American Politics

[desin24]

Idk, I feel like moderation is overrated. Too many people on the left care too much about appealing to moderate republicans, and it's paid them dust. The more the turnout is, the more it favors Democrats. Which implies that the GOP gerrymandering and voter suppression is done for a reason. Most Americans are liberal, or hold pretty liberal beliefs when it comes to many issues.

Hmm. Maybe not appeal to moderate republicans but moderate independents? It seems like the divides between the only two parties is getting broader and broader with no sign of relief.

Gerrymandering is so fascinating. As a European, it seems so absurd that tracing those district lines can change the outcome of elections on a massive scale (Dem vs Rep). It is done to win. In true competitive spirit, you use every possible chance to get an advantage. This reminds me of a segment from the Today Show when John Oliver still used to be a correspondent and he asked a Rep Representative what their number 1 responsibility is and his first answer was "getting re-elected" before asking to roll the tape back and change the answer.

 

[kkck]

Independents within the US largely lean left (left within the US context at least)... Democrats targeting moderate independents would means they are targeting the minority of independents. That said, that is probably less absurd than what they actually do, trying to appeal to moderate republicans...

 

[desin24]

Independents within the US largely lean left (left within the US context at least)... Democrats targeting moderate independents would means they are targeting the minority of independents. That said, that is probably less absurd than what they actually do, trying to appeal to moderate republicans...

Seems like we have different definitions here. Leaning left in my eyes does not exclude you from being moderate. The opposite to moderate would be far and I don't think the majority of those people are far left. Same with the right. The extremes are loud and get amplified because of our attention-based media and that is what draws attention but in the end, the majority is certainly somewhere along the middle. Do you have any examples of how they would try to appeal to moderate republicans?

 

[Ramen]

Seems like we have different definitions here. Leaning left in my eyes does not exclude you from being moderate. The opposite to moderate would be far and I don't think the majority of those people are far left.

If were going off a spectrum kinda model, most people are center right/left and actually switch depending on who's campaign appeals to them the most.

 

[M3J]

Idk, I feel like moderation is overrated. Too many people on the left care too much about appealing to moderate republicans, and it's paid them dust. The more the turnout is, the more it favors Democrats. Which implies that the GOP gerrymandering and voter suppression is done for a reason. Most Americans are liberal, or hold pretty liberal beliefs when it comes to many issues.

And to independent centrists, which is ridiculous. Claiming to support candidates that are willing to compromise with the other side is a silly move because it shows that they're willing to cater to republicans, and it discourages many left-to-liberal voters from voting. One of the reasons why I'm not really for Biden is because he seems like he's more than happy to reach the middle ground with republicans at the citizens' expense.

But ultimately, I agree, moderation doesn't help anyone but the republicans, and we need to stop appealing to them. It's not like enough of them will suddenly start supporting the Democratic candidate or keep that support.

 

[xi0]

This reminds me of a segment from the Today Show when John Oliver still used to be a correspondent and he asked a Rep Representative what their number 1 responsibility is and his first answer was "getting re-elected" before asking to roll the tape back and change the answer.

It's because their terms are only two years and if they're in a purple district they basically have to always be campaigning. In a way the turnover is good, but it also keeps too many from doing their jobs.

 

[desin24]

It's because their terms are only two years and if they're in a purple district they basically have to always be campaigning. In a way the turnover is good, but it also keeps too many from doing their jobs.

Wow that's nothing. I mean they are basically campaigning non stop because everything they do can affect their chances for reelection. Btw I found the clip again and I was mistaken. The question was: "What makes a politician successful?" A: Getting reelected by his/her constituents.

If were going off a spectrum kinda model, most people are center right/left and actually switch depending on who's campaign appeals to them the most.

Exactly, wouldn't you want to get most of those rather than appealing to the fringes and hope that those center people don't go to vote/vote bluered no matter who?

And to independent centrists, which is ridiculous. Claiming to support candidates that are willing to compromise with the other side is a silly move because it shows that they're willing to cater to republicans, and it discourages many left-to-liberal voters from voting. One of the reasons why I'm not really for Biden is because he seems like he's more than happy to reach the middle ground with republicans at the citizens' expense.

But ultimately, I agree, moderation doesn't help anyone but the republicans, and we need to stop appealing to them. It's not like enough of them will suddenly start supporting the Democratic candidate or keep that support.

But isn't that one of the reasons why he won the primaries (not the main reason)? He is an establishment "regular" democrat. He was Obama VP and you know what you get with him. Going for the extremes will just further mobilize the right and give them the possibility to be the "civil ones" and get the moderate vote. Plus young people don't give a fuck so democrats will continue losing IMO.

 

[M3J]

But isn't that one of the reasons why he won the primaries (not the main reason)? He is an establishment "regular" democrat. He was Obama VP and you know what you get with him. Going for the extremes will just further mobilize the right and give them the possibility to be the "civil ones" and get the moderate vote. Plus young people don't give a fuck so democrats will continue losing IMO.

Somewhat, but I think Bernie is just seen as too radical no matter what. I think no matter what though, the right would either get the moderate vote, or the moderates wouldn't really vote. They just don't seem like they'd support Democrats.

 

[SharkBait]

I have split from my party and decided to go for the Democratic Primary and pick the candidates who are most supportive of UBI. This crisis has highlighted how we need something to guarantee every American has economic support.

No longer will I support people who care about the Dow Jones Index and the NASDAQ over American lives.

Still dont know if it was any point for me choosing Mr. Sandars for my states primary tuesday.

 

[hokageji]

I have split from my party and decided to go for the Democratic Primary and pick the candidates who are most supportive of UBI. This crisis has highlighted how we need something to guarantee every American has economic support.

No longer will I support people who care about the Dow Jones Index and the NASDAQ over American lives.

Still dont know if it was any point for me choosing Mr. Sandars for my states primary tuesday.

What party were you before if you dont mind me asking? UBI makes so much sense with the current covid situation. The government giving checks to its citizens and all... i got one even though i would rather not have it, so by that, i still think there's a need to improve on it but as a concept it does make sense...

I think the Dow Jones statement needs more context though, you are talking about the bailout that happened this time? Not sure i understand....

THere is no point supporting Sanders anymore, its just taking votes away from Biden or Trump. atleast that's my opinion

 

[M3J]

I have split from my party and decided to go for the Democratic Primary and pick the candidates who are most supportive of UBI. This crisis has highlighted how we need something to guarantee every American has economic support.

No longer will I support people who care about the Dow Jones Index and the NASDAQ over American lives.

Still dont know if it was any point for me choosing Mr. Sandars for my states primary tuesday.

Why are you supporting UBI? Didn't that go against your views previously? Weren't you arguing against us on stuff like this? I'm assuming you got laid off and don't or didn't have any income.

THere is no point supporting Sanders anymore, its just taking votes away from Biden or Trump. atleast that's my opinion

This was before Bernie dropped out. And he claimed to have been a republican/Trump supporter. Go through this thread.

 

[SharkBait]

What party were you before if you dont mind me asking?

usually stood with the conservative republican views (i was a marco rubio supporter)

Why are you supporting UBI? Didn't that go against your views previously? Weren't you arguing against us on stuff like this? I'm assuming you got laid off and don't or didn't have any income.

Seeing essential front line workers at meat packaging places, grocery stores, and such bear the grunt of the coronavirus crisis, as well as how our terrible health insurance scheme is once people are laid off/reduced hours, as well as all those people at food pantries around the country, and rental offices, private lenders just be heartless people in the face of crisis, just showed to me that we need a system in place to ensure people have the basic income to survive and live and erhaps have extra to thrive. Imagine how much better we would have been this crisis and before and after with this. To me it seems to be that which we need for a strong economy.

I have income, but my next job will be one of those that gets reviewed yearly so I could very well face an issue of having no income.

 

[kkck]

Presidency wise, bernie is simply no longer relevant. He just won't be the nominee unless biden gets at least violently ill.... And 4 years from now he will be too old for a first term... Heck, I would argue bernie and even trump were already too old for a first term back in 2016 but for some reason people at the US love having mummies running for office...

 

[SharkBait]

think the Dow Jones statement needs more context though, you are talking about the bailout that happened this time? Not sure i understand....

its from the comments from our administration that believes Human Capital Stock are ready to go back to work even though the crisis is rampant
Die for the stock market

White House: Weâre Going to Have to Let Some People Die So the Stock Market Can Live

“We’re gonna have to make some difficult trade-offs.”

www.vanityfair.com

 

[Ramen]

(i was a marco rubio supporter)

Better than Ted Cruz lolz

 

[M3J]

usually stood with the conservative republican views (i was a marco rubio supporter)



Seeing essential front line workers at meat packaging places, grocery stores, and such bear the grunt of the coronavirus crisis, as well as how our terrible health insurance scheme is once people are laid off/reduced hours, as well as all those people at food pantries around the country, and rental offices, private lenders just be heartless people in the face of crisis, just showed to me that we need a system in place to ensure people have the basic income to survive and live and erhaps have extra to thrive. Imagine how much better we would have been this crisis and before and after with this. To me it seems to be that which we need for a strong economy.

I have income, but my next job will be one of those that gets reviewed yearly so I could very well face an issue of having no income.

You mean, it took a pandemic to show you just how bad things are in the US, and how most of us are one crisis away from bankruptcy or seeing our lives destroyed? Do you think the wealthy should be taxed more?

By income, I was also talking about unemployment.

its from the comments from our administration that believes Human Capital Stock are ready to go back to work even though the crisis is rampant
Die for the stock market

Didn't you say something like this years ago?

 

[SharkBait]

You mean, it took a pandemic to show you just how bad things are in the US, and how most of us are one crisis away from bankruptcy or seeing our lives destroyed? Do you think the wealthy should be taxed more?

The strong economy and lowest unemployment in years, and wealth for all just made it appear as if we were truly on the top of the world here.

I dont think the wealthy should be taxed more. If you earned it, you do deserve to keep it.

Didn't you say something like this years ago?

I didn't want it at the cost of human lives.

 

[Ramen]

The strong economy and lowest unemployment in years, and wealth for all just made it appear as if we were truly on the top of the world here.

Strong economy where? 78% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

Let's not forget that Trump inherited a pretty good economy in regards of unemployment rate from Obama.

 

[M3J]

The strong economy and lowest unemployment in years, and wealth for all just made it appear as if we were truly on the top of the world here.

I dont think the wealthy should be taxed more. If you earned it, you do deserve to keep it.



I didn't want it at the cost of human lives.

Both of those are thanks to Obama. Trump only deserves credit for not ruining it. However, at least one person realized the reality of USA's economic situation.

Majority of the wealthy have not earned their wealth, and this has been proven by how they want to reopen the country. Plus, if they're taxed more (like they were decades ago), that money could be used to help citizens. The wealthy aren't affected by higher tax rates. I can't recall anything that'd cost over $100 million that would be necessary for the wealthy.


Interesting view you have there.

 

[Ramen]

This pandemic will be Trump's biggest challenge. Obama was able to recover from the great recession and build a good economy slowly but surely.

We'll see if Trump can do the same since numbers are reaching Great Depression level.