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Darklord#10

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Gruvia was a nice ship at first but it slowly but surely had a negative impact on both Gray and Juvia's development as characters.
It completely destroyed gray. He's no longer the same guy he once was. Gray Fullbuster is dead to me. Now we have gray fullbushit or Gray the coward
 

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I never liked the Gruvia ship. Juvia and Gray's "GRAY SAMAAA" delirium rejecting her is what was wrecking the ship as early as the original series.
How this ship got more progress than the Nalu is beyond me 🤦
Gray would have been better off in a relationship with Ultear.
 

Darklord#10

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natsu choosing to be human is complete bullshit. He should have never decided to be a human.
 

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natsu choosing to be human is complete bullshit. He should have never decided to be a human.
It was to be expected, but I was hoping for either Dragon Natsu or Dragon-Demon hybrid Natsu:feelsbadman. I still have a little bit of hope that the spinoff rectifies that
 

Darklord#10

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It was to be expected, but I was hoping for either Dragon Natsu or Dragon-Demon hybrid Natsu:feelsbadman. I still have a little bit of hope that the spinoff rectifies that
END is dead. Dragon natsu idea is dead. Can't believe natsu choose to be a fodder creature like human. Smh
 

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It was to be expected, but I was hoping for either Dragon Natsu or Dragon-Demon hybrid Natsu:feelsbadman. I still have a little bit of hope that the spinoff rectifies that
Same for me, I still have some hope that Natsu can control the combined Dragon and Demon fire and even use the black fire of God-Slayer that he ate from Zancrow again (if Mashima remembers this... ) thus combining in Natsu the fire of Dragon, Demon and a God, dreaming costs nothing and I would like this to happen, but I see it as very unlikely to happen.

Considering all the Nakama Power cringe speeches he put out in the Dogramag arc you shouldn't get your hopes up.
ALL the characters in Fairy Tail use that speech when they fight, from the beginning it has been established that the bonds of friendship, brotherhood, love, etc. is the main source of power in this series, the problem is that when the character who is everyone's favorite says it, they don't protest there.

END is dead. Dragon natsu idea is dead. Can't believe natsu choose to be a fodder creature like human. Smh
That is already Mashima's problem, it is not Natsu's, it is the author who places his characters in certain situations (such as the case of E.N.D.) that they fail to convince their audience.

I admire Mashima but I don't agree with several situations that he raises in the manga, I'm not a mangaka, but I humbly believe that some things would have gone differently.
 

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Same for me, I still have some hope that Natsu can control the combined Dragon and Demon fire and even use the black fire of God-Slayer that he ate from Zancrow again (if Mashima remembers this... ) thus combining in Natsu the fire of Dragon, Demon and a God, dreaming costs nothing and I would like this to happen, but I see it as very unlikely to happen.



ALL the characters in Fairy Tail use that speech when they fight, from the beginning it has been established that the bonds of friendship, brotherhood, love, etc. is the main source of power in this series, the problem is that when the character who is everyone's favorite says it, they don't protest there.



That is already Mashima's problem, it is not Natsu's, it is the author who places his characters in certain situations (such as the case of E.N.D.) that they fail to convince their audience.

I admire Mashima but I don't agree with several situations that he raises in the manga, I'm not a mangaka, but I humbly believe that some things would have gone differently.
Moment for it has passed, it would just feel forced now, or that’s how I feel about it anyway. We got the resolution, Lucy re-wrote the book with Gray giving her life support, that came through ok in the mess that was the final arc. I get the feeling his editors probably talked him out of going full on evil Natsu, probably felt it would have upset a chunk of the audience. It’s surprising how unpopular great twists like that are with a lot of fandoms like these :(
 

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Moment for it has passed, it would just feel forced now, or that’s how I feel about it anyway. We got the resolution, Lucy re-wrote the book with Gray giving her life support, that came through ok in the mess that was the final arc. I get the feeling his editors probably talked him out of going full on evil Natsu, probably felt it would have upset a chunk of the audience. It’s surprising how unpopular great twists like that are with a lot of fandoms like these :(
Regarding the theme of the E.N.D. book, I have always had the idea that when Lucy has rewritten the book, she has only rewritten Natsu's memories and personality so that the person everyone knows continues to coexist with everyone and does not get lost in his demon essence and the life link that Natsu had with the book and with Zeref was also remade, since when the latter died and the book disappeared, Natsu did not disappear with them.

Based on what was stated in the previous paragraph, I humbly think that this would be the best way to justify that E.N.D. since this demon is Natsu practically, he has never left, Mashima has given some hints of it, for example:






For these moments it is that I still maintain the hope that the theme of E.N.D. be taken into account again. But let's see what Mashima comes up with. In some more parts the theme of "burning the world" was touched on in terms of Natsu.

What happens, I think, is that Mashima doesn't want Natsu to get too far away from the rest in terms of power, so that's why he reduces the power of the God-Dragons and creates new enemies so that the others can have good fights and moments where they grow in terms of ability and power.

And as for the fandom, it is difficult to please everyone, each one has a different opinion of how they would like the events and narrative of the story to happen. We will see how Mashima carries out the plot.
 

SleipnirX

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Regarding the theme of the E.N.D. book, I have always had the idea that when Lucy has rewritten the book, she has only rewritten Natsu's memories and personality so that the person everyone knows continues to coexist with everyone and does not get lost in his demon essence and the life link that Natsu had with the book and with Zeref was also remade, since when the latter died and the book disappeared, Natsu did not disappear with them.

Based on what was stated in the previous paragraph, I humbly think that this would be the best way to justify that E.N.D. since this demon is Natsu practically, he has never left, Mashima has given some hints of it, for example:






For these moments it is that I still maintain the hope that the theme of E.N.D. be taken into account again. But let's see what Mashima comes up with. In some more parts the theme of "burning the world" was touched on in terms of Natsu.

What happens, I think, is that Mashima doesn't want Natsu to get too far away from the rest in terms of power, so that's why he reduces the power of the God-Dragons and creates new enemies so that the others can have good fights and moments where they grow in terms of ability and power.

And as for the fandom, it is difficult to please everyone, each one has a different opinion of how they would like the events and narrative of the story to happen. We will see how Mashima carries out the plot.
It’s difficult to say as we only have a few small hints about END to work with, but I think if he was ‘fully awoken’ for lack of a better phrase, he’d be similar to the small section we got in the Alvarez arc where he’s pretty much still Natsu, but most of his personality fades into the background as he’s focused on eliminating Zeref (this is the role he’s created for, though arguably his motivation at that point was more to avenge Lucy’s apparent ‘death’ at Dimaria’s hands). Therefore without Zeref it’s unclear what END would entail other than a curse-based power up for Natsu.

Again it’s pretty vague what Lucy actually changed in the book of END, but it seemed to just be decoupling him from Zeref, so the latter’s death wouldn’t also mean Natsu’s. With that said, I don’t think the references to Natsu as a demon are especially meaningful in 100YQ… he is still END, an etherious just as he always has been, Lucy didn’t change that and presumably can’t as the human Natsu is long deceased.

As much as I think END being the final villain of the original series would have been amazing, particularly as Zeref never struck me as a fighter before the final arc so Natsu could have been a proxy under his control, by now that part of the series is done. There’s no other remaining etherious that we know of (presumably they all ended with Zeref’s death?), Zeref himself is gone, and the book disappeared, so I don’t see what mechanism or motivation even exists should Mashima want to revisit this.

So I agree it’s disappointing what could have been the best part of this series by far if done well never came off, I just don’t see the opportunity to actually do it any better now.
 

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It’s difficult to say as we only have a few small hints about END to work with, but I think if he was ‘fully awoken’ for lack of a better phrase, he’d be similar to the small section we got in the Alvarez arc where he’s pretty much still Natsu, but most of his personality fades into the background as he’s focused on eliminating Zeref (this is the role he’s created for, though arguably his motivation at that point was more to avenge Lucy’s apparent ‘death’ at Dimaria’s hands). Therefore without Zeref it’s unclear what END would entail other than a curse-based power up for Natsu.

Again it’s pretty vague what Lucy actually changed in the book of END, but it seemed to just be decoupling him from Zeref, so the latter’s death wouldn’t also mean Natsu’s. With that said, I don’t think the references to Natsu as a demon are especially meaningful in 100YQ… he is still END, an etherious just as he always has been, Lucy didn’t change that and presumably can’t as the human Natsu is long deceased.

As much as I think END being the final villain of the original series would have been amazing, particularly as Zeref never struck me as a fighter before the final arc so Natsu could have been a proxy under his control, by now that part of the series is done. There’s no other remaining etherious that we know of (presumably they all ended with Zeref’s death?), Zeref himself is gone, and the book disappeared, so I don’t see what mechanism or motivation even exists should Mashima want to revisit this.

So I agree it’s disappointing what could have been the best part of this series by far if done well never came off, I just don’t see the opportunity to actually do it any better now.
I humbly do see an opportunity, for the return of E.N.D. (Note that this is a personal opinion and that would seem great to me).

There could be a mental meeting between Natsu and E.N.D. (resource used in the world of entertainment), a fight in which the winner takes everything, and I give an example of what happens in the Mortal Kombat X comic:





In these scenes it is shown how Hanzo Hasashi in a mental encounter fights against Scorpion, his spectral counterpart (because the human Hanzo Hasashi died and then was reborn as Scorpion, something similar to Natsu's situation).

I would like something like this to happen between Natsu and E.N.D., it would be very good for Natsu's growth, also to control those demonic powers much better apart from the dragon ones that he has.

But I repeat, this is a personal desire of how I would handle the situation of E.N.D. which in my opinion would be fine, but we know that each one of the readers of this series therefore have very different ideas and ways of seeing the narrative.

Mashima has the last word and decision on how to carry out the story and at that moment we will see if he convinces us or not.
 

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I humbly do see an opportunity, for the return of E.N.D. (Note that this is a personal opinion and that would seem great to me).

There could be a mental meeting between Natsu and E.N.D. (resource used in the world of entertainment), a fight in which the winner takes everything, and I give an example of what happens in the Mortal Kombat X comic:





In these scenes it is shown how Hanzo Hasashi in a mental encounter fights against Scorpion, his spectral counterpart (because the human Hanzo Hasashi died and then was reborn as Scorpion, something similar to Natsu's situation).

I would like something like this to happen between Natsu and E.N.D., it would be very good for Natsu's growth, also to control those demonic powers much better apart from the dragon ones that he has.

But I repeat, this is a personal desire of how I would handle the situation of E.N.D. which in my opinion would be fine, but we know that each one of the readers of this series therefore have very different ideas and ways of seeing the narrative.

Mashima has the last word and decision on how to carry out the story and at that moment we will see if he convinces us or not.
Hmm, but the trouble I see with this is it requires END to be a full second personality for Natsu, where nothing so far has indicated that is the case. Indeed quite the opposite, Natsu was still Natsu when fighting Gray, he’d just gone berserker mode and was focused on eliminating Zeref. Indeed he still recognised Gray and reacted to Erza stopping the fight. So at the bare minimum this would feel like a last minute retcon of what END is. As far as I can see Natsu is END and has been from the start of the series. For whatever he said about being Human with the seeds, he isn’t, he’s an etherious, the Human Natsu died as an infant hundreds of years ago. If anything Mashima seems to be signalling a new but similar effect from Ignia’s flames, but that’s obviously more likely to be linked to his dragon slayer magic than his demonic origins. Therefore we might get a partial recycling of what Mashima had in mind for END (assuming he was meant to be Natsu under Zeref’s control) with Ignia.
 

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Hmm, but the trouble I see with this is it requires END to be a full second personality for Natsu, where nothing so far has indicated that is the case. Indeed quite the opposite, Natsu was still Natsu when fighting Gray, he’d just gone berserker mode and was focused on eliminating Zeref. Indeed he still recognised Gray and reacted to Erza stopping the fight. So at the bare minimum this would feel like a last minute retcon of what END is. As far as I can see Natsu is END and has been from the start of the series. For whatever he said about being Human with the seeds, he isn’t, he’s an etherious, the Human Natsu died as an infant hundreds of years ago. If anything Mashima seems to be signalling a new but similar effect from Ignia’s flames, but that’s obviously more likely to be linked to his dragon slayer magic than his demonic origins. Therefore we might get a partial recycling of what Mashima had in mind for END (assuming he was meant to be Natsu under Zeref’s control) with Ignia.
At least I don't see a problem with that, in the case of Scorpion, he was always the same being, only when he became human again he found some peace, Scorpion was his vengeful part that after that mental fight managed to dominate and also dominate hellfire powers

The same thing can happen with Natsu, he and E.N.D. they are the same being, only that the last one is the part that only seeks destruction and burn everything, a fight of those would seek to dominate that destructive part of him.

But I repeat again, this is an idea that at least to me seems like a good way to bring E.N.D. Again, if you and several others don't think so, there's no problem, it's your opinion and it's respected.

Now also what you propose can also be a quite viable option in the event that Mashima wants to recycle the idea of E.N.D., waking up that berserk mode with the power of Ignia can also be an important part in terms of the God-Dragon's plan of fire has in mind for Natsu.

These debates are very interesting, but in the end I hope Mashima comes up with something good and doesn't rush things, we'll discuss it as soon as what Mashima is proposing for this situation happens and we'll see how he carries it out.
 

Darklord#10

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Gildarts using a name attack to one shot historia god Serena doesn't really mean anything to me. I don't place much emphasis on using named attack to take out somebody
 

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Gildarts using a name attack to one shot historia god Serena doesn't really mean anything to me. I don't place much emphasis on using named attack to take out somebody
Especially when those named attacks look the same as any normal punches. Like Laxus' Roaring Thunder, which he definitely used against Ivan without naming it, or Lightning Bolt against Ajeel
 

Darklord#10

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Especially when those named attacks look the same as any normal punches. Like Laxus' Roaring Thunder, which he definitely used against Ivan without naming it, or Lightning Bolt against Ajeel
I don't know why people place emphasis on them especially in a series like fairy tail
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Especially when those named attacks look the same as any normal punches. Like Laxus' Roaring Thunder, which he definitely used against Ivan without naming it, or Lightning Bolt against Ajeel
Why do people place emphasis on it? Natsu and suzaku were using not named attacks for majority of the fight. Kirin wasn't even using any named attacks throughout
 

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I don’t care about feats because Hiro will sometimes increase some characters power levels faster than other
 

Darklord#10

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I don’t care about feats because Hiro will sometimes increase some characters power levels faster than other
I care about feats. Feats is what many battle debates goes by. When there's statements and zero feats the statement is not credible. Feats a lot of the time shows us how strong a character really is. If we go by the plot setting Mira would be as strong as erza which doesn't make sense because erza has better feats than Mira. Same with gray and gajeel with natsu.
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I'm not saying feats is the end all be all but a lot of the times it tells us how strong a character really is but when it comes to fairy tail I understand why people don't use feats. But in this manga everything fucking contradicts everything. Feats portrayals and statement. Look at ignia vs selene and acnologia vs igneel. Acnologia had a tougher time against half dead igneel than ignia with selene. Selene is supposed to be as strong as acnologia but she didn't even do any lasting damage on ignia for now at least. Everything fucking contradicts everything.
 

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I care about feats. Feats is what many battle debates goes by. When there's statements and zero feats the statement is not credible. Feats a lot of the time shows us how strong a character really is. If we go by the plot setting Mira would be as strong as erza which doesn't make sense because erza has better feats than Mira. Same with gray and gajeel with natsu.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I'm not saying feats is the end all be all but a lot of the times it tells us how strong a character really is but when it comes to fairy tail I understand why people don't use feats. But in this manga everything fucking contradicts everything. Feats portrayals and statement. Look at ignia vs selene and acnologia vs igneel. Acnologia had a tougher time against half dead igneel than ignia with selene. Selene is supposed to be as strong as acnologia but she didn't even do any lasting damage on ignia for now at least. Everything fucking contradicts everything.
Your right feats do help to know how strong someone is, problem is Hiro in most cases will favor some characters over others which is one of the reasons why characters like Natsu and Ezra have better feats than most. Also I’m not a big fan of comparing recent feats to feats that happened over a year ago
 
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