriously hurt, and that they stopped when Shanks lost his arm.

And that is indeed correct.

Though we know that they kept meeting and having friendly chats afterwards since Shanks told Mihawk about Luffy, unless they were dueling during the 4 year long stop at Luffy's village.

 

[LadyVados]

I was thinking about why we’re always talking about Zoro vs Sanji or Mihawk but then I realised after the yonko, admiral, commander debates were banned on this thread, those are the only 2 interesting things left to talk about really.

 

[Nie Li]

The fact that they are considered rivals tells us multiple fights occurred.

And if multiple fights occurred and only Mihawk won... they wouldn't be considered rivals and Mihawk wouldn't have actively sought out someone he could defeat every single time.

It is revealed it was MIHAWK that sought out Shanks. Not the other way around.

Both had to have won against eachother for it to make sense.

I'm okay with the conclusion you arrived at but I want to ask you when was it revealed that it was Mihawk who sought Shanks?

I think it can be implied, since Mihawk is searching now for people stronger than Shanks to duel, it can be implied that he also used to seek duels with Shanks for the excitement of it. It goes well with what I think of Mihawk's character and personality, but I'm asking in case it has really been revealed as in, confirmed, and not just implied.

Also, there's a secondary implication from this that may be more divisive: If Mihawk is looking for swordsmen stronger than Shanks to duel them (as confirmed in the vivre cards by Oda, so we know for sure it's not Mihawk bluffing or something) yet he has lost interest in Shanks, it seems to imply that after Shanks lost his arm he somehow didn't keep up with Mihawk (in Mihawk's eyes, not necessarily from an omniscient perspective, but Mihawk should be able to gauge that rather well going by what he said to Zoro at the Baratie).

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 26, 2020, Original Post Date: Nov 26, 2020 ---

I was thinking about why we’re always talking about Zoro vs Sanji or Mihawk but then I realised after the yonko, admiral, commander debates were banned on this thread, those are the only 2 interesting things left to talk about really.

I think you can talk about yonko, admirals and commanders?

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story

It's actually Mihawk and ZvS we shouldn't focus too much on.

 

[LadyVados]

I think you can talk about yonko, admirals and commanders?

Oh no, you have to do that in the designated thread now

 

[Pirate Queen]

I'm okay with the conclusion you arrived at but I want to ask you when was it revealed that it was Mihawk who sought Shanks?

I think it can be implied, since Mihawk is searching now for people stronger than Shanks to duel, it can be implied that he also used to seek duels with Shanks for the excitement of it. It goes well with what I think of Mihawk's character and personality, but I'm asking in case it has really been revealed as in, confirmed, and not just implied.

Also, there's a secondary implication from this that may be more divisive: If Mihawk is looking for swordsmen stronger than Shanks to duel them (as confirmed in the vivre cards by Oda, so we know for sure it's not Mihawk bluffing or something) yet he has lost interest in Shanks, it seems to imply that after Shanks lost his arm he somehow didn't keep up with Mihawk (in Mihawk's eyes, not necessarily from an omniscient perspective, but Mihawk should be able to gauge that rather well going by what he said to Zoro at the Baratie).

Mihawk refused to fight Shanks after he lost his arm. It wasn't stated the had one duel after Shanks lost his arm and Mihawk realized Shanks was no longer strong enough... also this is null because Mihawk fought preYonko Shanks not Yonko Shanks.

And we can see how far Luffy had advanced from just 3 short years ago. He was getting whooped by people like Buggy. Shanks last fought Mihawk 6 years before being a Yonko unless you want to imply Mihawk and Shanks never got stronger in the time after they last fought... which doesn't make sense to me personally.

 

[Nie Li]

Mihawk refused to fight Shanks after he lost his arm. It wasn't stated the had one duel after Shanks lost his arm and Mihawk realized Shanks was no longer strong enough... also this is null because Mihawk fought preYonko Shanks not Yonko Shanks.

And we can see how far Luffy had advanced from just 3 short years ago. He was getting whooped by people like Buggy. Shanks last fought Mihawk 6 years before being a Yonko unless you want to imply Mihawk and Shanks never got stronger in the time after they last fought... which doesn't make sense to me personally.

Not at all, what I want to imply is that they both got stronger and yet Mihawk is looking for someone stronger than Shanks, despite knowing full well that Shanks has become a yonko and having met him on at least two different occasions (before Marineford).

I believe they're both incredibly strong, but there must be a reason why Mihawk hasn't turned back to fighting him despite his thirst for someone stronger and my personal interpretation is that despite Shanks' incredible growth, his missing arm still gives Mihawk (who grew equally) an edge over him in a duel.

 

[XXGenesis]

Not at all, what I want to imply is that they both got stronger and yet Mihawk is looking for someone stronger than Shanks, despite knowing full well that Shanks has become a yonko and having met him on at least two different occasions (before Marineford).

I believe they're both incredibly strong, but there must be a reason why Mihawk hasn't turned back to fighting him despite his thirst for someone stronger and my personal interpretation is that despite Shanks' incredible growth, his missing arm still gives Mihawk (who grew equally) an edge over him in a duel.

IMO it’s because Shanks has top tier swordsmanship that has droppped because he only has 1 arm. But I’m sticking to Shanks having high Martial Arts prowess as to how he he’s gotten stronger and attained a spot amongst the Yonkou.