American Politics

[Heero Yuy]

I understand it too. I just don't like it being shared among thousands of impressionable barely-able-to-vote youths.



Yeah I don't see the IDF being denounced much either, that's fair.




In that case, enjoy a conversation between two people arguing in good faith.

There are even several videos of Destiny pointing out the bad-faith arguments of Ben Shapiro you can find, if you need convincing that his pro-Israel stance is well thought out.



Hamas, probably. But I don't know that that trust is warranted. Trust that their actions will lead to a peaceful end for Palestinians? Of course not. Trust that they're trying to pursue a better future for Palestinians? Sure. Trust that they won't use them as human shields? Also a no.



If by indiscriminately you mean "without concern for civilians amongst Hamas", what are they supposed to do to completely route out Hamas? I say this as someone that would prefer they focus exclusively on Hamas. I know it isn't that easy though.



I've heard this stated a lot, and it's certainly possible that's the case. But let's assume for a second that it wasn't. Let's say they didn't want to commit a genocide, but wanted to root out Hamas completely: how do they do that without civilian casualties?



Because Republicans wouldn't even try to protect women's rights, and they're only just starting with the amount of regressive policies they want to put forth. Not just trying to get rid of abortion, but getting rid of contraception, outlawing puberty blockers for kids, attempting to re-write history with anti CRT stuff, more anti-voter policies to make it harder for minorities to vote, pushing Christian Nationalism down everyone's throats, the list goes on.

You can be pro-Palestine without being anti-democracy, I think.

Dude, Israel is not a democracy, how many times are you gonna ignore literally the fact Palestinians are not treated as human beings like the fucking West Bank, there's no "terror" group there and yet ISRAELIS ARE INDISCRIMINATING ATTACKING THEM IN BROAD DAYLIGHT, BURNING DOWN MOSQUES, CHURCHES, DESTROYING QURANS, BIBLES, TORAHS, like how much more ignorant are you gonna act and go to such lengths to accept that Israel is a fucking Zionist Apartheid State or are you gonna call South Africans and Irish people liars too, and say that what they went through is justified like holy shit, you stand on the wrong side of history

Also you keep going on and on about Hamas using human shields, WHERE ARE THE VIDEOS THEN WHY IS ISRAEL MAKING THESE OUTLANDISH CLAIMS FOR YEARS AND NO VIDEO EVIDENCE OF SUCH THINGS and yet there's FUCKING VIDEO, ON THE GROUND PROOF THAT IDF, ISRAEL ARE DOING WHAT THEY CLAIM HAMAS IS DOING, like get got damn head out of your ass and stop defending FUCKING COLONIZERS WHO FROM THE GET GO NEVER WANTED PEACE WITH PALESTINIANS CUZ Israelis are not fucking Jews, they are Zionists, fucking Nazis, how many times is video of Jews actual Jews need to be posted for you to get it through your head. Like all I've seen you do here in "good faith" is dick ride Israel, not call them out for the shit you and every other zionist supporter fucking claims Hamas is, what Palestinians are, Nazi fucking anti-semetic subhuman trash that are animals cuz that's what western Politicans, the IDF, the citizens of Israel think of anyone who EVEN remotely throws out the idea of a ceasefire. Like holy fuck legit lost brain cells each time, I see you literally decide to be complicit with Israel's actions and ignore the mounting evidences of videos, pictures, eye witnesses, people who have experienced what an Apartheid(South Africans), what people have experienced in a Democracy with terror groups(Ireland), and the key part of all of this IS HOW ORTHODOX AND PROGRESSIVE JEWS AROUND THE WORLD DENOUNCE AND CONDEMN ISRAEL AND CALL THEM OUT FOR BEING MODERN DAY NAZIS.

https://apnews.com/article/israel-b...ntina-brazil-4cc038c0dbe1de9b5e4118e2ceac2181 > Like look at this disgusting shit yo, Israel demands South Americans to condemn Hamas with the same excuses.

"Israel on Wednesday called on Colombia and Chile to “explicitly condemn the Hamas terrorist organization, which slaughtered and abducted babies, children, women and the elderly,” according to a statement by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs."

Said excuses which have been fucking debunked by old video footage of Israel murdering and slaughtering babies, Israel harvesting organs, and skin from dead Palestinians. How the fuck is this a Democracy if every single Palestinian is treated as a 2nd rate citizen where they have to be collared ID like the Nazis, have to have their own laws and regulations that Israel controls and gives them different shit then Israelis. Like you have countries ending ties with Israel over this but keep go going that Pro-Israel stance of yours and live in a false bubble that Israelis, the IDF want you to think that "Hamas" a resistance group CREATED by the decades of injustice to Palestinians be it a muslim, christian, jewish is commiting and breaking international laws and the Geneva Conviction is doing that when it reality, its been Israel.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 7, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 7, 2023 ---

> OH LOOK AT THAT, THE CLAIM THAT ISRAEL SAYS THAT HAMAS HAS TUNNELS UNDER HOSPITALS THUS MAKING IT FAIR GAME, DEBUNKED so quite frankly it's absolutely garbage and disgusting as fuck that people who actually do their jobs show that time and time and time again that Israel are liars are being called out for "faking" evidence by Zionists aka Israelis, Western Media and Politicians and labelled "You'Re AnTi-sEmEtIC" by the real antisemitic people aka Israeis who parade around claiming that they are Jewish, by western media and politicians.

 

[M3J]

If by indiscriminately you mean "without concern for civilians amongst Hamas", what are they supposed to do to completely route out Hamas? I say this as someone that would prefer they focus exclusively on Hamas. I know it isn't that easy though.

Point is, they're not trying to route out Hamas, they don't care about Hamas, they likely fund and support Hamas because it serves their interest. Hamas is a perfect scapegoat to get the West against Palestine/look the other way when Israel bombs Palestine.

What you're saying is what they want, "oh hey Hamas is hiding behind civilians and using them as a shield, so they have to bomb innocent people!" That's how genocide is being justified.

I've heard this stated a lot, and it's certainly possible that's the case. But let's assume for a second that it wasn't. Let's say they didn't want to commit a genocide, but wanted to root out Hamas completely: how do they do that without civilian casualties?

Special forces but they can try not stealing Palestine lands or committing violence and genocide against the Palestinians.

Because Republicans wouldn't even try to protect women's rights, and they're only just starting with the amount of regressive policies they want to put forth. Not just trying to get rid of abortion, but getting rid of contraception, outlawing puberty blockers for kids, attempting to re-write history with anti CRT stuff, more anti-voter policies to make it harder for minorities to vote, pushing Christian Nationalism down everyone's throats, the list goes on.

You can be pro-Palestine without being anti-democracy, I think.

Women in so many states have lost their rights despite a Democrat president. They've also gerrymandered but I forgot if that's under Trump or under Obama or Biden. We're already getting most of this stuff under Democrats, which is why having a Republican prez again won't seem to make much of a difference

 

[xi0]

Incredible

22 Democrats voted for this shit. Thankfully none of them from my state. Wasserman Schultz did though, no clue how that corrupt ghoul still has a political career after her DNC antics in 2016.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 8, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 8, 2023 ---

There are even several videos of Destiny pointing out the bad-faith arguments of Ben Shapiro you can find, if you need convincing that his pro-Israel stance is well thought out.

Oh I don't doubt that. I wasn't trying to group them together other than them being debate-perverts.

I just don't see how Destiny can stand for most of things he claims to stand for and consider his position on Israel as being "well thought out".

Hamas, probably. But I don't know that that trust is warranted. Trust that their actions will lead to a peaceful end for Palestinians? Of course not. Trust that they're trying to pursue a better future for Palestinians? Sure. Trust that they won't use them as human shields? Also a no.

Yeah this is all probably true. I just don't know what the alternative is and why anyone can argue that 10,000 people deserve to die (4,000 of them children who can't even vote if Palestinians were allowed to) in order to get rid of Hamas. It'll end nothing and only usher on the creation of Hamas 2. The only way this ends is if Netanyahu and his friends get what they want and they go further with their genocidal ambitions.

https://i.redd.it/4qnaycrhnvyb1.jpg

www.reddit.com

Assuming you all don't believe this tweet is a pack of lies, then you've gotta accept he's trying. This has to count for something.

I still think most of this is way too charitable and is a dishonest framing since it doesn't actually address the conflict at all. 100 million is a lot of money, but he's earmarked 150 fucking times that for Israel. Delaying for the sake of our own military assets and personnel and the hostages that Netanyahu clearly gives no fucks about does next to nothing for the Palestinians. Next to no one in our government is calling for a ceasefire, they're terrified to even use the word.


You need not look further than the replies to see how deluded he is. I only know of JJ through another youtuber I follow who has interacted with Destiny on occasion, and while he speaks highly of JJ, this take alone is hurting my brain. A "conservative" gay Canadian who defends Biden. He comes off like a fence-sitting centrist moron who likes the smell of his own farts lol.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 8, 2023 ---

I remember someone took the photo/footage of her slapping the IDF soldier and claimed she was a Ukrainian civilian slapping Russian invaders and libs couldn't stop masturbating over it. Now when the reality is known it's crickets.

 

[xi0]

Wow man, so obvious who they're pandering to. Wonder why???

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 8, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 8, 2023 ---

In that case, enjoy a conversation between two people arguing in good faith.

I'm only about halfway through but I don't really see much of an argument going on? They're just recapping history.

Not that I'm trying to discredit the person before hearing all of their points (if they exist), but I found this clip interesting. Ignore the comments, not really an endorsement on my end.


I think it's kind of curious how his counter to the topic of 1948 is bringing up a statute of limitations on being indigenous. That's not really what's being argued? Zionism existed well before 1948 and there were Jewish settlements there prior to 1948 as well. In fact, the Jews in Palestine frequently clashed with the British. The crux of this issue is that the government in Israel is neither secular or democratic. It's an ethnostate that treats non-Jews worse than Jews, and Palestinians the worst.

 

[ninjabot]

I still think most of this is way too charitable and is a dishonest framing since it doesn't actually address the conflict at all. 100 million is a lot of money, but he's earmarked 150 fucking times that for Israel. Delaying for the sake of our own military assets and personnel and the hostages that Netanyahu clearly gives no fucks about does next to nothing for the Palestinians. Next to no one in our government is calling for a ceasefire, they're terrified to even use the word.

Sure, it's just, America doesn't have the same obligations to Palestine that it does to Israel, right? In a war between an ally and a non-ally, where is our aid supposed to go?

And I'm familiar with JJ, It's just this particular tweet served the purpose I needed it to: to show Biden's aid of Palestine in spite of his personal beliefs compared to what we'd get from a Republican like Trump.

I'm only about halfway through but I don't really see much of an argument going on? They're just recapping history.

Not that I'm trying to discredit the person before hearing all of their points (if they exist), but I found this clip interesting. Ignore the comments, not really an endorsement on my end.

Yeah, it wasn't a debate between a pro-Palestinian and a pro-Israeli, it was both sides conversing about the historical facts without virtue signaling or histrionics. If you wanted to see pushback, this is better since Lonerbox tells Steven what he thinks would be the right thing to do:

Att the 4:40 point so you won't have to sit through another long vid if you don't want to.

I think it's kind of curious how his counter to the topic of 1948 is bringing up a statute of limitations on being indigenous. That's not really what's being argued? Zionism existed well before 1948 and there were Jewish settlements there prior to 1948 as well. In fact, the Jews in Palestine frequently clashed with the British. The crux of this issue is that the government in Israel is neither secular or democratic. It's an ethnostate that treats non-Jews worse than Jews, and Palestinians the worst.

Dunno the full context of the quote, but I don't know if he's implying that's the extent of a pro-Palestinian's argument when mentioning 1948 so much as he's saying "this particular argument which I've heard people use is a bad one." But maybe I'm being too charitable because I really like Lonerbox for being further left than Destiny, but not crazy like Vaush or any of the other further left twitchpol folk.

EDIT: DEMOCRATS UP BIG THIS WEEK WOOYEAH

 

[Heero Yuy]

> Lmao, Imagine having the people who there on the Oct 7th attack refuting that Palestinians attacked that day cuz LAST I CHECKED AND MANY OTHER PEOPLE, HAMAS DOES NOT HAVE AIR COMBAT OPTIONS LIKE HELICOPTERS like this helicopter footage is an Israeli copter. Israel is lying and lying, and anyone here who even remotely questions this, you are in the same boat as western media, politicans, Israelis who consider muslims nothing as animals and terrorists.

> Whole ass fucking thread with Israel TAKING DOWN A NEWS ARTICLE THAT CONFIRMED THE IDF BOMBED THE FESTIVAL cuz it showed a video from the pilots view. But keep going on that Israel has the right to defend itself, Keep going on with that notion that Israel is in the right, anyone who even thinks Israel is right for a second, you are a genocide enabler, you are complicit in believing what an Zionist Regime Apartheid state that is the literally fucking modern day version of Nazis.

 

[M3J]

 

[ninjabot]

What about now? Is he still not doing better than a Republican president would?

EDIT: I don't/won't use Twitter thanks to vitriol for Elon Musk, so that's why I only post the links that I've seen others post and you've gotta go to Twitter to see the rest of it in case anyone's wondering.

 

[Heero Yuy]

What about now? Is he still not doing better than a Republican president would?

EDIT: I don't/won't use Twitter thanks to vitriol for Elon Musk, so that's why I only post the links that I've seen others post and you've gotta go to Twitter to see the rest of it in case anyone's wondering.

Buddy, Democrats are not any fucking better then the Republicans, the very fucking fact that the dipshit Genocide andy Biden has lost support of muslims and people of colour for votes, the FACT your WHOLE Government WANTS to eradicate Palestinians, and repeat their actions in Iraq, Iran, Syria just shows how fucked your own country is, The US Government is in bed with the Israeli Nazis aka the the whole entire fucking state.

> And openly shooting at people in hospitals now, but keep thinking that Israel has a right to exist, keep that thinking up buddy for you are a genocide wanter and enabler.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 10, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 10, 2023 ---

> Oh look at that would you, a baseless claim of Israel claiming that Hamas has tunnels under the hospital WHICH was debunked by staff who have worked there for 16+ years or more even before Hamas, Hospital is done gg fuck IDF, fuck Israelis, fuck the US Government, they're the real fucking animals, subhuman trash.

 

[M3J]

What about now? Is he still not doing better than a Republican president would?

EDIT: I don't/won't use Twitter thanks to vitriol for Elon Musk, so that's why I only post the links that I've seen others post and you've gotta go to Twitter to see the rest of it in case anyone's wondering.

No he is not when he could actually do more to stop it, but he's not. He doesn't want to, he's just looking like he does for votes.

 

[ninjabot]

No he is not when he could actually do more to stop it, but he's not. He doesn't want to, he's just looking like he does for votes.

More than 500 Biden campaign alumni want a Gaza ceasefire

What a letter from Biden’s field staff and organizers says about how Democrats see the Israel-Hamas war.

www.vox.com

It’s worth keeping in mind that a Trump presidency would also enable Israel, but there are indications that the situation would likely be worse. As ever, his comments with respect to this war are all over the place. He promised Hamas’s October 7 victims would be avenged “even beyond what you’re thinking about,” criticized Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on seemingly false grounds, and said he would have helped Israel make peace with Iran had he been reelected in 2020. Most alarmingly, he said he would restore and expand his Muslim migration ban to restrict Palestinian refugees from Gaza from entering the US.

I would implore you to ask yourself one last time whether keeping Biden in office is better for Palestinians than potentially Trump making it into office.

As for him doing more, what do you think he can do that doesn't have drastic political repercussions that will last generations? Do you want him to strongarm Israel into a ceasefire? The only way I see of fixing this, with my little bit of understanding of the situation, the ONLY THING, is a 2 state solution where neither Israel or Palestine are in control, and Hamas ceases to exist. Who should be in control? I dunno who has the authority to, but it has to be someone without skin in the game.

The Two-State Solution Is Still Our Only (Distant) Hope

Proposals for a democratic one-state solution are unpopular with Palestinians and anathema to Israeli Jews.

nymag.com

In the West, many progressive activists see the Israel-Palestine conflict through the lens of the anti-apartheid struggle in South Africa. And there are many commonalities between the injustices of Israel’s occupation and South African apartheid. But there are also major disanalogies between the two cases, not the least of which is that democratic equality was the central demand of South Africa’s liberation movement while it simply isn’t for the Palestinian one. For Black South Africans, there was no tension between the pursuit of national self-determination and enfranchisement in a multiethnic state: Since their group constituted nearly 90 percent of South Africa’s population, mere democracy would in practice guarantee their ethnic group’s domination of political life. By contrast, in a democratized Israel, the Palestinians would need to share power with a Jewish population nearly as numerous as themselves (and much more economically powerful).

2 state solution plus dead Hamas. That's the answer.

 

[McNuss]

which is really just a concentration camp at this point,

No matter how murderous the actions of the Israeli government and army are, I would kindly ask the moderators to condemn such statements.

They are just factually plain wrong. The reason why the Holocaust is condemned as a historically unique crime against humanity lies in the construction of an annihilation industry. The Nazis slaughtered humans like cattle in a slaughterhouse.

There is no such thing in the state of Israel, and what the Israeli government is doing, dropping bombs on people unable to escape, dropping bombs on hospitals, etc, those are war crimes and not industrial annihilation.

Any ideas trying to draw parralels between the Nazis and the state of Israel only supports right-wing politicians in Israel, whom you basically give a freepass for any of their actions - they will just say "look the Antisemites are everywhere and we continue to do as we please". And considering how bogus the Holocaust comparisons are, and what danger such accusations spell for Jews outside of Israel, here in Germany for example, they sort of have point here.

 

[ninjabot]

No matter how murderous the actions of the Israeli government and army are, I would kindly ask the moderators to condemn such statements.

I've been ignoring their comments because they're pretty yikesy, but I didn't want to seem insensitive because the sheer fervor with which they type shows some sort of personal attachment to the conflict that I lack, so I figured this was a way to vent and I'd leave them to it.

Still, it is pretty irresponsible to say some of the things they're saying.

 

[xi0]

Yeah, it wasn't a debate between a pro-Palestinian and a pro-Israeli, it was both sides conversing about the historical facts without virtue signaling or histrionics. If you wanted to see pushback, this is better since Lonerbox tells Steven what he thinks would be the right thing to do:

What I get from hearing Destiny in these videos is he acknowledges almost everything people say about Israel and it's current government, but prefers to throw his hands in the hair and say "might makes right" and leaves it at that. I understand the apathy most of the time but if he isn't willingly choosing to ignore what's going on on Twitter on a daily basis then he's just too far gone IMO. Maybe the issue is he's a solutions-oriented person, no fucking clue. But I don't get the apathy really.

Also I didn't really see much pushback in either direction in all honesty, but I guess analysis of solutions is interesting.

Dunno the full context of the quote, but I don't know if he's implying that's the extent of a pro-Palestinian's argument when mentioning 1948 so much as he's saying "this particular argument which I've heard people use is a bad one." But maybe I'm being too charitable because I really like Lonerbox for being further left than Destiny, but not crazy like Vaush or any of the other further left twitchpol folk.

Well I mean, either way it's kinda off-base IMO. I think it's perfectly reasonable to say it doesn't matter what the Torah says about who lived in that area thousands of years ago... and Israel knows it doesn't matter either, that's why they've been so aggressive with recruiting people to move there. Ethnic majority is what has always mattered.

I think I remember some thing with him and Hasan, seemed like salt because his name was banned in his chat or something, but I saw Hasan has watched his content recently so I'm not sure.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 11, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 11, 2023 ---

What about now? Is he still not doing better than a Republican president would?

EDIT: I don't/won't use Twitter thanks to vitriol for Elon Musk, so that's why I only post the links that I've seen others post and you've gotta go to Twitter to see the rest of it in case anyone's wondering.

Better than Trump? Probably.

But it's worth noting that Bush Sr was actually willing to threaten a pause on aid and loan guarantees if Israel didn't pull back on their settlement policies and he was a Republican. Clinton actually ran to the right of Bush on this issue and was much friendlier to them, which was certainly a factor for some voters in 1992. The most Obama could do was furrow his brow at it but he did nothing about it either.

 

[ninjabot]

What I get from hearing Destiny in these videos is he acknowledges almost everything people say about Israel and it's current government, but prefers to throw his hands in the hair and say "might makes right" and leaves it at that. I understand the apathy most of the time but if he isn't willingly choosing to ignore what's going on on Twitter on a daily basis then he's just too far gone IMO. Maybe the issue is he's a solutions-oriented person, no fucking clue. But I don't get the apathy really.

Also I didn't really see much pushback in either direction in all honesty, but I guess analysis of solutions is interesting.

From what I've seen he only recently chose to start ignoring what's being posted on twitter, to the point that now he's going to ban pro-Israel or pro-Palestine tweets in his subreddit because it's just propaganda from both sides. That's why he went full-on into looking into the history instead because he wants to come to the correct solution, not the most emotionally satisfying one.

Well I mean, either way it's kinda off-base IMO. I think it's perfectly reasonable to say it doesn't matter what the Torah says about who lived in that area thousands of years ago... and Israel knows it doesn't matter either, that's why they've been so aggressive with recruiting people to move there. Ethnic majority is what has always mattered.

Yeah.

I think I remember some thing with him and Hasan, seemed like salt because his name was banned in his chat or something, but I saw Hasan has watched his content recently so I'm not sure.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 11, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 11, 2023 ---

Hasan gets a lot of shit from twitchpol/youtubepol for being either an ideologue, or a grifter, or a hypocrite, or a coward, so he doesn't really interact with anyone that disagrees with him. Unfortunately his fame results in all of these other folks making videos about him in perpetuity pointing out things they'd love to confront him about that they see him as being wrong about, and in order not to lose members of his fanbase he does the same thing Vaush does and just doesn't engage with any of them, while also shouting them down as "debate perverts" that just want clout from him.

Lonerbox is one of these streamers who makes anti-Hasan content, but because he's a socialist as well, Hasan has to approach it from a different angle. He can't just say "fuck this shitlib". He can however prevent people in his community from knowing there's a fellow socialist who doesn't accept his own views on how the world should be.

Better than Trump? Probably.

But it's worth noting that Bush Sr was actually willing to threaten a pause on aid and loan guarantees if Israel didn't pull back on their settlement policies and he was a Republican. Clinton actually ran to the right of Bush on this issue and was much friendlier to them, which was certainly a factor for some voters in 1992. The most Obama could do was furrow his brow at it but he did nothing about it either.

Sure, but I'd argue the Republican party of the past isn't the same as the party of today, and having them in office wouldn't have the same anti-democratic outcome as having today's Republican party in office would. I still see letting Republicans win as sacrificing aid to Palestinians for the opportunity to punish Biden.

 

[xi0]

Any ideas trying to draw parralels between the Nazis and the state of Israel only supports right-wing politicians in Israel, whom you basically give a freepass for any of their actions - they will just say "look the Antisemites are everywhere and we continue to do as we please". And considering how bogus the Holocaust comparisons are, and what danger such accusations spell for Jews outside of Israel, here in Germany for example, they sort of have point here.

I really don't see analogies concerning genocide and/or ethnic-cleansing as being the problem. Punches don't need to be pulled just because some fascist politician might twist it to justify what they stand for. They don't need a reaction from anyone to continue lying.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 12, 2023, Original Post Date: Nov 12, 2023 ---

From what I've seen he only recently chose to start ignoring what's being posted on twitter, to the point that now he's going to ban pro-Israel or pro-Palestine tweets in his subreddit because it's just propaganda from both sides. That's why he went full-on into looking into the history instead because he wants to come to the correct solution, not the most emotionally satisfying one.

I think the "correct solution" is obvious, the problem is what is correct and what is feasible might as well be in different universes. What I saw in those videos is about the latter, which makes sense, sure. But when there's disagreements on even the basics of the situation it's difficult for me to care how they feel about feasible solutions. It's just too detached from the humanity of it.

From more of an outsider's perspective it just felt like it was yet another issue Destiny decided to go against the grain on because he hates Hasan and people like him. He didn't really demonstrate much of an understanding of ethnic conflicts at all in the first place.

Hasan gets a lot of shit from twitchpol/youtubepol for being either an ideologue, or a grifter, or a hypocrite, or a coward, so he doesn't really interact with anyone that disagrees with him. Unfortunately his fame results in all of these other folks making videos about him in perpetuity pointing out things they'd love to confront him about that they see him as being wrong about, and in order not to lose members of his fanbase he does the same thing Vaush does and just doesn't engage with any of them, while also shouting them down as "debate perverts" that just want clout from him.

Lonerbox is one of these streamers who makes anti-Hasan content, but because he's a socialist as well, Hasan has to approach it from a different angle. He can't just say "fuck this shitlib". He can however prevent people in his community from knowing there's a fellow socialist who doesn't accept his own views on how the world should be.

I think Hasan is reticent to engage with some of these people because of Destiny. Whether that's justified or immature, idk. Still don't have the full picture there. But given how much of twitchpol is molded by the influence of Destiny, it's easy to see why he'd avoid people in his orbit.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 12, 2023 ---

Sure, but I'd argue the Republican party of the past isn't the same as the party of today, and having them in office wouldn't have the same anti-democratic outcome as having today's Republican party in office would. I still see letting Republicans win as sacrificing aid to Palestinians for the opportunity to punish Biden.

I think it's worth examining why some Democrat voters are saying they would be willing to do something like that to prove a point to the DNC apparatus. Idk, maybe they'd learn something.

 

[McNuss]

I really don't see analogies concerning genocide and/or ethnic-cleansing as being the problem. Punches don't need to be pulled just because some fascist politician might twist it to justify what they stand for. They don't need a reaction from anyone to continue lying.

I mean, if you just take one paragraph from a multi paragraph post, you hide part of the meaning.

I repeat, what the Nazis did wasn't mere genocide, it was industrial annihilation, meticously calculated through by boring ass office guys who afterwards went playing cards with their friends at a bar, they slaughtered humans like cattle, a charge in, gas, next charge, gas, and so on until they needed to make a short pause because they couldn't get rid of the dead bodies fast enough. They trimmed genocide to maximum efficency. A logistic network that would make sure their victims would work their asses off until there's enough space in the gas chambers for the next charge.

Making any comparison between any actions of the Israeli government or army to the Holocaust is so fucking stupid, I am out of words...

Pls @ All educate yourself on the topic before shouting out such ridiculously uneducated and dangerous nonsense. You aren't helping anyone.

 

[xi0]

I mean, if you just take one paragraph from a multi paragraph post, you hide part of the meaning.

I repeat, what the Nazis did wasn't mere genocide, it was industrial annihilation, meticously calculated through by boring ass office guys who afterwards went playing cards with their friends at a bar, they slaughtered humans like cattle, a charge in, gas, next charge, gas, and so on until they needed to make a short pause because they couldn't get rid of the dead bodies fast enough. They trimmed genocide to maximum efficency. A logistic network that would make sure their victims would work their asses off until there's enough space in the gas chambers for the next charge.

Making any comparison between any actions of the Israeli government or army to the Holocaust is so fucking stupid, I am out of words...

Pls @ All educate yourself on the topic before shouting out such ridiculously uneducated and dangerous nonsense. You aren't helping anyone.

Nothing is hidden, it's what I chose to reply to. I'm not posting in order to compare the numbers, severity, or mechanics of said topic so why would I address it?

The phrase "mere genocide" in itself rings kind of oddly to me. I don't see much utility in reducing this discussion to a genocide dick-measuring contest when most people bring up past genocides do so as a way to draw comparisons. This is particularly topical when it involves Israel since Jews were victims themselves. That's the long and the short of it IMO. Whether a particular person has other ulterior motives in calling far-right politicians Nazis or unequivocally equating two events is not what I'm addressing.

Mincing words does not pay deference to victims of the Holocaust or any other genocides, and no one should do it for the sake of lying, ethno-nationalist, neo-fascist politicians either.

 

[McNuss]

Nothing is hidden, it's what I chose to reply to. I'm not posting in order to compare the numbers, severity, or mechanics of said topic so why would I address it?

The phrase "mere genocide" in itself rings kind of oddly to me. I don't see much utility in reducing this discussion to a genocide dick-measuring contest when most people bring up past genocides do so as a way to draw comparisons. This is particularly topical when it involves Israel since Jews were victims themselves. That's the long and the short of it IMO. Whether a particular person has other ulterior motives in calling far-right politicians Nazis or unequivocally equating two events is not what I'm addressing.

Mincing words does not pay deference to victims of the Holocaust or any other genocides, and no one should do it for the sake of lying, ethno-nationalist, neo-fascist politicians either.

Based on the vocabulary used here I just have to guess you lack profound education on the topic, for which I cannot blame you, since you are not a German and not forced to occupy yourself with it.

There is a clear distinction between murdering your neighbors in a fit of rage from an overescalated hate spiral swelling from a hundred years old conflict with them, and constructing an industry, with bureaucracy to calculate everything to maximum effiency, gathering halls in each city, railroads for fastest deportation, labor camps for temporary storage, gas chambers for annihilating millions at maximum economic effiency, and crematories to get rid of the bodies as if nothing happened.

Mincing words do indeed play a role here and nothing is in defense of the stupid Israeli Government. The words used are a door opener for the very same conspiracy theories that the Nazis coined and used to justify their horrible acts, and endanger the safety of Jews around the world.

I don't know if you know, but it is incredibly uncommon for a Jewish person in Germany to identify as such, synagogues and Jewish schools are under constant police surveillance that otherwise only politicians get due to security threats from antisemites, neonazis, islamists, and even agents of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards. If you identify with jewish symbols on the streets in certain areas, you greatly increase your chance of being physically assaulted. That is the reality.

Antisemitism is a global threat that needs to be fought and not fueled by repeating Hamas propaganda.

 

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Antisemitism is a global threat that needs to be fought and not fueled by repeating Hamas propaganda.

Hamas propaganda, huh.
Certainly, chasing people from their homes, forcifully occupying them, making them live like animals under constant threats/oppression and inforcing a hellish life on them on a daily basis for 75+ years, all while making it seems as if they've the right to defend themselves despite being a murderous colonizer is nothing but the truth.

Not to mention the grouping of islam alongside nazism, antisemittism, etc, which already proves how knowlegeable you are as well as your biasness.