Discussion Unpopular Opinions

[Anime VORTEX]

Problem is Mashona can write a good fight if he wants to but it just seems like he doesn’t now days.

Mashona

 

[Ratrace]

Mashona

Stupid autocorrect

 

[Sevently]

Suzaku is not stronger than human Selene, and he's not a tier stronger than the BDSK
Gray & Gajeel were much stronger during Alvarez than currently

 

[Darklord#10]

Simon's death has nothing to do with jellal. He was simping for a girl who didn't even love him. I hate milliana cuz she tried to coerce Erza to leave jellal and be in a relationship with her. Everyone knows that Erza has a huge crush on jellal I don't know why this two characters couldn't understand this. Erza doesn't owe shit to Simon, he died like trash and milliana should have followed him

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 17, 2023, Original Post Date: Feb 17, 2023 ---

The reason nalu isn't progressing is because of Lucy. Can't she like just tell natsu what's up. Natsu deserves a harem

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 24, 2023 ---

Suzaku was a good character until he associated with selene. He can still redeem himself in my eyes if he proves he's the strongest Diabolos guild member.

 

[Ratrace]

The way Hiro writes makes it where some feats and hypes don’t matter

 

[Darklord#10]

I don't care about frosch tbh. I've never given a fuck about him.

 

[FireIce]

I don't care about frosch tbh. I've never given a fuck about him.

What... Imagine not caring about Frosch

 

[Darklord#10]

What... Imagine not caring about Frosch

I never cared about him. He looks like a frog. as you all know I care very little for the side characters in fairy tail especially if you look at my discussions

 

[Rigel]

Sting is a suitable love rival for Lucy to contend with.

Unlike Lisanna and the rest.

 

[grey matter]

But really the dynamic of Natsu being the one to take down Zeref or finish Acnologia or even take down the dragon gods, isn't any different than Natsu being the one to take down Zero or future rogue, or Jellal.

Wut.
Natsu absolute was the strongest in those arcs, it's quite undebatable.

There was pretty much zero strategies involved in all three of these fights. In all three of these fights, Natsu simply closed the gap with the main villain through straight forward powerups, and got the last small push needed to surpass the villain through PoF.

Zero and Jellal completely destroyed him in no diff until Natsu got dragon force, which puts him as the undisputed strongest main character.

Against future Rouge, he literally got one shot in LFD mode while being in full on PoF. The reason he could compete was because he got MASSIVE boost from eating Atlas Flames' hellflames. Natsu not only needed a massive powerup in that battle, but also got infinite stamina through constant supply of fire from AF.


The only arc where Natsu took on the main villain while not being the strongest "good guy" was in Fantasia Festival arc.
That arc involved strategy, was a 2v1, and involved Laxus throwing the fight a bit due to wasting tons of MP on Fairy Law which did nothing.

 

[Darklord#10]

I think you're heavily misunderstanding what I'm saying. I'm saying that Natsu needed a powerup to face the big bad because he's not the strongest without them. For example with Zero, Erza was there in that arc and was stronger than Natsu. And Jellal was the source of Natsu's powerup in that fight. Yet the solution wasn't for either of those characters to face Zero or for them to get a powerup and beat him. Same reason the scenario was setup for Natsu to get a powerup with etherion and for Jellal to be injured by Erza prior so that Natsu could get the final blow in. Gray was just as strong as Natsu in that arc and Erza was stronger, yet the author didn't have one of them finish off Jellal. Same thing with future rogue. Erza and Laxus were stronger than Natsu in that arc, but instead of healing them up and having them beat future Rogue, He has Natsu come in and get a powerup through atlas flame.

This happens over and over again where Natsu is the one to take out the big bad (except Galuna island and Tartaros) through a powerup or a nerf to the enemy. He's not the strongest or the only one that can do the job, but thematically he represents fairy tails' values the most so he's the one that gets put in those positions (plus he's the main character). Mashima recognizes this which is why he always finds a way to close the gap for Natsu. In the current story, people are finding it weird that Natsu's opponents are always getting nerfed and they think he should be rapidly getting stronger than everyone else. I'm just pointing out that this is how the story always worked. by the way I never mentioned "strategies". When I said tactics, I was talking about the things Mashima does to close the gap between Natsu and his enemies (nerfs and powerups). The entire thing is from a writing perspective, sorry if that was confusing.

Also be for real. A 2-3x power boost made him the "absolute strongest" in TOH and Oracion Seis arcs?

Yeah I want to see how you'll react if natsu 1v1 a god dragon. Maybe you'll find another way to twist everything. I also want to see how you'll react when every member of team natsu fights decent character and gray gets shafted. Lol strategies. Like zeref was nerfed or zero was nerfed. Why would ignia want to fight natsu if he wasn't the strongest? Sure on a normal day there's people stronger than him. But natsu has the potential to surpass Erza, laxus we've been told this many times.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 26, 2023, Original Post Date: Feb 26, 2023 ---

Also be for real. A 2-3x power boost made him the "absolute strongest" in TOH and Oracion Seis arcs?

One moment you say statement>feats, but the moment the statement doesn't fit your argument you change

 

[grey matter]

I think you're heavily misunderstanding what I'm saying. I'm saying that Natsu needed a powerup to face the big bad because he's not the strongest without them. For example with Zero, Erza was there in that arc and was stronger than Natsu. And Jellal was the source of Natsu's powerup in that fight. Yet the solution wasn't for either of those characters to face Zero or for them to get a powerup and beat him. Same reason the scenario was setup for Natsu to get a powerup with etherion and for Jellal to be injured by Erza prior so that Natsu could get the final blow in. Gray was just as strong as Natsu in that arc and Erza was stronger, yet the author didn't have one of them finish off Jellal. Same thing with future rogue. Erza and Laxus were stronger than Natsu in that arc, but instead of healing them up and having them beat future Rogue, He has Natsu come in and get a powerup through atlas flame.

This happens over and over again where Natsu is the one to take out the big bad (except Galuna island and Tartaros) through a powerup or a nerf to the enemy. He's not the strongest or the only one that can do the job, but thematically he represents fairy tails' values the most so he's the one that gets put in those positions (plus he's the main character). Mashima recognizes this which is why he always finds a way to close the gap for Natsu. In the current story, people are finding it weird that Natsu's opponents are always getting nerfed and they think he should be rapidly getting stronger than everyone else. I'm just pointing out that this is how the story always worked. by the way I never mentioned "strategies". When I said tactics, I was talking about the things Mashima does to close the gap between Natsu and his enemies (nerfs and powerups). The entire thing is from a writing perspective, sorry if that was confusing.

Also be for real. A 2-3x power boost made him the "absolute strongest" in TOH and Oracion Seis arcs?

Ok, sure.
I agree that he wasn't the strongest until Alverez arc, he needed powerups to compete with the villains.

Yes, 2-3x power boost does make him the absolute strongest "protagonist" in ToH and OS arc.
In ToH, he was as strong as Jellal. In OS arc, he was almost as strong as Zero (without PoF).

But by Alverez arc, Natsu could willingly use Dragon Force as his trump card, meaning there should really be no debate from this point onwards. Not only has the gap between base Natsu and the "strong" good guys reduce, he also improved his DF (more scales) and is able to use it willingly.
He also got a new mode, FDKM, which allows him to compete with Laxus, Jellal and Erza (not necessarily above.....just compete). From there on, it became:
DF Natsu >>> Gildarts > Laxus/Jellal > FDKM Natsu/Erza > rest


Currently though, he gained an upgrade to FDKM, that allows him to access fire dragon king scales, which is basically his DF durability. This makes him the most durable FT member BY FAR, like nobody can compete with his raw durability currently. While other stats remain the same, for his FDKM.
His DF further improved since Alverez, allowing him to use not only his own fire element, but also generate fire of same quality of Igneel/Ignia/Atlas-Flames.
So right now, it is:
DF Natsu >>>> Gildarts > FDKM Natsu > Laxus/Jellal > Erza > rest


Current DF Natsu can really solo the entire guild.
Go to his DF, use a high end attack spanning several cities AOE (similar to the one he used to finish Aldoron). And that's it, every FT member get vap'd right there.
DF Natsu is so strong that his attack vap'd the entire body of FH Zeref, as well as created a hole on dragon Aldoron's body

 

[Darklord#10]

DF Natsu >>>> Gildarts > FDKM Natsu > Laxus/Jellal > Erza > rest

This is interesting, tbh I don't really agree but this isn't power scaling thread

 

[grey matter]

This is interesting, tbh I don't really agree but this isn't power scaling thread

What do you not agree with?

 

[Darklord#10]

What do you not agree with?

I don't agree that fire dragon king natsu is stronger than laxus and erza. I know jellal is being prepped up as laxus tier but I don't really see him being laxus level even if the story tries to portray it that way

 

[grey matter]

I don't agree that fire dragon king natsu is stronger than laxus and erza. I know jellal is being prepped up as laxus tier but I don't really see him being laxus level even if the story tries to portray it that way

Current version of FDKM is. He can access his DF durability, making him extremely hard to damage, tanking attacks that would otherwise one shot him.
FDKM always had top tier attack power, as we have seen in Alverass arc, as well as Aldo arc.

He also fought the BDSK with the best feats and portrayal by far.

So, why shouldn't current FDKM Natsu be above Laxus/Erza?

As for Jellol. Honestly he has little to no anti-feats, he is simply lacking feats. So, I go by portrayal and put in in same level as Laxus.

 

[Darklord#10]

Also when was it stated in TOH or Oracion Seis arc that Natsu was the absolute strongest? He wasn't even going to beat Jellal if not for Erza injuring him prior. And Natsu was getting overwhelmed in dragon force until he used flame of emotion. He's not the only one that can use the power of emotion and Jellal himself was the source of his dragon force power which mean a POE boost for him would have been greater since his base was already stronger

Lol at ft villains using poe. Even zeref's POE wasn't greater than natsu's POE. Zeref is probably the only villain that used his emotion to fuel his magic. Ft villains don't get the luxury of POE

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 26, 2023, Original Post Date: Feb 26, 2023 ---

ently Natsu is not the strongest and it's people like you that prompted me to write this.

Lol I never said he's the strongest. I've put laxus Erza and gildarts above natsu but peak natsu, natsu at his best is way stronger than the three of them combined. Peak natsu burnt infinite magic power and time. We're digressing from the purpose of the thread so I'll leave at that

 

[Ratrace]

I think you're heavily misunderstanding what I'm saying. I'm saying that Natsu needed a powerup to face the big bad because he's not the strongest without them. For example with Zero, Erza was there in that arc and was stronger than Natsu. And Jellal was the source of Natsu's powerup in that fight. Yet the solution wasn't for either of those characters to face Zero or for them to get a powerup and beat him. Same reason the scenario was setup for Natsu to get a powerup with etherion and for Jellal to be injured by Erza prior so that Natsu could get the final blow in. Gray was just as strong as Natsu in that arc and Erza was stronger, yet the author didn't have one of them finish off Jellal. Same thing with future rogue. Erza and Laxus were stronger than Natsu in that arc, but instead of healing them up and having them beat future Rogue, He has Natsu come in and get a powerup through atlas flame.

This happens over and over again where Natsu is the one to take out the big bad (except Galuna island and Tartaros) through a powerup or a nerf to the enemy. He's not the strongest or the only one that can do the job, but thematically he represents fairy tails' values the most so he's the one that gets put in those positions (plus he's the main character). Mashima recognizes this which is why he always finds a way to close the gap for Natsu. In the current story, people are finding it weird that Natsu's opponents are always getting nerfed and they think he should be rapidly getting stronger than everyone else. I'm just pointing out that this is how the story always worked. by the way I never mentioned "strategies". When I said tactics, I was talking about the things Mashima does to close the gap between Natsu and his enemies (nerfs and powerups). The entire thing is from a writing perspective, sorry if that was confusing.

Also be for real. A 2-3x power boost made him the "absolute strongest" in TOH and Oracion Seis arcs?

He didn’t beat the big bad in Phantom lord as well

 

[Darklord#10]

Anyway I've previously seen you make arguments that Natsu has to be on par with full power DGs and the nerfs don't make sense. I'm just saying that doesn't have to be the case as the story has worked so long without him being the strongest.

Not sure if I've said natsu's been on par with full power dragon gods. That can't be possible

 

[Garmadooon]

The Dogramag arc was just a waste of time and didn't add anything big to the story other than Ignia's goal (which of course will fail). This arc makes absolutely no sense in terms of powerscaling the fights were badly written the BDSKs and Dragon Eaters were very bland and Diabolos' sympathy towards Selene and FT is hypocritical and sickening. Fortunately, I started 100YQ in November 2022 otherwise I would have given up. I hope that this new arc will finally fix all the problems of the Spin-off and that Gold Owl will not be a Spriggan 3.0.