Doubles Final - Marui/Kaidou vs Shiraishi/Matsudaira

[Kaoz]

Doubles
Final​

Name	Marui Bunta
Grade	Middle School 3rd Year
Birthday	April 20th
Height	164 cm
Weight	62 kg
Handedness	Right
Playstyle	Serve and Volley

Name	Kaidou Kaoru
Grade	Middle School 2nd Year
Birthday	May 11th
Height	173 cm
Weight	57 kg
Handedness	Right
Playstyle	Counter Puncher

VERSUS​

Name	Matsudaira Chikahiko
Grade	High School 3rd Year
Birthday	March 31st
Height	176 cm
Weight	?
Handedness	Right
Playstyle	Serve and Volley

Name	Shiraishi Kuranosuke
Grade	Middle School 3rd Year
Birthday	April 14th
Height	178 cm
Weight	66 kg
Handedness	Left
Playstyle	All Rounder

Serve order: Marui -> Shiraishi -> Kaidou -> Matsudaira


This round ends on Monday, August 26th, at 8 PM GMT.

Have fun discussing.

 

[Kaoz]

Honestly, if we didn't come to any conclusion how one of Chitose, Inui, Yanagi or Miyako could break down WC, I don't see why Shiraishi would be able to. Matsudaira might still take his service games without much trouble, but in the end that's only 1/4 of the games.

Given the development so far, Marui/Kaidou should have this.

 

[-Ken-]

Isn't Shiraishi serve fairly decent, too?

That said, Marui/Kaidoh should take this.

 

[Hardy]

Honestly, if we didn't come to any conclusion how one of Chitose, Inui, Yanagi or Miyako could break down WC, I don't see why Shiraishi would be able to. Matsudaira might still take his service games without much trouble, but in the end that's only 1/4 of the games.

Given the development so far, Marui/Kaidou should have this.

Shiraishi plays perfect tennis, he's great at finding counters...

Wait, I think I've heard that one before

 

[Kaoz]

Shiraishi plays perfect tennis, he's great at finding counters...

And you're implying that the other four aren't?

 

[LetalHawk]

It's not that hard. If Marui was able to stop Tohno's executions, he will be able to stop Siraishi's shots perfectly. The same with Matsu's. If Matsudaira had problem dealing with Shiraishi's fast shots when he removed his gauntlet, Kaidoh's Gyro Laser is even more faster, so he won't be able to hit it back.

Kaidoh/Marui should take this.

 

[Hardy]

And you're implying that the other four aren't?

Let's see...

We've never seen Miayko really countering anything, so yeah Shiraishi is better at counters.
So far, the only thing we've seen Chitose counter was Hyakuren, and it was because he had been investigating aboutevery Muga door (so, he knew how to counter before playing Tezuka).
You proposed the "Shiraishi is awesome at finding counters" after Yamato defeated Inui in the high tier tournament... So you'd agree that Shiraishi is better at finding counters, right? (unless you disagree with your own arguments )
And the last round against Yanagi was really even, and no one really had a good argument to vote for Kaidoh / Marui.

So yeah... Shiraishi might take this ^^

 

[Kaoz]

You proposed the "Shiraishi is awesome at finding counters" after Yamato defeated Inui in the high tier tournament... So you'd agree that Shiraishi is better at finding counters, right? (unless you disagree with your own arguments )

I don't remember saying this at all. If you would be so kind to point out the exact post.

And the last round against Yanagi was really even, and no one really had a good argument to vote for Kaidoh / Marui.

I believe the argument was that Yanagi/Miyako would not be able to deal with WC.

 

[Hardy]

I don't remember saying this at all. If you would be so kind to point out the exact post.



I believe the argument was that Yanagi/Miyako would not be able to deal with WC.

Yeah sure... http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showt...amato-Yuudai?p=3515984&viewfull=1#post3515984

You said that after Yamato defeated Inui in the first round.

No one really said anything about Yanagi/Miyako, no one was sure where to start nor who had the upper hand there. It was prolly the match with less posts and votes.

 

[Kaoz]

How in the world do you interpret "Shiraishi has perfect movements" as "Shiraishi is awesome at finding counters"? Unless you're suggesting that Shiraishi would be able to return the ball very quickly every time and Marui wouldn't be able to keep up at some point?

 

[Hardy]

How in the world do you interpret "Shiraishi has perfect movements" as "Shiraishi is awesome at finding counters"? Unless you're suggesting that Shiraishi would be able to return the ball very quickly every time and Marui wouldn't be able to keep up at some point?

Well, I think some guy interpreted your words that way (the post after yours) and I was just ok with that interpetation.

Again, you proposed it after Yamato defeated Inui, we know Shiraishi has a different skillset than him, and has something completely different to offer.

I know WC is an amazing move, but this shouldn't be a sure win for Marui/Kaidoh at all.

 

[Kaoz]

Well, I think some guy interpreted your words that way (the post after yours) and I was just ok with that interpetation.

I did not get that impression, but if that was the case, let me clarify that it was not supposed to be taken that way.

Again, you proposed it after Yamato defeated Inui, we know Shiraishi has a different skillset than him, and has something completely different to offer.

I'm not sure how this is all that relevant though. I also argued for Inui > Yamato.

I know WC is an amazing move, but this shouldn't be a sure win for Marui/Kaidoh at all.

Maybe you should make an actual argument for Shiraishi/Matsudaira then to convince other people of it instead of a random one liner.

 

[Hardy]

Maybe you should make an actual argument for Shiraishi/Matsudaira then to convince other people of it instead of a random one liner.

The thing is, I'm not sure that Shiraishi/Matsu have the upper hand. The same happenned to me when Marui/Kaidoh palyed against Yanagi/Miyako. I just dunno. But I don't really think that WC is a move that can only be beatten with a lob, there has to be another way. But, as the manga didn't show anything else than a lob, I can't really support what I'm saying.

So, the only viable thing left is thinking that WC can't be used for an entire set, or that Shiraishi with his perfect movements would pressure Marui left and right, until WC fails... but we haven't seen anything like that in the manga either.

I dunno man, WC is apparently such a great move u.u

 

[Kaoz]

Maybe starting at the other end might be more productive? In other words, could Shiraishi and Matsudaira take care of TS/GL?

 

[Hardy]

I believe Shiraishi and his perfect movements would, and Matsu with his speed (and Shiraishi's advice) might catch up.

But it doesn't really matter. What happens if they manage to return Kaidoh's combo? They have to face WC again...

 

[Kaoz]

Well, yes, but picture this scenario. You could hit a shorter lob to the side (so that it would land in the doubles alley), which would then force Kaidou far to the outside. Then when he returns the ball, you could lob it again, but this time to the other side and preferably with a lot of topspin. This wouldn't work against Kite because he can cover the complete court in "one step", but it's different for Kaidou who doesn't have Shukuchihou.

So wouldn't that be a possibility?

 

[Hardy]

I guess (if Shiraishi / Matsu actually manage to pull 2 great lobs, 1 of them after Kaidoh's combo). Marui would go to the baseline to return the 2nd lob (just like he did in Kanto's finals)... WC would be broken that way, and Shiraishi / Matsu would need to pressure Marui to avoid him getting anywhere near the net. If Shiraishi / Matsu manage to finish the point there, they can win this.

Flower is just a serve right?

 

[Kaoz]

As far as we know, yes, it's only a serve.

 

[Hardy]

Yeah, I always mix Flower with Hakamada's move.

Well, it's not like we haven't seen Entaku Shot finishing points before.

This is still a tough one, I might go with Shiraishi / Matsu