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M3J

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Appealing to the youth, the left (people that are actually more likely to vote for her), Muslims, and Palestinians would have helped her immensely. It is about the demographics she should have appealed to, unless those four groups still wouldn't have gotten her the votes needed.
 

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Appealing to the youth, the left (people that are actually more likely to vote for her), Muslims, and Palestinians would have helped her immensely. It is about the demographics she should have appealed to, unless those four groups still wouldn't have gotten her the votes needed.
We'll know over the week when they start looking at who voted for her and who didn't. She did worse than Biden did in most states, and Michigan wasn't even THAT big of a loss despite it housing a big Muslim population there.

EDIT: I don't wanna pull the racism or sexism card but... it can't be ignored that the only times Trump has been seen as favorable for presidency has been against women.
 

M3J

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I think it was overwhelmingly Latinos and youths that voted for Trump, according to Twitter. And I had a lot of faith in our youths too smh

I wish Harris won, she actually would be a much better president than Trump, at the very least. More importantly, I do not want conservatives to control anything, much less who they can put into the Supreme Court. Was hoping so much that alone made people realize Harris was a much better option. Was so pissed off seeing so many of the left that I follow be okay with Harris losing just to stick it to her, but I am not interested in having their followers in my mentions.
 

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18% growth amongst Latinos. Fucking 18.

Time to start rethinking that wall lmfao.

Jokes aside though, things are really, really bad. Trump knows better what he can get away with. He has protections that he didn't have before. He has a plan with Project 2025... I can't think of an actual silver lining. I got nothing.

EDIT: OH! I got one. Now we'll get to see if the guard rails of democracy can really stand against true fascism. And if we can come out on top, we'll be stronger for it.
 
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18% growth amongst Latinos. Fucking 18.

Time to start rethinking that wall lmfao.

Jokes aside though, things are really, really bad. Trump knows better what he can get away with. He has protections that he didn't have before. He has a plan with Project 2025... I can't think of an actual silver lining. I got nothing.

EDIT: OH! I got one. Now we'll get to see if the guard rails of democracy can really stand against true fascism. And if we can come out on top, we'll be stronger for it.
18% growth amongst Latinos. Fucking 18.

Time to start rethinking that wall lmfao.

Jokes aside though, things are really, really bad. Trump knows better what he can get away with. He has protections that he didn't have before. He has a plan with Project 2025... I can't think of an actual silver lining. I got nothing.

EDIT: OH! I got one. Now we'll get to see if the guard rails of democracy can really stand against true fascism. And if we can come out on top, we'll be stronger for it.
I do not think there is an immediate silver lining. This is a current that does not only exist in america, all western countries are currently shifting to the right (even if they might not seem like it, because even social democratic parties shift to the right). This is a wave that is going to hurt a lot of people, until enough of them are fed up (similarly to the first time Trump was voted out).
 

M3J

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Republicans have all the power, there is no silver lining. The only possible silver lining we have is hoping enough republicans have enough common sense and care about people, which is a pipe dream.
 

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I don't buy the sexism excuse - and, if it is a reason why people voted for Trump then I'm afraid it might be a bed of the Democrats own creation

As an outsider to the circus, I saw very little attempt to win over the male vote - and ye olde 'vote for us or else you are sexist' is not a very convincing argument

There appears to be too much of a drive towards 'vote against them 'cause they are X, Y and/or Z' and not enough 'vote for us because we can/will offer 'U, V and/or W' (kinda irrelevant if the accusations are all true or not, if they don't sway your voters)

Now, it's entirely possible that I've missed all of this, due to only hearing/reading about the fear mongering articles

Personally, I think this result is a mistake - but it's America's mistake to make (and likely Ukraine's burden to bear)
 

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Kamala didn't outperform Biden in a single county. Think about that.

Not state, county.
 

M3J

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I don't buy the sexism excuse - and, if it is a reason why people voted for Trump then I'm afraid it might be a bed of the Democrats own creation

As an outsider to the circus, I saw very little attempt to win over the male vote - and ye olde 'vote for us or else you are sexist' is not a very convincing argument

There appears to be too much of a drive towards 'vote against them 'cause they are X, Y and/or Z' and not enough 'vote for us because we can/will offer 'U, V and/or W' (kinda irrelevant if the accusations are all true or not, if they don't sway your voters)

Now, it's entirely possible that I've missed all of this, due to only hearing/reading about the fear mongering articles

Personally, I think this result is a mistake - but it's America's mistake to make (and likely Ukraine's burden to bear)
It was also Harris and the Dems trying to appeal to the wrong demographics. I think they did do enough "vote for us because," but I could be wrong because I've heard about Harris offering an easier path to buying homes, Biden Admin fighting to put back protections for consumers, and more.

Sexism does feel like a copout when Clinton won the popular vote. Dems only have themselves to blame the loss, as well as their voters who took it upon themselves to harass people who were undecided or didn't want to vote for Harris.
 

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18% growth amongst Latinos. Fucking 18.

Time to start rethinking that wall lmfao.

Jokes aside though, things are really, really bad. Trump knows better what he can get away with. He has protections that he didn't have before. He has a plan with Project 2025... I can't think of an actual silver lining. I got nothing.

EDIT: OH! I got one. Now we'll get to see if the guard rails of democracy can really stand against true fascism. And if we can come out on top, we'll be stronger for it.
No! Democrats should offer to legalize more illegal immigrants. Next time latinos will definitely warm up to that.
 

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No! Democrats should offer to legalize more illegal immigrants. Next time latinos will definitely warm up to that.
What other solution is there besides amnesty though?
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---





I wonder how many examples of this kind of thing there will be when it's all said and done
 

kkck

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What other solution is there besides amnesty though?
At least electorally, the opposite. Personally, I'd go for mass deportations, permanently banning people who enter the country illegally from the possibility of even a tourist visa, severely punishing businesses that hire illegal immigrants, working on legal immigration pathways that respond to US job market conditions and needs. Don't separate families at the border, that shit is cruel and inhuman, deport them together. Cut illegal immigrants off from social services. Get the military involved at the border from time to time.

My issue with amnesty remains this: people outside the US have internet. So if the US government signals amnesty and whatnot then folk outside the US will know and take it as a sign that they can and should just go there. And the path to go to the US through central america was comically dangerous even before gangs and cartels got involved and started profiting off immigrants (human trafficking, racketeering, kidnappings, drugs, prostitution, there's a humanitarian tragedy there I am not sure anyone has properly quantified).
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

It's looking like trump is set to win several other states. Trump didn't just win, he straight up crushed kamala. I am still kinda surprised that the world is basically going "meh" at this.
 

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I am still kinda surprised that the world is basically going "meh" at this.
What kind of response would you rather?

Assuming he won in a legitimate election, the results are legitimate results. That is the problem with democracy - the 'good guys' don't always win

I think that accepting the results for what they are and trying to make do is the only/best course of action at this point
 

kkck

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What kind of response would you rather?

Assuming he won in a legitimate election, the results are legitimate results. That is the problem with democracy - the 'good guys' don't always win

I think that accepting the results for what they are and trying to make do is the only/best course of action at this point
I was sort of expecting a more similar response to his 2016 win tbh. Trump's not any better than he was back then, most folk abroad hated him. I still remember him sort of treating the UN as one of his rallies and folk there simply laughing at him. if anything trump's worse than he was back then. Older and crazier and his cultists are even more unhinged now. Ukraine is now a coin toss that as far as I can tell depends on which outcome makes trump look like he personally won and trump has been pretty clear about how he feels about israel-palestine. I honestly get the kamala hate and democrats 150% lied through their teeth about biden's overall state but trump is a lunatic.
 

James Rye

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I don't buy the sexism excuse - and, if it is a reason why people voted for Trump then I'm afraid it might be a bed of the Democrats own creation

As an outsider to the circus, I saw very little attempt to win over the male vote - and ye olde 'vote for us or else you are sexist' is not a very convincing argument

There appears to be too much of a drive towards 'vote against them 'cause they are X, Y and/or Z' and not enough 'vote for us because we can/will offer 'U, V and/or W' (kinda irrelevant if the accusations are all true or not, if they don't sway your voters)

Now, it's entirely possible that I've missed all of this, due to only hearing/reading about the fear mongering articles

Personally, I think this result is a mistake - but it's America's mistake to make (and likely Ukraine's burden to bear)
Maybe, but I do believe this was the last time you saw a female president candidate for the foreseeable future. Like the next 30-50 year or so. 2 women losing this much against the same guy, especially the 2nd time after the same guy's fans have done the J6 riot, has obvious plans to turn America into a more autocratic state (no matter how many times Trump says he doesn't know Project 2025, if his plans are to hire most of the people working on it then it gonna get implemented) and ofc is willing to forego of the US power position by isolating themselves from everyone be it Mexcio, Canada or their Nato partners and the 2nd woman still lost, tremendously. Yeah, no way any party gonna put up a woman for president in many many elections to come.

Also it won't just be Ukraine's burden to bear. Once Russia has successfully eaten them, and they will now with Trump's support aka 0 support for Ukraine, Putin will take Georgia and Moldova next. And if Trump succeeds in ending Nato then Estonia and Latvia and such will be next. And I do not see the EU to be able to form an European Army themselves, especially not with Orban sabotaging everything within the EU.

It's looking like trump is set to win several other states. Trump didn't just win, he straight up crushed kamala. I am still kinda surprised that the world is basically going "meh" at this.
There is nothing the world can do about it. They gonna do what they did in the 4 years of Trump, some will kiss his ass because it just works and try to convince him the others kissing his ass are not kissing it enough while others will try to find different partners and look down until 2028 with a new president like they did with Biden.
 

z.5

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Also it won't just be Ukraine's burden to bear. Once Russia has successfully eaten them, and they will now with Trump's support aka 0 support for Ukraine, Putin will take Georgia and Moldova next
Yeah, I didn't mean that only Ukraine stands to suffer - just their suffering will be more immediately evident than others

But I stand by what I said - what would you rather other countries do? Would it be good if countries like Germany or France refuse to accept the results? Flat out state that they will not work with the USA, until they change their leader?

Europe, and others, should take these results for what they are and should take measures from day -1. If America turns out to be as unreliable a friend under Trump, as some people worry, then now (or yesterday) is the time to prepare for the consequences of the American public's [poor] decisions


Just to clarify - that 'you' wasn't meant for specifically YOU (James)

More a collective 'you' for people who would rather a stronger response from other countries leaders/MPs/etc.
 

James Rye

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@z.5 No worries, think the same as you after all.

In the end though I don't believe Trump will be there for all 4 years. His health is obviously worse than 8 years ago and he was way more confused and unhinged in this campaign than he was 8 years ago as well. He will probably be succeeded by JD Vance in the next two years or so.
 
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z.5

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Whilst here (I don't often visit this thread, but thought that current events were historic enough to merit my temporary return), I'd also like to state that I haven't totally given up on the chance that America will have a female president at some point in the future

It's a huge country and I fail to accept that Harris (and especially not Clinton) are the best that it has to offer, in respect to capable [female] presidential material

I'd love to see a female PotUS, however I think the position should be one of true meritocracy and not one that is doled out solely due to ones gender/race/who you know/what family you belong to

To be honest, if I could see anyone winning the position, I'd rather it be a poor, young (I mean sub 40) person (gender is irrelevant here), from a working class background...
Someone who truly represents the American population and not some antediluvian billionaire who is so out of touch that it would be impossible for them to care about the average person, even if they wanted to...
 

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I still think Ukraine is a coin toss. If Trump thinks that Russia winning the war at Ukraine means he will be perceived as having lost it then he will hold onto ukraine like a tick.
 

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I was sort of expecting a more similar response to his 2016 win tbh. Trump's not any better than he was back then, most folk abroad hated him. I still remember him sort of treating the UN as one of his rallies and folk there simply laughing at him. if anything trump's worse than he was back then. Older and crazier and his cultists are even more unhinged now. Ukraine is now a coin toss that as far as I can tell depends on which outcome makes trump look like he personally won and trump has been pretty clear about how he feels about israel-palestine. I honestly get the kamala hate and democrats 150% lied through their teeth about biden's overall state but trump is a lunatic.
I would hope that aside from denouncing the fat orange cheeto, that the US Allies straight up tells the Dems what utter incompetent idiots they have been.
 
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