American Politics

[M3J]

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/3/25/11293258/tax-plan-calculator-2016

This was an interesting read. Quite an ambitious plan Sanders has. On the other hand clinton does not seem to be aiming to do much... The cruz and trump thing is predictable. I guess their plan is to cut taxes and then complain about the increasing deficit....

Hillary, Cruz, and Trump are likely doin whatever it takes to please their industry buddies and making the wealthy even wealthier. I'd love Bernie's plan if he focused on increasing taxes on the wealthy.

You brought up this gripe with it being talked about more than the other things you mentioned. I'm saying it's obvious why that is, it's topical now more than ever due to what happened in Brussels. There's always overreactions to such things by someone, but nothing is really gained by manipulating the narrative and acting like the only thing being talked about is terrorism. Whatever is topical is what is talked about. And of course loudmouthed republicans aren't going to go after right-wingers or white people or gun owners. That's just ludicrous.


Why are you acting like it's something people shouldn't be concerned about? I'm not talking about it consuming your life, but you did live through 9/11, no?

They won't, they're too stupid to. The least anyone can do is not go after innocent Muslims.

Yes I did, and since then we've had fewer attacks from Islamist terrorists than France in a year or two. there's a difference between reporting suspicious activity and directly going after Muslims or committing hate crimes.

He killed 3 people after getting the guy to open his door. What does the method of murder have to do with this? He seemed to choose them because they were neighbors. I'm not saying it had nothing to do with race or that it wasn't a hate-crime really. What I'm objecting to is the idea that others in some way bear responsibility for criticizing religion. People are still responsible for their own actions. Atheist aren't collectively planning to murder people who believe in God.



It doesn't matter why it's being done really. People do many things in the media or art to provoke a reaction. If you believe in the first amendment, you support their right to do it. You're sort of wading into regressive left territory when you look at it like that or say things like Charlie Hebdo deserved what happened to them.

Execution means it wasn't done in a fit of anger, unless he's the type of angry person who can be patient. I'm not saying it has anything to do with atheism, but something to do with the victims being Muslims. I haven't seen proof to contradict this.

Problem is, these people are openly tryin to provoke the Islamic terrorists into attacking them, if not outright pissing them off. Burning of the Qu'rans is just as bad as burning the Bibles or Bhagavad Gita.
Well, Charlie Hebdo kept antagonizing people, so I can't feel too bad about them. I don't support terrorist attacks though, before you misunderstand me, and it shouldn't have happened. While they may not have deserved it, they should have protected themselves better after the first attempt.

 

[xi0]

They won't, they're too stupid to. The least anyone can do is not go after innocent Muslims.

Yes I did, and since then we've had fewer attacks from Islamist terrorists than France in a year or two. there's a difference between reporting suspicious activity and directly going after Muslims or committing hate crimes.

Yeah but who is doing that? I'll admit that Trump and Cruz's rhetoric is borderline, but none of this is going on right now.

Who in a position of authority is committing hate crimes against Muslims? I'm assuming suspicious activity is reported all of the time. Us having fewer attacks has as much to do with security as it does geography. We just happen to be an ocean away and actually have border and customs security. I don't sweat it on a daily basis, I don't think many do.

Execution means it wasn't done in a fit of anger, unless he's the type of angry person who can be patient. I'm not saying it has anything to do with atheism, but something to do with the victims being Muslims. I haven't seen proof to contradict this.

That's not really what execution-style means. I personally have no idea what state he was in and I don't think anyone else does either since he left no witnesses.

So then it's just a case of you not knowing it's a fact, but knowing it to be true...

Problem is, these people are openly tryin to provoke the Islamic terrorists into attacking them, if not outright pissing them off. Burning of the Qu'rans is just as bad as burning the Bibles or Bhagavad Gita.
Well, Charlie Hebdo kept antagonizing people, so I can't feel too bad about them. I don't support terrorist attacks though, before you misunderstand me, and it shouldn't have happened. While they may not have deserved it, they should have protected themselves better after the first attempt.

Why would someone want to provoke people into attacking them? An act of defiance like burning a book or a flag doesn't mean you're willfully inviting violence upon yourself. Do you remember what country you live in?

So protecting themselves better means censoring themselves? What kind of logic is that? When someone is purportedly "offended" by something, murder isn't an acceptable response, nor should it be expected by any logical person. What the offense supposedly is has nothing to do with it. Enough with this false equivalence.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 29, 2016, Original Post Date: Mar 29, 2016 ---

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/3/25/11293258/tax-plan-calculator-2016

This was an interesting read. Quite an ambitious plan Sanders has. On the other hand clinton does not seem to be aiming to do much... The cruz and trump thing is predictable. I guess their plan is to cut taxes and then complain about the increasing deficit....

Well, it's obvious Clinton is the status quo candidate, while Sanders is posed as the opposite. Not sure either will accomplish much if congress is still controlled by the GOP.

 

[kkck]

Well, it's obvious Clinton is the status quo candidate, while Sanders is posed as the opposite. Not sure either will accomplish much if congress is still controlled by the GOP.

Well, the article does suggest her policy would increase taxes on the wealthy a bit and leave most people more or less the same. My guess is that she is aiming at something which could conceivable be achieved (he is being marketed as the candidate which could get stuff done unlike sanders who is dreaming a bit high). In the end I don't think a republican controlled congress would see much of a difference though.

 

[xi0]

Well, the article does suggest her policy would increase taxes on the wealthy a bit and leave most people more or less the same. My guess is that she is aiming at something which could conceivable be achieved (he is being marketed as the candidate which could get stuff done unlike sanders who is dreaming a bit high). In the end I don't think a republican controlled congress would see much of a difference though.

I don't really see it getting better for democrats as far as getting something done as president with the GOP still in control of congress. It'll be more of the same obstructionist nonsense, or even worse depending on the FBI's investigation into the whole email nonsense.

 

[kkck]

I don't really see it getting better for democrats as far as getting something done as president with the GOP still in control of congress. It'll be more of the same obstructionist nonsense, or even worse depending on the FBI's investigation into the whole email nonsense.

Fair enough. When are the next elections for congress members? Or how does that work in general? It'd be ideal to have a congress with a less obtrusive view so to speak.

 

[xi0]

Fair enough. When are the next elections for congress members? Or how does that work in general? It'd be ideal to have a congress with a less obtrusive view so to speak.

It's the same year. Congressmen have to run every 2 years, while Senators run every 6. It's just this cycle started so damn early with the presidential race and covering every facet of it...

 

[TotalEconomist]

It's the same year. Congressmen have to run every 2 years, while Senators run every 6. It's just this cycle started so damn early with the presidential race and covering every facet of it...

I really, really, wish we could narrow down the campaigning time like they do in some other countries. Like compartmentalize everything in 6 months.

 

[kkck]

http://www.cracked.com/article_23826_5-boring-election-campaigns-saved-by-hilarious-people.html

This was a fun read.

 

[xi0]

I really, really, wish we could narrow down the campaigning time like they do in some other countries. Like compartmentalize everything in 6 months.

Well, nothing is really preventing it being like this. They'd have to schedule all primaries within the same month or something. And even that wouldn't prevent people from declaring their intention to run and networks setting up debates and all. It seems the people involved prefer it like this for some reason.

 

[z.5]

Well, the longer it takes, the more it costs.
This means more time for donors to part with their sweet, sweet, money...

... for the thrill of it obviously.
It isn't like they will expect some favours later for their generous gifts...

 

[GrySun]

Yes it does, but when said generalization results in bad actions, it's when I have an issue. When white people are blamed for the shootings, you don't see minorities or other white people attacking them and calling them terrorists. the media even calls them lone wolves with mental issues. Same issue with police brutality - bad officers kill black people, which causes some fucked up people to retaliate and kill officers, after tons of people against police brutality talk about fighting back. Talking about shit is disturbing enough, but I draw the line at doing horrible things.

How often does that even happen? And what do you suggest is a good solution? You going and telling them they're retards? I don't think that'll help.

One Trump supporter? Try hundreds at any chance they get. I don't see how it's double standards when nearly all republicans and conservatives do bad things or hurt America while few "Muslims" do bad things.

I think you don't know muslims well enough at all to be talking about how many "bad things" they do. And nah that definitely does seem like double standards. Just listen to yourself, you are convinced that "nearly all" republicans and conservatives do bad things or hurt America. That's exactly what those people you're angry at are doing, thinking "nearly all" muslims do bad things. Quite hypocritical aye?

You daft? It's more about Bernie's reaction, how he just smiles where someone like Trump or Hillary would shoo it away or get angry.

That's just how Bernie is. He's quite passive, I bet he'd have given away his podium and entire rally to the bird if it didn't leave
But seriously I fail to see how reacting to a bird is in any way relevant to being the next POTUS. At best it can serve to create some intriguing memes, like this one.

 

[z.5]

But seriously I fail to see how reacting to a bird is in any way relevant to being the next POTUS. At best it can serve to create some intriguing memes, like this one.

Aye, it is completely irelevant.

That said, I feel that comic doesn't do justice to quite how stupid Trump actually is.
I doubt that he would even be able to realise that such a joke was possible.

He'd probably say something asinine like "Bernie had a bird land on his podium whilst he was talking? Trump will also get a bird. It will be the best bird. The. Best. It will be great. And what's more, I will get the Mexicans to pay for it. Did I mention how rich I am? Look at these hands."

The bird just became 10 foot taller...

 

[GrySun]

Aye, it is completely irelevant.

That said, I feel that comic doesn't do justice to quite how stupid Trump actually is.
I doubt that he would even be able to realise that such a joke was possible.

He'd probably say something asinine like "Bernie had a bird land on his podium whilst he was talking? Trump will also get a bird. It will be the best bird. The. Best. It will be great. And what's more, I will get the Mexicans to pay for it. Did I mention how rich I am? Look at these hands."

The bird just became 10 foot taller...

Ayy lmao. He could say that actually, Trump's a heavy memer after all
Do we love our birds?

 

[kkck]

How often does that even happen? And what do you suggest is a good solution? You going and telling them they're retards? I don't think that'll help.

I think you don't know muslims well enough at all to be talking about how many "bad things" they do. And nah that definitely does seem like double standards. Just listen to yourself, you are convinced that "nearly all" republicans and conservatives do bad things or hurt America. That's exactly what those people you're angry at are doing, thinking "nearly all" muslims do bad things. Quite hypocritical aye?

That's just how Bernie is. He's quite passive, I bet he'd have given away his podium and entire rally to the bird if it didn't leave
But seriously I fail to see how reacting to a bird is in any way relevant to being the next POTUS. At best it can serve to create some intriguing memes, like this one.

To be honest I think milly has a point but he is really bad at making it. Of course, the notion that all white people or republicans are bad people is wrong however the issue here would be perspective. In this specific case when it comes to safety there is the issue of homegrown far right terrorism vs islamic terrorism. Statistically Islamic terrorism is the least common one by far. As in, 90 something percent of threats and attacks relate to far right terrorism. Take the sovereign citizen movement which I have mentioned before. They are perceived as a bigger threat than muslim terrorist in general. Now, the other issue would perhaps be that when it comes to right wing extremists at the US you are not talking about a single group. You are talking about a variety of groups with different beliefs (say, this probably includes neonazis). With ISIS it's easier because it is more of a global threat and there is a single group to pin it all on. With right wing extremists you are talking about a bunch of groups made out entirely out of drunk rednecks whose collective IQ won't get past double digits...

 

[M3J]

Have I said all republicans/conservatives are bad? Many of them seem to be based on how they want to benefit the wealthy, reduce & restrict freedom, and are against stuff like Planned Parenthood.

 

[kkck]

Have I said all republicans/conservatives are bad? Many of them seem to be based on how they want to benefit the wealthy, reduce & restrict freedom, and are against stuff like Planned Parenthood.

That is what I get from your post to be honest. You seem to stop short of calling every right wing person satan.

 

[Dragoon]

I agree. I'm know you can tell the difference but you seem so pissed off at the Republicans that sometimes you only barely stop short of out right calling them all human refuse and will at times just categorize them all as 1 of mind just to save yourself the trouble of adding that not all are shit.

Edit: Damnit kkck... now I feel like I subconsciously emulated you and used "stop short etc..." after I saw your post... xD

 

[M3J]

Given that Trump is popular, and many republican politicians lie and get away with it, hard not to see the whole party negatively. I mean, democrats have its fair share of problems too, I am not denying, but still.

 

[kkck]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...6954fe-dbfd-11e5-891a-4ed04f4213e8_story.html

This one I enjoyed reading... In a way it helped me put the whole "political correctness" issue in the context of the republican party and make a big more sense of trump. At least up to this point the vast majority of times I have heard or read "I am not politically correct, "..."" the quotations so to speak are usually invariably followed by something that is xenophobic or racist or just outright stupid. The whole political correctness thing isn't really a problem, it's just racist/xenophobic people complaining that they are called out on being racist, xenophobic or stupid. Take trump... He makes the point that because of political correctness it is wrong to say "muslin neighborhoods" should be specially watched over. Not doing it is political correctness run amok... When the sad and simple reality is that doing such a thing would merely alienate the target population, play into ISIS rhetoric and overall likely produce no results. Basically, it's wrong and stupid to do this, at least if the opinions of people involved in security and whatnot that I have read about so far matter. So when you consider how similar trump's proposals are to the other candidates... It makes sense that the moderates would fail to appeal. In their minds the "politically correct" are usually people censoring themselves or just straight up lying. Heck, even looking into what is considered cases of political correctness run amok the issue is not necessarily political correctness but rather ignorance in dealing with what should be simple.... Of course, the implication here would be that trump is basically the same candidate as rubio or jeb in most issues but in turn rubio or jeb don't lie about their racism so to speak. I mean, looking into each candidate's positions on issues trump currently is remarkably similar to basically all other candidates. Of course, trump does lie a lot and adjusted his positions to cater to his audience so to speak but what he says actually reflects generic republican values.

 

[xi0]

Well, Trump just said last night that he wants Japan, S.Korea, and Saudi Arabia to have nuclear weapons, yet he's against nuclear proliferation..........wat