American Politics

[kkck]

GOP accusing Cohen for testifying out of scorn is just asinine (am I using it right?). Because quite frankly, testifying out of scorn is still better than any other reason imo. That said, the hearing so far doesn't bring anything new except reaffirming most points that have already been revealed. Cohen stripping Stone naked is probably the only new thing.

Yeah GOP are just trying to hurt cohen there... Of course, ultimately its not about believing cohen but rather whether what cohen says can be verified. That said, we kinda already know most of what cohen has said here so far.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 28, 2019, Original Post Date: Feb 27, 2019 ---

So, any takes on Cohen's testimony? As far as I can tell the checks and documents Cohen took to the hearing actually prove Trump was directly involved in pretty much all of the things Cohen has pleaded guilty to and is going to prison for.

On the other hand what cohen testified would also suggest there is no collusion between Trump And Russia. Trump supposedly heard about the email leaks from Stone who was in contact with Assange. If Trump was colluding with Russians then he wouldn't have needed to hear about this from Stone. I am curious if this could result in other charges for stone and trump in regards to being aware of the incoming leak but not really saying anything to authorities. Also worth noting, while this is evidence that Trump did not work directly with Russia, its not necessarily that for Stone. And Assange's ties to Russia would be kinda up in the air as well. I am not sure if Assange can be indicted for anything in that regard though. The only caveat here in regards to collusion with russia is the trump tower meeting with potential russian agents. I am not sure of how that fits into what cohen has testified.

Another takeaway from this: At least Trump jr seems to be heading for prison. Not quite sure about trump's other kids.

I don't think impeachment is necessarily likely here of course, that would require republicans to turn on trump.... And being president of course protects trump from being indicted for crimes (Muller did say a sitting president in his view cannot be indicted).

Thoughts?

 

[Franckie]

So, any takes on Cohen's testimony? As far as I can tell the checks and documents Cohen took to the hearing actually prove Trump was directly involved in pretty much all of the things Cohen has pleaded guilty to and is going to prison for.

Just two things:

1). Someone should ask the GOP why, given Cohen's long history of criminal ties and behavior—which was in the public domain before 2016—they made him the deputy finance chairman of the Republican National Committee in 2017.

2). There is so much wrongdoing it's hard to separate, but the important thing is to not separate things. The deep links between mafia activity, corporate crime and political corruption are what's important. Look at the big picture—a transnational crime syndicate posing as a government—and don't let them mask that horror with more minor scandals.

 

[kkck]

Just two things:

1). Someone should ask the GOP why, given Cohen's long history of criminal ties and behavior—which was in the public domain before 2016—they made him the deputy finance chairman of the Republican National Committee in 2017.

2). There is so much wrongdoing it's hard to separate, but the important thing is to not separate things. The deep links between mafia activity, corporate crime and political corruption are what's important. Look at the big picture—a transnational crime syndicate posing as a government—and don't let them mask that horror with more minor scandals.

Cohen being there definitely is problematic at best. Though I am not sure of what the RNC or anyone else should do about it. I would assume his tenure there would already be under scrutiny by authorities given all that has happened but of course there is no evidence of anything anywhere.

Yeah... Frankly, its almost mind blogging. What annoys me the most here though is that the bulk of what we know about cohen is rather recent however he worked as a fixer for 10 years. We are talking about 10 years worth of potential crimes (financial, extortion, taxes, intimidation, who knows what else....) carried in trump's or other's names. While it is reasonable to assume cohen is being honest about the stuff he confessed to, lying about it would just give him more trouble over stuff he is already convicted on, it is not quite the case that we can expect him to just admit to more crimes out of the blue. Of course, its entirely possible that his previous 10 years under trump are under investigation... Not sure if its plausible he got a deal over other stuff he could have confessed to.

A "transnational crime syndicate" sounds a bit too much like a conspiracy theory to me. Sure, trump has surrounded himself with liars, cheats and sycophants but the bulk of what we see at large still appears run of the mill corruption which trump can't even cover for (otherwise cohen wouldn't have shown up to congress with checks with trump's signature).

 

[M3J]

Another takeaway from this: At least Trump jr seems to be heading for prison. Not quite sure about trump's other kids.

why do you think he's headed for prison?

 

[kkck]

why do you think he's headed for prison?

Because, if I understand this correctly, Don jr at least signed off on the checks which cohen received (the illegal ones to be specific). Meaning he is pretty much guilty of the same things cohen is going to prison for. To be honest though, I am not 100% of the specifics but at the very least going by cohen's testimony Jr is guilty of financial crimes. Indicting Donald for a crime will be difficult while he is president but his family on the other hand has exactly zero protection from that. All the authorities have to do now is verify that jr was involved with the checks and he is done for.

 

[M3J]

That's the thing though, I don't think Trump's family has zero protection. In fact, Jr. could be pretty guilty and still avoid jail time, and Trump's supporters would likely make sure of that.

 

[SharkBait]

slow news day if people are criticizing him for sending FEMA aid. President is doing the good work, yet they find it in themselves to criticize. It was a mere figure of speech

 

[xi0]

slow news day if people are criticizing him for sending FEMA aid. President is doing the good work, yet they find it in themselves to criticize. It was a mere figure of speech

Seems you're missing the context here. One could maybe say he's learning from his past "mistakes" with handling other natural disasters, but there's a stark difference between the kinds of things he was saying back during the California Wildfires, or Hurricane Maria in Puerto Rico. Hell, he criticized California in the midst of them dealing with the fires. And what's the difference there? He carried Alabama in the presidential election.

Trump has nothing but glowing things to say about people who support him, right up to him praising literal bigots. And his opponents? He almost universally trashes them. This is whatever when it comes to politics, however it shouldn't factor into federal aide for disaster response.

 

[SharkBait]

Reasons the party will remain in 2020. Trump getting that wall deal and the national crisis at our border was very effective imo and greatly improved my view since he gets the job done.

 

[xi0]

Gets what job done? He was forced to take a shittier deal than one he could have had while the GOP still controlled congress, tried to use it as political ammunition against Democrats with this manufactured crisis and failed miserably...

 

[SharkBait]

Gets what job done? He was forced to take a shittier deal than one he could have had while the GOP still controlled congress, tried to use it as political ammunition against Democrats with this manufactured crisis and failed miserably...

A deal is a deal though.

 

[xi0]

A deal is a deal though.

That he was forced to make or another Shutdown would have happened

 

[SharkBait]

That he was forced to make or another Shutdown would have happened

Suutdowm is an effective bargaining tool and people supported ot. Remember he said TSA agents and border patrol were proud to about the shutdown.

 

[xi0]

Suutdowm is an effective bargaining tool and people supported ot. Remember he said TSA agents and border patrol were proud to about the shutdown.

He also says Climate Change is a chinese hoax

How can his supporters even take anything he says at face value? He lies like it's his job.

 

[kkck]

One way or the other, trump won't win reelection in 2020 with only republican support. Trump needs support from independents to win and his support among them has dropped dramatically since the last election. If democrats pick someone whom independents don't loath then right now things look pretty grim for him for the next election.

 

[M3J]

Suutdowm is an effective bargaining tool and people supported ot. Remember he said TSA agents and border patrol were proud to about the shutdown.

It did nothing for Trump except make him either look more incompetent or helped him demonize the Dems.

He also says Climate Change is a chinese hoax

How can his supporters even take anything he says at face value? He lies like it's his job.

Because he says what they want to hear, and he managed to brainwash them with "fake news" to anything criticizing him.

 

[SharkBait]

One way or the other, trump won't win reelection in 2020 with only republican support. Trump needs support from independents to win and his support among them has dropped dramatically since the last election. If democrats pick someone whom independents don't loath then right now things look pretty grim for him for the next election.

Who are independents going to vote for, if they even vote. Democrats are already divided over AOC, the Muslim congresswoman, and even Sanders policies. I cant see how they can unite at present to somehow put trump's chances in jeopardy.

 

[M3J]

One way or the other, trump won't win reelection in 2020 with only republican support. Trump needs support from independents to win and his support among them has dropped dramatically since the last election. If democrats pick someone whom independents don't loath then right now things look pretty grim for him for the next election.

Problem is, the Dems have to also pick someone whom the Dem voters can agree on as well, and that should be their priority. The independents are pickier/more choosy with whom they want.

 

[kkck]

Also, come on, trump clearly shut his own foot when he started the shutdown. It was a bad plan to get something done which the majority of the US opposes. It was literally the easiest win democrats could ever hope to have. As all they had to do was literally nothing at all to win. Well, not literally nothing, they just had to say it was a trump shutdown. But that is almost the same as nothing. The shutdown was an ill conceived plan that could only make sense to someone who doesn't understand anything about government.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 6, 2019, Original Post Date: Mar 6, 2019 ---

Who are independents going to vote for, if they even vote. Democrats are already divided over AOC, the Muslim congresswoman, and even Sanders policies. I cant see how they can unite at present to somehow put trump's chances in jeopardy.

AFAIK independents would be fairly receptive to literally any of those as the bulk of independents tend to lean left. Of course ilham omar or AOC are not running for president. The democratic party would have to pretty much conspire against the more popular leftwing potential candidates to actually alienate independents like that..... ah god dammit.

 

[M3J]

Trump didn't entirely shoot his own foot though, he also got people who didn't like Dems or were neutral enough to be more against Dems. The Dems didn't come out of this unscathed, lot of workers are still affected, and many people likely think if the Dems acquiesced to Trump (which in their eyes is a bad move because Trump is just trying to protect us), then they wouldn't be in such a pickle.

Independents want someone who is borderline socialist, at worst, and many want Dem candidate/s who support Palestine.