Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[HereNThere]

I wish we would have seen any of all that in the actual manga.

I haven't followed the anime ever since it disappointed me in Marineford.

To be fair, with the exception of Luffy, we've barely seen anything from the other Strawhats during those two years.

Sanji and Zoro are the only other SHs who we got small snippets from after him.

 

[Nie Li]

To be fair, with the exception of Luffy, we've barely seen anything from the other Strawhats during those two years.

Sanji and Zoro are the only other SHs who we got small snippets from after him.

I wish we would have seen more of them all. At least some collage of how their time went. Especially for Zoro, Sanji and Robin.

Even for Zoro and Sanji most of what we know is anime-only except for that short novel about Perona's POV with Mihawk and Zoro.

 

[HereNThere]

Even for Zoro and Sanji most of what we know is anime-only except for that short novel about Perona's POV with Mihawk and Zoro.

What did the anime show?

In the manga, we got to see Sanji running all day and all night, which lead to Sky Walk. And for Zoro, we saw his discussion with Mihawk about Black Blades.

 

[Nie Li]

What did the anime show?

In the manga, we got to see Sanji running all day and all night, which lead to Sky Walk. And for Zoro, we saw his discussion with Mihawk about Black Blades.

For Zoro, in the manga we didn't even see the humandrills, those big monkeys that copied human fighting techniques and that apparently were responsible for sparring with Zoro most of the time according to the anime (they were shown in the manga as some shadows lurking on the island but we weren't told they were important or even that they were used as training tools. They weren't important in the novel either).

For Sanji, the anime showed all of that about Sanji being offered some super-recipes for defeating a specific number of okama masters over the course of the 2 years. In the manga he was indeed simply shown running away non-stop for two years and developing things like Sky Walk and Blue Walk. He had no other interaction shown in the manga other than running away for years to come.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

Saw theory about sanji vs perospero. Pretty makes sense, to be honest. Sanji power is fire so it's effective against perospero here and perospero is enemy from WCI (year of sanji)

 

[HereNThere]

For Zoro, in the manga we didn't even see the humandrills, those big monkeys that copied human fighting techniques and that apparently were responsible for sparring with Zoro most of the time according to the anime (they were shown in the manga as some shadows lurking on the island but we weren't told they were important or even that they were used as training tools. They weren't important in the novel either).

For Sanji, the anime showed all of that about Sanji being offered some super-recipes for defeating a specific number of okama masters over the course of the 2 years. In the manga he was indeed simply shown running away non-stop for two years and developing things like Sky Walk and Blue Walk. He had no other interaction shown in the manga other than running away for years to come.

We actually did see the Humandrills during the Pre Time Skip stuff. It was off screened, but Mihawk had chided Zoro for not being able to defeat them initially, but Zoro had indeed defeated them in.

Did they show him fighting some in the anime? The specific Masters hadn't been shown, but he was making the deal with Iva, they had their silhouettes shown.

 

[Nie Li]

We actually did see the Humandrills during the Pre Time Skip stuff. It was off screened, but Mihawk had chided Zoro for not being able to defeat them initially, but Zoro had indeed defeated them in.

Did they show him fighting some in the anime? The specific Masters hadn't been shown, but he was making the deal with Iva, they had their silhouettes shown.

Oh, right. I forgot they were on that scene, but that was where their importance ended, right? Just that an injured Zoro defeated them before kneeling to Mihawk, right? In the anime they were expanded upon and there was even one of them who wielded a sword identical to Mihawk's.

For Sanji, the deal with Ivankov was shown in the manga? I honestly don't remember it. I only remember that they started chasing him and then the cover story thing where they chased him until they managed to crossdress him. Every other reference to his timeskip adventure in the manga is just about how he spent those years running away.

As far as I know, the anime didn't show the fights between Sanji and the masters either, only the negotiations. If those were on the manga then I just miremembered and there really wasn't that much of a difference for him between the manga and the anime.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 18, 2021, Original Post Date: Apr 18, 2021 ---

Saw theory about sanji vs perospero. Pretty makes sense, to be honest. Sanji power is fire so it's effective against perospero here and perospero is enemy from WCI (year of sanji)

Sanji defeating Perospero to save Marco would be pretty badass actually.

Perospero lost an arm but he was capable of holding back two sulongs all alone. He's no push-over.

However, Sanji isn't one to get lost and he was choosing between going for the Scabbards or going for Momo, I don't think he'll be approaching the plaza at all.

 

[catagon87]

Saw theory about sanji vs perospero. Pretty makes sense, to be honest. Sanji power is fire so it's effective against perospero here and perospero is enemy from WCI (year of sanji)

Sanji defeating Perospero to save Marco would be pretty badass actually.

Perospero lost an arm but he was capable of holding back two sulongs all alone. He's no push-over.

However, Sanji isn't one to get lost and he was choosing between going for the Scabbards or going for Momo, I don't think he'll be approaching the plaza at all.

This would actually be a pretty cool fight. Not to mention didn't Perospero pretty recently fuck up Wanda and Carrot? It fits perfectly. Damsel in distress is what took him to Black Maria. Perospero is on the level of King / Queen, I think, too. He's confident enough to think he can take on Marco at least. He made such short work of Pedro.

 

[HereNThere]

Oh, right. I forgot they were on that scene, but that was where their importance ended, right? Just that an injured Zoro defeated them before kneeling to Mihawk, right? In the anime they were expanded upon and there was even one of them who wielded a sword identical to Mihawk's.

For Sanji, the deal with Ivankov was shown in the manga? I honestly don't remember it. I only remember that they started chasing him and then the cover story thing where they chased him until they managed to crossdress him. Every other reference to his timeskip adventure in the manga is just about how he spent those years running away.

As far as I know, the anime didn't show the fights between Sanji and the masters either, only the negotiations. If those were on the manga then I just miremembered and there really wasn't that much of a difference for him between the manga and the anime.

Yeah, that was it for the Humandrills. The one with Mihawk's sword was actually in the manga too, I think he was just in the background.

Yeah.

Spoiler

 

[King Moe]

Saw theory about sanji vs perospero. Pretty makes sense, to be honest. Sanji power is fire so it's effective against perospero here and perospero is enemy from WCI (year of sanji)

Nah, too easy and plus Macro will be fighting him. He be facing King or Queen more. Not much sense especially no serious between them like certain characters. It's not like Zoro vs Orochi as example.

This would actually be a pretty cool fight. Not to mention didn't Perospero pretty recently fuck up Wanda and Carrot? It fits perfectly. Damsel in distress is what took him to Black Maria. Perospero is on the level of King / Queen, I think, too. He's confident enough to think he can take on Marco at least. He made such short work of Pedro.

It be like Luffy vs Enel. He got weakness on him and not much fight and plus Macro won't be facing Beast Pirates members and will leave it to New Generation Pirates like Sanji is. Plus It won't be his fight to beat him given once moon shows in the sky, I think Carrot and Wanda will return.

Sanji make most sense with facing King or Queen to be honest.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 18, 2021, Original Post Date: Apr 18, 2021 ---

Oh, right. I forgot they were on that scene, but that was where their importance ended, right? Just that an injured Zoro defeated them before kneeling to Mihawk, right? In the anime they were expanded upon and there was even one of them who wielded a sword identical to Mihawk's.

For Sanji, the deal with Ivankov was shown in the manga? I honestly don't remember it. I only remember that they started chasing him and then the cover story thing where they chased him until they managed to crossdress him. Every other reference to his timeskip adventure in the manga is just about how he spent those years running away.

As far as I know, the anime didn't show the fights between Sanji and the masters either, only the negotiations. If those were on the manga then I just miremembered and there really wasn't that much of a difference for him between the manga and the anime.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 18, 2021, Original Post Date: Apr 18, 2021 ---

Sanji defeating Perospero to save Marco would be pretty badass actually.

Perospero lost an arm but he was capable of holding back two sulongs all alone. He's no push-over.

However, Sanji isn't one to get lost and he was choosing between going for the Scabbards or going for Momo, I don't think he'll be approaching the plaza at all.

Given Carrot and Wanda stop due to moon being covered, I don't think the fight over. They will come back to face Perospero with Marco perhaps and plus Sanji won't care for him much. He isn't after Momo compare to King and Queen who are after him during this battle. You guys throwing him into fights with not much to them. It more about beating Beast Pirates which relates more to facing either YC especially the hints with them.

 

[Prince13333]

This is part of what I hated about WCI.

We were told she'd be knocked out and it didn't, she still went on to chase them, lol.

Point of the cake was to save the strawhats from Big Mom, and it did just that. Big Mom literally stopped chasing the Strawhats after she saw Sanjis cake. After Sanjis cake arrives in 892 the Strawhats don't see Big Mom for the rest of the arc. Big Mom spends the remainder of the arc focused on that cake, and it ultimately buys the strawhats enough time to escape the island.

 

[Nie Li]

Given Carrot and Wanda stop due to moon being covered, I don't think the fight over. They will come back to face Perospero with Marco perhaps and plus Sanji won't care for him much. He isn't after Momo compare to King and Queen who are after him during this battle. You guys throwing him into fights with not much to them. It more about beating Beast Pirates which relates more to facing either YC especially the hints with them.

I'm not throwing him into any fight, if you actually read my post, I said it's unlikely Sanji would face Perospero, but it would be a cool fight.

King and Queen are fighting Marco on the plaza, they aren't near Momo and they certainly weren't chasing after him last time we saw them.

Not every fight is something personal between both sides, sometimes it's just fighters running into eachothers, and currently there's no reason to believe Sanji is going to cross those two. His most obvious opponents so far would be:

- Jack: because he's chasing the Scabbards himself and currently fighting two of them.
- Orochi / Fukurokuju: because they're currently engaged with the Scabbards.
- Kanjuro: because he seems to be focused on attacking the Scabbards from the shadows.

And so far that's it because Momo isn't currently under attack by anyone and I don't remember any enemy actively going for him last time we saw them.

If Sanji faces someone with a personal connection to, Queen is the most likely candidate because of the interest he showed in Sanji being a Vinsmoke. Queen is also probably acquainted with Judge as a fellow scientist.

However, for Sanji to face Queen he should be headed to the plaza (which he isn't), or perhaps if Perospero takes Marco down, Queen could take the chance to go look for Momo (and somehow pass through X-Drake and Chopper) so Sanji could intercept him, but Queen running away so easily looks unlikely. Even more so, Queen running away at all after Marco finally goes down is unlikely in itself.

As for Carrot and Wanda, I doubt they will be fighting again. Their sulong deactivated because of the moon, sure, but it's not like her powers deactivated and Perospero simply left them there: he beat them up while they were depowered to the point the couldn't move anymore, so even if the Sulong returns they should be out for the count. Perospero isn't even near them anymore anyway.

 

[King Moe]

I'm not throwing him into any fight, if you actually read my post, I said it's unlikely Sanji would face Perospero, but it would be a cool fight.

King and Queen are fighting Marco on the plaza, they aren't near Momo and they certainly weren't chasing after him last time we saw them.

Not every fight is something personal between both sides, sometimes it's just fighters running into eachothers, and currently there's no reason to believe Sanji is going to cross those two. His most obvious opponents so far would be:

- Jack: because he's chasing the Scabbards himself and currently fighting two of them.
- Orochi / Fukurokuju: because they're currently engaged with the Scabbards.
- Kanjuro: because he seems to be focused on attacking the Scabbards from the shadows.

And so far that's it because Momo isn't currently under attack by anyone and I don't remember any enemy actively going for him last time we saw them.

If Sanji faces someone with a personal connection to, Queen is the most likely candidate because of the interest he showed in Sanji being a Vinsmoke. Queen is also probably acquainted with Judge as a fellow scientist.

However, for Sanji to face Queen he should be headed to the plaza (which he isn't), or perhaps if Perospero takes Marco down, Queen could take the chance to go look for Momo (and somehow pass through X-Drake and Chopper) so Sanji could intercept him, but Queen running away so easily looks unlikely. Even more so, Queen running away at all after Marco finally goes down is unlikely in itself.

As for Carrot and Wanda, I doubt they will be fighting again. Their sulong deactivated because of the moon, sure, but it's not like her powers deactivated and Perospero simply left them there: he beat them up while they were depowered to the point the couldn't move anymore, so even if the Sulong returns they should be out for the count. Perospero isn't even near them anymore anyway.

Why you think they won't go to plaza given there is a hole above there to the Rooftop and Momo side expresses desire to go up there? I think it will come to them being seen and Sanji facing King or Queen from not going after Momo.

Macro isn't beating them. He already stated he tired facing them both and they haven't gone full power on their side on Haki, Hybrid Form, and Awakening. Plus Perospero coming into this is more facing Macro given grudge fight until Carrot and Wanda come back once moon isn't covered. He won't be one to face anyone on the Beast Pirates, but just be there for support of everyone of New Generation Pirates.

As for what you mean on fights, I get that. Though you forget that Scabbards are active again, so it won't be reasons to face those above especially group interest to go to the roof.

Though can see Sanji saving Macro given to fight with King or Queen to move to doing other stuff which is possible to happen too.

 

[Nie Li]

Why you think they won't go to plaza given there is a hole above there to the Rooftop and Momo side expresses desire to go up there? I think it will come to them being seen and Sanji facing King or Queen from not going after Momo.

Macro isn't beating them. He already stated he tired facing them both and they haven't gone full power on their side on Haki, Hybrid Form, and Awakening. Plus Perospero coming into this is more facing Macro given grudge fight until Carrot and Wanda come back once moon isn't covered. He won't be one to face anyone on the Beast Pirates, but just be there for support of everyone of New Generation Pirates.

As for what you mean on fights, I get that. Though you forget that Scabbards are active again, so it won't be reasons to face those above especially group interest to go to the roof.

Though can see Sanji saving Macro given to fight with King or Queen to move to doing other stuff which is possible to happen too.

I know you want Sanji to save Marco but I fail to see how Sanji going to the plaza would make sense in the current scenario.

Last time we saw Sanji, we saw him make a choice between going to the Scabbards' location or to Momo's. That scene ended in a cliffhanger, but Oda made sure we knew he would be going to protect one of the two.

Choice 1: When Sanji was choosing, the Scabbards had already been patched-up by the mysterious person. Now they're fighting again, but that wouldn't stop Sanji from going to them if that was his choice.

Choice 2: When Sanji was choosing, Momo was already very far from the plaza and Sanji knows this since he was the one who entrusted Shinobu to take him away from there. I'm trusting Sanji's CoO to find him.

There being a hole on the rooftop above the plaza is inconsequential. Sanji saw Luffy and Zoro couldn't go through it and he helped escort Luffy through the stairs because he knew the hole is offlimits, so it wouldn't make sense for Sanji to come all the way back to the plaza now to try again to go through the hole. If Sanji wanted to go to Kaido, he would just take the stairs again. However, I fail to see why Sanji would go to the rooftop either: he knows Momo hasn't been captured yet, so Sanji is smart enough to know there's no way Momo was brought to Kaido by his teammates (it would mean certain death for Momo. He must stay as far away as possible from him).

In fact, Yamato was trying to get Momo off Onigashima on a boat when Onigashima was lifted, so Momo is at the furthest point both from the rooftop and the plaza.

Something drastic should change on the battlefield for Sanji to meet an All-Star, and I'm sure Oda can write such a change if he wants to (I still believe Sanji will likely fight Queen for their connection, one way of the other) but if we go by the current scenario, as of the current chapter, they are not going to meet eachother.

 

[M3J]

To be fair, with the exception of Luffy, we've barely seen anything from the other Strawhats during those two years.

Sanji and Zoro are the only other SHs who we got small snippets from after him.

I think we saw plenty from Franky, Usopp, and Robin, no? The three showed what they were capable of in Dressrosa, and I think Nami did as well in WCI.

We barely got anything from Zoro though, or Sanji. Arguably even less than we got from the three in Dressrosa.

Point of the cake was to save the strawhats from Big Mom, and it did just that. Big Mom literally stopped chasing the Strawhats after she saw Sanjis cake. After Sanjis cake arrives in 892 the Strawhats don't see Big Mom for the rest of the arc. Big Mom spends the remainder of the arc focused on that cake, and it ultimately buys the strawhats enough time to escape the island.

I think you should ignore people who bring up baking cake even though that saved the ship and the crew. People are idiots and will ignore facts, especially when it comes to Sanji. Note how very few people have criticized Luffy for actually putting the crew in danger but how so many of them criticize Sanji for saving the crew.

 

[HereNThere]

I think we saw plenty from Franky, Usopp, and Robin, no? The three showed what they were capable of in Dressrosa, and I think Nami did as well in WCI.

We barely got anything from Zoro though, or Sanji. Arguably even less than we got from the three in Dressrosa.

We were moreso discussing seeing what everyone had learned through flashbacks during their time separated. Like Luffy's flashback with Rayleigh teaching him haki.

 

[M3J]

We were moreso discussing seeing what everyone had learned through flashbacks during their time separated. Like Luffy's flashback with Rayleigh teaching him haki.

ooh forgot about the context.

What'd we get for Sanji? I don't remember any snippet

 

[HereNThere]

What'd we get for Sanji? I don't remember any snippet

Just a few panels of him running from the Okama Masters to show how he developed Sky Walk.

 

[King Moe]

I know you want Sanji to save Marco but I fail to see how Sanji going to the plaza would make sense in the current scenario.

Last time we saw Sanji, we saw him make a choice between going to the Scabbards' location or to Momo's. That scene ended in a cliffhanger, but Oda made sure we knew he would be going to protect one of the two.

Choice 1: When Sanji was choosing, the Scabbards had already been patched-up by the mysterious person. Now they're fighting again, but that wouldn't stop Sanji from going to them if that was his choice.

Choice 2: When Sanji was choosing, Momo was already very far from the plaza and Sanji knows this since he was the one who entrusted Shinobu to take him away from there. I'm trusting Sanji's CoO to find him.

There being a hole on the rooftop above the plaza is inconsequential. Sanji saw Luffy and Zoro couldn't go through it and he helped escort Luffy through the stairs because he knew the hole is offlimits, so it wouldn't make sense for Sanji to come all the way back to the plaza now to try again to go through the hole. If Sanji wanted to go to Kaido, he would just take the stairs again. However, I fail to see why Sanji would go to the rooftop either: he knows Momo hasn't been captured yet, so Sanji is smart enough to know there's no way Momo was brought to Kaido by his teammates (it would mean certain death for Momo. He must stay as far away as possible from him).

In fact, Yamato was trying to get Momo off Onigashima on a boat when Onigashima was lifted, so Momo is at the furthest point both from the rooftop and the plaza.

Something drastic should change on the battlefield for Sanji to meet an All-Star, and I'm sure Oda can write such a change if he wants to (I still believe Sanji will likely fight Queen for their connection, one way of the other) but if we go by the current scenario, as of the current chapter, they are not going to meet eachother.

Maybe not the plaza yet, but Momo side could go there or be above it when wanting to head to the hole above and get spotted by King and Queen who will intercept them which can result in Sanji fighting them.

Plus word will be spread about current situation with Luffy up there and it can change the minds of certain characters to go up there to fight Kaido and support Luffy and Sanji can be one of them to do that especially Momo side express desire to go up to see Kaido.

It will get to that as we need patience, but can see it how it lead to that and I don't think Momo and Yamato are going to leave island as they want to stay there and even talk about seeing Kaido. Doesn't make sense to get off it especially it's floating island now. I am just saying Oda zig zag characters into position, not straightforward to who they face, so it can still happen on reasons for interactions and how he face one of them and might get involve with facing Kaido too.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 18, 2021, Original Post Date: Apr 18, 2021 ---

Just a few panels of him running from the Okama Masters to show how he developed Sky Walk.

Do you think that was only Cipher Pol move he knows as I feel he would know certain CP moves to work with if his body was push to stronger point to know those moves. I am seeing hints in the Anime he can do long-distance attacks with his legs that look similar and based on moves we saw CP members use like how he break fence with Zoro.

 

[Grandmaster Woro]

It be like Luffy vs Enel. He got weakness on him and not much fight

wrong analogy there. In fact in WCI, we saw pudding could injure reiju with candy bullets (perospero power). So there is some foreshadowing on the conflict between vinsmoke (sanji) and perospero