American Politics

M3J

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Trump would be easy to support if he didnt change his views. Did some new evidence happen to be unearthed that he had to say that Obama was in fact born in America, when he wasnt?

I didn't know Hawaii wasn't part of America anymore! When did it stop being part of America?

In the meanwhile, few people gave a shit about Ted Cruz being born in Canada. Bullshit if people say skin has nothing to do with it.

No, Trump couldn't find or make up the evidence that Obama wasn't born in America, so no point in using that as an argument when it wouldn't help him.
 

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To be fair about Ted Cruz, Trump did questioned him about his status of being born in Canada instead of the US (I'm unsure about the other candidates tho).

So Jimmy Fallon is under-fire over his interview with Donald Trump (although I'm unsure if it's political or just entertainment). The only clip that I've managed to watch was Jimmy messing with Trump's hair (which he said he was fine about that). People getting mad at him just because he treated him humanely just seems silly IMO.
 

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I didn't know Hawaii wasn't part of America anymore! When did it stop being part of America?
Was it a part of America when he was born though?
 

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Yes. Hawaii became part of the United States by 1959; Obama was born in 1961.
 

M3J

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To be fair about Ted Cruz, Trump did questioned him about his status of being born in Canada instead of the US (I'm unsure about the other candidates tho).

So Jimmy Fallon is under-fire over his interview with Donald Trump (although I'm unsure if it's political or just entertainment). The only clip that I've managed to watch was Jimmy messing with Trump's hair (which he said he was fine about that). People getting mad at him just because he treated him humanely just seems silly IMO.
One person, and how much did he grill Cruz? And I rarely saw anyone else bring it up.

Also saw what Trump said about Hillary's views on the Second Amendment and taking guns away from her guards. How does that even translate into him talking about assassination? All it does is make Hillary look like a hypocrite or try to see sense, but nothing else. I'm against Trump 100%, but this accusation is ridiculous.
Was it a part of America when he was born though?
Yes. As someone who claims to love US, you should know this.
 

Onyx Darkmatter

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One person, and how much did he grill Cruz? And I rarely saw anyone else bring it up.
He did grilled Cruz, both directly and indirectly (especially his wife and all; then there's the "Lyin' Ted" nickname). Although Trump's greatest smackdown on Cruz is if he were the one to win Texas in the Primaries (similar to what happened with Rubio's case, where he dropped out of the race because he lost Florida).
 

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Trump jumped on the Birther thing because it gave him a lot of media attention. And to be honest, due to Hawaii's rather uncommon laws, a paranoid racists' suppositions about Obama's childhood gave it more fuel then it normally would have. Regardless of the circumstances or how it was handled, it was obviously fueled by bigotry.

He did apply the same sort of standards to Cruz though, but it was fueled more about by a constitutional debate, not your standard-fare conspiracy theory. It became less relevant since he was never nominated though. But I really do believe there would have been a court case about Cruz's legitimacy to run if he had been nominated.
 

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I am the only one arround here who think clinton will make a great president and is a generally decent human being with integrity, right?
 

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There are some of her policies that I think is just literally impossible to co-op or even to achieve, like Military enhancements cannot co-op with Student Debt crisis unless we increase our Taxes (which is not the greatest move, considering how the economy is still recovering) or how she claims she could end Gun Violence or finding a cure to Alzheimer's Disease.
Don't get the wrong idea: I would love to have most of these come true (except for the Military part, unless we're going to invade the world), but these are most likely just policies to gain vote instead of part of her agenda.
I don't think Hillary would become a great president, but I know that she won't become one of the worst presidents in US History unless she hits a scandal that's equally or bigger than the Watergate Scandal or worse (IMO, nobody beats Herbert Hoover as the worst president in US History).
 

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I am the only one arround here who think clinton will make a great president and is a generally decent human being with integrity, right?
She abandoned hard working americans overseas in benghazi therefore she wont be a great president in my book and she has questionable integrity.
 

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She abandoned hard working americans overseas in benghazi therefore she wont be a great president in my book and she has questionable integrity.
Whom did she abandon there?

@Onyx Darkmatter Well, we will see about that i guess. As a senator, she did a realy good job and got reelected.
I would give her the benefit of the doubt here.
 

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I am the only one arround here who think clinton will make a great president and is a generally decent human being with integrity, right?
You might be lol. Personally I think she would generally do a good job and actually be able to get past the republican congress blockade which has haunted obama all this years. Partly because she is not black and republicans in congress are laughably racist. And partly because for her a "concession" in regards to policy is a good thing (and I agree with that line of thought though it depends exactly on what she is conceding about) rather than a disastrous defeat. This is something that I think will plague her if she becomes president. Say, the democrat agenda right now has endorsed many of bernie's ideas. And it is basically certain that they will actively pursue this agenda honestly. But if hillary gets to pass a bill by making a concession with republicans she will absolutely do it. And the bernie supporters in questions will hate her for it and call out on bernie for siding with her and tell everyone "I told you so". Even if what happened is actually a step forward.

Where I have absolutely no faith in her though is her hawkishness. Obama has had a very sound and consistent foreign policy which has been relatively unaggressive, at least compared to past presidents, and the world is actually better of for it. And this resulted in the US presidency not being the laughing stock of the world (seriously, every US ally thought nothing of george bush). However hillary is far more interventionist and aggressive, enough to be virtually equal to republicans in that regard, and is a genuine risk for another Iraq IMO. Obama's worst thing so far is Lybia but as you said earlier that is dramatically different from iraq and by any standard far less severe.

In the end it comes down to how tainted her image is..... People are still on about Bhengazi at the US even though it takes barely a half functional neuron to see how laughably moronic the notion is. You have to be astoundingly stupid to not realize that Hillary definitely did not do anything wrong if 9 highly partisan investigations over 2 years have exonerated her. Seriously, a hollow earth conspiracy theorist would be Einstein next to the morons who still think this is a thing. Then the email thing... People actually think Comey would let her go easy or that he was bought of somehow.... Even though he stood up to bush, a president from his party, years back. And then Comey releases the interviews, which actually justifies the FBI decisions not to indite and people pretend this somehow does the opposite. One way or the other the 20 year smear campaign the republicans have had against hillary has been extremely successful.
 
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xi0

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I am the only one arround here who think clinton will make a great president and is a generally decent human being with integrity, right?
Regardless of candidate, I think it's kind of foolhardy to look at any of them and be confident that they'll be a great president. As far as who they are personally, who the hell knows? Running a political campaign isn't really first and foremost about being a decent person or even having decent integrity. It's appearing to be this way that matters, a la "likability". There's a few exceptions really, and far often they never make it out of the primaries. A good example would be someone like Joe Biden, I'm glad he was our vice president and I was disappointed when he didn't run this election. I think he would have been a much stronger candidate, but he's older now and the death of his son seemed to take too much of a toll on him to run all over again.

As far as Clinton being a decent human being with integrity goes - I think there are more than enough questions regarding that to where I don't think one should be convinced either way. I don't know what it is about her, but she's comes off as a very guarded person, and it's something she's dealt with since she was the First Lady of Arkansas. Even if you remove all of the bullshit with her husband's impeachment and act like it never happened, she's still shown questionable judgment and has had definite moments of ineptitude. I think at best, she's a standard fare politician, who's really good at playing "the game"...at worst...well, there's more than enough things online that you can probably be convinced of. She just isn't someone I think is deserving of the office. I didn't feel that way about Obama or Al Gore. And despite me being a Democrat, I didn't think that of McCain either. I'm a bit dubious in regards to Romney though.

At this point, I think that if you're actually interested in fixing the system we have, you can't do that while supporting a Republican OR a Democrat. Maybe someone will come along and prove me wrong, but these two parties like the arrangement they have, as much as their member politicians like to scream and insult one another. They have a stranglehold on the political process, and supporting one of "their" candidates will never change the status quo.
 

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He did grilled Cruz, both directly and indirectly (especially his wife and all; then there's the "Lyin' Ted" nickname). Although Trump's greatest smackdown on Cruz is if he were the one to win Texas in the Primaries (similar to what happened with Rubio's case, where he dropped out of the race because he lost Florida).
Interesting.
I am the only one arround here who think clinton will make a great president and is a generally decent human being with integrity, right?
Probably one of the very few on this forum, if not the only one.

She abandoned hard working americans overseas in benghazi therefore she wont be a great president in my book and she has questionable integrity.
While you believe in abandoning hardworking Americans in favor of the wealthy ones or deceitful people who work in financial/banking industry.
 

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Where I have absolutely no faith in her though is her hawkishness. Obama has had a very sound and consistent foreign policy which has been relatively aggressiveness, at least compared to past presidents, and the world is actually better of for it. And this resulted in the US presidency not being the laughing stock of the world (seriously, every US ally thought nothing of george bush). However hillary is far more interventionist and aggressive, enough to be virtually equal to republicans in that regard, and is a genuine risk for another Iraq IMO. Obama's worst thing so far is Lybia but as you said earlier that is dramatically different from iraq and by any standard far less severe.
Obama was pretty anti agressive, what agressiveness did you see in him. His lack of wanting to squash and crush these terroristic non christian peoples forced him to finally up military utility in this his final year, he reaped what he sowed. Our country is supposed to free people under these regimes, being scared to be aggressive saves no one and puts American homeland security at risk. Look how many new terrorists attacks on the homeland happen under obamas failed stance on foreign affairs, three this week even.

Hilary is the change we need and whom I feel more confident about of the remaining candidates.
 

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She abandoned hard working americans overseas in benghazi therefore she wont be a great president in my book and she has questionable integrity.
That's a spin-heavy commentary if I've ever seen one. Where'd you lift that one from? What does the victims of the Benghazi attack work ethic matter in regards to the issue?

A few months ago when your darling Rubio was talking about Trump's genitals in innuendo and getting smashed by him over it, you were 100% behind Hillary. What changed between then and now for you to be against her? There's not much consistency of thought here.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Hilary is the change we need and whom I feel more confident about of the remaining candidates.
So you have confidence in her despite thinking she won't be a great president and thinking she has no integrity......

...what?

You must really love Trump :lmao
 

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That's a spin-heavy commentary if I've ever seen one. Where'd you lift that one from? What does the victims of the Benghazi attack work ethic matter in regards to the issue?

A few months ago when your darling Rubio was talking about Trump's genitals in innuendo and getting smashed by him over it, you were 100% behind Hillary. What changed between then and now for you to be against her? There's not much consistency of thought here.
Shes votable and wont make america worst but Im not aligned with her 100% to say that she will be a great president like Bush. I just dont want trump there and she at least has sensible economic ideals and experience with foreign affairs.
 

M3J

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Bush was never a great president, but according to few sources he, like Obama, never used Islamic terrorists to describe such terrorists. Hell, Bush even advocated for accepting Muslims, no? Though, under his reign Muslims were arrested, questioned, and all that shit. Bush played a huge part in the downfall of the economy and the country.

Sad conservatives will never make sense about Obama. They whine about how he made us look bad or nonaggressive, but that's a major bullshit from what I hear from friends and people from Middle East.
 

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Shes votable and wont make america worst but Im not aligned with her 100% to say that she will be a great president like Bush.
:yoda
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
IIRC World wide Bush is probably regarded as the worst president in recent memory.
 

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Obama was pretty anti agressive, what agressiveness did you see in him. His lack of wanting to squash and crush these terroristic non christian peoples forced him to finally up military utility in this his final year, he reaped what he sowed. Our country is supposed to free people under these regimes, being scared to be aggressive saves no one and puts American homeland security at risk. Look how many new terrorists attacks on the homeland happen under obamas failed stance on foreign affairs, three this week even.

Hilary is the change we need and whom I feel more confident about of the remaining candidates.
Ah, I typed that wrong. What I meant to say is that he was less aggressive than others but still plenty aggressive (from my point of view at least). That said, what makes you think he lacks wanting of defeating terrorists? The guy has a solid bombing policy against terrorists. What obama hasn't done is send armed troops over to the middle east but other than that he has hit them hard. Isis in particular has taken significant damage over the past year and a half having lost significant amount of territories and funding (which seems to be the reason for the increase in terrorist attacks as well). The notion that obama has not wanted to crush them hard enough is, well, false.

The terrorists attacks the US faces are not because the US is not aggressive enough. If anything it's the opposite, the whole thing is the result of people being bombed by the US taking issue with being bombed. Isis as a whole is an Iraq legacy (thus a bush legacy).
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
Bush was never a great president, but according to few sources he, like Obama, never used Islamic terrorists to describe such terrorists. Hell, Bush even advocated for accepting Muslims, no? Though, under his reign Muslims were arrested, questioned, and all that shit. Bush played a huge part in the downfall of the economy and the country.

Sad conservatives will never make sense about Obama. They whine about how he made us look bad or nonaggressive, but that's a major bullshit from what I hear from friends and people from Middle East.
Bush, from what I understand, knew precisely squat about foreign policy but at least he kinda listened to his advisers when making decisions (albeit poorly). Which is basically why he didn't say the stuff trump says now or never even considered the stuff trumps speaks about so carelessly. I am not so sure that bush did have a part in the downfall of the economy. What did the iraq war have to do with the financial crisis? The iraq war definitely increased the country's deficit but would not going to that war have left the US better equipped to handle the crisis? Bush was the one who started the bailouts, which was ultimately the correct move (and obama continued the bailouts, simply because they made sense and today most economists agree they were a positive thing).

From what I can tell, the issue in regards to how bush is perceived by republicans is that they seem to think respect is the same thing as fear. Republicans don't feel well about themselves in general if they do not feel that their enemies fear them. They live in a bubble where the ridiculous notion that there is an amount of attacking and bombing they can do that will finally lead US enemies to fear the US and thus not attack. In spite of the simple fact that the US has been bombing the middle east for decades and that only seems to piss people of more rather than bring about the fear induced peace. So while republicans felt plenty good about themselves thanks to bush being tough and invading the crap out of stuff, the rest of the world just stared in awe at the insanity and just accepted the US was led by an ignorant buffoon that they, if given the chance, wouldn't trust near pointy objects.
 
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