Canon Base Luffy vs Zoro

[nik87]

With Asura, there is no obstacle Zoro cant overcome, whether it is FS or aCoA, he is far more complete combatant than Luffy who has been catching up because of his inferior combat style since his old one doesnt work against top tiers while Zoro's works, like a glove.

 

[Sachsenhesse]

On some days i truly believe Nik and Moe are one person who is trolling us all.

 

[Pirate Queen]

On some days i truly believe Nik and Moe are one person who is trolling us all.

Yeah its slowly been getting worse lol

 

[Shasha23]

Luffy is just that powerful lol. I am neither high or... well I might be crazy.

ACoO and ACoA is just that overpowered. There is no defense for that combo that we have seen in the manga yet. Apparently even Monsters with absolute defense like Kaido are susceptible to that haki if utilized correctly.

Gears just lower the difficulty in which Luffy wins.

No Gears = Zoro wins high/extreme diff
Gears 2-3 = Luffy wins mid/high diff
Gear 4 = Luffy wins mid/low diff
Gear 4 Snakeman wins low diff (due to speed factor)

He is, but base Luffy is nowhere close to Zoro, thinking otherwise is illogical.

Lets not forget that this CoA Luffy is learning Zoro already had it, and as we know haki blocks haki , the only problem is Luffy's CoO but in base Zoro is more than fast enough to blitz him.

Base - Low diff Zoro
G2 +3 - mid/high diff Zoro
G4 - Luffy low/mid diff this ( this will be corrected after more feats from Zoro

Zoro and Luffy have always been close only difference now is that Luffy has way more feats than Zoro, after more feats they will return to being Luffy>=Zoro again

 

[Rmstorm]

He is, but base Luffy is nowhere close to Zoro, thinking otherwise is illogical.

Lets not forget that this CoA Luffy is learning Zoro already had it, and as we know haki blocks haki , the only problem is Luffy's CoO but in base Zoro is more than fast enough to blitz him.

Base - Low diff Zoro
G2 +3 - mid/high diff Zoro
G4 - Luffy low/mid diff this ( this will be corrected after more feats from Zoro

Zoro and Luffy have always been close only difference now is that Luffy has way more feats than Zoro, after more feats they will return to being Luffy>=Zoro again

Luffy went past Zoro in Armanment haki, using the msot Advanced Form, internal destruction haki/ destroying things frim within. ( Only Garp, Luffy and Rayleigh have this haki)

Zoro losing to Nerfed Killer, struggling with hawkins, needing Orlumbas help to fight Pica, shows he is nowhere near Luffy.

They have never been close since the timeskip started.

All the BS that you spew wont change the fact that

Current Luffy Low Diffs Zoro in Gear 4

Current Luffy Midd Diffs Zoro in Gear 2nd and 3rd.

 

[Pirate Queen]

He is, but base Luffy is nowhere close to Zoro, thinking otherwise is illogical.

Lets not forget that this CoA Luffy is learning Zoro already had it, and as we know haki blocks haki , the only problem is Luffy's CoO but in base Zoro is more than fast enough to blitz him.

This is where you are wrong. Luffy just master a haki thats many times greater than the haki Zoro utilizes. It bypasses all defenses and logically other types of haki. It is internally attacking targets. People seem to miss this. What Luffy learned is overwhelmingly better than any type of CoA we have seen before .

Even if Zoro blocked with his swords, Luffy's haki would bypass the blades and hit Zoro. That how it works. Theres no defense to it that we know of.

We can speculate that haki can block it, but we don't know that yet. If it can pierce Kaido's scales we can assume no CoA could block it

 

[Shasha23]

This is where you are wrong. Luffy just master a haki thats many times greater than the haki Zoro utilizes. It bypasses all defenses and logically other types of haki. It is internally attacking targets. People seem to miss this. What Luffy learned is overwhelmingly better than any type of CoA we have seen before .

Even if Zoro blocked with his swords, Luffy's haki would bypass the blades and hit Zoro. That how it works. Theres no defense to it that we know of.

We can speculate that haki can block it, but we don't know that yet. If it can pierce Kaido's scales we can assume no CoA could block it

No the haki is the same but the application is different, because Luffy uses fists he had to learn a form suited for him but Zoro uses blade so his application is different, they both use advanced CoA the application is whats different.

Zoro's haki is as strong if not stronger than Luffy's, lets not forget this advanced haki Luffy just learned a few days ago Zoro had already mastered it at a minimum months ago, so saying something baseless like Luffy's haki is stronger is just nonsensical!

It cant pierce them untill proven otherwise, also lets not forget Zoro can now also pierce his scales so saying Luffy's CoA is stronger is just baseless and premature, Zoro has better CoA feats so until Luffy proves his are better in battle its only logical to say Zoro' CoA is > than Luffy's

 

[nik87]

Even if Zoro blocked with his swords, Luffy's haki would bypass the blades and hit Zoro. That how it works. Theres no defense to it that we know of.

No, it's not how it works. It is not a remote thing that you can explode wherever you want, you still have to make contact unless you plan to wield that haki a meter away from you which is just silly. Zoro's defense is safe, between the swords and his body is a good meter of distance.
Also, that Haki is nothing special, just different application of it and swordsmen have no use for it because for them there are no excuses as tough scales, they have to cut all the way. The inferior combat has to come up with other solutions that work.
Another thing, Haki flow has nothing to do with the quality of Hardening haki, different branch.

Luffy went past Zoro in Armanment haki, using the msot Advanced Form, internal destruction haki/ destroying things frim within. ( Only Garp, Luffy and Rayleigh have this haki)
Zoro losing to Nerfed Killer, struggling with hawkins, needing Orlumbas help to fight Pica, shows he is nowhere near Luffy.
They have never been close since the timeskip started.
All the BS that you spew wont change the fact that
Current Luffy Low Diffs Zoro in Gear 4
Current Luffy Midd Diffs Zoro in Gear 2nd and 3rd.

You can use a bigger font if you are trying to convince us but no guarantees it will work. The "almighty" Luffy needs Zoro against Kaido.
As for Luffy vs Zoro, Zoro will cut off his hands.

 

[Shasha23]

You can use a bigger font if you are trying to convince us but no guarantees it will work. The "almighty" Luffy needs Zoro against Kaido.
As for Luffy vs Zoro, Zoro will cut off his hands.

Why are you even replying to that airhaed's post?

 

[Pirate Queen]

No the haki is the same but the application is different, because Luffy uses fists he had to learn a form suited for him but Zoro uses blade so his application is different, they both use advanced CoA the application is whats different.

Zoro's haki is as strong if not stronger than Luffy's, lets not forget this advanced haki Luffy just learned a few days ago Zoro had already mastered it at a minimum months ago, so saying something baseless like Luffy's haki is stronger is just nonsensical!

It cant pierce them untill proven otherwise, also lets not forget Zoro can now also pierce his scales so saying Luffy's CoA is stronger is just baseless and premature, Zoro has better CoA feats so until Luffy proves his are better in battle its only logical to say Zoro' CoA is > than Luffy's

That is not what is explained in the manga

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 4, 2019, Original Post Date: Dec 4, 2019 ---

No, it's not how it works. It is not a remote thing that you can explode wherever you want, you still have to make contact unless you plan to wield that haki a meter away from you which is just silly. Zoro's defense is safe, between the swords and his body is a good meter of distance.
Also, that Haki is nothing special, just different application of it and swordsmen have no use for it because for them there are no excuses as tough scales, they have to cut all the way. The inferior combat has to come up with other solutions that work.
Another thing, Haki flow has nothing to do with the quality of Hardening haki, different branch.

No you just not understanding how it is applied, both you and Nik clearly don't understand how the application works

That haki is nothing special? Lol what a troll. It is literally the strongest form of CoA in the manga. Higher than even advanced applications. Of CoA that Zoro utilizes. It is stated in the MANGA.


"Zoro's defense is safe, between the swords and his body is a good meter of distance."

Lol Zoro has to touch his swords to use them genius. You have no good arguement and are failing to undermine how badass this new haki is because Zoro will never be able to achieve such high level CoA

 

[Shasha23]

That is not what is explained in the mang

Well clarify then since im pretty sure the manga says otherwise

 

[Pirate Queen]

No the haki is the same but the application is different, because Luffy uses fists he had to learn a form suited for him but Zoro uses blade so his application is different, they both use advanced CoA the application is whats different.

Zoro's haki is as strong if not stronger than Luffy's, lets not forget this advanced haki Luffy just learned a few days ago Zoro had already mastered it at a minimum months ago, so saying something baseless like Luffy's haki is stronger is just nonsensical!

It cant pierce them untill proven otherwise, also lets not forget Zoro can now also pierce his scales so saying Luffy's CoA is stronger is just baseless and premature, Zoro has better CoA feats so until Luffy proves his are better in battle its only logical to say Zoro' CoA is > than Luffy's

It is a fact that Luffy has better haki than Zoro despite Zoro having it before Luffy.

You have no proof Zoro can pierce his scales where I have proof Luffy has the ability to bypass a physical barrier to hit something internally. You have no proof. Nothing.

Only Rayliegh and Luffy know this type of haki

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 4, 2019, Original Post Date: Dec 4, 2019 ---

Well clarify then since im pretty sure the manga says otherwise

Hyo explains that the level ABOVE what Zoro utilizes it what Luffy has mastered

It doesnt matter what physical barrier is in the way, Luffy will be able to hit it from within

Luffy CoA > Zoro's CoA

That in now canon manga FACT despite what naysayers are claiming.


This is literally all the info you need.

If after this you are saying Zoro still has the better haki you are just being willfully ignorant for the sake of it.

 

[nik87]

No you just not understanding how it is applied, both you and Nik clearly don't understand how the application works
That haki is nothing special? Lol what a troll. It is literally the strongest form of CoA in the manga. Higher than even advanced applications. Of CoA that Zoro utilizes. It is stated in the MANGA.
"Zoro's defense is safe, between the swords and his body is a good meter of distance."
Lol Zoro has to touch his swords to use them genius. You have no good arguement and are failing to undermine how badass this new haki is because Zoro will never be able to achieve such high level CoA

No, you dont get how it works. He clearly has come within couple of centimeters on every panel you posted so good luck applying that to Zoro's body while he blocks it lol. That haki application is so amazing that Rayleigh didnt bother use it against a freaking Admiral because it is shit compared to a sword.

Where have I claimed that Zoro doesnt need to touch the swords? You have no arguments and come up with something like that which I never said...
Zoro's CoA will always be miles above Luffy's, you can bet on that.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Zoro's CoA will always be miles above Luffy's, you can bet on that.

Except it isnt and the manga backs that up while you are left with baseless claims

 

[Shasha23]

It is a fact that Luffy has better haki than Zoro despite Zoro having it before Luffy.

Only Rayliegh and Luffy know this type of haki

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 4, 2019, Original Post Date: Dec 4, 2019 ---

Hyo explains that the level ABOVE what Zoro utilizes it what Luffy has mastered

It doesnt matter what physical barrier is in the way, Luffy will be able to hit it from within

Luffy CoA > Zoro's CoA

That in now canon manga FACT despite what naysayers are claiming.


This is literally all the info you need.

If after this you are saying Zoro still has the better haki you are just being willfully ignorant for the sake of it.

Let me explain since you missed the whole point of this training in the manga

CoA : hardening > extending it out from your body : from this point there are 2 branches:
1. Internal damage
2. Something completely different that has something to do with blades

Extending the haki out is the advanced form, which Zoro had been using since they reunited, from there on we dont exactly know the extent of his advanced form since he has no feats fighting top tires, you only think internal damage is stronger because you were shown a few panels, 1 against a tree and a piece of iron LOL

Saying internal damage is more advance is stupid since that is something only hand to hand fighters need to learn while swordmasters learn something completely different.

Now ill ask you again how is Luffy's CoA stronger than Zoro's when Zoro masters this haki long before even Luffy tried!

How do you know Luffy will hit it from within when he has never done it before, how do you know this haki bypasses another person haki?
Your just making baseless assumptions and trying to push them as fact when they are nothing but headcanon.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 4, 2019 ---

Except it isnt and the manga backs that up while you are left with baseless claims

Luffy's best advance haki feat is breaking a tree while Zoro's best advanced haki feat is slicing a logia,
now tell me who has better COA feats

 

[Pirate Queen]

Let me explain since you missed the whole point of this training in the manga

CoA : hardening > extending it out from your body : from this point there are 2 branches:
1. Internal damage
2. Something completely different that has something to do with blades

Extending the haki out is the advanced form, which Zoro had been using since they reunited, from there on we dont exactly know the extent of his advanced form since he has no feats fighting top tires, you only think internal damage is stronger because you were shown a few panels, 1 against a tree and a piece of iron LOL

Saying internal damage is more advance is stupid since that is something only hand to hand fighters need to learn while swordmasters learn something completely different.

Now ill ask you again how is Luffy's CoA stronger than Zoro's when Zoro masters this haki long before even Luffy tried!

How do you know Luffy will hit it from within when he has never done it before, how do you know this haki bypasses another person haki?
Your just making baseless assumptions and trying to push them as fact when they are nothing but headcanon.

Lol omg you really dont get it with an explaination like that.

I have proved panel stating what Luffy learned is a level above what Zoro knows.

Can you provide a single panel proving what you are trying to explain?

I gave my proof, you give yours

 

[Shasha23]

Lol omg you really dont get it with an explaination like that.

I have proved panel stating what Luffy learned is a level above what Zoro knows.

Can you provide a single panel proving what you are trying to explain?

I gave my proof, you give yours

Yes we all see Luffy learned a level higher than extending it out of the body no one is denying this......................................
The point is a swordmaster doesnt need to learn this since its useless for them, they learn something different and we dont know what this is yet, we will learn it soon. Why are you being oblivious to this POINT?

Im on my phone so ill tell you when they used advance forms

1. Luffy vs a tree, used internal damage on the tree
2. Zoro vs Monet, cut the logia user without touching her

Now please tell me why your soo adamant that one form is better than the other?

 

[Pirate Queen]

Yes we all see Luffy learned a level higher than extending it out of the body no one is denying this......................................
The point is a swordmaster doesnt need to learn this since its useless for them, they learn something different and we dont know what this is yet, we will learn it soon. Why are you being oblivious to this POINT?

Im on my phone so ill tell you when they used advance forms

1. Luffy vs a tree, used internal damage on the tree
2. Zoro vs Monet, cut the logia user without touching her

Now please tell me why your soo adamant that one form is better than the other?

Because it is stated in the manga that it is BETTER. Holy shit am i talking to a wall?

There not 2 different forms! Zoro knows ADVANCED COA Luffy knows the level BEYOND ADVANCED COA

How aren't you getting this?

 

[nik87]

Except it isnt and the manga backs that up while you are left with baseless claims

Where has Zoro's CoA failed and Luffy's succeeded? Destroys some rocks and a tree? In case you missed, Zoro is shrinking Wano's coastline and splitting mountains with his Haki. As I said, that Haki is so awesome that Rayleigh ignored it completely because it is inferior to bladed combat.
Also, while Luffy is making excuses about the tough scales I dont hear any excuses from Zoro who is being setup to cut through them.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Where has Zoro's CoA failed and Luffy's succeeded? Destroys some rocks and a tree? In case you missed, Zoro is shrinking Wano's coastline and splitting mountains with his Haki. As I said, that Haki is so awesome that Rayleigh ignored it completely because it is inferior to bladed combat.

Just because he doesnt have Luffy's superior haki doesnt mean his CoA is useless. Zoro is still a mountain splitter, Nik. No one is taking it away from him. I'm not discrediting Zoro here. My goal is to get you to understand why what you are saying is inaccurate, which I expect to fail because you are far too stuck in putting Zoro > everyone.

While Zoro has been cutting coastlines and mountains Luffy has been fighting Yonko Commander and clashing with Yonko, getting real experience and upgrades. Luffy wasnt handed a pair of magic boxing gloves that help him train his haki, and it just so happen those boxing gloves were the only thing to hurt Kaido.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 4, 2019, Original Post Date: Dec 4, 2019 ---

@nik opened a thread on the main forum page. Let's take the discussion over there